strawbossisevil

Staggering isn't the word I'd use for it, in fact while I agree with you that I'd rather not give up more prospects, Doug has yet to trade away a prospect that has developed into an above average major league player. He gave up LaPorta who may become that eventually, but LaPorta's numbers last season were not super exciting, an OBP of .308, an OPS of .750 as a 24 year old (hardly young). For a comparison, many here were disappointed in Gamel's hitting, but Gamel actually put up a better OPS last season than LaPorta. Add to that fact that LaPorta is a liability defensively playing anywhere but at 1B and to this point that move has not benefited the Indians all that much (and we replaced LaPorta in the move by signing a high ceiling guy, Kentrail Davis, with the pick we got from Sabathia). You might point to Brantley and his .358 OBP, but then it is only fair to point out that he is slugging about as well as Jason Kendall, while being mediocre defensively for a CF. While he's not a horrible option in CF, he's really not any better than Gomez is for the Brewers. It also could be added that Brantley got thrown out trying to steal about 10% of the time he got on base, but that is just poor coaching. Those are the two biggest names we have moved. We moved Inman, who was projected to struggle to make it to the big leagues and those projections turned out to be correct, and the other pitcher we sent in that deal, Garrison, while promising has spent more time on the DL than on the mound. Examples of teams getting young, top of the rotation, cost controlled starters via trades are few and far between. You've pointed to the Rays getting Kazmir as an example, or the Twins getting Garza, but those moves jump of the page because they are indeed so rare, as quite often the only way a team would be able to trade for such starters is to give up a player like Fielder or Braun in a trade, a true difference maker. The biggest problem for the Brewers has not been the trades they've made so far (because amazingly they've done very well on selling high on their prospects), but instead the problem was Jack Z leaving the organization with bare cupboards in the area of starting pitching. Despite that fact, Melvin has been able to maintain a rotation that has been average over his tenure here (with some major ups, and some major downs) and the numbers back that up.

I could see this being a very bad thing for NBC (and its ratings) if Conan catches on somewhere else though. For example, if Fox picks him up right away for the same time slot as Jay. Since polls show it being split down the middle, he could theoretically lose half his audience to Conan. If I was Conan, and was looking to screw over Jay, that's exactly what I'd do too. Compete against him and drag his ratings down with you.

Has there been any word of Bush not being ready to go for this season? If there is, I haven't heard it. Just because he struggled through an injury at the end of last season doesn't mean that Macha and Melvin don't recognize him as a guy who should be in the rotation if healthy. And while I suppose it's possible that Parra could be sent down, I imagine the team will want him going every 5th day under the tutelage of Peterson. If Macha starts Suppan over Bush or Parra that is an epic fail and I'm guessing will almost assuredly get him canned. While I know fans like to play up the stupidity of the managers, I would find it utterly shocking if they went with Suppan over either of these two unless they just plan on punting the season. If he starts Suppan over either of those two for reasons other than injury, I will not buy ONE ticket all year.

I´d agree with you statman, if it weren´t for a few facts: 1) NU has never made the big dance, a win like this makes their first ever Final Four tournament a definite possibility. 2) It was against a team ranked #6 in the country (even if they had lost two straight). I say let the NU fans enjoy it, they've never had a team play so well.

I really doubt that Suppan would keep his spot in the rotation if we added another average starter. I think Doug is smart enough to know that goose is cooked. Parra and Bush both have upsides and should be able to pitch later in games than Suppan. Just because Suppan makes the big dollars doesn´t mean he´ll start, I got that impression when Doug talked about starting pitching at the end of last season.

And all those OPS numbers mean nothing as they are small samples. And the number I posted was in response to what Pogokat posted above (1.5 million).

Right, but that ignores the fact that if they don't go with option A, they are less likely to be in playoff contention at the halfway point of the season. And as others have pointed out, the Brewers were still in the playoff chase at the deadline last season, so to sell off then wouldn't have made sense.

