HiAndTight

Yeah, that's great news. It makes the pieces fit much-much better. And it's tough to find someone at 42, but certainly not impossible. A guy like Karim Mane, a 6'6 freak athlete from Canada who hasn't really played against much competition yet would be my ideal pick. Scouting report talks about what a hard worker he is, a grinder, but he's also an explosive athlete. You figure a guy like that should at least be able to turn into a good defender and contribute and maybe you hit on him and he's a 2nd rounder who develops into more. Markus Howard is another guy. He's not going to be a starting PG, but if he can come in and provide some instant offense....might be worth the 60th pick.

That wasn't directed at you at all. Just among Packers fans, I don't they really appreciate how good Linsley is. He might be the best player at his position in the NFL and he plays an important position. I agree, he's the most easily replaced and I even suggested Jenkins taking over the job at Center. If he was a College Center, it makes a lot more sense to me to play him there than LG. He's actually looked so good at Tackle this year though...I might play him there. I think he could be a Pro Bowl caliber player at either Guard spot, Center(since that was his position in College) or at RT. It just makes sense. The most important positions on the OL go LT, RT, C, LG, RG. So if Jenkins can play all of them, put him at RT or Center. We also two young guys who we haven't seen yet in Hanson and Stepaniak. Stepaniak was drafted knowing he'd miss this season after he tore his ACL at the end of last year. I thought he was a guy that people thought could be a 3rd round pick before tearing the ACL before the bowl game. So they've got depth and a lot of options. Ideally, they'd lock up all of them, but that's not possible. When you sign your LT for 23 million, you're not going to be able to pay your Center 12 or so per year and then Jenkins will only have 2 years left after this and I'm sure they'd like to extend him earlier than later. So maybe they surprise us and sign Linsley...but it seems unlikely.

Worth noting, Amos has rallied very well after his very slow start. PFF now has him ranked as the #15 safety overall, so that rating has climbed significantly over the past few weeks. The Packers do have an out on his contract after this year, but he's a player where I'm not sure you can take the $4 million you save and use that to replace him effectively. Yeah, that's kinda what I'm getting at. Ideally, his contract would be 4/32, but the intangibles there, the continuity on the backend, having a smart, reliable player, a pretty sure tackler, it's worth the slight overpay. Not Packers related, but what in the hell are the Seahawks gonna do with Jamal Adams? You give up 2 1st's and he's basically become a 2 down LB'er who can't cover. And he's most effective as a pass rusher... Will they just bite the bullet, admit they made a mistake and move on? Or double down and pay him anyway?

I'm more concerned about the cap being maxed and no 1st round picks for years to use as trade collateral. Really reduces our flexibility. And I just realized that this trade puts Thanasis as our 6th man... Yeah...again, this isn't a criticism of the trades, but my concern is the same. You're pretty much doing what the Cavs did with LeBron. When you have a superstar like Giannis, it's worth it, but...the Spurs should be everyone's model on how to build and not be overly aggressive. If you have the luxury of knowing your star is staying...you can be more patient and or not have to overpay for talent like we did with Holliday. It's really going to be interesting to me to see what players are willing to come to Milwaukee to play with this team. The older guys who want to wing another ring(or just A ring). Guys like Crowder, Matthews, I've heard Serge Ibaka's named thrown around as someone the Bucks could target with that MLE. Frank Mason, Cam Reynolds, Sterling Brown...we'll likely buy at LEAST 1 2nd round pick, probably 2. Horst said they wanted to get more top-heavy. They didn't want 10 good guys, they wanted to focus on improving those core players. They definitely did that.

The cost is really contingent upon the contracts of Giannis and Jrue. If both sign, the picks are likely not that big of a factor. If they don't sign, then you're just dead in the water for 4-5 years. Like the Nets after the Celtics trade, minus the potential to sign Free Agents. So you're talking about what COULD be 5 really rough years worth of picks that the Pelicans own or have the right to swap with you. I don't think anyone's saying they'd rather have the 1sts and lose Giannis. Bottom line, we probably overpaid for Holliday, underpaid for Bogdanovic, but I think if anyone had been presented with the idea that we'd get BOTH of those players for Bledsoe, Hill, DD, Wilson, Ersan, 3 1sts, and 2 swaps, they'd have jumped at it. And again, we still have a ~4/40 contract we could hand out...and I believe a bi-annual exception. My guess is they split up the MLE on a couple players...they definitely need a PG. But either way, this is the best starting 5 the Bucks have had since they sent a certain HOF'er to the Lakers in the 70's. So...we want our teams to go for it, the Bucks are doing their part now.

