ramssuperbowl99

You know how many career games Martin Prado has in RF? 1. He's not a RF. And I can't believe we are in an era where people still use batting average. There is nothing otherwordly about Prado's .350 OBP and .450 SLG. He's a decent player who, when he plays 2B or 3B can rack up some value. But he's not a RF. Still waiting on those RFs who can replace Hart.

Hey, your the one that started looking at small sample sizes when you compared Hart to Braun, Fielder and Pence. Let's look at larger sample sizes and compare those players, I'd be glad to. Yup, Reyes has missed more games than Hart and is a bigger injury risk - but he plays a premium defensive position and plays it well. Not to mention he turns quite a few walks/singles into doubles throughout the season...... guy is a special talent. Again, I'm not trying to rip on Hart but if we have to move him to get Reyes..... it's a no brainer to me. There are holes in Hart's game. As for who I would replace Hart with - I'd try to work a trade with the Braves for Martin Prado in exchange for Hart, although that could get complicated as the Braves are looking for salary relief...... but that is the guy I would target and he is on the block. He can play the infield as well - bring Hairston back and a I already love the versatility we have off the bench as well. Then I would target a guy like Kubel or Cuddyer - will probably get a $5-$6 million dollar contract...... if he lasts in FA, he could go even cheaper on a 1-2 year deal. Both those guys can play 1B/OF. Dump McGehee for a prospect - let Loe walk, that would free up some additional funds as well. Could always explore the idea of trading Wolf as well (and trying to get Jurrens in the Braves package). That is spending about 10 minutes thinking about it...... like I said, I don't think Hart would be the hard to replace in terms of run production. Especially if you replaced him with a plus defender like Prado. I'm not trying to compare Hart to Braun or Fielder - we all know who the worst player is in that bunch. I'm just trying to say that Hart has been an 8 win player over the past 2 seasons. And the fact that he makes $9 M this year is hardly a burden given that his production is worth nearly $20 M per season. I see on the games played. So SS's on the DL are more valuable than RFs on the DL, especially when that SS is likely making double (and triple the contract length) of the RF. That makes sense. Martin Prado isn't a RF (doesn't have the arm) and doesn't hold a candle to Corey Hart offensively. And we save about $4 M dollars in the process. That's a terrible trade since between Taylor Green, Casey McGehee, Rickie Weeks, Jose Reyes, JHJ and Ryan Braun, we'd be trading Hart for a guy to ride our bench. Jason Kubel can't play RF since his ankles don't work. He's out. That and the fact that offensively he doesn't compare to Hart either (his wOBA is about 40 points lower). Cuddyer's wOBA doesn't really compare to Hart's either (.329 in 2010 and .354 in 2011 versus .369 and .373). And with -10 DRS in his past 1100+ defensive innings in right, he's not a defensive upgrade over Hart either (Hart is -2 DRS in his career and was +1 this year despite how bad he looks sometimes). Still waiting on those RFs who we can replace Hart with.

You win with good baseball players, not just with power. The Orioles were 4th in baseball in HRs, the Reds had 2 fewer home runs than the Brewers this season, the Nationals and Indians each had more home runs than the 102 win Phillies did. You don't need power, you need good baseball players. While good baseball players are often good home run hitters, that's not necessarily the case, as baseball players can provide value in a ton of ways besides the home run.

Not going to get into a WAR debate. If you want to believe Hart was a top 50 positional player in all of MLB last season, have at it. All I'm saying is that it would be far easier to replace Hart with a cheaper option than it would be to find anyone close to Reyes talent........ at any price. If getting Reyes means we have to trade Hart and replace him......... I've got no qualms. Hart's defense is terrible and he's missed about 50 games over the past 2 seasons....... he also hit .236 with 2 outs and RISP ( Braun .315 and Fielder .299) this past season...... I appreciate what Hart has done as a Brewer, but he can be replaced with a FA option. If it's so easy to replace Hart for cheaper, start listing names. And I love how you criticize Hart's durability, then say sign Jose Reyes, who has missed 15 more games than Hart over the past 2 seasons and played in only 36 the year before that. With men on base, Hart OPSd .850. That's damn good. But I appreciate your 50 PA sample size (where Hart also OBPd a respectable .344). In 2010 Prince Fielder hit .212 with 2 outs and RISP. You wanted to replace him too right?

