tmwiese55

Yes, being taunted and "trash talked" to is very fun. That's why everyone loves bullies. Football eliminated most celebrations when players took them over the top (i.e. Randy Moss "mooning" the Green Bay crowd and players hiding props in the goal posts to use in their celebrations). I'm sure the concern is that players will continue to try to outdo one another and pretty soon you've got a circus. Do we really want to see players moon-walking around the bases or hiding a cell phone under 2nd base and pretending to call someone to describe the home run they just hit? At some point, respecting other human beings should be considered, and if someone does something to disrespect others, then I can understand when that person/group gets upset about it. And, while some fans may like seeing players "taunt and trash talk," other fans won't want that, and it will turn them off from the game. Personally, I like watching baseball for baseball. I dislike watching someone get "taunted and trashed talked to" in pretty much any situation. Do you watch the NFL? Yes they eliminated prop celebrations, that's about it. Standard first down results in a celebration. Sack the QB, run around and dance after. Huge celebration for every TD, let alone a game winner in the playoffs (equivalent of walk off playoff HR). Then thrown the standard in your face trash talking player do on every play. Umm, I don't think the NFL has a problem with popularity. Do you watch the NBA? It's all trash talking and celebrating for routine 3s or dunks throughout regular season games. The most popular player in the world (Curry) dances and celebrates 3s and even turns and talks trash to the opposing teams bench during the game. NBA is at the height of it's popularity. Which sport does have a problem with popularity, especially among youth? You guessed it, baseball.

I know Villar has been thrown out a few times trying to stretch things and I haven't "seen" them all. But of the few I have they have all been bang bang plays that he was very close to making, nothing wrong with that imo. Gomez was often getting thrown out by a 1/3 of the basebath in situations that didn't require any need to push it. Several times trying to steal 3rd with 2 outs and Braun at the plate. Just stupid, almost any hit from Braun (really anyone if you're gomez) and you're scoring anyway. The argument that his positives outweigh the negatives is true, but doesn't mean the criticism isn't warranted and an area he should have improved on as he grew up. All players should be looking to improve on their weaknesses, and that was his weakness.

In every other sport celebrating and some degree of taunting and talking trash is completely accepted. In baseball though, you get drilled with a projectice at 100 mph and punched in the face. Yea, makes sense. I'm with Bryce Harper, let baseball be fun.

I get your points but would only agree if it was a straight up trade. Him as the #1 guy combined with some lower level in the minors guys and you're onto something. MKE also does have a glaring need at 1B so to us that's not an issue.

Nobody really cares about PEDs other than the media. Road fans will boo him and joke on him for it because he's famous enough that they know. It's just something to heckle a guy about, just like if he was married to a Kardashian or had some other famous thing or scandal to pick on him about. No one cares about PEDs. I won't deny that the media has made it more well know therefore more people will rag on him for it though. He didn't do anything different than anyone else though. There wouldn't be an as you call it "hatred" for say Nelson Cruz if they traded for him just because the media doesn't talk about him. All I'm saying is the PED thing doesn't matter anymore in this discussion and overall fan dislike for a rival player goes away quickly too as others mentioned. The key factors in this are his age, injuries, contract. Not this ESPN talking head bs. Edit: also factor in that many many Cubs fans are bandwagon idiots so most aren't even aware of the PED thing. They're just there to have a good time.

Almost all PED users lie when they're initially caught.

Look at how many Red Sox have gone to the Yankees and vice versa. Fans get over it, that stuff really doesn't matter after the first gut reaction. If Braun hits like he is now he'll be embraced but would have a shorter leash with fans than someone else I suppose. I hope they take the PED high ground while loving them some Sammy down there.

Right, my take on trading Braun has been to get the true elite level prospect, if not just keep. Schwarber fits that other than having the injury, but throw in some others and you have a workable trade.

You guys ever read about the idea of rental type trades? I think it happens in European soccer. So essentially in this situation the Cubs would give us a prospect or two and they get Braun for the rest of the year and then he comes back to MKE. I suppose you could negotiate anything though, so he could go there for two years, just go somewhere else and they pay salary, negotiate on who pays salary, etc. How crazy would that make things?

Not so sure it makes sense, they have healthy deals out to Heyward and Fowler already. Schwarber coming back next year and you'd have a crowded OF on your hands. I think the only way it would work is if they gave us Schwarber along with other pieces. I suppose if you're truly in World Series mode then why not. T They need a C as well. Should be able to extract a ransom for both guys.

Yea Braun made it last year with far less stats and his past was a non-story as he was probably one of like 10 other PED linked people there. Heck, this year will probably be a Big Papi slurpfest and he's a PED guy too (back when they actually used real steroids too).

The issue has much more been the bad drafting/development than the players we gave up in the trades. The only quality pitcher we gave up was Ordazzi and he's merely OK. Our rotation would still be in the shape it's now and we'd still be in last place. Considering it almost worked for a two year title window I think it was well worth it. If anything maybe they should have gone even harder for it, gotten a better SS/3B, etc.

