Ron Robinsons Beard

There was. The fact that they were able to piecemail together a competent rotation was pretty miraculous, considering 3 of their top 5 preferred rotation members failed miserably, including their opening day starter and de facto #1 (Chacin). That is a credit to Stearns and the team's management/coaching.

If he's anything like 36 year old Verlander...why not? Bingo! For some reason everyone here(or most everyone), seems to think/assume, that just because a pitcher(or any player) is in his mid to upper 30's it automatically means he will be terrible. They have no way of knowing that. I mean, are those the same people that think your above example, Justin Verlander at 36, isn't worth what he's making?? I would take 36 year old Randy Johnson, Nolan Ryan, Justin Verlander over most other pitchers in baseball. To automatically assume Stephen Strasburg wouldn't be worth $30/mill a year at 36, is just their way of trying to prove he wouldn't be worth it. Those guys that you mentioned are all very, very rare exceptions to the rule. They are all generational talents that defied very long odds to continue pitching at a Hall of Fame level into their upper 30s/early 40s. Cole and Strasburg are fine pitchers, but comparing them to the Johnsons, Ryans and Verlanders of the world is an insult to to those all-time greats. Heck, just a couple years ago Cole was a failed starter that the Pirates pretty much gave away. He doesn't hold those guys' jock straps.

How in the world has a thread about Jordan Lyles signing a two-year deal for $8 million AAV devolved into yet another argument about the Brewers not signing top free agent pitchers to $100+ million guaranteed deals?

Exactly! Just like huge money deals, sometimes value signings don't exactly work out. The difference is that the deal Albers signed isn't going to be an albatross hanging around the team's neck for the next half decade.

For $5 million over two years, he was fine. Provided some value, and there were stretches in both 2018 and 2019 where he was the best reliever on the team. So your attempted cherry-pick doesn't work here. He was below replacement level, which means he literally provided negative value. Saying he was good for stretches is cherry picking. He had terrible seasons both years with the team. Albers had a $2.5 million AAV. Sorry, using him as an example of a poor value signing is just a bad argument.

In general I'm quite pleased Stearns as a GM, but he didn't have viable backup plans when two of the three young starters failed miserably. There was no one decent to plug in to their spots in the rotation until we traded for Lyles. That's not entirely true. Gio was signed early on, was plugged into one of those spots, and performed quite admirably. They also started the year with Chase Anderson in the bullpen, as a viable alternative should the young starters struggle. What they didn't have a backup plan for was Chacin pitching horribly.

For $5 million over two years, he was fine. Provided some value, and there were stretches in both 2018 and 2019 where he was the best reliever on the team. So your attempted cherry-pick doesn't work here.

I’m ok with that. Not an Ozuna fan, even though technically he fits the Brewers’ need I suppose.

This pen is a poor return from Knebel away from being an unmitigated disaster. You have 3 known commodities and 1 is coming back from TJ within the year. Either you like these JAGs (just a guy) way too much or you don't value the pen at all. 2 of them in the pen to start the year, maybe. 1 sure. 5? Just cancel the season. To put it bluntly, I really like Perdomo and Andrews. Both lefties, both rack up high K/9 totals. Andrews has shown he can go multiple innings, and he has a decent bat. Devin Williams also looked good in Milwaukee, IMO. Feyerisen and Yardley are interchangable with the likes of Rasmussen, Supak, Roegner, File, Bettinger, Burnes, QTC, Black, Wahl, Faria. Heck, add Zach Brown if he bounces back any. Andrews will likely begin at AA this year, and if he pitches well, MIGHT see AAA by the end of 2020. The chance that he makes any sort of significant major league impact in 2020 is about as close to zero as you can get. Perdomo has a chance, though.

We thought it was a huge mistake last year when they went cheap on the rotation, and we were right. Losing Lyles like this is embarrassing. Its becoming clear that Attanasio has slashed the budget. The Brewers are always going to be a value based organization that doesn't overpay. That's the way David Stearns operates. I sort of thought that was pretty obvious by now. I would have done it personally, but not paying $16 million guaranteed to Jordan Lyles is FAR from embarrassing. That is absolutely the top of the market for a guy like Lyles with his track record. The fact that Lyles, Pomeranz and Moose have signed for over what most predictors said they would says a lot about the Brewers' talent evaluation. And it gives me hope that they will be able to continue to acquire guys who are undervalued or misused by other teams.

I think you nailed pretty much every stage of grief (denial, anger, bargaining, depression) in one post. I think you are even on the verge of acceptance by the end. The next step is hope. You'll get there. The Brewers starting pitching philosophy is what it is. It's pretty obvious that they have identified spending big money on starting pitching as an inefficient practice, and they have stuck to that. Stearns even said it in his interview on 107.5 on Thursday ... they need to develop starting pitching from within, because they are never going to go out and sign the Coles and Strasburgs of the world. So yeah, you hope you can develop some top of the rotation guys, and hope you can hit on some wild cards from outside of the organization to fill out the rotation.

