JohnBriggs12

Finding pitching is more luck than anything. But you can draft them. Key is you can't play the service time game with them. When they are ready, they need to be in the majors facing major league hitters. That's how they go from great stuff to major league aces. They get tested at the highest level. You really don't develop great pitchers. They usually dominate immediately. Look at guys like Bumgarner, Sale, and Kershaw. Price and on and on. They were all great from the time they turned professional. Chances of finding say a Jacob DeGrom in round 9 are pretty slim.

Flores is nothing of value. No need to accomodate him. At best he is just a guy. I have no idea why any team would ever trade for him let alone try and find a place in the starting lineup. We agree to disagree. In 2015 between AAA and the majors, Flores walked more than he struck out, as a 23 year old. He hit .426 with a 1.194 over his last month at AAA. He also posted a .902 OPS against LHP in AAA in 2015. Since two teams traded for him within a few months, I suspect that GM's see him as more than "just a guy". Of all the OF that Stearns acquired, Flores is the one that's not "just a guy". He also can play 1B, and if Carter stumbles, who knows? Not many 5'10" 1B, though Steve Garvey had a pretty nice career and he's a lefthanded thrower.

One thing to keep in mind. Santana is not an established major league hitter and he's going to have to hold off Flores who's primarily a LF and brings different offensive skills (better contact, lesser power) to the table and is a lefty bat on a team lacking them. Whether he ultimately beats out Santana remains to be seen, but I doubt anything is completely set in stone until Santana proves he can produce over a bigger sample.

Best by far was Segura/Wagner for a controllable rotation arm, a veteran bat and an exciting hitting prospect. Honorable mention was Sardinas for Ramos. Ramos looks like a solid 4th OF at worst and maybe he could become a Parra type. Sardinas is a nice athlete but lacks a regular's bat. Worst is a tie between Lind for 3 undistinguished pitching prospects and Rogers for a guy with contact issues. Hitting and making consistent contact is at such a premium these that you can't just virtually give away a middle of the order accomplished hitter (and your lone LH bat with pop) to save such a modest amount of salary and bolster your rookie league teams. Rogers deal could be defended assuming you held on to Lind, but they didn't. Rogers is a self made player who defied odds to get to the big leagues because he knows how to hit. That is a rare commodity. There's plenty of guys that swing hard and miss a lot and occasionally hit HR like Broxton. But guys that can hit tough pitching in tough situations are rare. Rogers proved he can often facing tough relievers late in games off the bench. Honorable mention for worst goes to the Davis deal. The one saving grace of that is they did get a guy back in Nottingham who plays a position they lacked in the system and appears to have a bat that will play as he advances. But it's going to be tough watching Davis pile up the HR especially if Santana isn't matching him, and the return from the deal is still a ways away.

I don't think Lucroy gets moved until midseason. They could get a catcher included back in the deal or just go with Maldonado and likely Manny Pina for the rest of this year, then they'd look at some bargain veteran FA (Nick Hundley?) in the offseason that can tide them over until Nottingham is ready.

So you add a prospect to sweeten the deal enough to get Kepler. Isn't that how trades are equalized? Don't the Brewers now have one of the deepest systems in all of baseball?

I think it's 80% that he's a Brewer on opening day, and 20% that he's a Brewer on August 1. I think the Cubs are where he ends up but they are fine waiting to see he's healthy before they give up Baez who's the guy Stearns wants. The Brewers probably will need to include Smith and Cubs will send Montero back so the deal will be Lucroy and Smith and another piece (Villar or a minor league arm) for Baez and Montero. Cubs lineup includes 4 LH bats. That could leave them vulnerable to LH starters they see in playoffs. David Ross is not an option other than as Lester's personal catcher. Montero's not cheap, but he allows Brewers to continue to have veteran working with all young pitchers as place holder through at least until trade deadline of 2017. You take him and his salary so you can get the guy you want, Baez, a man without a position in Chicago, who'll be everyday 3B for years.

Some players who had more strikeouts than hits last year (at least a 1.16 K per hit): [pre]PLAYER TEAM AB R H HR RBI BB SO OPS WAR Kris Bryant CHC 559 87 154 26 99 77 199 .858 6.0 Chris Davis BAL 573 100 150 47 117 84 208 .923 5.2 Justin Upton SD 542 85 136 26 81 68 159 .790 4.4 Addison Russell CHC 475 60 115 13 54 42 149 .696 3.4 Lucas Duda NYM 471 67 115 27 73 66 138 .838 3.0 Colby Rasmus HOU 432 67 103 25 61 47 154 .789 2.6 Joc Pederson LAD 480 67 101 26 54 92 170 .763 2.3 Ian Desmond WSH 583 69 136 19 62 45 187 .674 2.0[/pre] Apples and oranges. Those are big time power guys. Broxton has some pop but a career minor league slugging percentage of .410 is far cry from the names on that list. He's going to need to put the ball in play a bit better than he's shown. More power to him if he can.