My mistake. I knew Jrue was just shy of 30had just turned 30, but I thought he was a little older than Bled. It wasn't a criticism of the trade though. Holliday has that Rondo gene. Regular season...not a big difference between the two, but in the playoffs, he's been so much better. Just watched First Take though...which I certainly don't do to get informed, but rather for the entertainment. Steven A is still arguing he's right and the Bucks should trade Giannis at the deadline. He's turning into Skip Bayless. I never thought he was a great analysis before....but now he's just saying REALLY nonsensical stuff just to fit his previous arguments. I actually expect Giannis will announce an extension in the next week or two. I don't know if it matters when he does it. If I was the Bucks, I'd try to keep it quiet because I think players like Joe Harris and Dragic and others might be gotten for cheap this off-season if the big players are holding onto that Cap room hoping they can sign Giannis...I'm still hoping the Bucks are willing to push it a bit further and use that full MLE on one more piece, but we'll see. But what I KNOW is not happening is that the Bucks are NOT gonna trade Giannis at this trade deadline!

This is all true...the only thing I don't love is we're DEFINITELY backed into a corner now. Even if you get Giannis and Holliday to re-sign, it would appear you've given up pretty much any chance to develop your own talent in the near future. So that and losing DD kinda sucks...but to be able to put a PG on the court that's not a liability in the playoffs is worth it. If Giannis was already signed, not sure you'd have given up quite so much for Jrue, but...Griffin knew he had some leverage. It's a lot to give up to get basically an older version of Bledsoe who doesn't suck in the playoffs...but I'm pretty excited. I'm also pretty confident we can use the MLE to get another nice piece. Also, Cam Renyolds was a guy I thought had a chance to contribute last year. Now with the depth severely diminished with us being a far more top-heavy team, I'd think he'd get a shot. Probably not looking at the same type of regular season out of this team, but the post-season should be a lot less frustrating. Hopefully Bled figures it out for the Pelicans.

Man...this has me a bit torn. You've really handcuffed yourself from improving your team in the future...Holiday and Giannis are both FA's, you've given up most of your 1st round picks for the foreseeable future, DiVincenzo is a REALLY nice young glue player to me. But you add another All-Star caliber player, one who can defend, get to the rim and shoot it, you add a SG who can get his own shot. Screw it, this is just exciting. If we lose Giannis, this team was going to likely be miserable anyway. So you add two guys who are clear upgrades and you STILL have the MLE to go out and maybe get a Jordan Clarkson type player? And I'd assume the Bucks will be looking to buy a couple of 2nd round picks. This might be the best year to do that with some guys who might end up going later than expected due to the cancelation of the College season?

Linsley is so underrated. I agree he's likely a cap casualty after signing Bahk, but I think he's going to be missed badly. He's been arguably the best center in the NFL the last couple of years and it's such an important position. I wonder if they may move Jenkins there(with Patric backing up). If you're not playing Jenkins at Tackle...you might as well play him at Center. It's more important than Guard and harder to find. Kirksey should be gone. I hope he does have a great second half and gets himself paid next year, but I think we're good enough at LB'er. Martin, assuming he can stay healthy has been awesome when he's been healthy. Barnes is a nice player as well. Summers provides nice depth and we've got all those draft picks we didn't part with. Wagner is likely gone. Lowry-Not sure. He'd only save you 3.5 million. But if you look at Shelby Harris, he signed for roughly that with the Broncos and would be an ideal fit in Green Bay(Milwaukee Native). He had a breakout year last year and then somehow still had to settle for a one-year deal. I'd gladly trade Lowry for Harris and it'd be that much better if you could do it without it costing more. King has a ton of talent and he may end up becoming a stud elsewhere, but he has only shown flashes in Green Bay. If he'd sign for 3/18, I'd like to see that happen, but I think a 6'3 CB with his talent will fine one team that's willing to pay quite a bit more. Preston Smith-I would look to restructure first. Ask him to take a pay cut and restructure. He should be able to read the tea leaves and understand he's not going to get 16 million on the open market. But they'd have to figure that out before his roster bonus is due. Amos-He's overpaid but not sure you're saving enough to move on from him...especially if you're already losing King. Since they decided to hold onto all their draft picks, I'd like to see the Packers take some shots in the draft. A guy like Reggie Roberson Jr, someone who was a potential day one pick prior to suffering a knee injury, someone who can be used in Tyler Ervin's role but is closer to DeeBo's size and skill set. He's probably more likely to be a 4th or 5th round pick now. Tyler Shelvin DT LSU-Opted out. He was the best run-stuffer in the SEC, but has had problems with his weight....ballooning up to almost 400 pounds from his ideal playing weight of ~340. And Justyn Ross, the WR'er from Clemson who was considered right up there with Chase as the top WR'er in the draft but had spinal surgery for a congenital fusion...that would take him off some teams draft boards, would drop him down to a 2nd or 3rd for some teams. That's a guy who is back in pads, but won't be able to participate in any contact until next year. But at 6'4...he's an All-Pro talent and a guy who'd normally go in the top 10. This off-season is going to be unique. Between the uncertainty surrounding the cap, all the players opting out and players who have suffered serious injuries, this off-season is really going to give this front office a chance to distinguish itself.

