TheCrew07

Anyone who's actually read what I've posted will know that I coveted Marcum in 2008 prior to his injury and thought Melvin should have traded for him or McGowan straight up for Overbay instead of going for quantity MLB talent., This is like a bad joke... this trade is 3 years too late and they want to extend him if he pitches well? Seriously? Marcum is still a good pitcher, but he's already past his prime physically, he's no longer the young pitcher that could run the ball up there over 90 MPH.... fngraphs has his average FB velocity for 2010 at 86.9. He's always been a pitchability guy, but he'll be 29 next season, so color me unexcited, especially given that we gave up one of our a very select few impact bats in the minor leagues. Those who said this is a typical Melvin move nailed it, he traded for another proven pitchability guy. I would have preferred someone with a higher ceiling or someone on the proper side of the injury nexus for a potential impact bat. Again, I like Marcum quite a bit, I always have, but physically he's a #4 or #3 type pitcher who pitchers like a #2 because of his smarts... he mixes in that change very effectively. He's also at the age where we should expect his numbers to start to slide a bit each year and I'm extremely concerned that the Brewers will extend him if he's pitching well. I desperately want to avoid multi year contracts with pitchers over 30 who's FB velocities are already below average, and it appears Melvin has set the stage for another one of those contracts. Objectively this will be a better deal for Toronto if Lawrie pans out at all. They traded a quality pitcher at the right time for them for all the right reasons and received potential impact talent in return, who also happens to be Canadian. From the Brewer perspective they traded away a potential impact bat for 2 years of an aging pitchability guy... as much as I like Marcum, he's just not a guy I would have targeted at this time.

The article doesn't mention the Brewers signed him first then released him again... *sigh*

I'll simply say it does the Brewers no good to trade pitching for pitching when the solution and there aren't really other options behind the prospects being moved. I like our prospects as much as anyone but I'm really not ready to hang my hat on Scarpetta, Peralta, and Odorizzi today. If they were healthy and finishing off solid seasons in AA sure, but none of those guys has a full year above A ball yet. Every move Melvin has made has shortened the competitive window of the team, every single move, even Sabathia. What good would a playoff appearance in 2011 be just to slip even farther down the scale of ineptitude in 2012? There is a rather large segment of the posting community here that is incredibly short sighted, only being concerned with 1 season at a time. That's fine, but realize what you are calling for and then have the common courtesy not to complain after the fact.... like so many people who were in favor of all or the majority of the moves Melvin made up through 2009. but then complained all 2010 about the rotation. I have much more respect for people who vehemently disagree with me but at least stand their ground than all these people who's opinions change as the fortunes of the team change.

He might have had his finest season, but he's already 26 years old, there's a couple of guys like him every year. 1 good season in AAA doesn't mean he deserved more playing time than he got. I wouldn't be surprised if Escobar and Gomez bad mouthed Macha to Cruz, I felt Macha did everything he could to crush Escobar's confidence. Getting back to Cruz, that's certainly nothing you say publicly unless you're certain it's true, and I'm not sure he spent enough time with Macha to spout off like that. I also wouldn't mind if he wasn't with organization next year, his comments rubbed me the wrong way and he only posted a .723 MiLB OPS in his 10th minor league season. Go whine somewhere else, Escobar put up a .762 OPS at the same lvl at age 22.

No, no I'm not. I'm talking about building a pipeline of talent that can cycle around itself, both through the draft and through trades. Melvin acquired all of 1 young projectable starting pitcher in his tenure in Milwaukee, this fact has been well documented previously and I see no reason to revisit the issue here. Once again no I'm not. Parra has no value as a starting pitcher, no one is going to take him in a a trade and think they can insert him into the rotation. Be patient? Let the process run it's course? You can't undo what's already been done, there are no do overs here. Look to move the organization forward, all we've done is spin our wheels since 2007. No, it really doesn't... what matters is the value we've gotten back. I've previously said I value players in this manner... starting pitchers > position players > relief pitchers. I see no value in dumping any prospects for relief pitchers, they just aren't very valuable. I'd rather be trading up on the scale than always trading down. Prospects will absolutely fail, that's why we need depth instead of pinning all our hope on the 1 or 2 prospects that have actually made it through the system. Trading 3 pitching prospects away for less than 3 years doesn't help Milwaukee fill any holes, we end up with the same exact problems the following year. There's no magic here, if you don't address a hole with a long-term solution, it remains a hole. The rotation is in the exact same state as it was in 2006 and 2007. No progress has been made. What? I've been talking about the Rays since prior to the 2008 season, their pitching pipeline was obvious. I've been warning people about the Reds since the 2008 off season, and the Cubs farm system isn't a joke anymore either. You don't solve organizational wide issues trading for Ace starting pitching. Somewhere we have to turn the corner so we aren't relying on scrap heap pickups and FA acquisitions to round out the rotation. Every year the Reds have made a significant move to bolster their pitching... trading for Volquez, drafting Leake, signing Chapman. Chapman may end up as a closer, but the theory is still sound... for the same yearly salary would you rather have Hoffman or Chapman? Similary the Rays traded for Jackson, Kazmier, and Garza. Either a GM spends his resources wisely or he doesn't, there isn't much inbetween here. Melvin hasn't spent wisely in FA nor has he spent prospects wisely trading down in value. Once again the object here is to someday have a self sufficient pitching pipeline, but it has to start some place, and the only team that's done it entirely through the draft that I can think of is the A's. Baltimore is close, their young pitchers just need to start pitching closer to their ability over the course of an entire season. I'm not saying it's easy, in fact I've said quite the opposite over the last 3 seasons. To build a foundation of quality pitching would have taken giving up pieces that would have hurt, pieces that would have been hard to part with. That's the disconnect.... I would have traded anyone not named Braun or Gallardo for more young pitching and I've been saying it since 2008. Melvin also had other opportunities to try and acquire some meaningful pitching but he always went the "MLB proven" route which limited the upside of the players we were getting in return. The last part of your statement I agree with, only not in the manner you suggest, I'm tired of the low ceiling /high floor players that Melvin typically acquires, it made sense when the team was loosing 100 games but we're long past that stage. To your point, how does acquiring Greinke make us front runners for anything? We're more than 1 pitcher away... look at the teams in the post season, even with Greinke we don't match up pitching wise with any of them. Maybe the Twins and Yankees, certainly no one from the NL. Sure we might win 6-7 more games with Greinke, but to what end? My end game here is to have enough surplus pitching that we can field the best rotation in the division and trade away some excess for pieces needed elsewhere like the Rays have done. You don't get to that point burning all your prospects "going for it", the numbers just don't add up for that to be a realistic solution. Milwaukee can't just be focused on today, the organization also has to plan for tomorrow, because for us there is no such thing as signing a marquee FA to plug a hole. Large market teams can continually dump their prospects and sign known commodities in FA to plug holes, as much as some people want it to be, that's not our reality as Brewer fans. For Milwaukee, true flexibility isn't payroll flexibility, or having 10 mil to spend on a player, it's having multiple high ceiling options available when holes present themselves. True flexibility is depth of talent, not being X number of million under the break even point financially. At any rate the whole "prospects will fail" argument is the most empty and unsupportable argument thrown around on this forum. Every MLB regular was once a prospect, no one goes right from the draft to MLB. Not every prospect is going to reach their ceiling and many will fail, but just as many will also succeed, but the learning curve is nearly impossible to predict because the variables are nearly limitless. As I said when we acquired Gomez, CF wasn't an organizational weakness, it was only a temporary weakness at MLB until Lo Cain was healthy. Gomez had already established a track record of suckitude in MLB, but he was going to contribute immediately in Milwaukee so Melvin made the trade. Cain is clearly the superior player now, Gomez didn't even last a full season for us in CF. I'm not against trading prospects or acquiring talent, I'm against dumping depth for temporary solutions, and I view anything less than 3 years as temporary. In the future the Brewers might have enough talent where a rental trade at the deadline would make sense, but we aren't anywhere near that point yet.. Once again you're confusing value with production and inferring conclusions that I've never made I said many times prior to 2008 and during the 2008 season that the Brewers would have 1 or 2 opportunities to fix the rotation long-term. I didn't want to go after Peavy, Halladay, or Sabathia like was discussed on the forum, I wanted a player on the rise who we would control for at least 3 seasons to help carry the load with Yo. I've been very consistent on that point... we had surplus hitting talent it doesn't matter what those players do once they are moved, our return for the value we gave up is all that ultimately matters. I like Cleveland as an organization for many reasons, so I want to see all the prospects traded for Sabathia perform well. For some reason people want the prospects we trade to fail so we win the trade? Why does that even matter? It's the same reason I wanted to move Hardy for pitching following the 2008 season, even though he's my namesake on this site he was the most expendable player without a contract and if you don't address the hole with a long-term solution it remains a weakness. A weakness that Melvin has tried plugging with aging veteran FA pitchers none of which I was in favor or acquiring. Peaveyfury once said that I pissed on every move Melvin has made and he was right, I did and continue to bash Melvin because the scenarios have played out exactly the way I feared they would. You don't have to agree with me, but at least give me the courtesy of acknowledging that I've been consistent in my opinions regardless of the backlash I've taken for them. It's not about right and wrong, or me saying "i told you so", it's about finding a consistent winning philosophy for a small market organization, because the results speak for themselves. We only have so many bullets in the gun and we need to make them all count. I have no problem with people who are happy with the Sabathia trade because the post season appearance meant that much to them. I do however have a problem with people who refuse to accept the chain of events that have led us to the point where we are. It's been entirely predictable and a few of us have been voicing concerns for a very long time, this domino effect has been in play for a very long time. I don't think it's possible to acquire them anymore unless a bidding war erupts for one of our position players. I won't say it's impossible as anything can happen, but I think the possibility is highly unlikely.given Melvin's history. He targets players with MLB experience who will at least contribute in some way for the MLB team, he doesn't chase unproven impact talent. The market swung back towards pitching and away from power in 2008/2009 so I think we're better off hoping that Rivas and Rogers work out wonderfully and the young pitchers behind them continue to progress rather than trying to force a winning situation by making splash trade that in the long run will ultimately set the organization back more than it would help in 2011.. That's because Melvin didn't catch on, he just follows the market cycles and never exploits the market, nor does he spend money wisely. Once again, I never once said it was easy, I just have a very strong opinion regarding the direction this organization needs to take to be competitive on a yearly basis. We've already wasted 2 years of the current core trying to patch the rotation enough each year to win instead of fix the root cause of the pitching issues. At some point enough is enough and it's time for a new strategy, at some point we need to cure the disease instead of continually treating the symptoms.