Reyes would have way more value to this team than Hart does. While Hart's production at the plate would tough to replicate, it wouldn't be that tough to find a replacement that has fairly equal overall production. Finding anyone close to Reyes talent at SS? Not going to happen. Yes, I say this while knowing Fangraphs and WAR loves Hart - but real life production leaves a lot to be desired imo. I'd have no problem taking a flier on a bounce back candidate or a lesser name if it meant landing Reyes. That's right, I forgot, WAR isn't 'real life'. Since 2010, Corey Hart has the same number of HRs as Ryan Braun. He has the same slugging percentage as Prince Fielder. He's got the same OBP as Hunter Pence. That sure leaves a lot to be desired...

The Mets are bankrupt and have pretty much said he's not coming back. (The exact quote was "letting other teams set the market") The Marlins are in on everyone and have said their top priority is starting pitching. To me, that says they are just doing their due diligence on Reyes. It's pretty amazing, at least in my opinion, that the market for Reyes appears to really involve the Brewers. Who would have thought the day would ever come where we'd be talking about New York's high priced free agent prize coming to Milwaukee?

If we offered Narveson, Gamel and Merklinger the Marlins would keep laughing. It would take a package around a Wily Peralta - LoMo might not be their favorite player but top 20 hitting prospects are more valuable than a 5th starter, below average 1B and organizational player/middle reliever. I think you are really undervaluing Narveson. He is only a 5th starter on our team. I see him as a 3/4 pitcher who is relatively cheap for the next 4 years. Also as a lefty he hold a good value for a team the competes with the Phillies(lefty dominant hitters) in their division. All that being said Marlins love cheap and i think that would hold great value to them. He's 30 years old, losing velocity on his fastball, striking out fewer, and walking more with a career ERA of 4.6 in 400 IP with FIPs and xFIPs of 4.1. He might be relatively cheap, but he's going to arbitration starting next year, he's about to enter his decline phase (if he hasn't already), and he's not that good to begin with. In fact, last season Ricky Nolasco, Josh Johnson, Javier Vazquez and Anibal Sanchez all were substantially better (Nolasco in FIP and everyone else in just about every pitching statistic measureable). He's a 5th starter, not just for the Brewers, but for just about anyone. So no, the Marlins aren't going to trade a young OFer/1B who has had a fair bit of major league success already, has 5 more years of team control, and was a top 20 prospect in all of baseball for Chris Narveson and some throw in pieces. And if they do, they all deserve to be fired. It's a laughably one sided deal.

While it is unlikely, no one had Chapman becoming a Red either. I'd love to bring him in, but it would force the organization to move Hart to 1B, which apparently they aren't interested in.

While I agree that it would take more, I don't think I would take TOO much more. Narveson has 4 more years of control and would be a needed lefty in their rotation. Even if we included Gamel & Merklinger I would still be in favor of it. If we offered Narveson, Gamel and Merklinger the Marlins would keep laughing. It would take a package around a Wily Peralta - LoMo might not be their favorite player but top 20 hitting prospects are more valuable than a 5th starter, below average 1B and organizational player/middle reliever.

Bradley was 91-94 mph, showed good arm action, stuff, and command on his offspeed pitches. Got a K, 2 routine GBs to SS (and one of them was booted), then a K. Really impressive.

I haven't been around as long on this forum - I started following the link report sometime in 2010. That said, I really appreciated everything you did bringing all of this information together each and every day. Thank you. I wouldn't know half as much about Brewers minor leaguers if not for you. Best of luck moving forward.

Or let one of them battle for a spot and move Narveson to the bullpen. No reason to trade from your SP depth if you don't think you have to. Also, why on earth would we trade Marcum when his value can't possible be lower? He has injury rumors that are unsubstantiated and posted an ERA of 9 during the past 6 weeks. Why not wait for him to reestablish himself (which he will).

Morgan's career triple slash line is .288/.347/.374. So, while he's not a .300 hitter, he's close enough that it doesn't matter. And his career numbers say he's worth 4 wins per 162 games. So, that's not just a starter on a team trying to make the playoffs and win, that's a very good core piece on a team trying to make the playoffs and win. He might not slug for power, and I wish he'd walk more, but he plays great defense at a valuable position and gets on base enough to be an incredibly valuable piece. To think otherwise is to just basically ignore all of his performance thus far in his MLB career.

