coolhandluke121

It's not an obsession. It's no different than wanting Hader to develop more pitches in his arsenal or wanting Peralta to improve his command. We're all fans and we want our team's players to do what it takes to improve. If someone said Hader should throw more than just fastballs and everyone started arguing with him, you're damn right that person would argue back. That doesn't make it an obsession; it's just what happens when the majority is wrong and tries to drown out a minority opinion. Calling it an obsession is a cheap tactic used to try to silence a minority opinion who's not arguing about it any more than the other side. You're just as obsessed with responding/reacting to it. I feel kind of sorry for some of you because you've obviously never been in great shape in your lives if you can't see the difference. I'm not talking great weekend warrior shape or high school athletics; I'm talking the type of fitness, conditioning, and physique that Khris is going to need to actually deserve his status as the #2 guy on a contender, emulate guys like Reggie Miller and Richard Hamilton, and not have teams like Toronto play small-ball and run circles around him.

Wow, unbelievable. It's going to be real interesting to see what you guys say when Khris actually comes out and says he slimmed down a little. It takes a special kind of person to look at that picture and still insist that he doesn't have any more tone and definition than he did several months ago. Incredibly disappointing and inappropriate for a mod to be partaking of that sort of sarcasm too. You know when you were about to argue about the collective bargaining agreement and the payroll situation, but then you stopped yourself because you admitted you didn't know much about it and didn't want to learn? You should do that now too.

So here's what Khris looks like after shedding some excess fat. Looks like playing on Team U.S.A. over the summer and having a taste of title contention has motivated him in a way that losing in the first round year after year could not. Nice.

Are the Brewers a better team without Yelich?

Sure, they can make some adjustments in the playoffs. But the larger issue is that Giannis is the only regular all-star caliber player on the team. I'm disappointed with some of the decisions they made not because I like Brogdon and Mirotic more than Middleton, but rather because keeping both of them instead of Khris would have probably been cheaper, would have left them with slightly more overall talent IMO, and (most importantly) would have left them with more flexibility for finding the right combination of vets and young players to trade for another star. Teams that are trading away a guy like Anthony Davis or Paul George aren't looking for a Khris Middleton on a near-max deal. Brogdon + Leuer on an expiring deal + picks + Brown/DDV types are much more flexible trade packages. There was a time when I thought they could lose just Brogdon and keep everyone else, but when it became obvious that they would have to lose two good players to keep Khris, I switched to wanting them to let Khris walk. I am less concerned about it now than I was because I didn't realize they were going to be able to persuade so many veterans to stay/join on bargain deals, but I still have this sinking feeling about the money the commitment they made to Khris.

Life is good.

I was irate when I realized they were going to stay under the tax threshold, but I have to admit they have an impressive roster considering they didn't pay the luxury tax. They're not as good as their peak last year, but they're good enough to win a title. And experience was probably a bigger issue than lack of talent anyway. That said, I'm a little concerned that this roster is going to be better on paper than on the court. They got a lot of pretty well-known name guys, but all of them have big question marks. None of Smith, Matthews, or Korver can replace Brogdon, and you can't just replace him by committee. I'm not even a big Brogdon fan, but every other option (except Hill when he plays with Bledsoe) has significant disadvantages compared to Brogdon without any significant off-setting advantages. The old guys are going to be liabilities at times due to declining athleticism and the youngest guys are too inexperienced or just not talented enough. Basically the Bucks already had a quantity-over-quality issue and they made it even worse. Their depth will be nice in the regular season, but a team like Toronto last season or maybe Philly this year (better top 4 or 5 guys) will still probably have a slight advantage in the playoffs.

They're a pitching-starved team that just lost their ace who they've ridden to a bunch of wins this year. Hiura, Thames and Braun are nicked up heading into one of the most important weeks of the season thus far. They're going to have to decide whether filling the 3-4 holes they have is worth it, and I won't be shocked if they decide it's not if they drop a bunch of games this week. Woodruff hasn't spent any more time as the staff "ace" than Nelson, Davies, Chacin, Guerra, or Anderson have in the past. In fact, he's probably had a shorter stint there than any of those guys did in their best seasons. And Gonzalez has had the best career of any of them. It's a team effort, and all they need is for some of their pitchers to return to serviceable career norms to weather the loss of Woodruff and improve their record. They don't need any of them to return to their career best form. It's annoying to watch them pitch like this, but it's reactionary to dismiss their chances at this point. Especially since they've slumped at least this bad shortly before and after the ASB each of the last two years as well, only to turn it around both times. They'll be fine.