The end rarely justifies the means when it comes to those huge contracts. I'm not adverse to risk, but signing a huge name pitcher to a $100+ million deal have very low odds of working out value-wise. That's what's simple.

I'm skeptical of any reports about the Brewers finishing in the red. That's basically asking us to just blindly believe the Brewers finances from a reporter who was told by who? Not an objective 3rd party most likely. And as so many have said, there are a lot of creative accounting measures that can help them show a loss when in reality they made money. But of course nobody on here knows what's going on. I am a bit surprised how many people are concerned about a billionaire losing a few million dollars in a particular year in one of their investments...one that most billionaires get involved in because they enjoy it and less because of the potential financial windfall. But then I also think the idea that the Brewers should take out loans in order to be able to meet the payroll obligations. I think what most fans want is pretty simple. A team that's competitive, that's trying to win and that occasionally will reach a bit further when they're close to winning to add a couple of pieces. I think it's pretty hard to argue that the Brewers HAVEN'T been doing that during Mark Attanasio's tenure. I just want to see the Brewers make smart decisions and every once in a while...sure, I'd like to see them really stretch their financial resources. But it seems like too many want them to do this annually. Strausburg for example. Great pitcher, but he averaged ~145 innings from 26-29. Is that really the type of guy the Brewers should be betting their financial future on? Wheeler was even riskier. I don't think there is a number that anyone can throw out there and say the Brewers should be spending this much per season. We're all just too ignorant about their financials. But just as I'm surprised to see how worried so many are about a billionaires finances, I'm equally surprised in the lack of faith in Attanasio. The idea that he's equally or more invested in making money from the franchise than he is in winning. A lot of these guys buy teams because they've had tremendous success and they want own a franchise so they can win. Again, I really haven't seen evidence that Attanasio is not living up to that. I’m not personally concerned that Attanasio might be losing a few million every year. But if you are looking for a logical, legit reason why payroll isn’t higher, that’s it. Whether you like it or not, it is what it is.

Why? Aside from 75 or so innings with the Brewers over the last two years, Lyles has never been all that good. Because those 75 innings were pretty dang good, and $8 million a year over two years isn't a crazy sum for even a league average starter. Yeah, you'd be taking a risk, but is it better to pay Lyles a guaranteed $16 million, or MadBum $116 million?

Sure, he probably will, but how good will they be, really?? I mean, at this point, with the exception of maybe mad bum and ryu, to me everulne else is a dart throw and you HOPE you can get a decent season or two out of them. No different then Chacin. Doesn't really take the Brewers to the next level, unfortunately. They will never have 3 stud arms, or even two will they?? Probably not, unless they home grow them. Signing starting pitchers to huge contracts is a pretty inefficient use of available funds.

You must like throwing darts, huh?? That's what these are. Guys that could, MAYBE give the Brewers one decent(ish) year. Is that really going to improve the rotation much?? Other than maybe mad bum and Ryu, there are no pitchers out there that would clearly take the Brewers to the next level. *sigh* they are just always going to have "just guys and hope" for a pitching staff aren't they?? Can't they ever have 3 stud arms in one rotation?? That's my dream. Two castoffs, Jordan Lyles and Drew Pomeranz, pitched like Cy Young contenders in August and September last year, and got this team to the playoffs. Wade Miley did it the year before. Perhaps these guys know what they are doing a little more than the "sign the namez!!!" guy.

Who's not relaxing? I would have loved to get Lyles back, but there are probably 30 pitchers on the free agent market with his level of talent. He just managed to put it together for the Brewers last year, and was able to cash in, much like Pomeranz. Good for those guys. The Brewers have a knack for getting the most out of these type of pitchers.

It is a good thing that these guys that played for the Brewers last year are signing lucrative deals. Other MLB players are going to see the effect that playing in Milwaukee had on these guys, and look at rebuilding their value here. And it's a good thing that we have a front office that can recognize untapped potential in a lot of these guys. I expect to see more of that next season.

Well, it's the Rangers. They are going to suck. The Brewers can just trade for him again at the end of July.

Damn. I would have paid that.

This is a team that has stuck two different lumbering 3B at 2B the last two seasons, and they managed to make that work. They gave playing time to a very defensively challenged catcher in Stephen Vogt in a playoff chase in 2017, and went with another ancient defensively challenged one in Erik Kratz in 2018, and they made that work. I trust them to make this work as well.

It wouldn't surprise me is they made a play for him at the deadline. There's a huge difference between grabbing him for two months as a rental and signing him to a $100 million deal, though.

MadBum just doesn't strike me as a Stearns-type move whatsoever. There are pitchers on the market who will come cheaper, and likely provides better results. I think everyone should take this report with a big grain of salt.

Brewcrewin07 would be absolutely stoked.

This would either be great or end horribly. Not a lot of middle ground there.