[quote author=rawbecht wrote: [/b]Hamilton - 3.4 (7.2 in 2010) Teixeira - 2.5Gonzalez - 3.0 (5.2 in 2010) I'm not really sure why Teixeira is so low with 39 HR and 111 RBI. Probably cuz his OPS was .835 (with avg under .250). Anyway, you just upped that number to 2.6 and I'm not sure why since the original talk was about Gamel being a 2.0. And you keep throwing out names that Gamel obviously won't compare to, 2 of which don't even play 1B. However, I will throw some 1B out there that I think he could compare to. Hosmer - 2.3Freeman - 1.7Goldschmidt - .6 (in 177 PA so about 1.8-2.0 in full season) I don't think he'll hit for as much avg as Hosmer or maybe even Freeman (I see Gamel around .270). He also won't put up as many HR as Hosmer did but I see him right around 20. He'll probably get on base about the same as the others, around .340. Then I think he'll slug around .460 for a nice OPS around .800, which is where all three of those guys wound up. Gamel is a few years older than these 3 but I also think that gives him a bit of an edge with more experience. Ultimately, Hosmer will most likely be better than Gamel (Freeman and Goldschmidt might wind up better too) but I think the seasons they had last year are about what we can expect from Gamel.You said he might be 2 WAR with the bat. Those guys had about 20 BRAA. And the reason Tex is so low isn't because he was good with the bat, it's because he's a 1B! He loses 12.5 runs because of that. If you think Gamel is going to have an OPS 80 points above league average, more power to you. But that 80 point difference is the same as the difference between your projected Gamel line and Robinson Cano.

So you wanna keep Yuni but bring in a new CF, 1B, SP, RP, and 3B? And not only that but the CF must be "solid" offensively and defensively, even though that's exactly what Morgan is. And the 1B must be able to hit for power and average (so Prince?). The SP must be an ace and the RP must be a stud. Sorry but we're not the Yankees/Red Sox/Phillies. Not only are these players not usually freely available, they also cost a lot of money. There's no way to get a stud at every position. The CF platoon is more than solid offensively and defensively. A 1B who hits for power and average will usually cost a lot in terms of money and/or prospects. The cheaper guys are the ones who hit for one or the other (power - Branyan-type or avg - Loney-type). Obviously there are only a limited number of ace SP so they will also cost lots in terms of money/prospects. Same with the stud RP. The Brewers have to do the best they can with what resources they have. That would be leaving CF as is, giving Gamel/Green/possibly McGehee/Hairston 1B/3B, and upgrading SS and another arm in the pen.The CF part is the most hilarious/absurd. The Brewers ranked 6th this season in CF WAR with an even 6.0. Morgan, for his career, is a 4 win player per 162 games and is under team control for 3 more years. To even suggest that we need any change in CF is bordering on insanity.

Barmes is a plus defensive SS and Gamel is an unknown quantity defensively as a 1B. For the record, people aren't contributing WAR on offense or defense, all of those stats are measured against the average, then total replacement value is the 20 runs or 20 wins per 650 PAs. Anyway, let's say Gamel is scratch with the bat, which is what you meant to say (since 0 BRAA + replacement adjustment = 2 WAR). And let's say, because we have no idea how good he is at 1B, he's scratch there too. 0 BRAA + 0 UZR/DRS - 12.5 runs for 1B positional adjustment + 20 runs for replacement adjustment = 0.75 WAR In order for him to be a 2 win player, he'd need to be a 5 run defender and contribute 7.5 BRAA. That would mean raving reports about his defense, which aren't there, or he's going to completely go off at the plate, to the tune of 12.5 BRAA. Which is about Jay Bruce, Brian McCann, Andre Ethier, Eric Hosmer, Logan Morrison, JJ Hardy, and Nelson Cruz territory. Yeah, good luck with that. And calling a guy a 1.5 WAR player with a 2 WAR ceiling is not "hating" on him. Nor is saying the organization shouldn't look to upgrade on that player. He's not a superstar and he's almost assuredly not going to be a superstar. The sooner BF.net gets that through it's head, the better. For the record, WAR isn't a universally-calculated stat like BA, OBP, SLG, etc. Sites like FanGraphs, Baseball Reference, and Baseball Prospectus all have different ways to calculate it. I was using baseball-reference and they list an offensive WAR and defensive WAR. Since they listed Barmes at a 1.4 oWAR for last year (with a .244/.312/.386 line), I figured Gamel should be able to get a 2 oWAR. Granted, SS was a pretty poor position for offense last year but I still think Gamel will be able to produce relative to his 1B counterparts as Barmes did to his SS counterparts.oWAR includes the positional adjustment, so that would mean Gamel would need to be .6 better than Barmes, plus the SS adjustment, plus the 1B adjustment, which is about 2.6 oWAR in total. Once again, the comps for something like that are Josh Hamilton, Mark Teixeira, Carlos Gonzalez, and other players who are just quite simply miles better than Mat Gamel.

This. I don't want a 32 year old lefty signed to a 5 year deal, but it would never hurt to look and see what he's being offered and try and low ball him.