I think it's kind of funny that Melvin already had 5 years to acquire some quality starting pitching with longevity to go with the current position players and hasn't done it, and now people want to raid what's left of the farm for one last gasp with the same guy pulling the strings? Good luck with that. Many of us called our shots going into 2009, called our shots about 2010, and if nothing changes 2011 will be no different. Parra isn't good enough to start for us and yet KC would take him as a starting pitcher for Greinke? Really people? While he certainly has the talent to be a top of the rotation starter, he doesn't appear to have found the intangibles yet to enable his game to mature. Isn't that how you thought of the team when Fielder, Weeks, Hart, Hardy, Gwynn, Gallardo, and Braun were all coming up? Nope, I've wondering aloud and talking about the pitching for years now while most everyone else obsesses about the lineup. If you want the Brewers to contend every year then we have to start developing enough top of the rotation talent to maintain the rotation from within, we aren't ever going to get there trading those players away to go for it with 1 CY quality starting pitcher at a time. What happens if we give away all that talent and the pitcher gets hurt? Then what? It doesn't matter what the prospects do or don't do down the road, the question should always be does this make the organization stronger? Not 2011 Milwaukee Brewers, the entire organization. Does this trade move the organization closer to be self sufficient pitching wise? Does it help solve the long-term needs of the organization? Greinke is a fine pitcher, but his ERA moves up and down with his K rate. Yes he was fantastic in 2009, but I don't think that level perfomance is a reasonable assumption year in and year out. He looks be similar to Yo... a safe bet to pitch around a mid 3 ERA, he's not Sabathia. I understand people wanting to break the cycle of mediocrity, but it's a process that largely depends on the progression and health of our young starting pitchers. I feel similarily to this as I did when people were making the claim that "Cincy's rotation was suddenly really good out of nowhere"... really? These guys came out of nowhere? While we did nothing, signing over the hill FA pitchers, Cincy was persuing projectable young pitching trading Hamilton for Volquez. While we spent money on Wolf, they spent similarily for Chapman. You want to be competitive year in and year out? Fine, it starts with the pitching, but I don't understand why so many people think the Rays and Reds just got lucky? Nothing is more valuable than quality starting pitching, but the trick is to acquire it prior to a player being "established", because then the player costs too much to acquire and to retain. Every year the focus around here changes from one CY candidate or winner to the next. The idea should be to acquire young starting pitching that you can then flip later on for more young starting pitching if you aren't able to afford the player any longer. That way the talent cycle keeps perpetuating on itself, the way most of you want to work these trades we'll be continually short of prospects because we'll always be trading 3 or 4 away at a time for a quality pitcher that might only be here 2 years. I honestly thought Melvin would flip young bats for young pitching, but that just never happened. We need to be acquiring more projectable pitching to be able to maintain, not trading it away for "proven" MLB talent. Our pitching pipeline has been a trickle... 1 player at a time, years apart. We need it to be gushing a couple of legit prospects a year so that decisions can be made based on talent and performance rather than cost, pitching is power. I've watched the talent cycle through Milwaukee during Melvin's tenure, can we honestly say we're in better shape at the MLB level now than we were coming out of 2006? From where I'm sitting it looks to me like we mortgaged the future in 2008 on Sabathia and if the Mets wouldn't have collasped this first core of players wouldn't have even netted us a single post season appearance. We needed then what we need now, quality young pitching with longevity, not 10 different faceless pitchers who are all in that 4-5 range talent wise, we don't need a single Ace either, we need quality pitching, and lots of it. We've had the same holes in the rotation for years, always plugged the same way. With Parra's failure we need 2 good young pitchers beyond Rivas, Rogers, and Jeffress (if Jeffress is even a starter anymore). I mean pitchers who can post a legit low 3 ERA year in and year out. We don't need an ace, we need 3 or 4 #2s in the rotation. We have 1 in Yo... who knows what Wolf will be next season, so we need 2 more legit top of the rotation starters to hope to compete for the division much less in the post season, otherwise we're just wasting our time. We don't match up with Cincy today, and that's with Chapman pitching in relief and Volquez coming off surgery, how will we match up next season trading what little surplus we might have for just Greinke?

Al you're entirely missing the point... Sure, with things the way the way they are, none of this matters. The Brewers are just doing what every other organization is doing... some token lifting. The problem is that they aren't getting the return on their limited investment in the activity because the players aren't eating properly, they may as well not even lift at all to be honest. It's no different than practicing some skill wrong, it doesn't matter how many times you do it if you're doing it wrong. You remind of me of parents I have to deal with every year that tell me it's too much trouble for their kids to make it early mornings and lift/off season condition, but they are the first parents to complain about a lack of playing time for their young men when kids who were always less talented and behind them on the depth chart since pop warner pass them up because they work harder to get better. I want the Brewers to look to maximize every single aspect of the organization, and since they aren't able to compete dollar for dollar with the big boys for talent, I want them to look to maximize their potential in other areas of the organization, which they haven't done. They've made changes with their pitching philosophies, but so has pretty much every organization. Looking around baseball what are the Brewers doing that other teams aren't? It looks to me like they are simply doing what they've always done. Why not try to add more coaches and see what happens? Maybe it won't matter, but what if it does? Fruthermore Weeks and Braun weren't rushed, they were top 5 picks coming out of college, those guys don't spend years in the minors. What about the fact that Fielder couldn't even do the basic 1B fundamental consistently and stretch to the location of the throw when he came up? How many times did he stretch towards the infielder prior to throw and let a ball get through him? What about Gamel? He's not been rushed... or Escobar who wasn't rushed at all? To claim these players were rushed because of their bats is a disservice to the reality of the situation, the organization knew Weeks and Braun were going to be pushed when they were drafted. How much extra work did they get knowing they were on a shorter schedule to the bigs? Defense hasn't been an organizational priority, it's that simple. What about when these guys get to the majors? When I'm paying someone to produce at the big league level I'd like to be maximizing their potential and production. I'm not into paying players to learn how to play defense at the major league level, and it's impossible to perform when you aren't healthy enough to play. You don't believe if Casey dropped 15 lbs of fat and added 10lbs of muscle there's a chance he'd be a better defender, a better hitter, and possibly all around better baseball player. I'd rather the organization went out of it's way to prepare these guys in every aspect of the game because I want the best possible team out there on the field. You're talking about trying to identify more diamonds in the rough, I'm talking maximizing the potential of the entire organization by giving our players every possible legal advantage.

And why would you be taking Doug Melvin's word on anything? That looks like typical PR spin to me.

