NievesNoNO

If they could work something with Baltimore I'd want Zach Britton. Matusz would obviously be very nice as well. Guthrie is quite underrated, but probably not enough of a return without some more added.

Cain's value isn't anywhere near enough to get an established starter in return. He's only played 99 games above AA and he turns 25 in April. It makes sense to deal him only if you think his performance last year was a complete mirage because if he hits .306/.348/.415 over 500 at bats, his value will skyrocket well beyond what it is now. You're right, he won't bring back an established guy straight up, but in a trade package he could. My point was that the Brewers need Cain this year more that they need Tillman this year. In the end Tillman could very well be more valuable. In fact, if I'm the Orioles I probably wouldn't deal Tillman at all. Each player is more valuable to thier current team that they would be to each other.

I actually kind of agree. It seems like a little bit of a slap in the face. I mean, obviously (I'm assuming here) the Brewers have offered him an extension in the past that they feel they could afford and is fair. I wouldn't be surprised if that is basically a standing offer. On the other hand I suppose it's conceivable that Fielder is seeing some money thrown around and knows he could have his share right now instead of waiting a year and MAAYYBEE he's told Boris to soften his stance some.

If the Brewers had chosen to go with more of a rebuild mode heading to this season I'd say yes, however given that they look to be attempting to put a staff together to win now and they don't really have a CF to replace Cain with I'd say it's not a good fit. Not a bad deal, but the timing isn't right. I'd only move Cain for an established starter right now.

The Cubs are now supposedly in on Garza. I'd say the price just went up. Or it's at least an attempt by the Rays to move the price up for a team who's shown legitimate interest. Actually, I'm not sure why more teams aren't "in" on Garza.

Thank you for interjecting some sense into this. I love how passionate we all are about our favorite team, but sometimes I think its appropriate to take a small step back and look at what exactly we're trying to draw a conclusion from. I liked the trade, however I also think Lawrie's a heck of a prospect. Braun good? Maybe, I don't know but I won't rule it out. I don't really think a few pictures of a 20 year old partying is enough to make a judgement on one's ability to hit a baseball or on his work ethic. Heck, even if he suffers from poor judgement off the field that doesn't mean he can't dominate on the field. Does a still shot of Marcum's delivery motion showing an inverted W mean something? I'm not qualified to know and even if I was I don't think I could make a judgement on that information alone. The way I see it the Brewers got a very good pitcher, which they desperatley needed, and the Blue Jays got a player they coveted who might turn out to be an All-Star. Perhaps the Brewers did have questions about Lawrie's attitude, but I would guess that was somewhere down the list of things being considered when making the deal.

Agreed. He was horrible last year and not all that impressive the year before. I'd say he's lucky to give 100 innings this year. He's definitely a big risk/reward type, but I'd still much rather sign him than Pavano though.

I couldn't agree more. Marcum is an ace. I get the injury concern but the guy has a decent track record for being very good. I'm not sure what some of you need for proof, but he's got around 500 innings of proof and consistency. Yes, everything being equal I'd take the guy that throws harder, but he's proven he can get outs without lighting up the radar gun. He's probably an exception to the hard throwing ace type, but there have been others. Brandon Webb didn't light up the gun either, but I don't think anyone would argue with his success (not that they have the same type stuff).

The more I think about Garza the more I want him in a Milwaukee uni next season. I probably shouldn't get my hopes up though, maybe the Brewerfan.net faithful can force a trade if we keep discussing it http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif. If that doesn't work out, what do people think about Cain for Mike Minor (Braves)? Not sure if that's an upgrade for this season as Minor is largely unproven, however I like that he was able to maintain his K ratio in limited work in the big leagues.

Ahh, thanks. I would be fine with Jeffress and Cain then. However, I think the Rays might not be a match. Do they really need and OF? They still have Jennings, Upton and Zorbist.

I could see that working as well. I really like Garza, but does anyone know his contract status? Does he have just one year of arbitration left? I think Cain and Jeffress is too much to give for just one year. Like someone else mentioned, Shields might be the better target and may cost less.

Just saw that too. Things are certainly getting interesting!!

I do. I don't think this is a move a guy makes in our current situation if he's confident he's going to be around for the long term. I think what's really best for the Brewers is to take a few years off from trying to add impact pitchers and settling for soft tossers(though Marcum's certainly a legit pitcher), let our prospects catch up, and then when we've clear the salaries of some of these guys(or hell, re-sign a couple of them) then be a bit more aggressive. Aggression when it's going to lead to the upside of 85 wins isn't really doing it for me. I'm not sure waiting is what's best for the Brewers. Sometimes I think there's this fictional place in our heads where we think the perfect storm exists where all our prospects pan out and arrive within a year or two of each other. Everyone plays at a high level and the majority of our players are signed cheaply so we can be aggressive with available free agents. I'm not saying that can't happen (Rays), but I think the odds of it coming together like that are not all that great. I don't think Doug is trying to save himself. He'd have a fairly nice line of teams interested if he was available. I don't think the guy can win in some people's eyes. He's criticized for not being able to acquire pitching and then when he acquires a solid youngish starter he's seen as desperate to save his job. People say he's the same old Doug Melvin who doesn't learn from his mistakes and doesn't take chances on trading for pitching when it's available, but then when he does make a move many are trying to figure out who he should've got instead! I will agree that Marcum make us better, but not championship worthy, so I do understand what your saying. I'm just hoping Doug's not finished this off-season.