Here's a question that has been bouncing around in my brain the past few weeks. Melvin is always talking about the need for our team to remain flexible for a midseason deal. My question is, does leaving money on the table now with anticipation of a midseason deal make us more likely to succeed or less likely to succeed this year. Let me give an example. Let's say that we have about $6 million dollars left to spend at this point. Which situation would set the team up to succeed more: Option A: Spending the 6 million dollars now on a pitcher. For that amount we'd hopefully find someone who is projected to have an ERA in the mid to low 4s. This starter pushes Suppan out of the rotation completely, leaving us a rotation of: 1) Gallardo 2) Wolf 3) FA 4) Parra 5) Bush The advantage to this option is of course that the only time Suppan would be starting would be in the case of an injury to one our starters. We go into the season with a strong rotation, but have no money to compensate were we to be hit by a rash of injuries elsewhere on the club. Option B: We save the $6 million dollars, and have Suppan pitch the first half of the season (and perhaps more if another member of the rotation goes down), but we are able to bring in a $12 million dollar type pitcher in the second half. (Possibly a Cliff Lee type, if Seattle isn't in the playoff hunt - along with that we lose at least two major prospects). The advantage of this option is that we add a superior starter down the stretch, at the cost of some of our prospects. Now which equation would be better for the team over the course of the season (and long term). A) No Suppan in the rotation at Start of Season + Average Starting Pitcher + No Ability for Moves at the Deadline + Keep All Prospects or B) Half a Year of Suppan (more if injured) + Half of a Year of Elite Pitcher + Lose Two (or more) Elite Prospects What I think: Option A is better for the regular season/long term success of the ball club. Option B is better if/once we make the playoffs (having an Elite Pitcher being an advantage to having an Average one in short playoff rotation). What do you all think? Do you see Melvin's talk of midyear flexibility as wise? Or do you think the Brewers ought to pony up now and get an average starter so that Suppan is no longer part of the opening day rotation?

To spend money on outfield when we still have a tremendous need at SP, and limited funds would be a total waste IMO. I would call it the exact opposite of a must. Gerut is a very competent #4 OF. And Byrnes is horrible, the guy hasn't OBP over .275 in the past two seasons. He was solid three seasons ago, he can't play CF anymore at a passable level, what exactly is there to like about this guy at this point? It isn't like he's young and due for a huge turnaround, he's in his mid-30s. I'd rather give a shot to Heether or the Hurricane, at least those two have some upside left in their careers, and the great thing is they'll cost us $1 Million dollars less. That's a no brainer in my book.

Have the terms of the deal been disclosed? How does this addition compare to Suppan?

