ilikewisco

And some people just need new angles to defend him when their original stance proves wrong.

All I care about is what he does at the plate next year. If he's back to his MVP self, that is good enough for me to take him at his word. If not, I'll always feel he wasn't completely truthful about his use. If he is putting up big numbers and there is no more rumors every other month, he has convinced me. Until then I will still be skeptical. Edit: I would feel this way if he made this statement in a live presser or to my face. He's obviously a good liar.

I don't think he'll be a .220 hitter, but I don't think he will be a .330 hitter either. I don't think he will be the power threat he has been clean. It's just my opinion but I wouldn't be surprised to see a .270-.280 20-25 hr guy from here on out. That is still very good, but not what he was. And I agree with Bruce, their is a difference between what guys are using now versus then. I just believe what they are using now helps them more than just to stay on the field. Which I believe it helps with that as well.

What I don't understand is how people can say PED and steroids do not improve a player's game. Look at what McGuire and Sosa did, Bonds, Caminiti, etc. Its pretty obvious there is a plus to PED use, otherwise they wouldn't risk it. I would trade him if they can get a good return, otherwise just see what he can do clean. I fear it isn't much though. Definitely not worth what Milwaukee will be paying him.

Found this in a Ken Rosenthal piece linked in MLBTR's. Thought everyone might enjoy. GREINKE TO HIS CATCHER: YOU’RE GONE! Los Angeles Dodgers right-hander Zack Greinke is famously blunt, but even catcher A.J. Ellis was taken aback by an exchange he had with the pitcher during a Sunday afternoon game in San Diego in late June. The Dodgers were struggling at the time, so Ellis enlisted Greinke, a student of the game, to play GM. Neither was playing that day, so Ellis told Greinke during batting practice, “Let’s figure out how to make the team better.” Greinke replied, “Let me think about it.” Then, while sitting on the bench during the game, he informed Ellis of his solution. “The first thing I’m doing is trading you and signing Brian McCann,” Greinke said, referring to the Atlanta Braves’ catcher, who is a free agent at the end of the season. Ellis, who is earning $2 million, said that Greinke also has told him that he is pricing himself out of the Dodgers’ plans, as if such a thing is even possible. When I asked Greinke about that, he denied the charge. “He’s not pricing himself out,” said Greinke of his teammate, who has two years of arbitration remaining. “He’s not a home-run hitter. Home-run hitters are the ones who price themselves out.” TRUE COURAGE Some athletes are best remembered for heroic actions off the field. Ellis indeed has only 21 career homers in 912 at-bats, but he doesn’t take offense at Greinke’s candid assessments. Indeed, the debate over Ellis’ value has become a running gag between the two. “He’s probably the most refreshing teammate I’ve ever had,” Ellis said. “I’m enjoying every second with him.”

Terrible call! Why does Roenicke not get out there and argue that?

I think we will no longer see the homeruns. The ball jumped off his bat. When I first witnessed it I thought it was an amazing, god given gift, though I did have my thoughts that it might not be. Being that it is so out of the norm for a player to be able to do that, I am more convinced it was PED aided. I don't think we will see near the power he's shown from here on out. And with that lost power I'm sure he will be pitched differently. I just don't think we will ever see a season like 2012 out of him again. I do hope I'm wrong though.

I'd go with the composite decking, much less maintenance. Anyway, that was not me you are quoting there. I believe he was admitting to PED use.

I think we probably just disagree on this and that's not going to change, but by your reasoning we shouldn't have trials or rules of evidence in this country because prosecutors would never indict somebody if they weren't convinced they were guilty. Furthermore, MLB still has a grudge from when he beat them via arbitration in 2011; they were utterly convinced that he took PEDs even before the Biogenesis stuff broke, so they were going to put the hammer on him whether or not the Biogenesis evidence was sufficiently good to pass muster as proof that he was truly guilty. Agreed, we are coming at this from two totally different perspectives. Neither is wrong so we'll just agree to disagree on this one. And I doubt we will ever know one way or the other the way this has went. We can agree that we both will be pulling for Braun when he does come back next year no matter how this plays out.

Hard evidence is a 65 game suspension, he already was convicted. I'll still root for Braun when he comes back next year and I would have been way more upset if this happened during a contending year. I'm just disgusted by his selfish motivation for trying to cover it up, he made his bed now he's gonna have to lay in it. I don't feel like he's been victimized at all. I also think this was not an isolated incident so I am very worried about his production going forward. I know that is just suspicion, but that is how I feel. If MLB wants to let everyone use PED's that is fine with me, but as of now they don't. Braun did something to warrant a 65 game suspension, so that makes him a cheat. Edit: In the eyes of the MLB he was 100% guilty, otherwise he would not be suspended. There is no such thing as 75% guilty or innocent, so why use percentages. You're either guilty or innocent of breaking the rules, no gray area.

I just want one thing to be clear, you think MLB would do this to Braun even if he were 100% innocent and did completely nothing wrong? If that is true I think you are letting your hometown bias sway your judgement way too much. I understand why he would take the suspension now, its pretty obvious. But I don't think MLB would go this far against a player if they weren't positive that the player were breaking the rules. And if they did ban him for life and he were completely innocent I'm sure the players' union would have his back. I just don't agree there is even a 2% chance, I would call it zero, that they could ban an innocent player for life.

SRB, so you think Bonds was totally clean as well. I agree there was collusion to make him retire, but come on. I like Bonds and think his reasoning for using was pretty sound if the rumors are true. All I'm trying to say is you keep insinuating Braun is clean and many other players have been guilty in public opinion for far less. If you want to feel that way its fine with me but don't insult our intelligence for disagreeing with you.

