BrewerFan

I don't think it was meant to be an exact comparison with Braun, simply pointing to a guy who had a long term deal who found a way to contribute on the backend of that deal.

I don't see a big distinction there. He's stayed healthy this year, but he's missed a few weeks every year. If he can finish his career...similar to the type of production Braun provided, I'll be happy. I'm not talking specifically about WAR, but just the impact that Braun had. I don't think he has or will be worth 26M to the Brewers, but THIS version of Yelich is most definitely a net positive. The one thing that baffles me is why we hit him 3rd vs left handed pitchers where it seems like he's less likely to hit for power and more likely to draw a walk, but...on balance, it's hard to complain what he's done in 2023.

Yeah, the Bucks could have beaten this...IMO. The problem was Beal had a personal connection to Pho(his agents son is the Suns President of...something). But that's CP3 and Shamet who are just there for salary purposes. Paul was going to get waived. 2nds can be bought pretty easily. Pick swaps are basically just lottery tickets in case a David Robinson type situation occurs. Or they're far enough out that KD will be gone. The problem for the Suns is they really have no way to add depth. For a team without a PF, that's going to be tough. They have 5 guys under contract and outside of trading Ayton(and they can't package players with him) they're going to have to sign basically all veteran minimum guys. It's good for the Suns owner, but man, this team could be in REAL trouble if they have any injuries. Ayton HAS to be moved now in a deal where they can get a defensive big and then a couple other depth pieces. The Knicks seem like a good option. Mitchell Robinson, Obi and even a guy like Hartenstein. They've really made that 2nd luxury tax threshold kinda punitive. I'm thinking the NBAPA is going to want to re-visit that as it's going to cost a lot of vets a lot of money. It also almost forces teams who are already over that limit to pay whatever FAs they have what they want(if they have their Bird rights). Really hope(and assume) Middleton and Lopez understand this and are willing to work with the team.

I don't believe that to be the case because Aaron Rodgers didn't believe that to be the case. The same day the Wilson traded was finalized was the day the Packers put the tag on Adams. As Rodgers said on the McAfee show, he felt there that Adams would be coming back up until they made their final offer to Adams...which again was larger than Adams, and then the deal got done very quickly. So I'm pretty sure you're wrong about that. I don't think they knew when the Russell Wilson trade was finalized on March 8th that Davante Adams was not going to be coming back. Here's Rodgers who said he was in regular contact with Adams leading up to the trade and who officially signed his contract on the 17th of March. Rodgers signed his deal on March 17th. Rumors about his extension came out about a week earlier. Again, per Rodgers, the deal came together quick. So if the Broncos finished the trade with Wilson on March 8th, that means they likely turned down the Rodgers trade a week before that, maybe less. Adams I'm curious why you believe that they already knew when they turned down the Broncos trade offer that Adams wasn't coming back? In fact, the details around the Rasul Douglas extension suggests more than anything that the Packers did not in fact know he was gone as they went from telling Douglas they wouldn't be able to extend him to pivoting and then extending him. March 14th-Not expected to retain him. March 19th-One day after Adams is traded, they sign him to a 3 year contract. This all tells me they definitely didn't know Adams was gone when they turned down the Jeudy+1sts package for Adams.