Unless I'm completely wrong about what the Brewers can get for guys like Grandal, Moustakas, and/or Thames, I couldn't disagree more with the premise that the Brewers should be sellers. They are technically in the wild card game as of today, and have been in the top 5 in the NL for most of the season. They were 29 games above .500 last year and 10 games above .500 the year before, so it's no fluke. They have survived absolutely disastrous seasons by multiple solid to good players. On paper, they arguably have a better roster than they had even last year. Granted, some of the regression is almost certainly going to be persistent (Aguilar, Pina, probably Cain due to age) but by large I think regression to the mean is in their favor. And it's not like they have an obvious guy who they can trade to signal a rebuild, like Braun in 2016 or Greinke in 2012. It was (or in the case of Braun, should have been) an extremely obvious choice to trade those guys for financial reasons, long-term planning, and a good return, but none of those things are issues with Moustakas, Thames, or Grandal - unless I'm completely wrong about the prospects they can get, like I said. Just get a few relievers and roll the dice on guys like Aguilar, Cain, Burnes, Peralta, and Chacin playing better. It's not far-fetched at all, and I'd even say it's more likely than not. It's an easy choice.

I believe the $12m already account for the plus or minus 25% of half of Brogdon's salary, so it's a hard cap on the TPE. In other words, I believe ~$9.5m is half of Brogdon's salary and $12m is ~125% of that. In general you can't just trade cash in the NBA, except when buying picks. There may be a few other rare exceptions I'm forgetting, but it's not like baseball. You definitely can't include any other players. But I'm almost certain you can acquire more than one player from another team. For example, you can take a player making $7m and a player making $4m from a team. You have to resolve it all at once though. Yes, it's essentially a dump. And that Pacers pick is not likely to be good, so the return on the Brogdon deal isn't great. And they have to keep a cap hold on Brogdon to keep the TPE, so it's not as much flexibility as you might think. They barely fit their other offers under the cap, and reportedly there's a chance they might not get the TPE at all. I think we're waiting to see if Hill waived his $1m buyout as part of his new contract, and that determines whether they have enough cap space to keep Brogdon's cap hold and get the TPE. Bottom line, as much as I'm not a big Brogdon fan, I think they cheaped out overall. I think they could have kept Brogdon's qualifying offer and matched an offer after the fact. I think it's pretty suspicious that they're still very likely to be under the tax threshold for the next 2 years. I don't believe it was necessary at all. It's neither here nor there anymore, but I also would have rather had Brogdon and Mirotic than Khris. I would take Khris over Brogdon obviously, but not over Brogdon and Mirotic. But they did reasonably well this off season. I'm really relieved they got Hill for the equivalent of the MLE.

Even that Pistons team had several regular all-stars. Billups made it 5 times, Hamilton 3, Rasheed 4, Big Ben 4, McDyess 1, and heck, even Derrick Coleman had 1 though that's pretty irrelevant. They were more a testament to a team being able to without a true superstar, but they had lots of stars. Dirk had Marion with 4 all-star selections and Kidd with 10 when he won a title. They were past their primes, but still easily better than anything the Bucks have besides Giannis IMO. Tyson Chandler would also be an all-star later on and Jason Terry was at least comparable to Khris or Brook in all-star worthiness but the competition at his position in his conference was very different from what Lopez and Khris faced. The only really close comparison I can come up with is Olajuwon in 1994. Otis Thorpe made one all-star game in '92 and Cassell would make one much later, but Hakeem was amazing. I think that's the level of impact Giannis ultimately gets to, though with some differences in their game, and I think Hakeem should be a dark horse for top 5 all-time but those lists don't usually appreciate defense enough so not many people put him there.

