TooLiveBrew

I agree in theory on Trachsel. He's not ancient, and he's not a velocity pitcher, so it's not a big deal about his age (36). However, his ERA spiked to 4.97, and ERA+ slipped all the way down to 87 in 2006. He still managed to go 15-8 with that explosive NYM offense, though. Two quotes (per Rotoworld): #1 - #2 - While I will always try to form my own opinions of players, this is a red flag. When you've got a bunch of baseball players/guys questioning him, I think that's a very valid concern. Players (and ex-players) tend to be the first to stick up for a guy when he gets hurt. (Unless it's JJ Hardy, in which case, that would be me http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif )

and, in doing so, adhere to the tried but true "Good pitching beats good hitting"

GAME, that's Melky, not Miguel Cabrera. Yankees OF, not Marlins IF.

My guess as to why they've left Ohka alone is that his unjury in '06 was a partially torn rotator cuff, which does not bode well for the near future (probably the same reason a guy with a career ERA of 4.04 & ERA+ of 111 hasn't signed a deal yet) I think CV is the obvious second option to Suppan, which is nice since he's already inexpensive Brewer property through 2009, after which he hits arbitration. My third option (from that list) would be John Thomson. My only worry is injury, although I don't know the specifics. He seems a solid choice off a list of question marks, unless his injury trouble is severe. In any event, any of those guys would be 1-yr, cheap deals, or else no dice

Just that stupid Lake of Mexico or Mexican Sea.... don't remember quiet what it's called....

Well, I did say "the casual glance"..... Nice homework sbryl

Well, we already had Mr. 3000 filmed in Miller Park, so I guess Mr. 600 wouldn't be that big of a stretch, let's do it!!!! Seriously, no MLB team wanted him last year. Now, one year older, and even less in-shape.... I think the Nats offered him a one-year, on-the-cheap deal last offseason, and I guess I could see some crap squad giving him a minor league deal w/an invite. It will not be the Brewers, I can guarantee you that

Madison Mark? Or where?

I know i can change the size of the font. What I'm talking about is thickening it up -- changing the style of the font. Not in my posts, but overall. I don't mind too much, I just think the small font on the different topics, and especially within each thread (individual responses) are hard to read at times.

Well, one slant to consider there is that the ChiSox traded away a power hitter in a deal that nearly every baseball observer said we fleeced them, and the next season they won the WS. Scotty Po will never be confused with a player of Lee's caliber, but as a LF replacement, coupled with his speed on the bases (& the field), he clearly was the better fit on the 2005 White Sox. With Konerko & Dye the only two ChiSox hitters with 30 HRs that year, the casual glance at their lineup says they needed another slugger to be world-beaters, but obviously their lineup was fine. I think Lee's lackluster D is the major reason those guys on the South Side sent him packing. We all know how Guillen & Williams love their D & pitching

Let's look at it this way -- it was obviously a wine & dine session. The fact that it went so long tells me there was some good food, good chat, but most of all, some good wine & booze http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif If they were able to chill & hang out like that, I really like our chances....

*ahem!*......

Lotta talk on the Blue Jays' fan forums about dealing Rios. It's for a SP, almost every time. If Suppan can be signed, it may give the club the flexibility to trade Vargas & Jenkins* for Rios, I'd be perhaps surprised, but happy nonetheless. That may not be enough. * Another big fan proposal on the fan boards was trading for corner OF (Halladay - Matt Holiday deals were mentioned on each site). Toronto may actually be a team that would have a use for both the other half of Menchkins, as they currently only carry 4 OFs. Mench, as a backup for around $3 million (correct me if that's an inaccurate estimate for his arbitration) in 2007 might not sound that bad anymore.

does anyone think this is a good idea? Just thicker would be better, really. I just think it'd be much easier to read. Thoughts.......

This from the article that both Rotoworld & benmaller.com cited So if they wanna shop Lieber for a reliever, why not TBow? I'm again confused. Also, if they do trade Lieber for a reliever, does that make said player a relieber? Or does it just make me an idiot....

Oh! That's right, thanks tyguy. In any event, from benmaller.com (a foxsports guy) I find it hard to believe that if they're after Salomon Torres, that TBow as, at worst, a starting point in a trade, isn't "attractive"

I like the sound of this, and I was also encouraged to read earlier on the thread that someone mentioned Melvin's offer was 3 years at appx. $33 mil., with an option for a 4th (seems like it would have to be a club option, otherwise just give him 4 years straight up). Same poster said that the Pirates have made an offer, but it's not up to Suppan's desired AAV. I like the sound of all this..... we might know by this weekend. NOW it's time for Melvin to be acting quickly, as you want to have a good offer ready to counter anything Soup will see from teams that view him as their fallback after Zito

From Rotoworld (Source - foxsports.com)

I know dadofandrew, but this is the kind of deal for which I would take that risk. Adding bullpen arms is the perhaps the cheapest form of player signing, and pen guys are easily inked to one-year deals. In addition, we'd still have Brady Clark to deal for a relief pitcher. If, between Clark & a FA, we can add two arms back to the pen -- preferably one of them LH, this deal gets even better. I know this leans towards 'Everything falls into place', but I think I'm being objective & reasonable about the players involved

From Rotoworld (Source: Philadelphia Inquirer) Ok, so why can't a deal be worked out between the Phils & Crew here? They want to move both Burrell and Lieber, and the Crew need a corner OF & SP. The Phils want relief help. So why not this deal? ('07 $$ in parentheses) Jenkins (7 mil), Mench (appx. 3 mil), Turnbow (2.3 mil), &/or Aquino (380k)/Capellan (373k) (highest total $ = 13 mil) for Burrell (13 mil) & Lieber (7.5 mil) That's a net savings of $7.8 million for Philly if it only took Aquino. If Capellan had to be added, it's $7.45 mil in savings for Philly. This would give us two pieces to fill needs, and would result in getting two puzzle pieces at a cost of roughly $7-8 million. Lieber's contract expires after 2007, and Burrell's after 2008 (he's owed $14 mil in '07). The only roadblock I see is Gillick wanting more value for Burrell, perhaps a SP. But I think the deal I've proposed is objectively fair, and based on the rumors of what Philly desires (for both players). The perception out there is that Gillick wants to move Burrell primarily for salary relief, but I know he won't just give him away.