Bradley Beal...given permission to talk to the Bucks. I'm split. He's not been a good 3 point shooter the last ~5-6 years. He HAS also put up 30PPG twice in that span(on bad teams). Can he get back to 40% from 3 or is he more of the .347% since 2017? If he has Giannis and Middleton, is he the floor spacer who can create his own shot? The question is, what are we giving up for him? Jrue=Sure. With just 2 years left and then retirement(which he seems set on) it makes sense. You'd BETTER believe you have someone like Beauchamp who's ready to make that jump and get into the lineup. 2nd issue-It'd almost certainly push you over the 2nd line. That means you can't add players in a trade to match salaries, no MLE, no Bi-Annual, no buyouts. You greatly restrict what you can do. Jrue's one of the most respected players around the league, so maybe a 3 team trade could work. But then there's another big factor. The only players with value are Portis, Beauchamp, Connaughton and Allen. At a minimum, you're going to have to include one of those players and the '27 1st into the deal. Probably a moot point as the Suns are now also invested, but is this the team that can get us back over the top? PG-Beal(?) SG-Connaughton SF-Middleton(if he's the playoff version) PF-Giannis C-Lopez Bench Ingles, Mathews, Portis. Leonhard, Thanasis, AJ Reed(?)... I don't know how much the defense takes a hit and how much the offense opens up. I think the better way to go would be to give Middleton a longer deal with a lower starting salary(5/170) first year at ~30M Lopez at 3/54 See if you can trade Crowder for a late 1st or at least a couple 2nds. There are some team with cap room apparently interested. I don't really see the value being there to extend him via Bird rights unless the new staff has very different ideas for him, or you decide to take a guy like Portis who's been INCREDIBLY loyal and passed up tens of millions to be in Milwaukee and make Jae your 6th man, backup 4. But it could really give us some breathing room to stay below the draconian restrictions that start this year for teams over that 2nd apron. Dame-He's all over the place and I'm not even gonna entertain that one as...again, why would Portland trade him here and for what? The best suggestion I've seen LONG term is Jrue+Portis for Simmons+Grant+3rd overall pick Scoot Henderson...who said his dream was to play in Milwaukee with Khris and Giannis. You get younger, more versatile and you stay under the luxury tax enough to still go out and added players via sign and trad and ML, Bi-Annuel, all those avenues to fill out a roster. I don't see why Portland is trading a talent like Scoot who'd be the #1 pick in most drafts(if he even goes 3rd) but I guess they feel a lot of pressure to win right now and Holiday playing with Dame in the backcourt is the reason behind such a proposal. The only thing I feel confident about at this point is Middleton and Lopez coming back and signing deals that can help the Bucks add other players in longer term deals with less 1st year money and then...Horst will have to pull off miracles.

See! I'm....right? I guess....🤷‍♂️ It's debatable!

It doesn't appear thus far that's the direction they'll go, but remember when Linsley lost the job in back to back years, then started due to injuries to...Even Dietrich Smith IIRC. Turned out to be the best thing that happened to them. As for Myers, he can get to the end level...vs slower NT or if they're shaded on his right shoulder and they're running that outsize zone the other way. But he's rarely beating DL to their spot. If you're talking about when they come out with the DTs playing a 3i, sure, he can chip and get to the next level, but I'm talking about beating his name to the spot, sealing and then going. Remember, this is a guy who was projected by some as 4th-6th rounder at Center due to his limited athleticism. Put when he locks onto a guy, he's more than capable of just planting a guy. Now...a big physical Center works great in...Dallas or Philly, but in a scheme where you need really athletic Centers such as our ZBS, that pick never made sense to be. Myers over Creed is like a...Sternberger over McClaurin type pick...if they were both WRers and one was the consensus #1 play at his position, scored a 10.0 RAS. There were concerns about Humphrey's ability to make calls(I think that's why he was available when he was). Maybe we'll pivot a bit this year. Especially if a guy like Jones works his way in there. More iso type FB, double teams at the point and just more physical. That'd play to his strength. Or maybe as Stenovich recently said, Tom WILL compete at all 3 spots, C, RG and RT. Or maybe Myers with Jenkins on one side, maybe he'll just play better. Just looking at Tom long term though, if he's not a Center, then his future position has to be LT or RT. Otherwise it seems like a bit of a waste to stick such a great athlete at RG. I hope you're right though, he just needs to play more consistently. It's not like he hasn't made some highlight level blocks. It's just a matter of how consistent he is.

That's a GMs job within reason. Again, this looked much different a week later when they couldn't convince Adams to stay. -Defense finished outstanding. -Hired one of the top STC in the NFL -You were returning the #1 WRer and back to back MVP They have AMPLE reason to believe they would as good or better heading into last year. I think it's fair to wonder what could have been now that we don't have Rodgers and see what happened last year, but trading away Rodgers at that point, when he was still talking about playing a few more years and wanted to finish his career in GB, it's easy to see why they didn't do it as well. It's even easier(not) to go back a year when the offer was Jeudy,+ Surtain(their 1st that year)+ 2 more 1sts+3 2nds/3rd round picks. That's a superstar in Surtain, an elite #2, maybe a #1 in Jeudy with 4 years left and 5 more picks. But when you think you can win a Super Bowl...which they had every reason to believe at the time assuming Bakh would be back and that core... I don't think you can predict lingering injuries, new injuries(Gary, Stokes, Bakh's appendectomy)...Barry seemingly figuring it out and then reverting again, etc... What's more, how much of the fanbase do you alienate? You lost due to STs(and of course poor Rodgers play, but directly due to STs failures). You were better than the Rams that season, the SB champs. We'd be saying Gutekunst doesn't care about winning Super Bowls, he's more worried about his ego. I'd also submit, particularly 2 years ago when the best deal was floated, it would have been very detrimental to Love's development. He wasn't close to being ready to step in at that point. But it sure as hell stings when you think you could have Surtain, Jeudy, Charlie Cross, you still likely end up with Watson or you only have to give up a ~3rd at most to move up. And you're still left with a 1st+2 more day 2 picks. That sucks, but again, it's tough to blame Gutekunst for not pulling the trigger.