Kawhi did a good job against Giannis but I think Giannis could have set up closer to the basket and used a size advantage if not for Ibaka or Gasol always being ready to help. In any case, the point remains that the Clippers don't have nearly the same defensive presence at the 4 or 5. Murder on the perimeter though. Can't hide anyone on Danny Green against them. I don't really agree with the "no excuses for Giannis" mindset. The only "excuse" he needs is the fact the entire rest of the roster has 2 combined all-star berths for their entire careers, and both of them borderline cases at best. Lopez averaged just 19 ppg and 7 rpg on slightly above average efficiency for the Nets in 2012-13, but he was the leading scorer for a good team so he got the berth despite Joe Johnson and Deron Williams clearly being better players IMO. And I think we all know Khris made it because everyone felt the Bucks had to have two all-stars this year and the PPGz will often get you in even when you don't really deserve it. When you think about it, it's almost unprecedented to accomplish what they did with only one star. Robinson and Hakeem had similar success with, respectively, Elliot and Thorpe as their nominal "sidekick", but they didn't lead their team to an all-time great regular season. And Robinson had Rodman. Giannis was great, but I see people blaming him and am always reminded that no good deed goes unpunished. It's pretty obvious that the Bucks lost the series primarily because of bad shooting on the perimeter, which in turn rendered Giannis less effective. Heck, you could argue the best defender on Giannis the entire series was Bledsoe. If anything, this means no more excuses for Lopez, Bledsoe, and Middleton.

You can acquire multiple guys for the TPE, just like you could have acquired multiple players from Indiana in the Brogdon deal - up to the amount of matching salary you're allowed to take in the deal. As far as I know, exact terms of Brogdon's deal aren't out yet, so I'm not 100% sure on all the calculations. But regardless of his exact salary next year, Brogdon is definitely a "BYC" player (huge raise, Bird Rights are salary cap exceptions for keeping your players, the NBA got tired of it being a loophole for signing and trading them) so the Bucks would only allowed to take back half his starting salary in the trade. But there's a margin of error of roughly +/- 25%, so I assume his starting salary is about $19m and 125% of half of that is about $12m.

I don't argue with people because of who they are or because of past interactions. Heck, I hardly even notice who is posting. I argue for what I believe. I pretty much agree with everything you said. Kawhi and Paul George are amazing. Some of my most heated past arguments have been about Harden vs. Giannis, so you know how much I value defense... among other issues with Harden. I would give Kawhi the defensive edge over anyone since Pippen on the wing. Paul George, Iguodala, and Tony Allen are decent. The Clippers are a tough match-up for the Bucks because of small-ball, but they don't have bigs like Gasol, Siakam, and Ibaka. I think it's revisionist of the media and fans to stay Kawhi stopped Giannis; aside from a few highlight blocks, he mostly just slowed him down enough for the help defender to come. The great defensive rotations of their bigs, especially Gasol, was the biggest factor. Gasol is an incredible defender. Not as athletic as Hakeem or Robinson, but he's a true savant with his rotations and timing. Kudos to OKC for basically giving up on winning with Westbrook and George. Westbrook is extremely flawed IMO. I don't think it matters much where they trade him. They would be very lucky just to get rid of his salary. He's just not a fit on a contender, which is a big reason Durant left in the first place. His fit is putting up gaudy numbers to carry a mediocre team to the playoffs, but sometimes the hand you hold is the hand that holds you down; he just isn't a great fit on most contenders that don't need him to play so much hero-ball. I don't like how the East always stays weak. I kind of wanted Kawhi to stay so they could have a rematch next year. I look for Indiana to be a huge threat, just because of how good I think Oladipo is. It will take time for him to return to form, but if he's good by the playoffs, their seed won't matter much.

You can't combine players with a TPE. Think of it as completing the trade with the Pacers; they were allowed to take back ~$12m in salary in that trade, but they didn't, so they have a year to take back ~$12m in salary in a single trade to make up the difference. It might help to think of the new trade as basically being completion of the Pacer trade. For example, if you take $12m in salary from Minnesota, it's as if Minnesota was part of the Brogdon trade in a 3-team deal. But you can't change the fundamental terms of the original trade by adding someone like Ersan to the TPE. The privilege is basically a delay in when you take back that matching salary in a one-time deal, but no other modifications of the original trade are allowed. The time to get Korver was 2 years ago. He would have been perfect but it's too late IMO. Would much rather complement veterans with the young wings.

