BrewerFan

That's fine. I'm sure the contract will reflect that and he had pretty good stuff. Looks like it'll be a depth signing. Spent the last two years rehabbing, made it back and now should be healthy. And if he's not, it's not like this will be crippling.

I can't imagine NFL refs making that call. That'd have been worse than the Fail Marry by a pretty wide margin. There's always bumping, shoving and OPI, DPI on Hail Marrys. Unless you have every defender tacklke the offensive player they're guarding, it's a no-call. On that Hail Marry though, I would have liked to see 5 rushing. I'm putting Gary, Clark, Wyatt, Van Ness and then Walker in there as a spy who triggers as soon as Mahomes leaves the pocket. We've seen it with the Packers and Rodgers. You give them a much worse chance rushing three and letting the QB dictate where he's gonna throw the ball and be comfortable throwing the ball. BUT...that's nit picking(like KC fans who are whinning about the loss and blaming the refs).

Yeah...that's obviously true in the NFL. They could easily lose next week vs the Giants(especially with that inside pass rush). But the Panthers, Bears, Vikings sans Cousins, and TB...it's going to be a huge failure if they fall short of 10 wins IMO. As high as they're flying right now, they'll be that low if they lose more than 2 of the next 5. It's just insane that the team we saw vs the Vikings or the Lions early in the year...is now in a position to win 10 games(and IF you were to go game to game, would be favored in all 5).

LOL...yeah, I think he gets an extension. I'm not sure the fact that he beat Mahomes is going to be the driving force(may not even be that notable by the end of the year). I'd be shocked if they do it in-season though. There's just no reason to. You'd be rushing it. Love has a chance to run off 5 straight here(I doubt he will, but I certainly think he can run off 4 of 5 and get in). That AAV just continues to go up though. By the end of the year it may be around 50M....which would suck, but that's the price of having a good QB. And you can structure it so the cap hit is minimal next year, then they get clear of Bakh and Clark's deals(not that I want to be clear of Clark, I just don't think his future cap hits will be near 28M). I think the narrative on Gutekunst is also changing quite a bit. The young guys who are playing well, the late-round picks like Tom, Enagbare, Slaton, Valentine, Wicks, Carlson, Brooks, Wooden, Walker is a hit for a 7th. Still don't think he's the future LT, but at least a good swing tackle(and I think he'll end up being a really good OG). Things are really coming into view now. I'd still LOVE to see the Packers go and really get aggressive, move up for Joe Alt. I'd go 1st+2 2nds for say the 6th pick+a 4th, doubt they do it, so maybe a guy like Fuaga, a mauler in the run game and an extremely high ceiling, move Tom to RT and maybe Meyers is figuring it out? I don't know, but KC brings a LOT of pressure and the Packers just looked SO much better last night picking it up. Rhyan got whipped vs Jones, but everyone does at times. FUTURE'S LOOKING BRIGHT! And that Van Ness kid doesn't look like a slouch either.

I don't remember when Collinsworth first started. If you said it was 1995 or 2005, I'd believe you. I remember his notoriously bad take about Aaron Rodgers("you're not gonna win a lot of games with this guy as your starting QB," vs the Cowboys when he came in). Aikman, I've definitely heard the "this is how we used to do it," but I don't know if that's a bad thing(or a good thing). I enjoy watching or listening to Manning talk about things like that, but that's in a much less formal setting. I also think some guys have their favorites because they said things on air and now they want to be proven right. Almost like Skip. Dan Orlovsky with Wentz for instance(dude still insists he's a REALLY good QB). I'll just qualify this by saying I don't always listen that closely during the games and I can tune them out, but I always got the impression that the Packers were one of those teams that the announcers raised(especially Rodgers/Adams) and other fan bases hated them for that. Just like the the NFCN teams with the refs. If Rodgers was the QB, they'd be saying "the refs wanted Rodgers to get the W." Setting that all aside, last night end of the game, there were 3 controversial calls and the guys in the booth, plus the referee all had the same opinion. They were emphatic about the unsportsmanlike conduct on the Mahomes hit being a bad call. The MVS play was CLEAR DPI. And then the Hail Marry, that was pretty egregious as well, but they said it's rare you call those. I think those were all certainly accurate takes.