Yeah I know, it's almost like we're on a website comprised nearly exclusively of Brewers fans. [/conspiracytheory] I don't disagree with giving Gamel a chance if we can find a 3 win SS (Barmes would be great). But there are people on here claiming that looking into Andre Ethier is foolish because we have Gamel. That's absurd. If you have a chance to upgrade, you take it. If Mat Gamel starts the season in AAA, it's almost assuredly a good thing for Brewers fans because that means we have some established MLB player in his spot. Is this what the Gamel-hate has been about? Because one guy said he didn't want Ethier and his salary? I think everything being equal, a lot of people would take Ethier over Gamel. However, once you factor in Ethier's contract compared to Gamel's, along with the fact that we'd have to give something up to get him, I'd still take Gamel. And even with the state of the Dodgers being what it is, they aren't just going to give a guy like Ethier away. So obviously if there is a chance to upgrade, you do it. However, I don't think giving up prospects and having to pay Ethier likely $10+ mil is worth the slight upgrade. And yes I think Ethier would only be a slight upgrade over Gamel. edit: I'm also confused again as to how you think Barmes will be a 3 WAR player (which he's only done once, although it was last year) but you don't think Gamel can be a 2 WAR next year. If Barmes was a 1.5 WAR on offense last year, I think Gamel should be able to be a 2.Barmes is a plus defensive SS and Gamel is an unknown quantity defensively as a 1B. For the record, people aren't contributing WAR on offense or defense, all of those stats are measured against the average, then total replacement value is the 20 runs or 20 wins per 650 PAs. Anyway, let's say Gamel is scratch with the bat, which is what you meant to say (since 0 BRAA + replacement adjustment = 2 WAR). And let's say, because we have no idea how good he is at 1B, he's scratch there too. 0 BRAA + 0 UZR/DRS - 12.5 runs for 1B positional adjustment + 20 runs for replacement adjustment = 0.75 WAR In order for him to be a 2 win player, he'd need to be a 5 run defender and contribute 7.5 BRAA. That would mean raving reports about his defense, which aren't there, or he's going to completely go off at the plate, to the tune of 12.5 BRAA. Which is about Jay Bruce, Brian McCann, Andre Ethier, Eric Hosmer, Logan Morrison, JJ Hardy, and Nelson Cruz territory. Yeah, good luck with that. And calling a guy a 1.5 WAR player with a 2 WAR ceiling is not "hating" on him. Nor is saying the organization shouldn't look to upgrade on that player. He's not a superstar and he's almost assuredly not going to be a superstar. The sooner BF.net gets that through it's head, the better.

Yeah I know, it's almost like we're on a website comprised nearly exclusively of Brewers fans. [/conspiracytheory] I don't disagree with giving Gamel a chance if we can find a 3 win SS (Barmes would be great). But there are people on here claiming that looking into Andre Ethier is foolish because we have Gamel. That's absurd. If you have a chance to upgrade, you take it. If Mat Gamel starts the season in AAA, it's almost assuredly a good thing for Brewers fans because that means we have some established MLB player in his spot.

Yes. One group is collectively a bunch of homers. The other is a guy who views players objectively with no bias that I'm aware of. If I turned the clocks back a year, I'd find that the consensus on this forum was that Aumary Rivas was a back-end big league starter.I think the point he was trying to make was that because we follow the Brewers a lot more closely than a national guy, we'd probably have a little more insight. And just because we like the Brewers doesn't mean we're blind and automatically support anyone in the organization. If that was the case, we'd all want to keep Yuni. If anything, I think some people here are a little more down on certain players because they see them so much. The national consensus is that Greinke is a true ace and Marcum a solid 2/3, while some here think Greinke is no more than a 2/3 and Marcum is a 4 and should be traded. An example from me is Corey Hart. A lot of people think he's a very good player but from watching him every game, I see his defensive liabilities, his inconsistency, and his love of the low-and-away slider and I don't think he's that great (a solid contributor for sure but I wouldn't care if he left). There have also been other players throughout the years that people here haven't been high on. Like I said, just because they play in this organization doesn't mean we're obligated to like them. As for Gamel, it seems like all the naysayers have to go on is his 200 PAs over 3 years and the fact that he is 26 and hasn't been called up yet. The people who think he will be good are basing it off of his actual very minor league numbers in his career, as well as having seen him play. If anything, he should at least be given the chance to prove himself with some consistent playing time before you write him off. I'm also confused as to your feelings on him. You bad-mouthed him all thread and then in your last post said he has a chance to be a 2 WAR player (despite saying earlier he wouldn't be a 2 WAR player).This season I'd peg him for about 1.5 WAR at true talent. More down the road, I'm thinking he can be a 2 win player. Sorry, should have made that clear - 2012 Gamel is below average, peak Gamel is about average. And I miss the part where calling him that is trashing him. Cost-controlled league average players are good, I mean, by definition that means 15 or so teams don't have a starter as good as yours and you couldn't pay your starter less if you tried. I think you also missed the point on my "homer" comment. If we took a hypothetical poll on Brewer prospects' peak seasonal WAR on this forum, then compared that to notable outside baseball writers (fangraphs, baseballprospectus, keith law, whoever else), I bet the latter are closer. Brewer fans overrate their players all the time (other fanbases do too and there is nothing wrong with it, but it still makes their opinions less reliable IMO).