I agree, especially since we're just talking about the short term. The owners are still going to get the players to make some concessions since they could just hold the threat of a severely reduced cap that would crush FA's salaries, but the owners themselves are going to suffer in this case. You'd have to imagine they've got some idea of what the Cap is going to go up over the next 3 years or so. So if you believe the Cap is going to take this massive leap to 260 in 2022 based on revenue sharing, you can limit the future increases to offset the loss of revenue this season. Again, just based on how teams are behaving, it's obvious to me that they understand the cap won't be as high as they thought it would before Covid, but that they understand it'll likely be higher than the minimum they agreed to before the season.

This is what's really baffling to me. I understand not trading for Will Fuller(especially if the cost was a 2nd round pick). But to not go out and add a guy like Davlin Tomlinson or McLendon or Shelby Harris(who's really quietly a stud)...that just doesn't make any sense to me.

I don't know, it's possible his cap hit next year is not very big. Look at Preston or Za'Darius Smith's last year. Both were under 8 million I think. So his cap hit may go down. And I'm sure the Packers believe that the Cap WILL eventually shoot way back up after Covid. If these vaccines come through, it may even be as soon as next season that fans are back. Plus...I've always been convinced that they'll take steps to mitigate how big the drop is in the Cap. Teams were preparing for a ~240 million dollar cap. I really doubt they go with a 175 million dollar cap. Maybe they'll limit how much it goes up over the next 5 seasons or 3 seasons. But teams have not really pulled back on these types of deals. Bosa getting a 5/135, Ramsey getting 5/105(from a Rams team that was already a little cap-strapped) for example. These owners(and Murphy) have to have some indication that the Cap's not going to go down next year or I don't think they'd be making these moves.

Yeah, I wouldn't consider 4 blitzing...but I also didn't make note of how many times they only rushed 3 today. I don't think I've watched a game less intently than I watched the game vs the Jags. Just a bad game. I've also kinda written off Pettine. Obviously, I hope they can go on a run and win a SB, but even if that somehow happens...I really hope Pettine's gone. I'd MUCH rather go back to Capers and more than that, go to really any other DC in the NFL. I don't agree with the idea that our personnel is not a good "fit" for the 3-4...I just think our coaching is uninspired and we're missing just a single 34 DE from having the pieces in place. It has been nice to see Keke and to a lesser degree, Adams playing better this year though...

Sorry, I just strongly disagree. They whiffed on the valuations, then had to adjust after the fact to 'save face'. But, just IMO, of course. What are they supposed to do when they're wrong if they don't update their valuations? Just put an asterisk next the player noting that the value is wrong? Kinda. Yeah. I'd respect that more than "well, now that they're traded we need to re-address their valuation."

Did they blitz? I thought they rushed 4 on the last two snaps in particular. I mean...it was such a dull game, I erased it, but I'm pretty sure they just rushed Gary, the Smiths and Clark. 4 man rush. Pretty standard.

From Rob Demovsky; If you think David Bakhtiari's deal means the Packers won't be able to re-sign any more of their pending free-agents, GM Brian Gutekunst said this: "This actually gives a little more flexibility to move forward." I think it's unlikely they'd extend their All Pro LT at age 29 and then just rip apart their roster the following year.

Just going to reiterate this point...but this type of ideology leads to marginal players(usually). I'd rather they use their 1st round pick on someone with a higher upside who may take longer to reach it. The Spurs for example...seldom drafted for need and they drafted several studs late in the 1st round. Does anyone really think someone we pick at 24 is going to make a difference next season? Especially at Guard?