And the throw to MVS where he threw it behind him and low WAS perfect placement. It was zone and there was a safety(Owens IIRC) who came up and was right there as the ball got there. I also thought the comparison he made to Rodgers and Favre was the ability to get the ball out quickly and he was in general pretty effusive in his praise for Love, said the Packers would make the playoffs and the late hit isn't reviewable, he disagreed with it and the DPI late in the game on MVS was blatant and he pointed that out. I thought he did a pretty good job of calling a fair game last night with the caveat that the star QB gets a massive amount of praise(there are meme's of Collinsworth praising Rodgers later in his career after saying, "You won't win many games with Aaron Rodgers as your starting QB," a few snaps into the Cowboys games he came into). I think every fan base thinks the announcers hate their team and love the other team.

Because...in 173 PAs in AAA, his exit velo was similar to two rookies the Brewers had last year who didn't hit for a lot of power in their rookie season, ANY hope you had Black will hit for power, "these data run into them like a fist into a kidney!" Ok...maybe trying a bit hard to go for the dramatic line here. .307/.356/.525- Cody Bellinger's EV last year over ~560 ABs, 87.9 Not over a partial season in AAA, but over a whole MLB season. ...this is silly. Also, not sure anyone believes Black is going to be this big power-hitting corner IFer. He's not expected to be the next Pete Alonso. The kid did steal 55 bags last year while carrying an OBP of ~.420. So his value doesn't lie exclusively with his power(he's got a 40 power grade and the hope was he'd hit for 15-20 HRs). But the inference that ANY hope that he'll 'hit for power,' is just devastated by this? It's kinda silly on multiple levels. Small sample size and comparing him to two other rookies for the Brewers last year(one who also had a pretty small sample size) and neither of whom have really ever hit for power. But to be clear, the "problem," he's creating for the Brewers...the team that was playing Monasterio and Anderson at 3B last year...is that he may not hit for a lot of power(or I guess definitely won't based on the article)? I'll be alright if he hits .260/.350/.375. That'll be just fine for a rookie 3B.

Screw the talk about the DPI. How about the terrible 15 yards they gave to KC on the hit on Mahomes when he was clearly in bounds. Love was outstanding. He's proving he's a legit NLF QB that can be great at times and better yet, still has room to grow. Watson's injury is the one cloud over this win, but damn, what a turnaround. And with the cupcake schedule they have left...Chicago, Carolina, TB, Minny and the Giants...10 wins is not only reasonable, but it should be expected at this point. Jones, Jaire coming back. This front is looking great. From looking hapless and not scoring 20 to putting up more points on KC than anyone and Love coming back and facing the same team and scheme that made him look bad his first start, going for 3 TDs, no turnovers, making the right call over and over. Even the sack he took at the end. Didn't throw the ball away, throw it up. Tried to dip under, when he couldn't, lurched forward for what he could. Man, what a turnaround. We're not a "contender," but we've got a shot at having a REALLY good QB.

I mean...high leverage relievers are never redundant, especially not when their top reliever is out for next year. They're a 100-win team with the most young talent in the league. You need a dominant Pen to win it usually. I'll gladly go Williams and Burnes for the right package.

I'm not minding this deal myself. For all the talk about Burnes no longer being viewed as an ace, and his return being smaller than anticipated, this should disabuse people of that notion.

I grew up a big FSU fan, so I'd like to see them in, but the committee's goal is to get the 4 best teams in. I don't believe most genuinely believe they are one of the best 4 teams at this point. As for OSU...I don't know if they have a much stronger case than the team that won the SEC beating a team that had won...what, 45 of it's last 46 and the last two NCs. But it's also not the same powerhouse SEC programs, so it's going to be interesting to see what they decide. It'll be hard to fault them if they go with FSU, 'Bama, Texas. It's a rare year where there isn't a truly dominant team. UGA has been #1 almost all year and they've lost a ton of talent the last couple years. 'Bama really came on with their QB, but they really should be out of it if Auburn didn't rush 2 on 4th and ~30 to win the game vs Auburn. There will be people upset no matter what direction they go. This would probably be the perfect year for 8 teams as I really think the top ~8 could win...save for FSU due to Jordan Travis.