Strength is LESS of a priority at Center than it is at guard. Obviously you'd like maulers all over the place, but Centers are the smallest position on average along the OL. Yes, they have to deal with NTs...and they ALMOST never have to do it alone. You're getting a double on that NT from the Guard probably 90% of the time unless you're running away from him. Athleticism is the priority over size/strength at C. That's not to say Tom didn't need to make significant gains in terms of functional strength. It was an issue at any position along the OL. But he does look noticeably bigger this year.

This is of course the key. They need Misiorowski to continue to develop and stay healthy while moving relatively quickly through the system(as quickly as a pitcher really can while you build his innings each year). The prospect of Misiorowski, Ashby back healthy(which is why I wouldn't even be looking at him to make it back this year, but rather use ST'ing as a goal)...gives you the potential for two really overpowering arms. Gasser could be a very fine #3. Black-3B Chourio-CF Frelick-LF Wiemer-RF Yelich-DH Quero-C Turang-SS Brown Jr-2B Hiura-1B I don't have 1B figured out unless Hiura's new swing is actually going to yield results at the MLB level and we've still got some OFers to spare, but that's a really encouraging lineup looking at ~2025. If the Brewers can't get more production offensively, get Winker going or give Hiura a try, Frelick when he's back healthy, whatever it may be...I don't think it'd be out of line to see a trade with a team like the Mets. Burnes for Tidwell, Batty, a lower level arm like Diaz and...who knows, if they're desperate, maybe they'll take back the bulk of Yelich contract(that's a bit unlikely, but if Yelich is hitting ~.275 with an ~.800 OPS...is it impossible? Cohen doesn't seem to care about burning cash ala the Joker from Batman. Edit-At that point, I'd be all for including Williams in a trade to facilitate including Yelich. IF you are trading Burnes for example, then sell Williams when his value is still high...and this is NOT a reaction to the Twins. Just a way to try and see if you can get the Mets to bite and take of mostly off the hook for Yelich. A deal in which we pay his contract this year, next and then the buyout(in addition to what we're already paying in deferred money). It's always felt impossible to get out from under that, but MAYBE it's not. Feels like the worst thing the Brewers can do is just limp along, be ~500 and in it at the deadline. There's no real excitement, but there will be outrage if they sell. So get healthy, get those 3 bats in particular up and hope they can inject some life and if not, then I'd rather see them losing than sitting here in no mans land.

That is an incredibly difficult situation to be in. To be coming off two straight years where you're SO close to the SB and a QB who's won back to back MVPs...but man, with the benefit of hindsight, that is a franchise altering. A Super Bowl win is forever, so it's hard to blame them too much, but that's almost a Herschel Walker type trade. I wonder if the Broncos had just waited ~10 days...once Adams was traded, if the Packers would have changed course? If things had just moved quicker, perhaps this gets done. That gives us two years, a couple of premium picks and still an extra 1st for the '24 draft IF Love doesn't work out. I think Gutekunst did a nice job of squeezing out what compensation he could from NYJ...and again, I understand a SB is worth 2-3 1sts, but when you look back at an 8-9 season and you could end up with basically 2 2nd round picks and then the value of a late 3rd/early 4th to move up 2 spots, that's a stark contrast. That's not even addressing the salary cap and how much healthier we'd be when it comes to that. I can't crush Gutekunst for holding on, but when they lost Adams, then they turn around and move Rodgers a year later, it's definitely a move you'd love to have back.