Ha... and while all of those players have elite ability, even for professionals, all of them were very poor defensively when they got to Milwaukee. This is about getting more well rounded and hence more valuable players during the limited time frame we'll have the players they develop. Loosing 3 years to develop players in Milwaukee isn't a solid plan in my opinion As for the comment about diet I'm not even going to waste the time debating the merits of proper nutrition with you. Sure you can eat anything just to get through the day, but you're not going to build muscle eating just anything, that's just not how it works. This isn't really about the elite players who were drafted high and therefore don't exactly have to go through the same struggles as players drafted later in the draft, it's apples and oranges money wise, and you already know this. It would appear that you're being contrary for the sake of being contrary again.

I should have mentioned that I know the Brewer's farm teams have pretty decent strength & conditioning coaches, most of them have been interviewed over the last 2 seasons., In fact I remember an interview from 2 years ago where the coach in Helena praised Bucci for his excellent work ethic, Nick was self motivated doing his own daily routine. I do like the band work and the movement stretching most everyone is doing now from the big leagues down through rookie ball. It's easy to get form down using the bands, and the bands come with different levels of resistance so there should be a progression with the bands as well. As homer noted, the bands while not as cheap as you would think, are relatively inexpensive for a professional organization. Lawrie talked about getting some light lifting on certain days when he was in Appleton 2 seasons ago as well, though a quick google didn't come up with anything, then again maybe it was this season... all of the interviews start to run together after a while. I know they lift some when they at are home, but it didn't seem like much, Brewer's comments didn't make it seem like it was much, and I have a hard time believing every stadium has the same facilities, it would be nice to know from an insider exactly what happens strength and conditioning wise with these young men. I didn't mean to suggest that pitchers and position players should have the same work out regime, because I don't believe that's true. I think pitchers should be focusing mostly on core/endurance while position players should be focusing on the entire package. Every major muscle group is activated during a baseball swing, the forearms and wrists are just as import as the hips to a swing, and there's nothing wrong with being quicker/more agile in the field. Putting on muscle weight enhances one's natural gifts when done properly, it doesn't slow players down and remove nimbleness like conventional wisdom would seem to suggest. Baseball appears to be a very laid back sport, but it's at core is a fast twitch muscle game, with flurries of activity in very short windows of time. While I think a guy like Esky is leaving production on table do I expect him hit 20 HR a year? No, that's not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about preparing the body to be able to last through 150 games and getting the most out of one's natural gifts. There is a time a issue here as well... the common belief has always been that you shouldn't work out on a game day... if that's true how can a relief pitcher ever plan a workout? Over last couple of years I've sat through some interesting presentations that suggest light work (by light work I'm talking low weight repetitions/core work/plyos) X hours before a game actually can put the body in a peak performance state. I really don't believe that lifting would adversely affect position players on the field, but I'm quite sold on the concept yet for pitchers, but am I intrigued by the idea. My father is big on the idea, but I missed the guy that talked about it this year, I was in listening to the Olympic trainer talk about conditioning and workout recovery. As far as the field work thing goes... like I said previously I have a football mentality towards fundamentals.. You work the hell out of them in individuals getting each young man as many perfect repetitions as possible, then you put some groups together for inside run/pass skele where they can work on specific skills in a controlled environment, then you go to team and put it all together. I'm not sure how a MiLB coaching staff can do that... Using the T-Rats as an example, how does Chris Hook get every pitcher individual bullpen work a couple of time a week? It's certainly easier to do with the starters who actually have side sessions than the relievers, but there's only one of him... MLB teams have a 2 coaches for roughly the same number of players... On the position player side Erickson and Isom have to get the IF and OF through their daily work and get all of their BP done while splitting time with another team most every single day. How do they have time for individual instruction when every player needs daily work when they have a relatively short time frame to work in? I completely agree with Mass that it shouldn't be very difficult for the organizations to provide 2 good meals for the players every single day, athletic performance starts with nutrition and it's appalling how little the organizations care about this about stuff. We know the coaches do, it comes through in just about every interview, but the resources just haven't been devoted to make this happen.

I've been trying to educate people that there isn't anywhere near as much "development" in the minor leagues as they think there is. It's still basically a trial by fire system... play 500ish games and hopefully you figure out what it takes to be a player on your own by the team you reach the bigs. Most repetitions the players are getting are completely worthless because they are just going through the motions doing what they've always done, I've watched them take infield/outfield before the games. It's more a warm up procedure than it is "practice", and I'd honestly get just as bored working on the same things over and over like they do. My high school coach was notorious for having 1.5 hours of infield practice followed by batting practice, it was the same routine every day as much as I still love to compete, I'd get bored of it. We'd get so bored in the outfield we'd just turn around and watch the girls run track... They need a schedule that breaks up each day differently focus on something different at each position every single day, pull players aside and give them individual skill work I've coached enough to know that vast majority of the time if a kid isn't getting it right in individual group work, the light switch doesn't magically go on when we go team or on game day. The MiLB teams don't have the facilities nor are there enough coaches to give players daily individual instruction. Look at the T-Rats, they had to skip batting practice for some time just to get the extra defensive work they required, and WI was still a horrible defensive team. There are only so many coaching hours in the day... The players probably get some lighter type "conditioning" lifting when they are on a home stand, but I highly doubt they do anything when on the road. What kid can do it on their own? Maybe the players in the top 4-5 rounds if they are motivated enough? The rest get bye on nothing, the financial woes of the kids in the minors have been well documented on this forum, they simply just don't have the money to even eat properly, much less build muscle, and stay healthy. From the outside looking in it looks like baseball teams and many fans still haven't figured it out. The Pirates newish regime has been roundly criticized for trying to build their future and not spending money on MLB talent, but what's more important to a team than to development its own talent? Furthermore no team is devoting enough resources to truly develop their talent to it's fullest, not a single team. There isn't the money behind the minor league system to do anything more than they already are... it's not a question of good coaching, I think the Brewers have some excellent coaches in the system, it's a question of time and resources. The coaches don't have the time and the players don't have the resources, it's as simple as that. Some organizations have done a better job recently trying to develop the athlete and the baseball player at the same time, but most teams do not. Look at the Brewers, they should be fighting tooth and nail to keep Escobar out of winter league and should put him to work developing his frame and his athleticism, giving his mind a mental break from baseball. However my gut feeling tells me it's the exact opposite and I don't believe the organization even has a consistent philosophy on the subject. Playing baseball all year round isn't going to make Esky a better baseball player any faster... you can only grow so much facing inferior competition. This has been a very sore subject with me for a long time. If the Brewers are worried about investing in the MiLB facilities and then losing the franchise and having to start over, then they should just buy the franchises and commit the resources to give the players what they need. The Brewers cannot afford to spend money on premier MLB talent, so they had better do their best to develop as much talent as possible and retain talent the impact as long as possible before FA, our impact talent should never reach arbitration as long as the player is healthy and performing. There's much better value spending an extra 3-4 million per year on the entire minor league system than there is spending that money on some washed up 0 WAR relief pitcher. Baseball is notorious for having poorly conditioned athletes, the system is as much to blame as the players themselves, it's time for a change in philosophy, and while some teams have begun moving in this direction, let's just say I'm not holding my breath waiting on the Brewers. I would be shocked if something changed with Melvin and Nichols at the helm.

Did you mean the Cards and Cubs? Why would Cincy need him? They already have Volquez, Cueto, Leake, Bailey, and Chapman all coming back, all youngish, and all relatively cheap? Maybe Chapman doesn't stick in the rotation but I have feeling he was just slowed down innings wise similar to David Price when he pitched in relief for the Rays through the 08 playoffs. Not that any of those guys are finished products but Cincy already got to the post season with these guys. I guess what I mean is if we had their starting pitching, there's no way I'd want Melvin to make a move for him. I saw Leake ended up on the DL for a while and then didn't pitch again this season, but did I miss something like TJ or shoulder surgery? It's really irritating that the Cubs farm system is steadily improving, damn you Tim Wilken.

That was me... what absolute garbage this is. Sometimes the best cure for a player is some time away. I appreciate his work ethic, I do, but if the organization is behind this winter ball thing again I'm rapidly losing faith. He already dominated winter ball last year and that didn't help him during the 2010 season, what good is going back going to do him? He's not a sub .250 hitter, he just never got on an extended hot streak this season and my negative opinion on Macha's handling of him hasn't changed at all. A manager or coach simply cannot pull a young player every single time they struggle, or in Escobar's case every time he went 0-10, that's no way to build confidence which is at least as important as the physical tools a given player may possess. I watched some of the playoffs the other night at my brother's restraunt and saw Andrus for the first time in a year... while Andrus is filling out his frame, Escobar is remaining a toothpick... who was the better player this season? Who's likely going to be the better player next season? The Brewers need to start worry more about building better athletes and less about running players into the ground expecting them to play baseball 12 months a year. There's more to this hitting thing than just getting ABs against inferior competition.