Well Pujols is 31 so I'm not sure how he removed himself from the Pujols discussion by that statement. Because he'd be paying for 7+ years of Pujols outside the 27-32 age range.

He does have credibility - he gets paid to write about baseball. He's also someone objectively looking at Gamel instead of some blatant Brewer homer. If all I had to go on with a player was Matt Klassan's opinion and BF.net's collective opinion, I'm taking Klassan's. I also don't get how I don't think Gamel has a future. He has a chance to be a 2 WAR player - that's good! That's a valuable piece that I'm excited to have. And the fact that you would "not necessarily pursue" an upgrade for your baseball team is insane. It's like saying, "Well, we could make the team better, but...nah". And, as for your plan, why Gamel over Taylor Green? That makes 0 sense to me Really, you wouldn't take the collective opinion of a group of people that have likely seen and researched Brewers players more in 1 day than 1 guy has spent in his "writing" career. I wasn't specifically referring to just you. No, I wouldn't put a lot of time and effort to try and upgrade the 1b position. I never said anything about the rest of the team, but twist my words if you must. What has Taylor Green done to have earned the 3rd base job?Yes. One group is collectively a bunch of homers. The other is a guy who views players objectively with no bias that I'm aware of. If I turned the clocks back a year, I'd find that the consensus on this forum was that Aumary Rivas was a back-end big league starter. Your plan was sign Ramirez - I'm assuming that means at 3B since you don't like upgrading Gamel. And all Green did to earn a 3rd base job was hit better than Gamel. Not sure why you want to go and bring in an outside candidate in spite of Green, but at the same time not even pursue bringing any 1B in.

Well, clearly you were trying to support your argument by posting a random quote from somebody who might appear to have some credibility. So, obviously you think his opinion matters in the context of this discussion. Obviously there are those who prefer to stick with Gamel this season and those who think we need to upgrade and some who think Gamel has no future. Count me as somebody who thinks he still has a future, and we should give a chance while being open minded to an upgrade but not necessarily pursuing one. I'd much rather put time and resources into signing Barmes, bringing Ramirez to play 3rd or upgrading pitching.The sky can look red sometimes, I rarely call people idiots, and if I did, it really shouldn't matter to you. He does have credibility - he gets paid to write about baseball. He's also someone objectively looking at Gamel instead of some blatant Brewer homer. If all I had to go on with a player was Matt Klassan's opinion and BF.net's collective opinion, I'm taking Klassan's. I also don't get how I don't think Gamel has a future. He has a chance to be a 2 WAR player - that's good! That's a valuable piece that I'm excited to have. And the fact that you would "not necessarily pursue" an upgrade for your baseball team is insane. It's like saying, "Well, we could make the team better, but...nah". And, as for your plan, why Gamel over Taylor Green? That makes 0 sense to me

Wow, I didn't know Matt Klaassen was a MLB GM!! Great, he works for Fangraphs, how nice. I'd say his opinion matters about as much as yours or mine. When did I say anyone's opinion matters. And whether they do or not, it doesn't mean that the opinions aren't right or wrong. If the only opinions worth discussing are the opinions that matter, we should immediately shut this site down. That's like me saying, "the sky is red" and you calling me an idiot. Then I say, "Oh who cares it's not like it matters!"

Ryan Howard's situation was different, and, if you remember correctly they traded a hall of famer to make room for him. It's also worth pointing out that Howard was at the height of his prospect status when they traded him, unlike Gamel who hasn't been relevant on the national prospect scene for 2 years now. I also see no reason why the Brewers can't sign more than 1 guy or spend more than $12 M this offseason, yet everyone here is under the assumption this is all we have. Playoff revenue and TV revenue should manifest themselves in a $90 M payroll this season. Obviously Gamel + good shortstop > Ethier + below replacement junk. That wasn't what I was arguing.