I agree on Runyan. He's a solid starter. He's extremely reliable. Assignment sure. All those things have value, but he's as you said, physically limited. I'd like to see Tom at C, Myers at G and then open the competition up at RT. Tom has the athletic ability you need at Center where Myers doesn't. Myers struggles to get to the next level, he can be a bit slow off the snap and allows defenders to cross his face, however, he is a mauler and I think he has enough athleticism to play OG. But this is mostly about Tom. I think he could develop into a Kelce like Center. The way he comes out in the run game, he's smooth, quick and most importantly low. He just wasn't very strong last year. At RT, Jones looked interesting, but it's an uphill battle for him in this offense as he's also not a great athlete, but he's so damn big, it's was incredible how he was walling guys off last year. Some were even solid veterans trying to make teams. 6'9 and 36 inch arms and he looked pretty smooth out there. But the most likely scenario is Myers/JRJ and Tom pushing Nijman at RT. Whatever they end up doing with Tom, I think he's going to be a cornerstone of this OL moving forward, and outside of Watson, the player from the last couple drafts who has the most upside for their respective positions. With very few true Superstars, I believe those two are the most likely to ascend to that level. And I just think you start with putting your best players at LT, C and RT, then fill in the Guards around that. But despite MLF saying Tom would get snaps at C, and both spots on the right side, I'm not sure he's gotten those snaps at Center yet which would mean they think more highly of Myers than I. Sean Rhyan is playing some Center. I think that could be interesting despite most people writing him off after an unproductive rookie year culminating in a suspension. Whatever they choose to do, having their two top OL back to anchor the left side gives the whole group an enormous advantage over what they had going into last year or the end of '21 when both were out with injuries.

That was a LOT. The bubble, then an abnormally short post-season. Throw the Olympics in there and the Bucks weren't getting any time off. Also, if Middleton can come back and play a full season. How he played in the post-season this year was encouraging. If Beauchamp or Portis and the supporting cast. The big thing though, I just don't think you can break basketball down like you do Baseball. It's not individual matchups. In those post-season numbers for Jokic, he's not facing the same defenses. We saw what Giannis did vs the Suns. The Warriors were another team that did not have much inside resistance. Especially when you contrast that to what Giannis has with the Celtics, the Raptors when they had Kawhi, Gasol and Ibaka was still playing well defensively. Finally...I REALLY think trying to break down the best player into minutes played or games with Giannis is a little silly. You're not talking about Ben Simmons. The Bucks are extremely cautious(as they should be) with a generational talent. Jokic isn't running guys down like LeBron when, for example he got Bridges in the finals that's forgotten about as the play where he stops Booker and then goes up and gets Ayton was such an freakish play, they were asking if that was the best play in finals history the following day. In any event, there are two different conversations. Can the Bucks win again. Can they add teammates who will hit their shots, take pressure off Giannis as Murray does(and Middleton has) and who's the better player between the two. Throw Giannis on GSW, change nothing and he's going to be an even more efficient scorer and I'm pretty certain he'd widely be considered the best still. A playoff run like each have had most certainly cements your legacy, but it also leads to overreactions. With Giannis, as I said, it was "Is he a top 10 player all time already," and Jokic I saw a clip Richard Jefferson said he was KD scoring, Magic passing, Duncan rebounding and Steph shooting(though he at least added the caveat that Steph shot more often, so just as good, not better). You can certainly make an argument for Jokic right now. That's not crazy. I'd disagree, but Jokic is an incredibly skilled player. I don't think you can take what Giannis does on both ends and say it's so obvious it's not debatable.

In something that's actually news...aside from the "best shape of my life," platitudes, Bakhtiari is taking reps in team activities. That's a pretty big deal. You'd assume if he wasn't absolutely 100%, they wouldn't risk him in off-season activities that...he really doesn't need to be a part of. Perhaps confirmation that Gutekunst was telling the truth when he said they have "zero long term concerns about Bahktiari's health). All the talk about Love's weapons is great, but we know there's no greater weapon for a young QB than a great OL. Bakh/Jenkins all the way back healthy, and then some combination of Tom, Myers, JRJ, NIjman, maybe Jones or Walker(Jones is apparently weighing around 350, so he MIGHT actually be in the best shape of his life, though I remain skeptical). A more simplified, strictly MLF offense, experienced OL, an Elite RB and then Dillon trying to redeem himself from last year and explosive young WRers, If the OL holds up, that's everything a young QB needs to get a fair shot...and frankly more than just about any other 1st year QB gets.