They beat LSU as well as Duke and Louisville. So...three, but they beat the first couple with Travis at QB. They're a very different team without him. I think they're a very worthy team...IF they have Travis, but they don't. How does UGA stay in and 'Bama get knocked out?

Well...you got your dream, but I can't see FSU being one of the top 4 teams. Their offense is so bad. I also don't think the SEC is getting two in. I think it's a tough argument to get one in this year. Michigan and Washington are locks. UT should be I think...and then I would say 'Bama...but they're not all that impressive this year. Michigan appears to be the favorite, but this is going to be a year where none of the games are obvious locks. It should make for a more entertaining CFP.

The hell it wasn't. This was a huge topic of conversation. I probably posted about it...25-30 times and that was hardly rare. That was easily the consensus. Sign Chourio to a long-term deal. It's in pretty much everything. The "your off-season thread," threads about Yelich. It was a regular topic on here. I'll take your word for it that you didn't see it...somehow, but take mine that we absolutely were talking about it and hoping for it(and this exceeds expectations).

Yeah, but he was slow for an NFL back. He was slow...and that's after he lost ~20 pounds going off the NFL combine score. The "did he get more carries because he was the 11th pick," isn't something that can be answered objectively, but it stands to reason they gave the 11th overall pick carries...because he was the 11th overall pick. Of course they matter. But over 228 carries(Barber, who BTW had 213 carries at 4.7 yards and nearly 1,000 yards more in total, but ~235 more rushing yards) unless you're saying Dayne was just a short-yardage back(Which doesn't seem consistent with the 228 carries) that's a hard argument to make. Those aren't all short yardage. It's also a very inconsistent stat. The 2nd year in the league, Dayne had a 38.9 success % and Barber a 47%. That's a pretty big difference. Yet AGAIN this year Dayne got more carries(which would seem to support the "he got more carries as the 11th overall pick," narrative). Again, they each had 200+ carries. They weren't ABLE to use Dayne the same way they used Barber. They were able to do everything with Barber, not so much with Dayne.

Wisconsin has had two wildly different teams. One that's hitting open shots, playing with energy, moving. The other that's just flat and plays the same ugly style of basketball, but plays it sloppy. Marquette should win by 10 on talent, but this series seems like the better team seldom plays to expectations. I'm looking forward to it. I know I'm meant to hate Marquette but I don't. I like watching them play.

That's a bit of an odd assumption. Counting his brother's money as a deterrent? That's a HUGE assumption that he'd risk holding his hand out to his brother rather than just...make his own money. And yes, I think he'd be asking for a good amount. 8/80 is a good amount 4 years away from FA. That's a baseline. Maybe it is 7/80 with 2 TOs or whatever, but it'd be unrealistic of him to think he'd beat Murphy's deal. Finally, yes, you're ALWAYS going to be giving up FA years. There is zero reason for any team to commit this type of money to a player just to ensure they get their money through arbitration. The FA years are the only reason you consider giving ~80M to any player.

I just started listening and what a GREAT point they're making. You want to spend this money on Jackson Chourio or spend twice this on Cody Bellinger? It's a no-brainer. That's setting aside how overrated I think Bellinger's "bounce back" season was. The raw numbers were great, but projecting forward, the exit velo and the advanced analytics, that's a helluva risk.