Rogers had 10 IP in MLB and 116 between AA-AAA for a total of 126 IP this last season. Lets not get carried away over 10 nice IP at MLB, and I've always been a huge Rogers supporter on the MiLB forum. If you bring him up immediately the scenario is 160ish innings of Rogers + 60 replacement innings from some other starter, I think it's foolish to push him into the 180 IP range when he just finally broke the 100 IP threshold for the first time in his career (He pitched 98.2 innings in 2005). I understand the "he might get hurt again" argument, but why should we go out of our way to add unnecessary risk? Start him in Nashville and see how his command holds up, that's his biggest issue as a pitcher. It doesn't do him, the team, or us any good if he starts in Milwaukee and isn't locating effectively. Mark wasn't exactly what I would term "economical with his pitches" this season, he needs work in that dept. We have already have a bunch of guys who struggle to get through the 6th, I see no reason to add to that issue for the sake of pushing Rogers. Melvin will bring in some oldie retread and Rogers will find his way into the rotation soon enough as an injury replacement regardless. When that happens, I doubt he goes back down. If he ends up being lights out in spring training and earns a slot in the rotation I'll live with it, but if they are pushing him just to push him, I'll take serious issue with what's happening. I would love for him to take a big jump over the winter, I'm just not sure how realistic that is. Mark is ascending as a player, I'm just not sure what to comfortably predict from him next spring. The minor league pitcher who's ready to jump into the rotation and go the distance innings wise is Amaury Rivas, I hope he gets a shot to show what he's got in ST next season. He's gone 120, 133, and 141 IP over the last 3 seasons... I could get pretty excited about a Gallardo, Jeffress, Rogers, Rivas, and Wolf rotation to close out 2011.

You missed the point. Over slot isn't the problem here, I don't understand why every player doesn't come in for a physical immediately after being drafted, or at least the guys in the first 15-20 rounds? I understand how the signing process works, the medical part just doesn't make sense to me. Again, it's been bothering me since Scarpetta's original contract had to be voided, this isn't just a Dylan Covey deal.

I'm still catching up on reading here and there, reading a couple of threads a week, so I'm very late to the party. I no longer hold out any hope that the big league club will get over the hump until the organization can develop it's own pitching. The only impact pitching Melvin has been able to acquire in his tenure as GM was Sabathia, and it's awfully tough to miss when you trade for a healthy CY pitcher. I wasn’t in favor of the trade at the time and remain of the opinion that it hurt the performance of the team long term, but CC was an impact talent. DM just isn't willing or capable to make a deal for impact pitching, there's no history in Milwaukee or Texas to support the notion that he's even capable of building a championship caliber rotation. As a fan, I really only care about having the opportunity to compete for a championship, I'm not interested in 1 and done in the playoffs, I want to be able to compete with the big boys. I've already hashed out why I think the pitching is the key to Milwaukee’s future success/failure, and I'm not going to rehash dozens of posts here to make my point once again. However, this is the perspective I'm posting from. I like the fact that the power 50 has become pitching heavy near the top, I like the system now more than I have in the past. That being said I do find it curious that no one including the Brewers have pimped Rivas. We must not have all the information because they've pimped much worse pitchers much more in the past…. Little Ben anyone? They give him the pitcher of the year award for 2009 but the 3 guys we heard the most about once Axford and Braddock were up were Odorizzi, Rogers, and Jeffress. What's not to like to about a young pitcher who’s FB has good movement, sits in the low 90s, reaches the mid 90s, and has an excellent change to boot? Are they intentionally trying to fly him under the radar? While it was good for Rogers and Jeffress to get MLB experience the call-ups were clearly as much a PR move as they were a reward. 2 former first round starting pitchers make good and reach the majors… hurray for us! I won’t go name by name but I still think we’re short on impact talent pitching wise, especially given Parra’s failure in the rotation. Now if Jeffress comes back to starting and is effective and Scarpetta is truly working the mid 90s then I’ll feel better up about the situation than I do. It’s just hard for me to believe that Cody’s velocity jumped 4ish MPH in one year as he looked to be physically mature when I saw him pitch multiple times in Appleton last season, and we didn’t read about any major mechanical flaw that was affecting his velocity, only his location. I think many of the projections we read on pitchers in our system are very conservative because they don’t have jaw dropping peripherals and are works in progress (Rogers, Rivas, Peralta, Heckathorn). Odorizzi does have those peripherals, which is not so coincidentally why he’s routinely pimped by prospect gurus. I understand he has a legit 4 pitch arsenal as well, but we’ll see how well he locates all those pitches as he moves up and his FB certainly isn’t overpowering like Rogers and Jeffress. I’m still shocked that Rogers name doesn’t come up nationally, he throws as a hard as anyone at AA this season and injury history aside, how are his stuff/raw tools not exciting? I get that his command needs work and his BB/9 is borderline bad, but come on, the young man can throw the freaking ball and no one seems to be able to hit off of him. Of the players in the low rungs of the minors I find the Helena staff to be particularly intriguing, but I’m still very pissed that the Brewers played the waiting game trying to save some money with the Covey pick. The family is notified less than a week before the signing deadline that their son has type 1 Diabetes… of course they are going to take the ultra conservative road while they come to grips with the diagnosis. I don’t fault the family for making the decision to keep Dylan close to home, but I do wonder how the situation would have turned out if Dylan, his family, and the team had a couple of months to reflect on the situation and come up with a reasonable plan. This is exactly the type of the situation that gets chalked up to bad luck, when it’s just not that simple. I’m not sure I understand exactly why our draft picks don’t get physicals until they sign or are offered a contract, why don’t top picks fly in immediately for a physical before the process even starts? I guess what I mean is that it doesn’t seem right to offer someone a contract before doing your due diligence, it seems like a poor business practice to me and it’s been bothering me since Scarpetta’s finger. Position player wise, Lawrie could be an impact talent at some point and it’s pretty thin after that. Salome had that ability as a C, but he’s just a guy in the OF, and as he was always one of my boys, I was extremely disappointed by the freefall he put himself into. We have quite a few guys that project to be averagish MLB players, and I’m alright with that. A player like Cutter Dykstra doesn’t really have a home playing at the same level as Gennett, but I’m not sure he’s ready for 2B at AA next season either. Another player without a position is Chris Dennis… yes I understand that there is a DH every game until AA, but each player getting half the game experience they should be defensively doesn’t give me a warm and fuzzy, especially given the organization’s history developing defensive acumen. It’s kind of the same ole story, a bunch of intriguing/undervalued bats that may or may not play their current position. Having a system and a MLB team built around it’s position players didn’t work for us, and doesn’t really work for anyone that’s been in that position in the last decade. Having that great offense only means you’ll score runs, it doesn’t mean you’ll win games, none of those teams were truly competitive until the pitching caught up with the hitting. For example Philly was always a top 3 team in the NL offensively, but didn’t do anything in the playoffs until they picked more pitching. I would like to add some more impact hitting talent in the system as with Gamel and Cain graduating we’re pretty thin, so I hope an impact hitting talent is available when the Brewers draft next season but I am comfortable with this transition away from hitters who had dominated the P50 for years. There are position players I really like up and down the chain for various reasons, I think we have plenty of depth, but the lack of impact hitting talent at the moment is a bit concerning. I do believe though that dollar for dollar position players are better value in FA, so I’d much rather plug some position spots via FA if necessary than spend money on pitching. I’m pretty comfortable saying that we’ll be able to field a decent pitching staff from within in the coming years, so I’d like the drafting focus to return to more of an even split if possible. Obviously some drafts will favor pitching over hitting and vice versa, but in general I’m a BPA type of guy, and I don’t think that we can definitively say the Brewers have been drafting with BPA in mind other than drafting the best available pitcher. I’d also like to see them get away from drafting the “workout warriors” for lack of a better term. A workout warrior is that young man who impresses in a workout but doesn’t have the body of work to support their draft position, like a Frederickson or Walla. The Arnett pick hurts, but he looked to be a player on the rise who was a very good athlete to boot, I don’t mind that pick in the same way I’ve always been fine with the Rogers and Jeffress picks. The early returns are just incredibly disappointing, as is Nichols handling of the situation, which was ludicrous. I don’t quibble about the placements of individual players, the system is solid, and I appreciate the efforts of those involved in making the list.