I completely agree. The schedule the Packers have, they could(should) win at least ~8 games and could get to 9 or even 10(so I guess we disagree a bit there) But I'm not nearly as interested in the Packers win total as I am Love. We could win 10 games and be in a worse place than we were after Rodgers rookie season. You saw it quickly. You saw the discipline, you saw the big time throws, how elusive he was(I'm thinking of that NFCCG vs ATL where Rodgers was ducking free runners like he was Lamar). You knew. The team wasn't there yet, but you knew. That's all this year is about. Development and gauging who should be in the long term plans. If Love is the guy, the Packers are set up almost perfectly. 7-8 young targets with a TON of athletic ability, they can figure out who will separate themselves(Toure seems to be the guy the Packers FO mentions unprompted every time they talk about the team). Likely 2 1sts to hopefully fill out the team. Maybe a LT, keep building that DL, but they've got the answer to the big question. That's the best case clearly. The worst case is a Trey Lance type season. Not even in the sense that he suffers an injury, but just one in which they come out not knowing. The 2024 draft will be the "Caleb Williams" draft. I see mocks with Maye going ahead of him, I don't buy it. So hopefully either proves he's the guy and will continue to improve or we figure out definitively he is not. I believe in Jordan Love, HOWEVER, if he's just not the answer, I don't think making a huge investment in trading up to get him would be a bad idea. He's special. He's got a Mahomes type quality to him. Probably more athletic, so, so accurate and a QB in the Peyton, Luck, Lawrence mold...in that you know they're going to hit. It'll likely take a kings ransom(way too premature, but I'd guess both 1sts+2 more), But that's truly putting the cart before the horse. Either way, it'll be a fun year. See if Watson, Doubs, Musgrave, LVN, Tom can do, can Stokes get back to his rookie form, if a guy like Caleb Jones forces his way into the lineup. Who knows...maybe Love come out and he IS like Mahomes and he sets the league on fire in a weak NFC...50 TDs, 12 picks, 5000+ yards. Is that asking too much?

Well...I don't agree with the first statement...I don't think the best player on the team that wins the final is just anointed the best player. The game is played on both ends, not just the offensive side. I can certainly see an argument for Jokic, but the idea that there is this clear and obvious separation is as...unreasonable as the statement that the Giannis who won 2X MVP or FMVP, DPOY, etc..."ain't coming back." Put Giannis on a team with Murray, Porter Jr, Gordon, KCP and he's "clearly" the #1 player. Jokic is a more skilled offensively. That is clear. But the same can be said for Curry...arguably Embiid or Tatum. Giannis is still the best OVERALL player. This feels like a First Take type of reaction. I recall just 2 years ago they were asking if Giannis was already a top 10 player of all-time. I just don't get the logic in general. He WAS the best player doing...pretty much what he did now, just with a healthier team around him, but now he needs a great evolution and players around him to re-take that spot? Again, that's talking about which TEAM is better. Is Jokic actually better this year than he was last year when Murray and Porter Jr were out? The consensus seemed to be that he wasn't. But those two come back after playing just 9 games last year and NOW Jokic overtakes Giannis? No, the Nuggets have overtaken the Bucks and Jokic deserves his flowers. He's an incredible talent. Bill Walton if he'd have stayed healthy type talent. I'll give him that. I do agree the coaching staff needs to help Giannis and create an actual offensive gameplan while Horst needs to try and acquire young talent with limited resources. Beauchamp's development will be crucial...and he's certainly added a whole lot of mass to try and take that leap working out with Giannis in Greece. So we'll see how that goes.

Well, I don't agree it was closer to the J-Kidd version of Giannis than the MVP version. He was 3rd in the league in PER last year, but that's not even the issue. Making the declaration that at 28; I So 28, 3rd in MVP voting, 3rd in PER, 2nd in defensive rating, 3rd in defensive +/-, 5th in +/- overall, and his usage rate was 1st in the league at ~39% and at 28, the best version of him is "gone and ain't coming back," because he wasn't historically great last year? That seems like a wild declaration in my opinion. Even last year his TS% was equal to Tatum and we're writing him off now like he's some past his prime injury prone player? If ever there was a sign of how quickly we've taken for granted his greatness...

It absolutely does. It eliminates the MLE, it eliminates sign and trades, it eliminates the bi-annual, it eliminates a LOT of different trades, it eliminates signing players who were bought out. You trade a pick and that pick moves to the bottom of the round...so that future 1st the Bucks have that they could trade becomes far less valuable as a team that may look at it as a pick the Bucks may have without Giannis or during a rebuild loses that value. Getting below that 2nd line is really the only way they're going to be able to add anyone outside of a minimum salary veteran.

