dunder

Re the metric comment. Spot on. I think if you delve deeper behind the headline 25 number, you find a much higher xFIP. And you cant even rely on that as the sample is much too small.

The fact that Zach will 'talk to them (Brewers) about it' is a big plus from my point of view. I hope they are talking. And Melvin has been very, very good at getting guys signed that wanted to talk and are open. To have Yo and Zach as one / two, or should we say one / one, for 4 or 5 years would be wonderful.

I am just thinking: let the guy play. I think the Front Office is actually down on him. And maybe they know many things we dont know. It is werid to me to have him under such and such a microscope. What is strange is I was so high on him (what does it matter that I am high on him) because of all the hype two years ago and before. Then suddenly, I honestly think the guy will be worse than Casey last year - because of all the anti-hype. So I am back to 'I want to watch him play'. All my opinions are based on what others have fed into me. So, to the point of the thread, I am really confused! I am very HIGH and LOW and DONT KNOW on Mat. It is a good thread. RobDeer was fine to ask. And, wow, a lot of opinions are sure there!

Wow, we have a lot of time in the world these days. We have 62 pages of posts about if Braun has a cold sore. Then we are going to disect every time Gamel came onto the field, way back to A ball, what expresssion he had on his face and what it means. I just want to watch Mat play. I am thinking Overbay right now. But, honestly, the guy should get two years in the majors before he is released. His expression as he took batting practice in 2007? I dont care. Maybe he had a hemorrhoid.

My point was we seem to have a bundle of older guys who throw 89 mph in our minors. I mean we draft college guys that 'touch low 90s', but in reality are the 88-89 mph guys. Being college guys they dont have much room for developing extra velocity. So I would rather have 10 18 years olds throwing 87 rather than 10 21 year olds throwing 89. Now given my comment was a bit from a 'feeling' over years, I decided to go to that linked stats page on the top of the forum here. And lo after a bit of googling, I can find we have even 17 year old guys throwing above 90 and putting up good stats in Rookie ball. So, I am just wrong for not checking fully. Or maybe we have not been signing the central / south American guys before. So, just going down the list of minor league stats from 2011 (I always sort by WHIP then look for big Ks and/or good K/BB ratio) I find guys I never heard of: Jorge Ortega 18 yrs 74 ip 1.095 whip 5.4 k/9 ip 3.75 K/BB (I cannot find what velocity he throws, it cant be hard with only 5 k per 9 ip) Joel Dicent 18 yrs 60 ip 1.100 whip 8.1 k/9ip 2.45 K/BB (From Bernies Crew Blog: "The organization was raving about the young man last year, lauding his 91-95 MPH fastball and developing offspeed stuff") Gian Rizzo 17 yrs 64 ip 1.150 whip 9.37 k/9ip 4.79 K/BB (I cannot find velocity, but he must be 'up there' with more than a K an inning) Jorge Lopez 18 yrs is the 2nd rounder from this year, 91-93 mph fastball (well, I have heard of him!) Milton Gomez 17 yrs ... from Baseball America Aug 2010: "The Milwaukee Brewers have signed Dominican right-handed pitcher Milton Gomez for $350,000... The 16-year-old is from Santiago, with an average fastball that has been clocked at 92 mph and has shown a feel for a curveball" From a poster here ramssuperbowl99: Eliezer Montano is 6’7â€