I'd LOVE to become the Braves in this regard. They are set up so well moving forward. They have their stars all locked up just up until the back end of their prime years. Some are more expensive like Austin Riley(still a good value). He signed 3 years into his service time(well, as he was finishing his 3rd year) and has put up ~19 WAR the last 3 years. He's signed through age 34. Olson was heading into his 2nd year of arbitration, so you paid a premium there(and that worked out well thus far). Harris, Murphy, Albies, and then Acuna Jr. SIX of their 9 positions. Your C, 1B, 2B, 3B, CF, RF. All 6 are guys who you can reasonably expect 5-6 WAR from and in big years can, as we saw, out-perform even hat. I'd again continue to pound the drums for a Uribe deal, a Contreras deal, and maybe a Frelick deal. Obviously at very different numbers. Uribe for 8/30M or use Ashby/Peralta's deals. Contreras for an 8/80M type deal + 2 team options as well. Someone broke it down and compared it to what Murphy signed for next year and that's a fair deal relative to Murphy's and adds a ton of value to Contreras moving forward and allows you to do whatever with Quero. BUT--again, Jackson Chourio is in a different league than all of these players. What he's done at his age, what he's accomplished is just different. The upside is so much higher there. And it's rare. I would bet money Jackson Holliday doesn't sign that deal simply because he got a large signing bonus, he comes from money. And you just saw what it can cost if you wait a month or a few months with Carroll or Julio Rodriguez.

Yeah, Gibson was a massive human being. I thought he got up into the 400s. I actually thought he was that big for a time at UW, but they got him to lose some weight. It's just so rare for a human that big to be able to take the beating their knees, hips, ankles, back...all that stuff takes. And as we saw with Mekhi Becton, the time it takes to come back from injury can be much longer. It's very rare to have an Ogden-sized player who stays healthy his whole career. And almost all of those guys, once you get past 330 or so, you're going to have a lot of bad weight.

That's a REALLY dumb stat IMO. I would imagine Dayne would be higher simply because he'd be used in more short-yardage situations, but...that's not a particularly useful metric for me. But if you ARE going to use it, Barber had a significantly higher success rate in total during their time with the Giants. Yards per carry is a much better metric IMO when you're talking about the same team. You don't need to account for the OL like you do when talking about Barry vs Emmitt(imagine Barry running behind that 90's Cowboys OL). And you don't need to get real deep with EPA or stuff like that PFF does where you have someone grading every individual play. Something that's going to lead to inconsistencies even if it's the same person, but now you have multiple people doing it? The Giants went to the Super Bowl Dayne's rookie year. They spent the 11th pick. I could be wrong, but I don't think a HC in the NFL is going to give carries to an inferior back because he's not getting along with the back. But, that's just my opinion.

I tend to agree. I don't think he ever becomes Bettis-like. Bettis had extraordinarily quick feet for a back his size. Just in general he had quick feet. I'd also argue Dayne was never the "best" College Running Back of all time, but I get you're going by yards. Dayne had a really nice NFL career. Not everyone is going to be a superstar. He probably could have made a little more out of his ability, but I also think he was wildly overrated as the #11 pick and had a limited upside. Totally off the topic, but when I think about these big, bruising, physical backs, it just makes me marvel that much more at Jim Brown and Bo Jackson. Both were in that ~240 range with incredible speed and they were elusive. Brown at a time when many OL were barely 240!

Oh...I thought he got 5/85. The Covid year doesn't really matter in this regard(it certainly helped that he started, then opted out so it counted as a year of service, but not in their initial GTD offer).

Yes, but it's not a FULL 7 seasons. I'm the first to say, "it's closer to 7 seasons," but you really couldn't bring him up for OD before this contract. You had to worry about service time. So this could VERY possibly mean an additional 1st Rd draft pick, plus the money. Also, it's not a stupid game now. It's just "this is our guy, he's here through the age of 30...we don't need to start bracing 3-4 years in and talking about when we're going to trade him. That's really the huge thing. Most likely he's going to really struggle for stretches this year. A .770 OPS would be great, his D and Speed, also big. But that burns one year, then you'll likely have another fluke season. That's 2 years. By the time he really blows up and gets comfortable, you get maybe 1-2 years before you really start to worry about that(trading him). Burnes was actually an outlier in that he won his Cy Young earlier than normal, but that's been a constant issue and source of angst. How we're "blowing" the Burnes/Woodruff window. Well, it would have been all the worse if Chourio is the player people expect him to be. And again, if he's NOT the player we expect/hope he'll be, I don't think this is a bad deal even then. Even if you end up overpaying a little bit, he should provide 2-3 WAR at least with his power, speed, and glove. Maybe Byron Buxton isn't quite the "floor" for him, but it's pretty close...IMO.

What was LoCain GTD?