Have to think the Mets (with new ownership) are going to be in the think of it.. The Mets would be the most obvious team, but I'd imagine a lot of teams are still going to be interested in Lindor. I don't think things are so dire that a franchise player like him will be a salary dump. I love the guy though. Kinda a shame Cleveland can't keep him.

I said 11-5 earlier in the thread, with the wiggle room of a game each way. I'll take that wiggle room, and put them at 12-4. I see matchup issues with the Colts and Titans, but they "should" beat their relatively soft remaining schedule outside of those two. 12-4 sounds about right. I think between TWO Bears games and the Titans and Colts, we'll lose two more games.

They've traded down several times in the 1st as well though. In fact, he's actually picked up a 1st from trading down in that trade. I don't think the problem has been trading up or trading down.

Did they really try though? I suspect their definition of try is "take our low ball offer or forget it". Looks to me like Gute is Ted Thompson 2.0. Content to just be a second tier also ran year after year. It's so frustrating watching every other Super Bowl contender making moves to improve their team for the championship push while this organization is content to sit on their hands year in and year out. Just once can they go all in? Remember all the "would you rather" talk about either winning a Super Bowl and sucking for the next 10 years or being a contender every year and not winning one? Alot of people picked the latter. I suspect after today that number has significantly dwindled. I think Thompson was better about addressing needs in-season. That's not saying much, but it's a low bar. I just don't understand this. I don't know how much each player cost. Maybe the Texans wanted a 2nd for Fuller. That's too much. Maybe the Jets a 1st for Williams. I think that's fair, but I get if they don't. But there have to be SOME teams that were willing to trade. A 5th for Dalvin Tomlinson would have almost certainly got the Giants to bite and or McLendon. But we didn't even hear rumors about the DL the last few days. It seemed like Fuller or nothing. 11-5...they'll win a playoff game and then likely lose in the 2nd round or maybe the NFCCG. That's probably our ceiling. Edit-Oh...to answer your question...I don't know if they really tried. But when you're the GM of a team that doesn't have an owner in a revenue-sharing league like the NFL, trying doesn't mean much. You have a all time Great at QB. You need to actually get something done. If the Bucks can't or the Brewers can't make moves, I'll understand. The Packers really have ZERO excuses for not upgrading at least one area of this team. Desmond King was traded for a 6th round pick. Same with Avery Williamson. Both would have helped...even if they weren't big needs.

Unbelievable. I didn't actually lose faith in this front office until right now. I was fine with the Love pick. They'd talked about him, they reportedly really loved him, no pun intended. I was good with Gary. He was a freak athlete at a premier position. I'm fine with being a forward looking team and constantly building through the draft...but you can do that AND also address OBVIOUS needs now. This team was(and maybe still is, but I suspect they'll again fall short) of being a true SB contender. A Dalvin Tomlinson, Williams, hell, even a guy like McLendon would have helped this team out a lot. But while SF, NO, TB and all the other contenders make significant moves...at least we can say we tried again. We TRIED to sign AB this year. We TRIED to trade for Fuller. We tried to...everyone else must just be trying harder.

I agree. But they've played 3 games combined. OSU just beat PSU who lost to IU in week 1. I think it's premature to say that nobody can even play with them. Especially after we saw Mertz play so well.

That really was the most baffling thing about that Era. The one thing I'll say about Sherman as the GM, he did go for it. He went out and signed Joe Johnson, and it looked like that was going to really put that defense over the top. You had KGB, Vonnie Holliday, Cledius Hunt(who was still good before he got the big deal and REAL lazy) and then Joe Johnson who had a pretty clean injury history and had been very productive. But ultimately, he was a bust. That was a couple of years after Jamal Reynolds(who I thought was a Wolf pick despite being technically a Sherman pick). The whole Holmgren leaving because Wolf wasn't ready to hand over the reins though was handled about as poorly as possible. But we had a HOF QB who got us to 10+ wins just about every year.

It has to be. When they said he had surgery on a core muscle but wasn't going to sit out the whole season AND that he opted to have the surgery instead of hoping it healed on its own, it seemed really clear that it was a sports hernia. That'd be huge to get him back. He adds a real physical presence to this offense. He's really a very skilled TE as far as I'm concerned. The offense looks pretty good to me if we can get him back, get healthy. It just one of the two young big WR'ers steps up...if EQ can gain a little confidence, that could make a big difference. If MVS could show a little consistency(he doesn't even have to be great, just...decent) that'd be great. They don't both have to be studs. Of course...Rodgers has to trust more than just one WR'er and Ervin has come back as he's apparently just irreplaceable.