I'm still holding out hope for a Gavin Floyd trade. Maybe McGehee and a pitching prospect for Floyd. I actually like Correia as a solid back end type, but as chadomac stated we really need somebody who's more of a 2 type starter to have a significant impact.

Of course they don't. They just gave up thier best pitcher. I think Marcum is being sold a bit short here. We just acquired a proven very good pitcher under contract for a couple more years for an unproven talent.

I like this deal alot. Marcum is instantly at least our 2nd best pitcher and might be out best. There's obviously a risk involved with the previous arm injury, but I wouldn't say there's any more risk with him than any other pitcher. I do think that this means the Jays acquire Grienke though. There's no way they gave up their best starter without another deal in place.... IMO. Got to give to get.

I don't know if I fully expect Doug to make an offer, but I hope he's asking at least. I agree with others that it'll take 3-4 of our best prospects to get him. I'm not sure we're a complete match as I believe they might want a major league ready young future stud type starter in return. Really, I think this is somewhat of a fluky opportunity that the Brewers need to explore and push for. The Royals have said they won't trade him in the division and he supposedly isn't keen on pitching in a large market, essentially eliminating at least a third of the league from a trade. He's also a guy that you'd think the Brewers might be able to resign given the right circumstances. I'd start here: Lawrie, Jeffress or Rogers, Odorizzi or Peralta, Parra

Please let Washington outbid us! I can't imagine he would come all that cheap.

The only one I'd want is De La Rosa, but he'll get paid probably more than the Brewers should risk for his services at this point. So, I guess my answer is nobody. Work a trade Doug.

I think Floyd is a bit underrated. Other than Cliff Lee, I'd rather have him than any other free agent pitcher. The contract makes him even more appealing. I know it was only speculation, but I thought Beckham was a sticking point to a deadline deal. What I don't want to have happen is the Brewers holding out for a deal that isn't there and then letting Fielder walk because they're too stubborn, while not improving the pitching. Floyd absolutely improves the staff, now whether that would be enough to offset the loss of Fielder's bat I don't know. I do know it'll be harder to find a starter with Floyd's skill set than to find an adequate first baseman. We've seen what the Brewers are with Fielder and Braun and a good offense, but without pitching. They're simply not good enough.

Per mlbtraderumors, the White Sox are willing to discuss Gavin Floyd. I'd ship Fielder for Floyd straight up if they'd accept it. Floyd is under contract for the next 2 seasons and has a 9.5 million 2013 club option (Cot's). With all the ramblings towards the deadline this season, maybe they can rekindle some talks. Thoughts?

Depending on the player involved Papelpon would be someone to look into. Are the BoSox really looking to clear salary? As we get more information on potentially available players, the two I'd look into are Greinke and Gavin Floyd. There are enough proposals on Greinke in another thread, but I'd be willing to give up any of our prospects to get him. Trade Fielder straight up for Floyd.

Makes for interesting conversation, but I doubt a trade like this goes down. On the other hand, if you're the Brewers I think that nobody's untouchable (although Braun should be as close as they come). The truth is with both Braun and Fielder this team was a losing club. If you can upgrade your pitching and stock some more young talent I think you consider it. It would be kind of fun to see a bidding war for Braun as someone all ready mentioned the whole league could get involved.

All hail to the mighty Jack Z!! Maybe "his guys" just weren't in place yet. In all fairness, I think it will help the organization with Griffey being an alum and not a player going into next season. Ahh, how perceptions can change quickly.

Exactly!! Thank you! I've been trying to understand this logic as well. In fact, I'm convinced there will be even fewer teams interested with all the free agent options out there. And really, why would you give up what Doug is asking for when you don't have to give up anything and sign the next best option. That's not to say they couldn't consider offers next trading deadline again I suppose. If we are soo close as Mr. Melvin thinks then we should probably just gut our farm this off-season and try and land a couple front line starters (Greinke, Garza, Nolasco) even if we only have them around a few years. Overpay for either Vasquez or De la Rosa and have a go at it. I really wouldn't mind that approach because offensively we have enough, but I hope he doesn't say we're close and then not back it up with some corresponding moves this off-season. We'll see I guess.