MLB steamrolled him alright. They probably didn't have any evidence at all other than a scrap of paper from Biogenesis. Somehow they used no evidence and Jedi mind tricks to steam roll Braun into sitting out over 60 games, losing millions, millions more in endorsements, and incurring the wrath of fans, media, and players for years to come. Yea, makes sense to me. I'm sure if you were threatened with a career-ending ban that would cost you >$120,000,000, you would be eager to stand strong on your principles in order for baseball writers and people on the internet (who already hate you) not to be mad at you. Makes sense. You have went round and round with this same tired argument. If he did nothing wrong he doesn't take the suspension. When he finally does admit to doing something wrong will you finally eat crow? Because right now you are saying Braun is a victim of MLB and never did anything wrong. If you do believe that you are blinded by your mancrush on Braun. MLB is not going to go this far and hand out a suspension to someone who is innocent. And if he was innocent he would have never taken the suspension. Its not that hard to grasp, cite one report where MLB was colluding on a lifetime ban and forced Braun to do this. By the sounds of it Braun knew he was caught and finally faced the music, while looking like a complete buffoon in the process.

Well, chock up Aaron Rodgers as an unquestioned devourer.

You say there is no conspiracy then a few sentences later lay out an elaborate conspiracy. If he's not guilty he doesn't take the suspension. Say you were accused of theft or battery that you did not commit. Would you fight it to the end to prove your innocence? Now relate that to Braun, if he did nothing wrong why in the world would he roll over and take the deal? It does not make sense no matter how you spin it. And you can say he is dealing with MLB not the justice system, but I highly doubt the MLB has it out for an innocent man who did nothing wrong. And I doubt they could build a case against him to make him take a deal if he did nothing wrong.

No, I want to trade him because I don't think he will be the player he was. I'm guessing he was still juicing last year and that is what this suspension is about. I guess we will see next year.

I think this contract is going to be a huge blunder in the long run. They should move him when he gets some value back. If he's not juicing I don't think he will be nearly as consistent as he had been, with injuries and performance. And I agree admitting would have been the way to go, he just looks like a cheat and liar now. Even if he did lie after the appeal win, he could have done it much more modestly. He looks like a tool now.

We keep two hitters and pitchers. I have Greinke and Price for keepers, so I'm not considering any of those guys. If Peralta has a good start today I will keep him and just drop Skaggs I think. Like I mentioned earlier, we do farm systems too, so when I drop Skaggs I won't be able to pick him back up until he's over 50 ip's if he's still available. Another fantasy player took the Dbacks for their farm system. I still might just drop Turner too. I know he's the best of the bunch right now but the Marlins are terrible. I'm not sure what I'm gonna do. I have to decide by tonight. Edit: I dropped Skaggs, so now he will be great the rest of the year. 8/9/13: Just wanted to throw this out there and see what you guys think. I traded Trout, Tulo and Jacob Turner for Stanton, McCutchen, Segura, Matt Moore and Beachy about a week and a half ago. It's a 2 bat, 2 arm keeper league, so I hated losing Trout, but I got so much back I thought I might as well do it. Of course, Moore went on the DL the day the trade was final, but I still think I made out ok. I'm still the first team out of the playoffs with about a month left to play. So if I don't make the playoffs, this one is going to sting. Anyone feel I made a mistake losing Trout?

I have Skaggs getting called back up to start Monday and I need to make room for him. As of now he is on my NA list but I will have to drop him or one of Cashner or Jacob Turner. Cashner starts Monday as well, so I would miss his start for the week so I am leaning toward Turner. Both play on bad teams and Skaggs should get more wins with the Dbacks so I want to keep him. I have Cobb who should be back soon and Morrow, who I have no idea about. So two of the three will be gone soon anyway. And when Morrow is back I will probably get rid of the third unless they are doing really well. Any feedback would be appreciated. Edit: I forgot I have Peralta as well. I will probably drop him after his start tomorrow. And advice would still be welcomed. I'm not really sure how to rank Turner/Cashner/Skaggs/Peralta. I think Turner should be kept but the Marlins are terrible.

Thanks, I think I'll go with the M's and hope both Walker and Hultzen make it up this year or start next year in the rotation. Hamilton would have been a good choice but I don't see any other players worth keeping an eye on for the Reds. I liked the Cards cuz Martinez and Wacha should hopefully both be starting at some point this year and I would have a chance for Taveras at the start of next year. But no Taveras this year and possibly not next year (if he surpasses 120 AB's) makes it hard to take them.

We do a draft of farm systems at the all star break. You get first rights of anyone who keeps rookie status up to the draft next year. The Cubs, Astros and Twins are gone and I'm next. Debating between the Mariners and Cards. I was leaning toward the M's but Walker may not be up this year and Hultzen is shut down as of now. It would be a no brainer for the Cards, but we get one NA spot and the guy who had the Cards last year has Taveras on it. The good thing with the Cards though is if he doesn't reach 120 AB's this year I can hold over Taveras next year. Any advice would be much appreciated, not sure what to do. Considered Dbacks but not sure if Davidson or Bradley will be up this year. Any teams I'm overlooking? Suppose to make the pick soon so sorry for the late notice.

Someone needs to make a gif of Maldonado giving phantom high fives in the dugout. That was pretty funny. On a side not, not a big fan of Francisco. He looks like he doesn't even wanna be out there. He looked like someone kicked his dog when he got hbp today.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4hs6bBLvu1r6aoq4o1_250.gif

Jesus Christ!

http://i.imgur.com/R7abH.gif