Aside from the risk of injury, I see no reason NOT to offer Zack say 5 years x 16 mill tacked onto this year. As Briggs said, at the low end he is worth 13 a year and at the high end 20. In the playoffs you need a high, high quality 1-2. That will get you a long, long way. So you would be better to have two number 1s and 3 number 4s. So my thinking is you offer Zack. You leave Marcum alone and hope he has a great '12 so you can offer him a one year contract in the 12.5 mill cutoff range so if you lose him, you end up with a draft pick. Wolf with his 10 mill option will be interesting. I can see that as good value for next year. If you cant sign Zack, you have kind of wasted your money on Ramirez. Ramirez is a signing that says were are serious for THREE years, not just 2012. In free agency the Crew really cannot, cannot get good value on a number 1 pitcher. It was great to offer CC the 20 mill. But if you offer at the end, then you have no chance. If we do not extend Zack before the start of year, my feeling is 2013 and 2014 are the start of a prolonged period of rebuilding. Because you will be 'ok' with Yo and Ramirez and all that, but never quite good enough. Then Yo is gone and Weeks is gone and you never have a strong team. Just an OK 'old' team with guys dropping off each year. And you cannot replace the top guys with rookies. So, really Zack will be a big extension. You need pitchers who can dominate for the playoffs.

I do not know how often the other organisastions 'adjust' their new pitchers' mechanics. But I am so frightened every time the Crew drafts a guy with good/great velocity and stuff - and then says 'we are going to adjust him'. I am of the school where if a guy is so extremely talented that he is drafted, the last thing you do is say 'well, it was good luck you were so good as an amateur; but we are the pros here so we need to change you.' And I think the results over 10+ years show the Crew's coaches reworking mechanics has not been successful. The other point is our scouts just did not seem to care much about pitching. I mean they draft a guy who MAY turn out OK, but for every pitcher they drafted who MAY be OK, they drafted many more high end batters (and not fielders... ha ha). I would love our team to draft a LOT of high school pitchers in the mid, later rounds. And throw over slot or college promises at them. I can guess there are a lot of high school seniors that throw 87 - 88 mph and maybe they will GROW into 93-94 mph guys. If they do not grow... oh well. The organisation has paid a small gamble for a chance at a great pitcher (somewhere, they will snag one). And the guys themselves have proven, with say 2 or 3 years in the organisation, that they are not going to make it. And back to college they go. And they are happy they had their chance AND they get their college supported. That is just an idea. But the way we have done (badly) there sure needs to be some changes.

And in my hunting for a great RH OF bat to pinch hit, I stumbled accross Ryan Ludwick (signed with the Reds now for 2 million for a 'comeback' year). The guy was great... in St Louis, then he left St Louis and is no good. I honestly think there is something odd going on over there. Year after year guys leave and are then no good. Or guys who have become no good, sign and rekindle their lost youth... and STATS. Ok, once or twice... fine. But if it happens more, by far, than any other team Well, I think I have worked it out. They take their daily vitamins 'in the right way - the respectful way; they respect those 'vitamins' (in the right way)' Funny how the players only show the vitamins respect in St Louis. Before and after St Louis, they seem to lose all respect for their vitamins.

I have always been amazed at the 'best lineup' order projections say that 3rd is where you put one of your weaker hitters. Yet, for 100 years, your best batter gets to bat third, with the home run guy fourth. If it is reallly true, this 3rd aint too important, I would love to see Braun 2 and Gamel 3. But given history and what has been spoken by players, I suspect we will see: Hart (as said, he likes leadoff and RR likes it) Whatever correct handed batter is needed. So a Morgan/Gomez/Aoki juggle Braun Ramirez Weeks (I think he is going to have a crazy good year) Gamel - the new guy will not end up near the top and left handed here is good (against this 'tough' leftie I guess Aoki starts in right, with Hart at first; or we are in the market for a 30 game bench rightie (first base / outfield backup)) (in fact, the more you think, late in the game, when the LOOGY comes on for Gamel, RR will want a right hand pinch hitter) Gonzalez (I hope he makes cbs sportsline eat their words (see other thread that said re Yuni... out with the bad and Alex IN with the just as bad)) Lucroy (maybe he should get opportunity higher, but I think he and RR like him 8th)

I will be so happy - one way or the other - when this is resolved. It is a focus that is taking too much time and effort. And I cannot get out of my mind the picture of the Crew battling with St Louis, and some MLB guy coming up to not one, but THREE, of our guys and saying: 'by the way, there is something wrong with your tests... but not to worry, just put it out of your mind - and good luck with the rest of the playoffs.'