I have a lot of hope going into this next season when it comes to Brewers pitching prospects. My thoughts on a few of them in no particular order. 1) Rogers by all accounts is feeling great and is throwing smoke (as evidenced by his fastball numbers from Arizona). Certainly he may need a bit of time to master his control, but if/when he does, he has ace potential. I'm confident that having Peterson as the pitching coach will help him in the control department. As long as he avoids the injury bug, I think we could be seeing him rapidly climbing the prospect charts next season, potentially joining the rotation in 2012. 2) Jeffress, like Rogers he has tremendous potential and also is capable of throwing fastballs closing in on triple digits. His problem also is control, and I think he has the motivation to put the work in necessary to harness his pitches, working with Peterson should help. The key with Jeffress isn't whether he has the stuff necessary to be an ace pitcher, it's whether he can handle the mental part of being a professional baseball player. Once again, assuming he stays on the field this next season, I think he'll turn a lot of heads, I think he'll make it into the rotation in 2012 too. 3) Braddock. He's got wicked stuff, and all that is holding him back from being a potential #1/#2 type pitcher is various health issues. The good news is that by all accounts he should be heading into this season healthy. With a K/9 last season in excess of 13 (plus his exceptional showing in Arizona), all he needs in order to become a top of the rotation starter is that health, and since most of his injuries have not been ones that threaten his long term health, I look forward to this year being the year he remains healthy and makes a case for a top of the rotation spot as early as next season. 4) Arnett. He's a college guy with a mid 90s fastball and a solid slider. He should be a quick mover in the system, and will likely end up being a middle of the rotation guy quite soon for the Brewers. Possibly joining the team as early as 2012. 5) Odorizzi. He's a HS guy so he's a few years off, but he has been exceptional so far. His control is what really stands out from last year, walking only 1.72 batters per 9 in his first full year of minor league ball. That is outstanding. He features a mid-90s fastball and some solid breaking pitches, striking out almost a batter per inning against a league featuring many college players. He's got some work to go, but I say he shares a similar ceiling to Arnett, with the potential of being a 2/3 in the rotation as soon as 2013. 6) Scarpetta. Cody has a high ceiling, and even higher if he improves upon his control. So far in his young career he's K'd over 10 batters per 9. Featuring an extremely nasty curveball and a fastball in the lower 90s, he profiles as a pitcher who could have a ceiling of a 2/3 if he can learn to control. He could be ready by 2012. 7) Rivas. Will likely be up in AA this season. He profiles as a middle/back of the rotation starter 3/4. His K numbers have been good, but incomparison to others on this list, not great. His walk numbers are good, but not great. Good news is he could be ready to step in by midseason 2011. 8) Butler. He really moved last year, and I think it's quite possible we'll see him sometime in 2010. Of all of this group, he probably doesn't profile to be anything but a back of the rotation starter. In the minors he's K'd 6.8/9. I see him as a potential cheap replacement for Suppan in 2011, but I don't expect much more beyond that from him. 9) Peralta. I like Peralta a lot and I think he is often under-rated. I think he has great middle of the rotation potential. He has K'd 9.5/per 9 in his career so far, and few realize that he's only 20 years old. He's a ways from the big show, and his control from last season leaves something to be desired (4 BB/9). But he has the potential to be a 2/3, especially as he continues to grow and mature. I see him ready to go by 2013. 10) Heckathorn and Fredrickson are both players with tremendous potential, with both of them having 2/3 potential if they can work through their control problems. I see both of them arriving around 2013 if they can put it together. So based on how I see it, I could see them arriving this way (2012 looks like it could be a very exciting year if that group can stay healthy): 2010: Butler (back of the rotation) 2011: Braddock, Rivas (midseason) 2012: Rogers, Jeffress, Arnett, Scarpetta 2013: Peralta, Heckathorn, Fredrickson, Odorizzi

I seriously doubt that Bush and Hart get as much as some are suggesting here. Not after the numbers they put up last season.

I am impressed with 7. Before I installed it my computer was freezing 2-3 times a day with Vista. I haven't had it freeze up on me since installing 7 a couple of months ago.

It takes two to tango, and we have no idea if he was at all interested in coming to Milwaukee (especially at that contract, it likely would have had to be significantly higher). We can play the "what if" game all we want, but it isn't going to change the fact that Milwaukee generally has to slightly overpay to get many Free Agents to come here.

While you may disagree, I don't think anyone in MLB thought that Escobar was ready to step in as a Major League ballplayer last season. You also repeatedly ignore the fact that having Escobar up last season starts his arby clock during a period of his career when his bat will be more of a minus than a plus. A team like the Brewers is extremely dependant on having players cheap during their prime years, and to bring up Escobar a year sooner than need be (since JJ was still under contract for two seasons at that point). In that sense it would be utterly ridiculous to trade Hardy last season. The only way it makes any sense is with the benefit of hindsight. I'm a big believer in the idea that it is not in the Brewers' best interest to rush prospects. As much as you like to hammer on the downfall of last year's SP, last year saw horrible years from Parra and Bush which few saw coming, as well as a worse year from Looper than anyone could have honestly expected. If those three pitch at the level they were expected to, the Brewers would likely have been right in the hunt at the trade deadline.

I wouldn't be so sure about this. Hughes has essentially become nothing but a bullpen arm for them. That is valuable, but not so valuable that he couldn't be moved if a few top prospects were offered for him, especially ones that would improve their team at other positions in the immediate future. Adding Coffey and Braddock would likely improve the depth of their bullpen (currently a problem) without a huge drop off (Coffey's ERA was better than Hughes last year, although his overall numbers were not quite as good). Add in a Salome or a Hart, and those are improvements in other areas where the Yankees are still needing depth (or even starters) in the very near future. I don't think the Yankee's asking price is going to be Braun or Fielder for a guy who has been made into a setup guy in their bullpen. If he were a lights out Papelbaun-esque closer, then maybe, but he hasn't been THAT good to this point. Also, if Chamberlain can be had (which I don't believe he can be, since I think he has an even higher ceiling/better potential than Hughes) then he is a guy I want the Brewers to be trading for. He is a better version of Morrow at the very least. I do like the idea of taking on Igawa in the trade to even out salaries. I think he would be a good guy to have at AAA as insurance in case of a rash of pitching injuries.