I spend a fair amount of my time reading/treating concussions. The reason why baseball concussions seem to linger follows; 1) Hydration - Hydration has turned out to be key component to concussion risk, dehydration is often a main component in severe concussions. You don't have to be dealing with chronic effects to be dehydrated. Most people aren't hydrated enough from the start. How many baseball players would you consider in "good condition" and are "well hydrated"? In fact, we had a kid get a severe concussion this season and he never really got hit hard, he was however taking antihistamines and allergy medication without our knowledge which put him at a greater risk to suffer a concussion 2) Diagnosis - Many baseball concussions went undiagnosed over the years. Gehrig for example was knocked out in games multiple times, and the disease linked to his name now can be proven to be linked to concussions. 3) Reinjury - In all sports it's not the first concussion that truly creates the problem, it's trying to return to activity before your body is ready for it. Coming back to physical or mental activity before the body is is ready for it is a key contributing factor to the deteriorating effect of concussions. This season we had a young man lie about his symptoms to the trainer so that he could come back in play, which ended up costing him 4 weeks of the season as his symptoms have lingered now for weeks. In fact, one of the worst things for our kids that suffer a concussion is to be challenged mentally, they shouldn't even be in school. Some day people will pay enough attention and the kids won't be expected to perform in school if they suffer a bad concussion as well. Yes the NFL has been bad, but statistically speaking Baseball and Soccer have been far worse. I'm not sure why Soccer gets such a free pass being viewed as a relatively injury free sport by parents? There's nothing safe about redirecting a ball traveling 90 miles with your head. It's not just one sport, it's all sports, and all coaches/trainers become more educated hopefully we handle the situations better going forward. Speaking just for our coaching staff and trainer, nothing scares us as much as concussions and head/neck injuries. I think as awareness continues to grow, treatment will improve. There is no way to stop concussions, there is no helmet that prevents them, the only way to stop concussions is to stop people from competing in sports.

Final: Ogden 5, Helena 3 Brewers swept by Ogden The Helena Brewers fell for the sixth straight time against the Ogden Raptors on Friday night at Kindrick Field. In a game that was scoreless in the sixth inning, the Raptors plated five runs in the final four frames to go on to win 5-3. A bright spot for the Brewers tonight was the work of RHP Stosh Wawrzasek. Wawrzasek, the former 16th round pick in 2008, pitched five scoreless innings, striking out six and walking two. Helena's scoring didn't come until the seventh and eighth inning. Greg Hopkins, who was making his second start since coming back from an injury against Billings on July 6th, led off the inning with a single up the middle. He later scored after singles from Mike Walker and John Dishon. The Brewers scored two more in the eighth. Gerald Ogrinc and Shea Vucinich both singled in the inning, and were driven in by a double to centerfield by Cody Hawn, who leads the Pioneer League in doubles with 13. That was as close as they would get, and the Raptors went on to win 5-4. The Brewers will try their luck against the Orem Owlz tomorrow night for the start of a four-game home series. First pitch is scheduled for 7:05 with gates opening at 6:00. Helena Boscscore Wow what a skid the H-Crew is on, despite excellent starting pitching and a rare clean game defensively they still fell again. Stosh Wawrzasek started and pitched very well, allowing only 3 hits, 2 walks, while striking out 6 over 5IP. I just noticed, is that a mullet in his profile picture? Cody Ross saw his first action of the season allowing 2ER on 4 hits and a walk over his 2 innings. Chad Robinson whom I thought had reinjusred his shoulder last week only managed to record 1 out in the 8th before being lifted for Thomas Keeling. Keeling couldn't stop the bleeding, walking in one of Robinson's baserunners. Alex Jones finished the game pitching a perfect 9th with 2 strike outs. No Brewer had multiple hits, Cody Hawn managed the only XBH, a double, and is OPSing a cool .997 following today's action. Helena Recap I really liked Chad Robinson as a draft and follow, this is too bad. Very uneventful game until the 6th. Ogden Top 6th Pitcher Change: Cody Ross replaces Stosh Wawrzasek. Casio Grider walks. Jake Lemmerman singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Casio Grider to 3rd. Michael Pericht singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Casio Grider scores. Jake Lemmerman out at 3rd on the throw, left fielder Brandon Sizemore to third baseman Gregory Hopkins. Michael Pericht to 2nd on the throw. Robert Coyle doubles (6) on a line drive to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Michael Pericht scores. Jesse Bosnik called out on strikes. Blake Dean grounds out, first baseman Cody Hawn to pitcher Cody Ross. Helena Bottom 7th Cody Hawn strikes out swinging. Gregory Hopkins singles on a line drive to center fielder Leon Landry. Pitcher Change: Jake McCarter replaces Red Patterson. With Michael Walker batting, passed ball by Michael Pericht, Gregory Hopkins to 2nd. Michael Walker singles on a ground ball to second baseman Casio Grider. Gregory Hopkins to 3rd. John Dishon singles on a fly ball to left fielder Chance Gilmore. Gregory Hopkins scores. Michael Walker to 2nd. Brandon Sizemore grounds into double play, third baseman Jesse Bosnik to second baseman Casio Grider to first baseman Blake Dean. John Dishon out at 2nd. Ogden Top 8th Pitcher Change: Chad Robinson replaces Cody Ross. Jake Lemmerman singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Michael Pericht homers (8) on a fly ball to left center field. Jake Lemmerman scores. Robert Coyle singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Jesse Bosnik flies out to center fielder Franklin Romero. Blake Dean singles on a ground ball to center fielder Franklin Romero. Robert Coyle to 2nd. Austin King walks. Robert Coyle to 3rd. Blake Dean to 2nd. Pitcher Change: Thomas Keeling replaces Chad Robinson. Chance Gilmore strikes out swinging. Leon Landry walks. Robert Coyle scores. Blake Dean to 3rd. Austin King to 2nd. Casio Grider grounds out, third baseman Gregory Hopkins to first baseman Cody Hawn. Helena Bottom 8th Gerald Ogrinc singles on a fly ball to right fielder Austin King. Carlos George flies out to center fielder Leon Landry. Franklin Romero strikes out swinging. Shea Vucinich singles on a ground ball to left fielder Chance Gilmore. Gerald Ogrinc to 2nd. Cody Hawn doubles (13) on a line drive to center fielder Leon Landry. Gerald Ogrinc scores. Shea Vucinich scores. Gregory Hopkins grounds out, third baseman Jesse Bosnik to first baseman Blake Dean. Helena Bottom 9th Pitcher Change: Ji-Mo Lee replaces Jake McCarter. Michael Walker reaches on fielding error by second baseman Casio Grider. John Dishon strikes out swinging. Brandon Sizemore singles on a fly ball to center fielder Leon Landry. Michael Walker to 2nd. Gerald Ogrinc flies out to center fielder Leon Landry. Carlos George pops out to second baseman Casio Grider.