Yeah, that makes sense. He MAY have hit his peak. I don't see any reason he can't stay at his peak for a couple more years. Again, he's just 28. That was how old Jordan was when he won his 2nd Title. And his mid-range game is much better than I think he's given credit for. The problem was two fold. 1-They didn't actually run an offense. Ingles came back late and it was primarily just exchanging possessions in which someone would try and take their man off the bounce. 2-Middleton wasn't really all the way back until the end of the year. Had a lingering knee issue we just found out about. That forced Giannis to handle the ball and be the facilitator even more than before. And he STILL went for ~31/12/6. And this is a down year we're talking about. I think a new coach and some type of actual offensive ideology beyond penetrate and score or kick will help. I also don't think Giannis' athleticism is going anywhere in the near future. I also think we saw an injured Giannis in the playoffs and he'd lost his touch around the rim, which is an underrated aspect of his game. It's not just run and dunk, it's how he contorts himself and the ways in which he puts the ball in the hoop while splitting defenders. He still put up 38/20 in the last game and the Bucks blew two straight to the team currently in the ECF's with a 13 and a 15 point lead heading in the 4th quarters. There's not a lot of margin for error of course with a team this age, but there's still enough there to win another title with Giannis. https://fadeawayworld.net/nba-media/giannis-antetokounmpo-is-shooting-better-from-mid-range-than-jayson-tatum-lebron-james-and-zach-lavine

Well that makes sense. I think it's really just a matter of actually running a cohesive offense. I like what Jrue brings and I think we've got the pieces...IF they're healthy. I'm loving Beauchamp working with Giannis in Greece. I'm hoping Middleton can get back to the better version of himself. That he needed another surgery and STILL played as well as he did in the post-season is encouraging. He was around 24-25 PPG, shooting over 50/40. Ingles is old, but I think he can be a nice facilitator offensively. Terry Stotts is going to be great for this team...and I think Griffith can keep the defense elite. A HUGE part of the equation is going to be getting Middleton and Lopez back hopefully closer to ~33 and 17 than 40 and 20. Would keep us below the 2nd line that really handcuffs us. I think Jrue would bring back a nice return, but he's been pretty adamant about retiring after his contract is up. That could be in a year or more likely two. Not sure what that gets you.

I'm...just at a total loss for words. "Giannis is probably more ideal as a #2 all-around sorta player." He's been the consensus best player in the NBA the last 3 years and ONLY passed up because Jokic is having the type of post-season he had. Speaking of which, they're almost exactly the same age. So who are we adding so that Giannis is our #2? Man...do we get spoiled QUICK in Wisconsin. You've got a top ~15 player ALL-TIME in his prime and people are saying at...again, TWENTY-EIGHT years old, his prime is behind him and now that he's more ideal as a #2. Guess not a total lost for words, but just dumbstruck either way.

WHAT? Are you seriously inferring that the best of Giannis is "gone," at the ripe old age of 28? That's....wild.

Drafting based on need is not a particularly good idea in any sport, but at least in the NFL, you or NBA, you're talking about players who are more likely to contribute to their teams in the next year or two. In MLB, you're looking at ~3 years if you hit on a College prospect and 5 maybe 6 if it's a HS kid outside the rare stars in each. There's been a pretty stark change in their drafting ideology the last several years. Better hit tools, athleticism...just stick with that. As soon as you start trying to find your next 1B, you're going to reach and for what? Projecting the 2028 lineup?

No clue as this entire thing is absolutely ridiculous. Money to MAINTAIN the stadium? Sure...great. But this ridiculous threat or inferred threat that we'd better or else? I'm not sure what type of forum this is, but if I were to articulate my point how I wanted, I'm sure my post, which will be awaiting approval by a moderator-would not be approved. The stadium is outstanding, it's in great shape, the Brewers are doing well. And again, I get we need to plan ahead, but unless this was some combined blackmail by Attanasio and MLB to get the state to actually pony up money that I think both sides are already pretty much in agreement that this is something that needs to be done, then I don't understand the point. And not that this is of huge significance, but it's also made it sound as though we're on similar footing to the As or Rays and we've just got a trash stadium.