Odd question, let's say they played last night and the game got called after 6 or 7 like the Twins game. 6-0 Cubs win and Brewers have 0 hits. Does it count as a no-hitter?

Can someone find a team without a PED link of some kind? I think it's a moot point. it's all about his injuries the last few years and whether he can produce the next 4-5 years.

I guess to me it's if you get a truly elite prospect (Khris Bryant types) then you do it. If you're getting one guy from the tier below that (guys like Philips we got from gomez, which are still basically crapshoots) and then one or two guys lower then I'd rather just keep him. And you're not getting a truly elite prospect so here we are.

I wouldn't say they show up for him but by being a team able to win 68-74 will probably draw a 100-200 extra thousand vs a team that wins 55-62 games. That's where he comes in right now, keeping them respectable instead of embarrassing.

And along those lines their internal views of him being around the team going forward. Yes we're fans and we think we know but really we don't know anything. They actually do, they know if he gets along with everyone and if the other guys genuinely like him or whether he's a jerk at all. Seems to me just watching from afar there is no issues in this sense, but who knows, if he doesn't get along with people and is likely to be kind of a jerk (behind the scenes of course, he'll always say the PC thing in public) throughout the rebuild then yea they'll be more motivated to move him.

Chances are you're never going to get a commensurate return for Braun and since you're team salary is currently nothing you can afford to keep him. My take is they should listen to offers in case something really blows them away but there's really no need to trade him so you don't have to force it. For those saying we suck anyway, attendance will be down anyway and spending money on him only to lose is a waste. Yes, logically you're correct. However, the ownership likely feels and imo should feel the need to put a competent MLB team on the field. Much like they did this year, yes the team has no shot and will likely lose 90-100 games but they're competent and not an embarrassment to the fans or the league. Take the Sixers in the NBA as an example, you can tank for the #1 pick without losing by over 30 points most games and struggling to not break the all time loss record. Look how that's gone over? There's a level of pride/respect most owners have, so if you're not getting legit value back on Braun then might as well keep him for those reasons plus there's a good chance he'll still be a good player in 2018 when they're trying to win and if he stays here his whole career and rebounds his image as much as possible it's good for the Brewers using him in marketing beyond his playing career.

I get that it's hard to define and each person's definition might be different. But i think all would agree that it makes no sense to throw deadly objects at people's head over a disagreement in that definition. Yell back at them, talk trash to the media after the game, whatever, no reason to have these beanball wars over such dumb stuff

haha, haven't watched the Warriors or Spurs much? NBA is blowing up worldwide and is the second most popular sport in the world after soccer. Really the NBA has probably never been stronger. In fact the biggest problem might actually be their biggest asset in that GSW is so good that it might kill the drama a bit. If they were just normal good the playoffs would be up for grabs to several teams.

Haha right, watching a HR is evil and disrespecting the other player and the game. But throwing a deadly object at someone's head is not disrespectful to that person or the game. So logical.

There's so much hypocrisy in all this that it makes it all nonsense to me. Cam Newton is acocky, showboater. Baseball player celebrating in anyway is wrong. But Steph Curry is the feel good story of sports. For me, I put the line at taunting vs celebrating. If you're just celebrating what you did amongst yourself or your team then no big deal. If you're taunting the other team or player then it's not. And I have that same take for all sports, baseball is no different. For example in baseball, Ryan Braun's big HR celebrations over the years are exactly what should be OK. Even Harper or Pujols staring at home runs is perfectly ok, it's their fault if it hits the wall and they get a single instead of a double. Bat flips are pushing the envelope but still OK to me, you're not staring down the pitcher or anything. Now, hit a HR then throw the bat look at or even point at the pitcher and bark at him, not acceptable. Strike a guy out, then walk his direction yelling at him like chris Carpenter did, not acceptable. Fist pump and yell at no one on the mound after a strikeout, fine.

Totally agree with reilly and And That. Listen to other team and you'll appreciate ours

It just means they didn't get as much back as they wanted and were in no rush since they can do it in the offseason. Also, supposedly a deal was done with the Pels but the owners nixed it. He received 5 max contract offers last offseason, if they lower their price a bit they'll get something back for the future. Or if he's happy in this role maybe he sticks around a while.

Monroe is playing the same amount of minutes since being "benched". It's slightly overblown. This way of playing just staggers the minutes of the guys so they don't have a godawful bench, it balances things out much better. They still usually finish the games with Monroe out there. I wouldn't use the Monroe signing as some indictment of the front office though. It basically fell in their lap of him call the Bucks due to his relationship with Middleton. It's not like the team was winning anything this year or next anyway, so he's a free asset you can get without giving anything up other than money. If it clicked, great you win. If not, it's a short term deal so you're not on the hook and you can trade him for whatever you can get and you have free assets. It was a no lose move (only risk was an injury that would kill his trade value). They'd have been stupid not to do it. Also, throw in the PR aspect to get the arena deal done. The thing to complain about is the Vasquez trade, that's horrible short sighted thinking with that one.