Does MA force Arnold to keep Burnes so we finish ahead of CC and the Cubs?

[Scooterfletcher]

I have a feeling Mark “needs” this coming season to have us finish ahead of CC and the Cubs and obviously Burnes helps in that.  Thoughts??

[Frisbee Slider]

I think that is a credible thought. Brewers would love to beat the Cubs in 2024.

Even without a grudge, I think there is merit to keeping Burnes in his final season.

[bigred]

If the Crew doesn't get a couple big veteran bats to help the offense, having Burnes would definitely help, but I don't think they would finish ahead of them anyways. Just my opinion. 🤷‍♂️

[Frisbee Slider]

12 minutes ago, bigred said:

I don't think they would finish ahead of them anyways.

Just a gut feeling? I don’t think the Brewers got worse in the off-season and the Cubs definitely did not get better.

We barely had Woodruff last year. And we did not have Santana or Canha until the deadline.

[MrTPlush]

I doubt it motivates them any more or less than it had prior. If the offers aren't crazy good, you still get a draft pick after the season. It also helps avoid the team plummeting into the abyss of 90+ losses, which can be pretty damaging to attendance etc.

They never seemed super interested in a fire sale after last year, even after Woodruff was dropped.

[Team Canada]

9 hours ago, Scooterfletcher said:

I have a feeling Mark “needs” this coming season to have us finish ahead of CC and the Cubs and obviously Burnes helps in that.  Thoughts??

No.

[wibadgers23]

9 hours ago, Scooterfletcher said:

I have a feeling Mark “needs” this coming season to have us finish ahead of CC and the Cubs and obviously Burnes helps in that.  Thoughts??

I agree with the premise but I think it has more to do with Mark A and company wanting to compete in general. I think they’ve decided to make one last run in 2024 before hitting the reset button next season.

[Underachiever]

I don't think so. One thing that I have learned is that fans often have way more emotion into these matters than the front office types. The Brewers will try to win the division, regardless of whether it is with or without Burnes. 

[Outlander]

If Mark really needed to finish ahead of the Cubs he would give Arnold a larger budget. Even with Burnes they are well below last year's salary.

[TURBO]

2 hours ago, Frisbee Slider said:

 

We barely had Woodruff last year. And we did not have Santana or Canha until the deadline.

and we don't have any of them now either...

If we don't have the production replaced that they offered us after acquiring them, there is a pretty good argument that we have gotten worse...

I'm choosing to believe that we do not go into the season with Jake Bauers as our starting 1B, there is just no way that happens...........................................right?

[monty57]

I hope Attanasio doesn't let his emotions get in the way of "the baseball people's" opinions. The last time he did that, we signed guys like Lohse and Looper "to remain competitive." He seemed to have learned the lesson and has let his GM make the baseball decisions and it's worked out pretty well. Making a move to get back at Counsell for going to the Cubs would be a really bad decision.

Plus, Burnes is projected to be a 3.8-3.9 WAR guy. Assuming we'd get a 1-2 WAR replacement, we're talking a relative difference of of 2-3 wins. If someone believes that we're a rebuild team without him, then they can't believe that we're a playoff team with him.

I believe that Attanasio is going to try to be competitive no matter what. If we keep him, then we should be signing a few guys to fill the holes on the roster to really "go for it" this year. If we're trading him, then Attanasio will still try to build a competitive roster in '24. He's not going to throw in the towel unless he's sure the fight is unwinnable.

[Jopal78]

I doubt the owner’s involvement extends to dictating actual personnel moves. I don’t think Brewers would have been able to achieve what they have in the last 20 years with that degree of meddling and NOT have it been reported on. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

1 hour ago, Outlander said:

If Mark really needed to finish ahead of the Cubs he would give Arnold a larger budget. Even with Burnes they are well below last year's salary.

well the Cubs are currently well below their 2023 team payroll at the moment, too - maybe the Ricketts and Mark A are having a contest to see who's the cheapest??

[stalton]

I think it was Lovie Smith who said that his only goal of the season was to defeat the Packers. Facetious or not, the Bears did not construct their roster to beat the Packers. 

Not that some people don't act out of spite or other emotions but I have to think people like MA don't get into the position they are in by being spiteful.

[Matt Breen]

The implication is that Mark A wants to spite the Cubs - and thus Counsel due to his leaving the Crew for Chicago.

No. That has nothing to do with it.

What may be on the table is Mark A 'forcing' the team to be competitive, and defeat the Cubs, so we can make the playoffs. I can see that happening. But it's nothing really to do with spite. It's about wanting to win - and the Cubs are in our division - so we want to beat them. Burnes helps us - a lot - with that task. 

So again, Mark A might put out a directive saying he wants to keep Burnes - but for the reason of winning. That they beat the Cubs and Counsel would - no doubt - be sweet - it's foolish to think Mark A makes such decisions based on sheer pettiness. 

[TURBO]

I think MA wants to stick it to CC in a very big way!  I mean, he's a competitive guy, I just can't imagine that the thought hasn't crossed his mind.

Will sticking it to CC be a driving factor in moves for the 2024 team?  Probably yes and no.  I don't believe that MA will risk the future of this team to beat the Cubs/CC this year, but there has to be a little bit of it in every big move.  Maybe he will loosen the purse strings a little bit to drive his need to not allow CC to win the Central, but I don't see him breaking the bank, or doing anything that will upset the team in 2025 and beyond.

[Underachiever]

2 hours ago, stalton said:

I think it was Lovie Smith who said that his only goal of the season was to defeat the Packers. Facetious or not, the Bears did not construct their roster to beat the Packers. 

Not that some people don't act out of spite or other emotions but I have to think people like MA don't get into the position they are in by being spiteful.

Lovie said the "number one goal" was to beat Green Bay, not the only goal. Big difference. And again, since the Packers were at the top of the division, it made sense. 

[Playing Catch]

I think, if anything, MA would want to keep the Cubs down EVERY year. If the Cubs win in 2024, only to have the Brewers win again in '25, '26, and '27, I think he'd be fine.

[Oxy]

6 hours ago, Playing Catch said:

I think, if anything, MA would want to keep the Cubs down EVERY year. If the Cubs win in 2024, only to have the Brewers win again in '25, '26, and '27, I think he'd be fine.

Assuming he plans on being the owner in '25, '26, and '27...

[bigred]

23 hours ago, Frisbee Slider said:

Just a gut feeling? I don’t think the Brewers got worse in the off-season and the Cubs definitely did not get better.

We barely had Woodruff last year. And we did not have Santana or Canha until the deadline.

Yeah, mainly. I think it's just a matter of time before the Cubs start spending this off-season. Hope I'm wrong. 

[sveumrules]

5 hours ago, Oxy said:

Assuming he plans on being the owner in '25, '26, and '27...

Think that’s a pretty safe assumption at this point.

Have to imagine the already started only going to get worse RSN situation would be a mitigating factor to any potential sale discussions since it introduces quite a bit of uncertainty with regards to projecting future revenues. 

[patrickgpe]

I don't think MA is as meddling as he was when he first bought the team, so I think the answer is no. I will assume that they just haven't got the right offer and not that he is being forced to keep him only to beat the cubs (plus I don't accept the notion that Corbin alone would be the difference in that).