Trouble is BREWERPRIDE, is that back of the bullpen won't at all matter if the guys handing them the ball can't give them a lead. We also saw last year how the bullpen was overtaxed late in the season because of our poor starting pitching. Hughes solves that problem. Hughes and Coffey had similar ERAs last season, with Hughes having the vastly superior K/BB rate. There is no doubt that Hughes is the better pitcher. Add on top of that that Hughes is pre-arby and would be under team control for a long time, makes it just that much more ridiculous to say that you'd prefer Coffey to Hughes. Coffey is an above average bullpen arm. Hughes profiles as one who could be a solid #2 starter which carries a much higher value. I think you overvalue Braddock and Salome too. Braddock is no sure thing with his injuries and may not become anything more than a bullpen arm. He has a huge ceiling but everything has to go right for him to reach it. Salome is a good catching prospect, but he's behind Lucroy on the depth chart and there are a lot of questions as to how his game will translate to big league success. The rest of the bullpen is hardly terrible. Even without Coffey we still have two elite RPs in Hoffman and Hawkins. To be honest, I was afraid the Brewers would be giving up too little in this deal, not too much. Pre-arby high ceiling SPs cost a mint in trades.

Right, but his value is limited there. He'd be more valuable in a trade IMO. Since the bullpen is one of the weaker areas on the Yankees, this deal would essentially be a 2 for 1 deal. They get two solid RPs (with Braddock having future potential as a SP) PLUS a solid catching prospect (needed in case Posada has injury problems, and the very real possibility of retirement in the near future) for the price of one solid RP/SP. This would upgrade their bullpen and their catching situation, and it would upgrade the Brewers' starting rotation. It's a win-win.

Why he's available: The Yankees have their rotation full with Sabathia, Vazquez, Chamberlein, Burnett, and Pettite. How much would he cost? I know that the Yankees are a bit thin at RP, so what if we include Coffey along with Salome and Braddock? (This would give the Yankees two solid BP arms and a catcher to fill in once Posada can't continue behind the dish). Hughes, I think has top of the rotation potential and is pre-arby, so he would be a very worthwhile target and a huge upgrade to our rotation. FWIW: Hughes ERA last season - 3.03, 96 k to only 28 BB.

Instead of complaining, I think we should find the golden strand in all of this. This makes Philip Hughes much more likely to be dealt. I think he is a guy the Brewers should definitely be going after as a cheap pre-arby SP who could be slotted in our rotation. (And from here I'll take this to the Trade Rumors forum)

We already know that it is not likely to be end of the moves. The Brewers are the favorites to sign Mulder, and they are searching the trade market (see Correia, Morrow) for another young starter. I would be surprised if another move isn't made. The point the Journal Sentinal writer is making is that they will not be adding any expensive FA options at this point, not that they won't be making other moves.

I would trade Hart and Salome for Morrow. And then I'd move Gamel to RF. Salome could be a C/DH option for Seattle (splitting time at C with prospect Adam Moore), Hart would be an upgrade in LF for Seattle.

The fact that he was in on Correia suggests that we have a few million yet to make a move, it just isn't going to be a FA signing anywhere near the cost of Wolf. I don't think this is anything we didn't know before.

FWIW, Bush's ERA was 4.52 when he got hit by the line drive. I don't think that would be classified as his "best season ever", it would be pretty average for him. Right about where I would have pegged him. The 50 IP after his injury were absolutely horrendous.

I doubt Bush's salary is going to prevent the Brewers from making this type of move. All of this talk about dumping Bush will all be mute at 12 AM Eastern Time tonight.