Not allowed to have George Hill on the roster under any circumstances if they stretch his $1m cap hit from his previous contract. Difference of $666,667 or whatever, so the premise is right. Honestly not sure how switching to non-Bird rights affects anything, but not gonna take this person's word for it if they don't know about the rule I mentioned above. Regardless to how it got done, Horst figured something out. Huge part of his job is fully understanding how to work the CBA guidelines/rules. Be interesting to see what he managed to do. That guy might have been right about switching to non-bird rights, but then I don't understand how they could get a TPE in the deal. Worth noting that Hill's deal is the same as a 3-year MLE deal. He must have had MLE offers from other teams and told the Bucks that's what it would take. ETA: sounds like they don't get a TPE. That's why I was surprised they had enough cap space for Hill's deal. Didn't account for the option of changing his cap hold in this fashion.

Not allowed to have George Hill on the roster under any circumstances if they stretch his $1m cap hit from his previous contract. Difference of $666,667 or whatever, so the premise is right. Honestly not sure how switching to non-Bird rights affects anything, but not gonna take this person's word for it if they don't know about the rule I mentioned above.

I don't know man, you're the one who's the expert on the CBA. I'm not on Twitter. Was just asking if someone had news of a waive/stretch that I didn't know about yet. I have changed my mind about which one player I would prefer to lose if they have to lose one, and I have a right to since a lot has changed since that Brogdon post from mid-season. But I've been consistent about only wanting to lose one. In January, that was Brogdon. When they got Mirotic and then when I realized Khris was going to get a lot more than I thought he was worth, I changed to him because there's no way in hell he's worth a max. But I have consistently said I wanted to keep as many guys as possible, and they could have kept Brogdon and Mirotic for the cost of Khris. Two for the price of one trumps all differences between the players they risked losing, but at least Mirotic and Brogdon aren't as important as Hill to next season's record IMO. And the kept the 3 who I think help the record the most (Lopez, Hill, and Khris in some order). Could have kept 4 though.

First off it was only $17m more than his $1m guarantee so I don't see why people keep saying $19m. Secondly, his expiring contract for trade potential was a big part of wanting him back. Thirdly, this shows that not waiving him would not have cost that much more anyway. But I am surprised they free up enough cap space for Hill and Lopez, and that makes it a lot better. Still would take Brogdon and Mirotic over Khris any day of the week but this could have been worse.

Not sure how they have the cap space to give him that. Did they waive/stretch someone? ETA: Guess Leuer could give them almost exactly the first year of a contract like that. But 3 years?

Traded player exception and the Bucks have a very big one. I think it's pretty straight forward, they can take back money in a trade...as well as a number of other things. I don't think it's that big. Pretty sure it has to be half of Brogdon's new salary, i.e., the same amount of salary they could legally take back in a sign-and-trade involving a BYC player. It also can't be combined with other players to make it bigger. Not a lot of good players making ~$10m being given away for trade exceptions these days. Besides, it's a little too uncanny that they managed to stay just a smidge under the luxury tax when it's all said and done. Far from a given that they'll use the TPE.

They are keeping everyone else. The lost Mirotic and probably Hill. When I say everyone else, I mean everyone else. Not some subset of everyone else that prioritizes two B-level talents over 3 others.

I was not. Why do you keep saying that? You asked me if I still "want to give him the max" and I corrected you. All along I said he was worth 4/$100m and I might go as high as 4/$120. I'm not going to go find it but is it really that hard to believe you confused me with someone else? Saying it again doesn't make it true. I never said it. Really unbecoming of a mod to twice assert that someone said something they never said.

I agree it's a bad move(disgrace I withhold for something a bit more serious). But no, you thought he was overrated and you didn't want them to pay the luxury tax 4 years in a row. Again, I wanted to trade him so they could keep everyone else. I didn't advocate trading Brogdon so they could save 10's of millions of dollars, which is what they've done. For god's sake that's exactly what I've openly feared all along. What's so hard to understand about that? I've always advocated for keeping as many of their guys as possible and paying the tax. At mid-season, my first choice was to trade Brogdon so they could keep everyone else. That switched to Khris when it became clear he would get a near-max deal, but the point is that I just want them to keep as many players as possible and not be cheap. And they've been significantly cheaper than even I feared they would be. And my plan to let Khris walk would have had them back under the tax threshold in just one year.

They're just worried about their profits. Milk the city for an arena and then leave them high and dry with a half-assed attempt at keeping a legit contender together.