Final: Lansing 6, Wisconsin 4 Lugnuts edge Rattlers By Chris Mehring / Wisconsin Timber Rattlers GRAND CHUTE, WI - The Lansing Lugnuts took advantage of a run scoring wild pitch and three innings of scoreless relief from their bullpen to hold off the Wisconsin Timber Rattlers Friday night at Time Warner Cable Field. Lansing edged the Rattlers 6-4 to defeat Wisconsin and take two out of three games in the series between the Midwest League rivals. Wisconsin (36-53 overall, 10-11 second half) scored quickly in the first inning as they loaded the bases with one out. Hunter Morris knocked in the first run with an RBI grounder. Cutter Dykstra followed with a two-run triple for a 3-0 lead. But, Lansing (47-43, 11-10) rallied for four runs in top of the third to take the lead. Randy Schimpf tripled in the first run of the frame. Kenny Wilson followed with an RBI single. Brad Glenn put the Lugnuts up 4-3 with a two-run double. The Rattlers even the score thanks to an error. Scooter Gennett reached second on a dropped fly ball to left to start the inning. Kentrail Davis doubled to left and Gennett scored the tying run. The Lugnuts had a runner at third base with two outs in the top of the fifth inning against Wisconsin starting pitcher Damon Krestalude. The Rattlers right-hander uncorked a wild pitch that let the go ahead run score. Wisconsin had an opportunity to tie the game in the bottom of the seventh inning. They had runners at first and third with no outs and Gennett at the plate. Gennett sent a sinking liner to left that was ruled a catch. The throw to the plate was in time to get the runner heading home for a double play. Lansing added an insurance run in the top of the eighth inning on a sacrifice fly by Ahrens to go up 6-4. Wisconsin got a two-out walk in the bottom of the ninth to bring the tying run to the plate against Casey Beck, but Beck got a strikeout to end the game. The Rattlers continue their homestand by hosting the Great Lakes Loons in a three game series that starts on Saturday night at 6:35pm. Jake Odorizzi (5-1, 2.86) is the scheduled starting pitcher for Wisconsin. Elisaul Pimental (8-3, 2.91) is set to start for the Loons. The first 1,000 fans into Time Warner Cable Field receive a snow globe with Fang inside courtesy of Cher-Make on Saturday night. There is also a scheduled postgame fireworks display sponsored by FOX 11. Plus, it is a Fruit Roll-Ups Fun Night! Fans aged 13 and up will receive a free sample of Fruit Roll-Ups on the way out of the stadium. If you can't make it out to the ballpark, you may tune into the broadcast on AM1280, WNAM. The Miller Lite Pregame show starts at 6:15pm. WP: Dave Sever (3-6) LP: Damon Krestalude (2-5) SAVE: Casey Beck (3) TIME: 2:43 ATTN: 4,997 Wisconsin Boxscore Damon Krestalude pitched well through the first 2 innings, fell apart in the 3rd, and then uncorked the wild pitch to allow a run to score as mentioned above. Damon gave up 9 hits in his 6 IP allowing the 5 earned runs on on 2 BBs and 6 Ks. Matt Costello pitched 1.1 innings allowing an unearned run, but he was pretty fortunate, especially in the 7th. Flame throwing Santo Manzanillo reigned in his control for a day and pitched 1.2 very solid innings with 3 Ks. The Lugnuts did execute a perfect double steal against Santo which directly contributed to Costello's unearned run. Kentrail Davis went 2-4 with 2 doubles, Cutter Dykstra added a single to the triple mentioned above to finish 2-4 and also committed his 13th error of the season at 3B. Wisconsin Recap The WI 1st. Wisconsin Bottom 1st D' Vontrey Richardson grounds out, third baseman Kevin Ahrens to first baseman Balbino Fuenmayor. Ryan Gennett singles on a line drive to right fielder Brad Glenn. Kentrail Davis doubles (6) on a fly ball to left fielder Eric Eiland. Ryan Gennett to 3rd. Khristopher Davis hit by pitch. Hunter Morris grounds out, second baseman Ryan Schimpf to first baseman Balbino Fuenmayor. Ryan Gennett scores. Kentrail Davis to 3rd. Khristopher Davis to 2nd. Cutter Dykstra triples (4) on a fly ball to right fielder Brad Glenn. Kentrail Davis scores. Khristopher Davis scores. Chris Dennis strikes out swinging. Krestalude's 3rd Lansing Top 3rd Kevin Ahrens singles on a line drive to right fielder Kentrail Davis. Ryan Schimpf triples (5) on a line drive to right fielder Kentrail Davis. Kevin Ahrens scores. Kenny Wilson singles on a ground ball to first baseman Hunter Morris. Ryan Schimpf scores. Justin Jackson walks. Kenny Wilson to 2nd. Sean Ochinko strikes out swinging. Kenny Wilson steals (31) 3rd base. Justin Jackson steals (7) 2nd base. Brad Glenn doubles (13) on a line drive to left fielder Khristopher Davis. Kenny Wilson scores. Justin Jackson scores. A. J. Jimenez grounds out, shortstop Michael Marseco to first baseman Hunter Morris. Brad Glenn to 3rd. Eric Eiland grounds out, second baseman Ryan Gennett to first baseman Hunter Morris. Damon also wiggled out of trouble in the 4th Lansing Top 4th Erik Miller remains in the game as the left fielder. Balbino Fuenmayor grounds out, third baseman Cutter Dykstra to first baseman Hunter Morris. Kevin Ahrens doubles (5) on a line drive to center fielder D' Vontrey Richardson. Ryan Schimpf singles on a line drive to center fielder D' Vontrey Richardson. Kevin Ahrens to 3rd. Kenny Wilson grounds into double play, third baseman Cutter Dykstra to second baseman Ryan Gennett to first baseman Hunter Morris to catcher Cameron Garfield. Kevin Ahrens out at home. Ryan Schimpf out at 2nd.

Final: Mississippi 5, Huntsville 1 Huntsville Boxscore I took a rare night off from baseball and just finished watching "The Last Samurai" to unwind from a long week at work and I came back to the Link Report ready for action... well so much for that. I wish I had kept track of the amount of 1st inning runs Mark Rogers has allowed this season. Mark got the start tonight going 4.1 IP on 79 pitches (44 strikes), he allowed 3 earned runs on 5 hits, 2 walks, while striking out 4. Lucas Luetge pitched 3 scoreless inning of relief, he was awfully good allowing a single hit and walk against 2 strike outs. Eddie Morlan finished the game on the bump allowing 2 runs, 1 earned, on 2 hits, 1 walk, and 1 strike out over 1.2 IP. No Star had multiple hits or an XBH though Drew Anderson did walk twice. Eddie Morlan committed the only error, leading to his unearned run. Hunstville Recap 1st Inning runs are an epidemic this season. Mississippi Top 1st Antoan Richardson hit by pitch. With Tyler Pastornicky batting, Antoan Richardson steals (13) 2nd base. Tyler Pastornicky triples (1) on a fly ball to right fielder Caleb Gindl. Antoan Richardson scores. Eric Duncan singles on a fly ball to center fielder Lee Haydel. Tyler Pastornicky scores. Coaching visit to mound. Mauro Gomez strikes out swinging and Eric Duncan caught stealing 2nd, catcher Anderson De La Rosa to second baseman Brett Lawrie. Willie Cabrera singles on a ground ball to shortstop Zelous Wheeler. Michael Daniel doubles (7) on a line drive to right fielder Caleb Gindl. Willie Cabrera to 3rd. Donell Linares grounds out, shortstop Zelous Wheeler to first baseman Chris Nowak. The Stars only run came in the 1st as well. Huntsville Bottom 1st Brett Lawrie flies out to center fielder Antoan Richardson. Caleb Gindl grounds out, second baseman Eric Duncan to first baseman Mauro Gomez. Zelous Wheeler singles on a line drive to left fielder Michael Daniel. With Drew T. Anderson batting, Zelous Wheeler steals (6) 2nd base. Drew T. Anderson walks. Chris Nowak singles on a line drive to right fielder Willie Cabrera. Zelous Wheeler scores. Drew T. Anderson to 3rd. With Taylor Green batting, wild pitch by Kyle Cofield, Chris Nowak to 2nd. Taylor Green grounds out to first baseman Mauro Gomez.

I was slightly concerned about him coming into the year, but when he started hitting the ball in AA I thought he was back. I'm certain his issues are all mental as he didn't perform well after his demotion last season either. I believe in Mat's talent, he just has to put it to good use and force some difficult decisions on Melvin.