Ok you guys want me to provide positives? Flores might be the best 4th OF in the division by the end of the season. Of course he'll likely be starting for the Brewers by then. Other than the Segura trade, I loved the Sardinas for Flores. Broxton: 967 career strikeouts compared to 762 career hits. That's not encouraging. Sorry. I know you guys get a sense of great accomplishment and pride in your team when it's system is highly rated. I don't. I view baseball as entertainment 162 times a year. When I'm not entertained by my team, I'm cranky. That's what happens when you get to my age. I don't see much entertainment for 6 months starting in April.

Nobody is going to trade for a guy coming off of back surgery, especially one owed $105 million over the next 5 seasons. It's unfortunate as it would have made a lot more sense to deal Braun than Davis for the salary relief alone. Braun will be here at least another year or two unless a couple of those OF really show something in 2016.

Unless I missed something significant, I think Jungmann is a lock for the MLB team. I don't know. It's Jungmann or Davies. I think both showed enough last year to get a rotation spot but there's only 5 of those spots and 4 have already been claimed. Jungmann would have to be awful in Arizona not to have a rotation spot. Remember he's already 26. It's not quite do or die, but he'll get a chance to fail over Davies who's 3 years younger. I wouldn't assume Garza's around for opening day either despite what they've said.

You guys are all overlooking Blaine Boyer who despite being right handed held LH hitters to a .169/.231/.205 line last year in a not insignificant 92 plate appearances. He'll battle Jimenez for "lefty" specialist.

Ok, I keep reading from the defenders of Stearns stuff like "Well Santana will be more productive than Davis" and that they "had to find a spot for him" as a defense for not getting more back for Davis. Really? Even the most strident supporters of Santana when he was acquired thought the big advantage of playing him in CF was to evaluate whether or not he could handle major league pitching to the point where it made sense to move either Davis or Braun. Nobody really knows for sure on him. What's changed since last year other than an awful few dozen games in winter ball. Now he's going to be out there with no net whatsoever and counted on to produce like a corner OF? Man it stinks being a fan of this team right now. For the first time in I don't know how long, I'm not looking forward to a baseball season. I'm sure I'll have plenty of "I told you so" moments, but I enjoy baseball for the entertainment value of it and frankly I don't expect this season to be the least bit entertaining.

"getting a future catcher hopefully". For one of the premier power hitters in baseball right now who's controllable for 4 more seasons, you better get a near future catcher definitely, not hopefully, and not one that's 3 years from his major league debut. There were going to be ample opportunities to pick up a catcher by other means over the next 3 years. This deal is a deal that teams tanking it do. Stearns doesn't want to take any chances that this team would be respectable and thereby draft below top 10 in 2017, and he's doing everything he can to insure it won't be. He might have held on to Davis if he got what he wanted for Lucroy by now, but in his mind a lineup that has both might actually be okay so better be safe than sorry and insure a 90 loss season.

Amen to all of that TPlush. Stearns undervaluing Davis doesn't bode well for a return should Lucroy get dealt. I've liked some of Stearns deals, but the 3 I didn't were Lind for 3 teenagers, Rogers for yet another contact challenged outfielder with no major league record, and this Davis deal. One would think you could get a lot than an A ball catcher and a mid level pitching prospect for a guy with a major league HR/AB rate better than Prince Fielder making major league minimum and controllable for 4 years. It seems Stearns is valuing Brewers based on what their value was as prospects rather that what they've done in the big leagues. Davis and Rogers weren't highly touted so he's valuing them in deals that way. Rogers would have been a better option at 1B than Chris Carter, especially if you are set on having Santana in the lineup everyday.

