Fatter than Joey

A couple of glaring omissions.... Mike Caldwell for Dick O'Keefe and some other dipstick. The Brewers got almost 100 wins out of Caldwell. Ben Oglivie for Jim Slaton, especially when we got Slaton back the following year. The 1982 Brewers don't go anywhere w/o Benji and Caldwell. A deal that didn't work out perhaps would be Colborn & Porter for Wohlford, Quirk and McClure. Solid list though.

Helling was on the scrap heap, had some pretty decent results as a mop-up/LR pitcher, for the Brewers -- and then got some starts and got crushed. McClung's problem in the past was his high number of walks (6+/9IP) -- He is still walking batters at that same rate, I dont see any reason to expect his ERA to stay under 4.00 much longer.

Some of this, I don't hang on Jack Z. When Weeks was drafted, scouts everywhere said this was a player who should be moved to the outfield, which was also true of Braun. This is a great point Splitter, and something that has been sticking in my craw lately. I think the biggest mistake that Melvin made in his tenure was not putting Weeks/Braun in the OF right away in the minors. As Splitter points out, the overwhelming consensus was that Weeks and especially Braun would not have the chops to play the IF at the major league level. I think DM succumbed to the temptation of getting Braun and Weeks's projected numbers at 3rd/2nd would give him sick results at those positions. Braun playing 3rd was an abomination, and Weeks continues to plateau at below-average to poor at 2b. If Weeks and especially Braun would have been in the OF last year, I have to think our D would have probably cost us less games and perhaps the Brewers would have clinched a playoff berth in 2007. No one said it was because the team is nuts, they should have put Hall at 3rd or 2nd and had Weeks or Braun learn the outfield. False. A ton of people here knew that Braun was a hack at 3b, the problem was, he didn't get any OF time in the minors, so playing him in the OF really was not an option. Koskie getting hurt sped up Braun's arrival as well. >

McClung has done ok in his current role, I guess...his 31 innings in Milwaukee at 115ish ERA+ is better than I ever expected. I don't have a lot of optimism about him as a starter though....I'd think you'd keep him in the one role where he's had anything like major league success in the hopes that he can become a valuable reliever. I agree with this -- This situation reminds me of Rick Helling -- which isn't good. If this start is a one-time deal to deal with a double header, then so be it, otherwise I am not a big fan.

Batting a guy like Kendall (decent to good OBP, low SLG) 9th is a significant upgrade at the bottom/top of the lineup. ...but then bats a guy like TGJ second? I'm very glad Yost has been unafraid to not be 'that' manager that puts on the hit-&-run or sac bunts to 'get things going yost H&R's way too much

In this case, Georgia. Rock on Stein, you are quickly becoming my favorite poster.

As Al Swearengen might say.... Al would swear a lot if he saw TGJ as the Brewers DH. Al would probably have fed TGJ to Woo's pigs. There is no way Kendall misses Al's squeeze sign either. Al would never bunt. Bashing Yost has become the cool thing to do because people have convinced themselves or been tricked into thinking that firing him will be a simple fix to the teams problems. It won't be. Gah. Enough with the strawman bull-ploppy please. Not one person here thinks what you say above. Sadly, this situation is just what I was worried about last offseason. I said the exact same thing on this board. I also think by not firing Yost in the off-season, the Brewers missed the opportunity to make a more thorough replacement search, and also missed the opportunity for a new manager to work with the players in ST. Last place sucks.

He's independently wealthy through his wife (Nancy Lopez), so he just retired. Ray Knight is married to Nancy Lopez

I genuinely thought they wanted to give him for time to improve his defense. Braun got hurt in 2007 ST as well. He needed the time to get back in shape

They have an unfair advantage in the front office and talent acquistion departments. Bingo -- The idea of rolling into Boston with TGJ as your DH, shows really where our disadvantage is at.

"The Red Sox made a bunch of errors, too, and they're world champions," Milwaukee manager Ned Yost said. "Think they're learning anything tonight? It happens. You make errors." The problem as I see it, is that the Brewers routinely make 3-4 errors a game (not nec. official scorer errors), if the Brewers were playing stellar D all season, and then had a game where they booted 4 balls as a matter of luck -- I think Yost's statement would have been appropriate. But, when your team plays very poor fundamental baseball day in day out, the statement Yost made was rather idiotic IMO.

No business owning a team? Didn't you just say new ownership has a lot to do with the capacity crowds? Yes. I think Mark A. has done a great job -- I have a problem with the idea that hiring a GM is a total crap-shoot for a cat like Mark A. -- I think we can all agree Mark A. is a shrewd business person, and probably is very good at finding people that can help him grow his businesses -- my point is (and it is a general one) is that if a business owner cannot identify a clear upgrade to his management, he has no business owning said business. The stadium is nearly 10 season old already FTJ (which is hard to believe). I don't think there's a lot of people coming to the Park at this point because they haven't been there yet. I disagree. MP is clearly an attraction to casual fans that County Stadium was not -- Every year I see people holding reunions/graduations/summer parties/etc. at MP that are going to MP because it is a great place to spend a weekend. I was asking FTJ if he had someone in mind, since it kind of seemed like he had some ideas. PF asks a fair question here -- I am not pretending I know who would be better -- my only point is, if hiring a GM (in any business) for an owner is a crapshoot, they probably shouldn't be in that business. As someone pointed out, Attanasio is a smart guy...if he saw an opportunity to improve the team, does anyone think he wouldn't do so immediately? No. I think he was reasonably patient with DM up until the end of this year. I think at the end of the 6th year if we continue to circle the toilet, it will be time to move on. Melvin probably has a get-out-of-blame free card due to Yost- he can fire Yost and have him take much of the blame for this year if they continue to struggle, which would probably buy Melvin another year. I agree.