Final: Ogden 8, Helena 5 Ogden edges Helena again, Brewers drop fifth straight The Helena Brewers (12-12) dropped their second straight game to the Ogden Raptors (14-10), fifth strait overall, in front of a crowd of 1,461 at Kindrick Field Thursday night. Matt Miller (2-1, 2.86) started on the mound for the Brewers and took the loss. He threw six innings and allowed four runs, three earned. Miller struck out three and walked one. Helena entered the bottom half of the sixth trailing 4-0. After Shea Vucinich walked, Cody Hawn hit is 12th double of the season. Vucinich scored on a passed ball, and Hawn scored when Greg Hopkins grounded out to third. Ogden answered right back in the top of the seventh, scoring two runs to widen the deficit back to four runs. The Brewers scored two in the seventh and one in the eighth to make it a one-run game. With two outs in the seventh, Carlos George and Franklin Romero reached on infield singles. Shea Vucinich knocked both in with a triple to right-center. John Dishon walked with one out in the eighth inning. Brandon Sizemore drove him in with a line-double to left field. That was as close as the Brewers would come to the win. Ogden plated two more runs in the ninth and went on to win 8-5. The Brewers look to avoid the sweep tomorrow night at Kindrick Field. Stosh Wawrzasek (0-1, 5.40) will take the hill for Helena. Red Patterson (2-0, 4.86) is scheduled to start for Ogden. Helena Boxscore Matt Miller started and was okay, working 6 IP, allowing 3 ER, 1BB, while striking out 4 but giving up a costly HR following a walk. If I told you Jimmy Nelson relieved and gave up more runs would you be surprised? I really don't know what to make of him and his uninspiring college career (pitching stats halfway down page).... was he just a 1 year wonder, is he a player on the rise? He did have his first 1,2,3 inning as a pro tonight though. Eric Marzec couldn't pickup Nelson in 9th, the defense didn't do either pitcher any favors. Shea Vucinich was 2-3 with a 3B earning "sleeper prospect" praise for Steve Wendt in the process. Cody Hawn was a 1-5 with a 2B, Brandon Sizemore was 2-4 with a 2B, and Carlos George went 2-4. Greg Hopkins returned after missing 7 games with a concussion and the H-Crew committed 5 errors in the context, some more costly than others. Helena Recap Walks are the devil! Ogden Top 3rd Chance Gilmore walks. Leon Landry homers (2) on a fly ball to left field. Chance Gilmore scores. Casio Grider grounds out, third baseman Michael Walker to first baseman Cody Hawn. Jake Lemmerman grounds out, second baseman Shea Vucinich to first baseman Cody Hawn. Michael Pericht strikes out swinging. Dean picked up George in the Ogden 4h. Ogden Top 4th Robert Coyle reaches on throwing error by shortstop Carlos George. Robert Coyle out at 2nd, catcher Brent Dean to second baseman Shea Vucinich. Jesse Bosnik singles on a ground ball to right fielder John Dishon. Blake Dean singles on a line drive to center fielder Franklin Romero. Jesse Bosnik to 2nd. Steve Domecus lines into unassisted double play, second baseman Shea Vucinich. Jesse Bosnik doubled off 2nd. Steve described this play in less than glowing terms. After bobbling the ball Romero was awfully nonchalant getting the ball back into the IF Ogden Top 7th Pitcher Change: Jimmy Nelson replaces Matthew Miller. Blake Dean strikes out swinging. Steve Domecus flies out to right fielder John Dishon. Chance Gilmore singles on a ground ball to center fielder Franklin Romero. Chance Gilmore advances to 2nd, on fielding error by center fielder Franklin Romero. Leon Landry strikes out swinging. Wild pitch by pitcher Jimmy Nelson. Chance Gilmore to 3rd. Leon Landry to 1st. Casio Grider triples (1) on a fly ball to right fielder John Dishon. Chance Gilmore scores. Leon Landry scores. Jake Lemmerman strikes out swinging. Helena cut the lead to 1, only to let Ogden off the hook, but once again they fought to the bitter end. Helena Bottom 8th Pitcher Change: Nick Gaudi replaces Bret Montgomery. Gregory Hopkins strikes out swinging. John Dishon walks. With Brandon Sizemore batting, John Dishon steals (8) 2nd base. Brandon Sizemore doubles (3) on a line drive to left fielder Chance Gilmore. John Dishon scores. Michael Walker strikes out swinging. Brent Dean grounds out, shortstop Jake Lemmerman to first baseman Blake Dean. Ogden Top 9th Blake Dean walks. Steve Domecus out on a sacrifice bunt, first baseman Cody Hawn to second baseman Shea Vucinich. Blake Dean to 2nd. Chance Gilmore singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Blake Dean to 3rd. Pitcher Change: Eric Marzec replaces Jimmy Nelson. Leon Landry singles on a ground ball to left fielder Brandon Sizemore. Blake Dean scores. Chance Gilmore to 2nd. Casio Grider pops out to third baseman Michael Walker on the infield fly rule. With Jake Lemmerman batting, Chance Gilmore steals (3) 3rd base, Chance Gilmore scores. Leon Landry steals (5) 2nd base. Leon Landry advances to 3rd. Throwing error by catcher Brent Dean. Jake Lemmerman strikes out swinging. Helena Bottom 9th Pitcher Change: Shawn Tolleson replaces Nick Gaudi. Carlos George singles on a ground ball to right fielder Robert Coyle. Franklin Romero strikes out swinging. Shea Vucinich singles on a line drive to center fielder Leon Landry. Carlos George to 2nd. Cody Hawn grounds out, first baseman Blake Dean to pitcher Shawn Tolleson. Carlos George to 3rd. Shea Vucinich to 2nd.

Final, Game 2 (7 innings): Lansing 4, Wisconsin 3 Lugnuts hold off Rattlers for a split By Chris Mehring / Wisconsin Timber Rattlers GRAND CHUTE, WI - The Wisconsin Timber Rattlers were in good position despite being down 4-2 late in game two of their doubleheader with the Lansing Lugnuts Thursday night at Time Warner Cable Field. Wisconsin loaded the bases with no outs in bottom of the sixth. But, Lansing closer Steve Turnbull got out of the jam and went on to save the 4-2 win for the Lugnuts to split the twinbill. The Lugnuts (46-43 overall, 10-10 second half) took the lead without the benefit of a hit in the top of the first inning. Kenny Wilson drew a leadoff walk to start the game. A balk by Rattlers starting pitcher Nick Bucci moved Wilson to second. Then, Eric Eiland dropped a sacrifice bunt to get Wilson to third. Sean Ochinko got the run home with a sacrifice fly to left. Lansing added to their lead in the top of the fourth inning. Brad Glenn hit a two-run homer to the scoreboard in left-center and the Lugnuts went up 3-0. Wilson made it 4-0 with a two-out, RBI double in the top of the fifth. Michael Marseco cut that four-run deficit in half in the bottom of the fifth inning. The Rattlers shortstop drove a two-out, two-run triple to right-center to get Wisconsin (36-52, 10-10) to within 4-2. The Rattlers made it very interesting in the bottom of the sixth. Lansing starting pitcher Egan Smith struck out Scooter Gennett to start the inning, but a wild pitch allowed Gennett to reach. Kentrail Davis singled to put runners on first and second. That was all for Smith as the Lugnuts went to Turnbull. Khris Davis make things very exciting when he reached on an error to load the bases with no outs. However, Turnbull quieted the crowd and the Rattlers rally by striking out the next three batters to end the inning and keep the Lugnuts up 4-2. Lansing's closer converted his twentieth save (in 21 opportunities) by setting down the Rattlers in order in the bottom of the seventh. The series concludes on Friday night at 7:05pm. Damon Krestalude (2-4, 5.29) is the scheduled starter for the Timber Rattlers. Dave Sever (2-6, 4.65) is set to start for the Lugnuts. Friday is a North Shore Bank Family Night as children 12 and under eat free as part of North Shore Bank Family Night in conjunction with momslikeme.com. It's also Fang's Birthday and the Rattlers are holding a Sweet 16 birthday party for their mascot. Area mascots will be in attendance to take part in a kickball game before the game and all of the festivities during the game. To get ready for the upcoming school year, Fang is asking for donations to a School Supplies drive. The supplies that are collected will be distributed to needy school kids in the area. KISS 95.9 FM presents a post-game fireworks display and - after the fireworks - ThedaCare Orthopedics presents Kids Run the Bases for children 14 and under. If you can't make it out to the game, you may tune in for the broadcast on AM1280, WNAM starting with the Miller Lite Pregame Show at 6:45pm. HOME RUN: LAN: Brad Glenn (9th, 1 on in 4th inning, off Nick Bucci, 1 out) WP: Egan Smith (3-0) LP: Nick Bucci (4-4) SAVE: Steve Turnbull (20) TIME: 2:06 ATTN: 4,093 Wisconsin Boxscore It's too bad that while Nick Bucci is starting to straighten out his peripherals he continues to give up runs. Nick almost went a complete game going 6.2, giving up 5 hits, 4 earned runs, walking 3, and striking out 8. The HR he gave up in the 4th proved to be the difference in this one. Matt Costello came in to record the final out. No WI hitter had more than 1 hit though Michael Marseco did triple, his 7th of the season. Wisconsin Recap Small Ball worked out against Bucci in the 1st. Lansing Top 1st Kenny Wilson walks. With Eric Eiland batting, Kenny Wilson advances to 2nd on a balk. Eric Eiland out on a sacrifice bunt, pitcher Nicholas Bucci to first baseman Hunter Morris. Kenny Wilson to 3rd. Sean Ochinko out on a sacrifice fly to left fielder Khristopher Davis. Kenny Wilson scores. Brad Glenn strikes out swinging, catcher Austin Stockfisch to first baseman Hunter Morris. WI had a golden opportunity in the 6th. Wisconsin Bottom 6th Ryan Gennett strikes out swinging. Wild pitch by pitcher Egan Smith. Ryan Gennett to 1st. Kentrail Davis singles on a ground ball to left fielder Eric Eiland. Ryan Gennett to 2nd. Pitcher Change: Steve Turnbull replaces Egan Smith. Khristopher Davis reaches on force attempt, fielding error by second baseman Ryan Schimpf. Ryan Gennett to 3rd. Kentrail Davis to 2nd. Hunter Morris strikes out swinging. Cutter Dykstra strikes out swinging. Chris Dennis strikes out swinging.

