8/11/08 Nationals (Mock) at Brewers (Bush): 1:05 PM CDT

[brewcrew00]

OK, we get your exaggerations, endaround.

[eanelson4]

Kappler batting third for the win!

[sheethead]

Counsell over Branyan over and over and over and over again is mind blowing to me. I would seriously like to know the rationale going into this manager's decisions. Good thing someone gave him the template for the lineup. 2B, SS, LF, 1B, RF, 3B, CF, C, P. Just plug in the players Ned and you're good to go.

 

Anyway, go get a win boys. I have a feeling we are going to need a solid game from Hart to get the W.

[brewcrew00]

Branyan does have twice as many starts as Counsell, and has logged 110 more innings. It's not like this has been the theme of the season.

[giffted1]

Anybody who thinks that Counsell in stead of Branyan is ok should be fine with Kapler replacing Braun. After all the drop in offense is less and the defense improves!

Once again, comparing apples to oranges. I do think Branyan should be in there, but the difference between Branyan and Craig defensively is much greater than the difference between Kapler and Braun defensively.

 

The fact that Counsell is in the game reduces the likelihood that the W shows up in the win/loss column.

By how much? I really have no idea but I'd guess that it would be single percentage points or lower. Probably not worth complaining about every time it happens.

[Oldcity]

Kapler hitting third, Counsell hitting sixth. Which team is the terrible one again? Couldn't tell by today's lineup.

[Fear The Chorizo]

LF Willie Harris
SS Pete Orr
3B Ryan Zimmerman
RF Austin Kearns
CF Lastings Milledge
2B Ronnie Belliard
1B Kory Casto
C Wil Nieves
RHP Garrett Mock

4 years ago the Brewers lineup looked something like this - it could be much, much worse!

[trwi7]

Anybody who thinks that Counsell in stead of Branyan is ok should be fine with Kapler replacing Braun. After all the drop in offense is less and the defense improves!

 

That's exactly right. And Kapler wouldn't be as big of a drop in offense from Braun as Counsell is from Branyan.

 

Kapler- .304/.335/.497/.832/ AB per HR 30.17

Braun- .300/.339/586/.926/ AB per HR 15.47

 

Counsell .226/.321/.304/.625/AB per HR 168

Branyan .252/.340/.588/.928/AB per HR 10.92

 

You can't tell me that Counsell's defense is the difference between the huge gap in their offense.

[endaround]

OK, we get your exaggerations, endaround.

It isn't an exagerration. Braun and Kapler would likely have very similar OBPs going forward with Braun slugging around .580 and Kapler .450 for .130 difference. Branayn if platooned would likely have a higher OBP than Counsell, but even assuming a.330 OBP for both, Branyan's slugging would be about .500 to Counsell's 310 for a 190 pt difference.

 

[rluzinski]

Why is it an exageration?

 

Counsell: .226/.321/.304/.625

Branyan: .252/.340/.588/.928

 

Now, it's not reasonable to assume Branyan can keep that SLG that high. .475 might be more realistic. The sad think is that Counsell is hitting at right around his preseason projections!

 

To dismiss the difference in offense between Counsell and Branyan as no big deal allows you to dismiss the offensive differences between most of the players on the team.

 

I think people have just been brainwashed into thinking that Counsell isn't that bad of a hitter. In reality, at this point in his career, he's terrible.

[brewcrew00]

I'm aware he's a terrible hitter, 6th spot isn't where he should be, I get that. I do think the argument can be made that his defense is worthy of him being in the lineup just as much if not more than Branyan, especially with a team that historicly struggles on defense. Counsell's career FP is 20 points higher, and he also has a much higher career RF (given Counsell has seen the majority of his chances, assists, and put outs in the middle of the infield).

[sheethead]

The bottom line is Craig Counsell should not be starting on this team right now. Not now, and barring an injury, not for the rest of the season.

[endaround]

I'm aware he's a terrible hitter, 6th spot isn't where he should be, I get that. I do think the argument can be made that his defense is worthy of him being in the lineup just as much if not more than Branyan, especially with a team that historicly struggles on defense. Counsell's career FP is 20 points higher, and he also has a much higher career RF (given Counsell has seen the majority of his chances, assists, and put outs in the middle of the infield).

Thing is Branyan has a better RZR than Counsell has at 3B this year(yes sample size). But the fact is Counsell no longer has the arm for 3B and his extra range just isn't that much of an issue there.

 

[Bring Back the Stein]

I think it's because Branyan has a rib problem, in that there are no good places to get Memphis-style ribs in Milwaukee.

[brewcrew00]

I can see that. So would you be more open to Counsell logging time up the middle?

[rluzinski]

And if Yost is trying to maximize defense, Counsell should be starting over Weeks and Durham at 2B, where the defensive advantage is greater and offensive difference is lower.

 

OK, I'm done polluting the IGT, promise!

[B2k1121]

Isn't this the type of pitcher everyone says the Brewers struggle against? The unknown recent call-up?

 

On edit, maybe he isn't a recent call-up.

[endaround]

I can see that. So would you be more open to Counsell logging time up the middle?

Sure, though he shouldn't lead off but that's a far more second order concern.

 

[sheethead]

I can see that. So would you be more open to Counsell logging time up the middle?

Sure, though he shouldn't lead off but that's a far more second order concern.

 

That is where he would fit in the template. You can't mess with the template.

[joepepsi]

Saw a blurb somewhere the other day that Rickie is hitting approx. .315 since the Durham acquisition.

Rickie in 81 plate appearances since the All Star break:.284/.395/.433 .828 OPS

[brewcrew00]

Right, my point was the Durham acquisition, like being sent down, is what triggered his better play. Even still, the numbers you posted aren't all that bad.

[Ennder]

Weeks has put up a line of .284/.395/.433/.828 since the all star break so I'm still confused as to why people complain when he is starting at this point.

[jhart05]

Weeks has put up a line of .284/.395/.433/.828 since the all star break so I'm still confused as to why people complain when he is starting at this point.

 

 

They can't get past what he did (or should I say wasn't doing) to start the season.

[jwill535]

The problem is that 2/3 of a year Rickie is bad and 1/3 of the year is decent in the last couple years.

[jhart05]

Well then, here's to hoping we are seeing the return of the "August/September 2007 - Rickie Weeks"!!!