I think Melvin has done a decent job at spending that money. The problem with firing somebody for not doing a job as well as one would like is you don't know how the new person is going to do. You could make the problem worse. I don't think Melvin has been "bad", only that there may be better options. Mark A., is an accomplished business man. I am certain he has a ton of experience hiring and firing people, and if he is unable to upgrade Melvin, he probably has no business owning a MLB team.

Any questions you'd like us to ask Doug Melvin? Maybe next time you should ask him this: "In the history of MLB, has a GM ever fired a manager and then honorably resigned in the same day?"

We should do what the Indians did that year they were in last place, and then eventually beat the Yankees to get to the World Series. I think the key is to get a naked cardboard cutout of the team's owner, and cover the cutout with other smaller pieces of cardboard numbering precisely the amount of wins necessary to get to the playoffs.

You think a winning record and near capacity crowds at Miller Parks aren't producing results? Yes. I think the new ballpark has a lot to do with the capacity crowds, and new ownership. At this point it looks like it will be season #6 w/o the playoffs, and probably time to see if someone else can do a better job.

1. He signed Soup because he is a post-season winner. If this statement was true, DM is an idiot for signing a "post-season" winner w/o signing enough "regular-season" winners Once again, load of crap. Melvin has been here 5 years. Not 15, not 25. This is Melvin's 6th season -- He has had enough time to get the Brewers into the playoffs. Not too many GM's in any sport get to keep their job for 6+ years w/o producing results.

I agree with the idea "Im OK with the idea of Stetter going down, but why Jackson coming up" I suspect that DM realizes we need some LHP to deal with the BoSox lineup -- why not Erasmo Ramirez who has a lot of MLB experience, why not add him to the 40 man?

First -- Braun, I love this deal beyond words. A lot of the positives mentioned many times in this thread I am in total agreement with. Second -- Hart, I think Hart should be the next target, especially if he is the future CFer for the Brewers. I think his stock is low (relative to Braun) right now, and if there is little doubt in my mind that Hart could produce a great OPS for CFer and provide decent D. Third -- YoGa --I don't like extending pitchers very much in general, but Yo is certainly the pitcher I would look at extending. Fourth -- Prince/Weeks -- The thought of these guys anchoring the right side of our IF together for the next 5-6 years makes me pee the bed at night. Weeks has no business on a playoff team's IF with a .187 BA and the C3P0 style of defense he provides. I think if we had a stud defensive 1b we could live with Weeks, or a stud defensive 2b, Fielder would be AOK at 1b, but the combination of the 2 does not equal crazy delicious to me.

Fireing Yost was pushed pretty hard last week by many posters as a fix for all our problems. In fact there were some who thought Yost was the reason for our young players not hitting. I agree with xisxisxis -- There is not a poster her that thinks firing Yost is a fix for ALL our problems -- nor is there MANY posters. Some people may very well think that Yost is a variable in the formula that defines our offensive output -- but no one here things Yost was the reason. I think the Yost discussions would be a lot more civil if people did not use such extreme verbiage or strawman arguments.

On the positive side, at least we know of Fallon's comedic abilities prior to his takeover of Late Night rather than a "no-name Conan" when he took over. I agree we know Fallon's "abilities", and I think most scientists have concluded that Fallon needs to be fed through a wood-chipper ASAP. Conan was hardly a "no-name" though, he was a very popular writer for SNL in its heyday of the early 90s, and wrote for and produced The Simpsons when that show was at its peak -- I don't think that there was any question Conan was a great talent.

The Greatest Closer in history is on our team. He is back. DM signed Rollie?

I'd say that Homer probably represents the average bf.net poster with maybe a bit less knowledge about the minors and more knowledge about the players, since he's more plugged in media-wise than we are. I generally enjoy listening to him, and find that my opinions pretty line up with his at about 80% regarding the team. I like Homer a lot, and I think this is a great overview. He had a great interview with Kendall yesterday. --

I still think we only gave away one really good pitcher in the Linebrink deal, and if Jack hits with the extra picks it's gonna be a complete rip-off! Thatcher was pretty much a throw-in for the deal. The Padres got 21 very solid innings out of Thatcher in 2007 -- much better than the innings we got out of Linebrink. If this deal was a rip-off, the Padres would have regretted making the deal -- I don't think they regret the Linebrink trade for a second. It sucks Thatcher got sent down, he was a good story coming from the Indy leagues -- I don't think there is a chance in hell he will ever be "great", however I was hoping he could have had Shouse-like career.

Unless I am mistaken, at least one wild card team has made the WS every year except once. I hear what you are saying.... although many years the WC is better than some of the Division winners, and could be the second best team in the league. -- The WC is not often "the 4th best team"