Final: Huntsville 5, Mississippi 4 Huntsville Boxscore I'm a sucker for a come from behind victory like this one. Mike Fiers wasn't as good this time out going 5 innings, giving up 7 hits and 4 earned runs, while walking 2 and striking out 3. What a job the relievers did though! Mark Willinsky pitched a scoreless frame breaking his streak of consecutive appearances giving up at least 1 run at 7. Andre Lamontange followed pitching 2 scoreless and getting the W. Jim Henderson finished the game for his 6th save of the season. Offensively Zelous Wheeler had the only multi hit game going 2-4. Chirs Nowak and Chuckie Caufield had the only XBHs, a big HR and a 2B respectively. Taylor Green committed his 15th error of the season. Huntsville Recap Fiers gave up 2 crooked numbers Mississippi Top 2nd Willie Cabrera grounds out, shortstop Zelous Wheeler to first baseman Chris Nowak. Michael Daniel doubles (5) on a line drive to left fielder Drew T. Anderson. Donell Linares grounds out, second baseman Brett Lawrie to first baseman Chris Nowak. Michael Daniel to 3rd. Jesus Sucre doubles (9) on a fly ball to left fielder Drew T. Anderson. Michael Daniel scores. Brandon Beachy doubles (1) on a fly ball to right fielder Chuck Caufield. Jesus Sucre scores. Coaching visit to mound. Antoan Richardson flies out to right fielder Chuck Caufield. Mississippi Top 4th Michael Daniel doubles (6) on a fly ball to right fielder Chuck Caufield. Donell Linares singles on a fly ball to center fielder Lee Haydel. Michael Daniel to 3rd. Jesus Sucre singles on a ground ball to center fielder Lee Haydel. Michael Daniel scores. Donell Linares to 2nd. Brandon Beachy ground bunts into a force out, pitcher Michael Fiers to third baseman Taylor Green. Donell Linares out at 3rd. Jesus Sucre to 2nd. Brandon Beachy to 1st. Antoan Richardson walks. Jesus Sucre to 3rd. Brandon Beachy to 2nd. Coaching visit to mound. Luis Bolivar grounds out, third baseman Taylor Green to first baseman Chris Nowak. Jesus Sucre scores. Brandon Beachy to 3rd. Antoan Richardson to 2nd. Eric Duncan walks. Mauro Gomez pops out to shortstop Zelous Wheeler. Huntsville lovin 3TO in the 2nd, couldn't pull out the HR. Huntsville Bottom 2nd Taylor Green strikes out swinging. Chuck Caufield walks. Dayton Buller called out on strikes. Michael Fiers called out on strikes. Huntsville made the second out at 3rd in the 6th.. Huntsville Bottom 6th Pitcher Change: Michael Broadway replaces Brandon Beachy, batting 9th. Zelous Wheeler singles on a line drive to left fielder Michael Daniel. Drew T. Anderson grounds out to first baseman Mauro Gomez. Zelous Wheeler to 2nd. Chris Nowak walks. Taylor Green singles on a ground ball to right fielder Willie Cabrera. Zelous Wheeler scores. Chris Nowak out at 3rd on the throw, right fielder Willie Cabrera to third baseman Donell Linares. Chuck Caufield doubles (7) on a fly ball to center fielder Antoan Richardson. Taylor Green scores. Dayton Buller walks. Offensive Substitution: Pinch hitter Caleb Gindl replaces Mark Willinsky. Caleb Gindl grounds into a force out, fielded by third baseman Donell Linares. Chuck Caufield out at 3rd. The Game Winning Rally, gifted by 2 errors in the inning. Huntsville Bottom 8th Pitcher Change: Jaye Chapman replaces Michael Broadway, batting 9th. Drew T. Anderson walks. Chris Nowak reaches on fielding error by pitcher Jaye Chapman. Drew T. Anderson to 2nd. Taylor Green grounds into a force out, first baseman Mauro Gomez to shortstop Luis Bolivar. Drew T. Anderson to 3rd. Chris Nowak out at 2nd. Taylor Green to 1st. Chuck Caufield strikes out swinging. Dayton Buller reaches on fielding error by second baseman Eric Duncan. Drew T. Anderson scores. Taylor Green to 2nd. Offensive Substitution: Pinch hitter Anderson Machado replaces Andre Lamontagne. Anderson Machado grounds out to first baseman Mauro Gomez.

Final, Game 1 (7 Innings): Wisconsin 7, Lansing 4 Rattlers stay hot By Chris Mehring / Wisconsin Timber Rattlers GRAND CHUTE, WI - Two days off didn't cool the bats of the Wisconsin Timber Rattlers. Wisconsin banged out 13 hits to beat the Lansing Lugnuts in game one of a doubleheader on Thursday night at Time Warner Cable Field. Cutter Dykstra drove in three runs to help the Rattlers to their fourth consecutive victory. Scooter Gennett started the onslaught in the bottom of the first inning. The Rattlers second baseman launched a home run, his seventh of the season, to center with one out to put the Rattlers (36-51 overall, 10-9 second half) in front 1-0. Later in the inning, Dykstra drove in a pair of runs with a two-out single. Lansing got a run in the top of the third inning on an RBI single by Sean Ochinko. But, that was the only run allowed by Del Howell. The Wisconsin bats got that run back plus two more in the bottom of the third as they strung together five straight hits. Kentrail Davis started the uprising with a double. Khris Davis followed with a single to put runners at the corners. Hunter Morris singled to sent Kentrail Davis home. Dykstra and Chris Dennis continued the hit parade with back-to-back RBI singles and Wisconsin was up 6-1. Howell had a bit of a hiccup in the top of the fifth inning as the first two batters of the inning reached base. But, the defense turned a neat 6-4-3 double play to get the first two outs of the inning. Then, Kentrail Davis made a fine running catch in right field to end the inning. Balbino Fuenmayor homered off Caleb Thielbar with two outs in the top of the sixth inning to get Lansing to within 6-2. But, Kentrail Davis drew a bases loaded walk in the bottom of the sixth to put Wisconsin back up by five runs. Lansing made it interesting in the top of the seventh as they loaded the bases with one out. Brad Glenn sent a deep drive to the wall in left, but Khris Davis had room to make the catch. However, a run scored on the sacrifice fly. AJ Jimenez followed with an RBI single. The Lugnuts made the score 7-4 and knocked Thielbar out of the game. Closer Jon Pokorny came into the game and got Kevin Nolan to pop out to short to end the game. HOME RUNS: LAN: Balbino Fuenmayor (7th, 0 on in 6th inning, off Caleb Thielbar, 2 out) WIS: Scooter Gennett (7th, 0 on in 1st inning, off Matt Fields, 1 out) WP: Del Howell (2-4) LP: Matt Fields (2-4) SAVE: Jon Pokorny (8) TIME: 2:16 Wisconsin Boxscore As disappointing as Arnett's season has been, I've been that happy for Del Howell. I was disappointed to read his velocity is only slightly above average for a lefty, but he's made such vast improvement over the course of the season I'll say I've actually crossed the line and I'm proud of him. Caleb Theilbar has now been scored upon in 6 of his last 7 appearances. D' Vontrey Richardson was 2-4, Scooter Gennett's only hit was the HR, Kentrail Davis was 2-3 with the 2B mentioned above, Cutter Dykstra was 2-3, and Hunter Morris was 2-3. After starting slow Hunter is hitting .308 over his last 10 games. Wisconsin Recap It's nice to be on the other side of a crooked number in the 1st. D'Vo... god bless him, continues to make outs on the bases. Wisconsin Bottom 1st D' Vontrey Richardson singles on a ground ball to right fielder Brad Glenn. With Ryan Gennett batting, D' Vontrey Richardson caught stealing 2nd base, catcher A. J. Jimenez to shortstop Kevin Nolan. Ryan Gennett homers (7) on a fly ball to center field. Kentrail Davis singles on a line drive to right fielder Brad Glenn. Khristopher Davis strikes out swinging. Hunter Morris singles on a ground ball to center fielder Kenny Wilson. Kentrail Davis to 3rd. With Cutter Dykstra batting, Hunter Morris steals (1) 2nd base. Cutter Dykstra singles on a line drive to center fielder Kenny Wilson. Kentrail Davis scores. Hunter Morris scores. Chris Dennis flies out to right fielder Brad Glenn. A SB cost Howell in the 3rd Lansing Top 3rd Kevin Ahrens singles on a ground ball to second baseman Ryan Gennett. With Justin Jackson batting, Kevin Ahrens steals (2) 2nd base. Justin Jackson flies out to center fielder D' Vontrey Richardson. Kevin Ahrens to 3rd. Kenny Wilson grounds out, shortstop Michael Marseco to first baseman Hunter Morris. Chris Hopkins walks. Sean Ochinko singles on a ground ball to right fielder Kentrail Davis. Kevin Ahrens scores. Chris Hopkins to 3rd. Brad Glenn grounds out, third baseman Cutter Dykstra to first baseman Hunter Morris.