I agree & disagree -- You're right that it takes an 'everything falls into place' kind of year to win the WS. However, that's true for even the largest of market teams. I disagree that with the small market teams, it was just one year of good fortune. The Twins, Marlins, and Marlins all were the product of many years' hard work in scouting, drafting, & skillful front office maneuvering. Everyone ripped the Marlins for their infamous 'Firesale' of veterans after 1997, but who would've guessed that in their first 10 years of existence, Florida would have 2 World Championships! I've mentioned this before, but in all honesty, I prefer the challenge of building a team, as opposed to patching one together with FAs - and especially in this crazy MLB economy.

The fact that this dialogue now actually applies to me. By Spring 2007, I'll be free! Free to get an enslaving 9-5 job, that is The way I look at it, I have to be one of the finest 6-7 year students that UW-Mad. has ever seen! But that's probably because there aren't many of us....

With our powers combined..... OVER 7,400 posts on BF.net!!! I don't mind picking up the slack, either http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

To possibly wear out my welcome on this thread, an anecdote - In 1983, Sandy Alderson took over as GM of the Oakland A's. The team had gone 68-94 in 1982, and needed to start over. For the next 5 seasons ('83-'87), the team had a combined .475 Winning %, with the best effort an 81-81 1987 campaign. From 1988 on, however, Alderson's hard work began to pay off -- including signing Mgr. Tony LaRussa prior to the '87 season. As their young stars began to truly arrive (McGwire, Canseco, etc.), the team skyrocketed - 1988: 104-58, AL Champs 1989: 99-63, WS Champs 1990: 103-59, AL Champs Alderson brought the A's out of decline that followed their 1972-73-74 WS 3-peat. The legendary Charlie Finley was the architect of those squads (and many, many, other winners), and after he sold the club in 1980, his successor Billy Martin left after his 2d year, the aforementioned 68-94 1982. Alderson succeeded, but it took time. In his 16 years in high posts with the A's (he was named President after the 1997 season, handing the GM reins to Billy Beane), the franchise won 4 division titles, 3 AL Pennants, and a WS trophy. This is not a process that occurs overnight in the small markets. We have to be patient. Remember that 1983-'87 .475 Winning % for Alderson's A's? The Brewers' Win % for 2005-'06 = .481. Patience is the biggest thing for Brewer fans to remember. I don't want to hear any "I've been waiting X years...." arguments, as we are only in year 3 of ownership & management having a real 'Money where your mouth is' approach - which is indeed yeilding improvement. Don't take me out of context, I am not making any sweeping predictions. I just want our fans to learn from the past, so as not to be doomed to repeat our own putrid recent history. Wikipedia has this to say about Alderson: The process of building a small-market team into a perennial contender takes time. Be patient with our guys - so far, so good! p.s. -- in April of 2005, Alderson was named CEO of the San Diego Padres, another team built (back) into contenders. To be fair, he arrived after the Pads went 87-75 in 2004 (after a 64-98 2003), but his arrival has helped sustain the success of that franchise.

Invader3K, after 106 losses in 2002, and 94 losses in both 2003 & '04, I do indeed brag about the drastic turn-around of the franchise. I think you're drastically wrong to say that there hasn't been an on-the-field improvement. And Mark A., along with great personell like Doug Melvin, deserve the lion's share of the credit. This is why I so passionately stick up for Attanasio. For some reason, he just doesn't get the credit he deserves. You don't turn a small-market 100-loss team into a divison title winner in 2, or even 3 years (don't bring me Detroit, they're hardly small-market). At least not into a consistent contender. What we have in Milwaukee is a very unique situation: We have an excellent Front Office. Player evaluations, drafting, and trading have been fantastic, across the board, since Melvin's arrival (and yes, I know that was in 2003, then still under Selig-ness). This has lead to a dearth of young, affordable talent. But we also have a limited amount to spend on player salaries. Which leads me to the next point - Attanasio's monetary contributions in his first two seasons (three if you consider that he's again upping payroll, in large part thanks to fans like us http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif ). This is the difference-maker. Ownership has a plan in place to continue to grow & expand our income. The reason I trust them is that, so far, they've been correct (& accurate). While he hasn't jumped the payroll up to the (unaffordable) $90-100 million range, Attanasio has made planning for payroll expansion a top priority each of his first three years. I know I was in my teens during the 1990s, but come on -- the Seligs never even came close to this. These gradual, incremental increases are the backbone for any sustained competitiveness in Milwaukee, and so far, they're working. It's the Twins & A's that Brewer fans need to examine - that's the way this franchise is being modeled, as it cannot sustain success any other way. The big, free-spending teams have it easier. Anyone would just love to go add the FA(s) of their choice each offseason, but I prefer the developmental route. I think we're going to be having a lot of fun as Brewers fans in the next 4+ years, and maybe by then more will recognize that Attanasio's arrival & the team's gradual but steady turnaround were not coincidences.