Don't forget the biggest reason last year was worse than expected: Kyle Lohse - 5.85 ERA (152.1 IP) Matt Garza - 5.63 ERA (148.2 IP) That's over 300 innings of awful pitching from our two highest paid pitchers. If those guys had just bad years instead of awful years, we would have won 5 more games. If they would have had normal-to-good years, we probably would have been around .500. One of them is gone and the other is bound to bounce back somewhat to his career norms or take a reduced role on the team this year. The hitting hasn't taken nearly the "hit" (sorry) that you would assume with all the trades and the pitching is likely to be better. If you're really interested in seeing how it breaks down, there was a nice read on FanGraphs a few weeks ago breaking down the team: http://www.fangraphs.com/community/being-sunny-about-the-brewers/ The hitting hasn't take nearly the hit? They've lost 2 of the 3 most productive hitters from 2015, 3 of 4 if you count Parra and 4 of 6 if you count Gomez. At least Gomez and Parra brought back players that can help some in 2016. None of the guys Davis and Lind brought back figure to start the year above high A ball. They've gone from a lineup that had some length to it, to one of the "shortest" in baseball. Their number 5 hitter figures to be a guy who was non-tendered is his prime for goodness sakes. The lineup has no lefty bat capable of more than a dozen HR, has 2 guys capable of 200 strikeouts, and no CF with any record of accomplishment in the major leagues. They'd need Hill to return to the player he's been on occasion in the past, Gennett go a full season without a horrendous 6 week slump, Villar or Perez to provide some offense at SS until Arcia arrives, Braun to stay healthy, and Santana to shrug off a horrendous stint in winter ball and somehow show he can make contact, something he's struggled with even as he put up healthy numbers in the minors. And he must do all that with a much weaker lineup around him. Flores is the one OF acquired this offseason that may help offensively when he's healthy but he may be needed to be alternative if Santana struggles. If all that happens, they might win 68 games again. Yes, Lohse is gone, but Garza's still here and other than hope, we have no idea if he'll be any better than he was in 2015. Forget 100 losses, this team could surpass the futility of the 2002 team. I have them pegged at 98 losses with 88 best case and 108 worst case.

There are currently 2 likely 200 strikeout hitters projected to be in everyday lineup in Carter and Santana. Gallo is a 250 strikeout guy. Maldonado as a starter would approach 150. If Broxton becomes the CF, that's another 175 or so. That would be a disaster.

He had a game against the Cubs (not his debut) where he shut them out for 5 innings, then instead of getting him out of there and letting him feel good about himself, Yost left him in there for the 6th and he failed to get an out before 3 runs scored. He never had any confidence after that. He was overwhelmed. That happens to some guys when they reach the majors. But he was very good in AAA in 2004.

Some of you are making this out to be the equivalent of trading Overbay to make room for Fielder. Make no mistake Domingo Santana is no Prince Fielder, and Khris Davis possesses a unique skill (power) that sets him well above the level of Overbay. Davis has one HR every 17.2 major league ABs. That's better than Prince Fielder (17.7) and Ryan Braun (18.6). The odds of guys with more AAA strikeouts than hits becoming productive major league regulars are quite steep and the Brewers could have gotten more for Davis after this year. I suppose it's a plus that we'll know about Santana, but I fear he'll be exposed and they'll still be looking for corner OF help.

I'll take the under. I put the over/under for this pair at 420 combined strikeouts and I'll take the over. Only way they don't get there is if Counsell loses patience and sits Santana from time to time. Over/under on games where Carter and Santana combine for 6 or more strikeouts is 15. If Broxton wins the everyday CF job, we could see 3 guys combine for 600.

Poor Craig Counsell. Where is going to hide these guys? No way he can put Carter and Santana back to back. I suppose Carter is 5 and Santana 7 now with Braun 3rd and Lucroy 4th? He'll probably stick Hill between them. What's the major league record for strikeouts by two teammates? I'll have to look that up. Tracking these two toward the record might be entertaining.

The guy Oakland DFA'd might be worth a waiver claim.

Davis will have 25 by the first of August. It will take until August of 2017 for Santana to hit 27. Davis may be 28, but he had not quite reached his peak, and that's part of the reason I didn't like this deal. Davis is a power bat in the category of Edwin Encarnacion and Jose Bautista, both of whom took until deeper in their careers to post the big numbers and ironically were also given up on by their original teams too soon. For the record, for those thinking I've criticized all Stearns' moves, I did post that I liked the Segura trade.

Santana in 90 plate appearances in Dominican Winter ball: .181/.244/.217. Zero HR. In his brief major league career, he strikes out at an alarming rate. So does Chris Carter. Between them they could well combine to set a record for most strikeouts by a duo in major league history. Boy that will be fun. Somewhere Jose K is smiling. Yeah Santana put up nice AAA numbers but they came with a flashing warning light too. More strikeouts (257) than hits (249). There are questions surrounding Santana. That's all I'm saying. Davis was still cheap and controllable and a proven premier power bat. The catcher they got for Davis might end up being a great return but I'm not doing handstands because Santana has a position. Sorry. Unless Santana proves he's a major league corner OF, and the bar is pretty high for such an offensive position, the fact is this trade not only weakens them in 2016 but 2017 and 2018 as well and one of their most marketable and tradeable players is gone for a return that's 3 years from major leagues. I could be wrong, but that's my opinion. I'm also concerned Stearns so highly values Astros products. Is that the only team he knows anything about?

This trade could be very good or it could blow up in Stearns face. Is Santana an everyday corner OF? I have serious doubts. Nottingham has a good bat but Clint Coulter like pass ball numbers. Davis could end up being a 40 HR guy and if he does the return could end up looking rather meager. It's going to take a few years but if Michael Reed is in Milwaukee and Santana is back in AAA, people will start wondering.