TJseven7

Why would Braun go to RF? He is staying in LF where he is better. I would think Yelich will go to RF and Cain in CF. Who do you think was going to LF? Lots of talk with yelich coming up and defensive stats that say Yelich doesn't have a great arm. Yet he posted a gg in lf a year ago. I see yelich in LF. Cain in CF. Braun in right with Phillips as the def rep. With a huge plus defender in LF. And a huge plus defender in CF. Braun in RF doesn't hurt and hurts even less when you can sub in the hired gun in Phillips. I'm seeing Cain got a 60 grade on his arm... so if you follow the astros tea leaves then he's quite possibly our Reddick. Granted with a contract starting 3 years later, for 1 year longer, at 3 mil more per year. (Oy) So Braun Yelich Cain makes sense on that logic. Yelich to LF if Brox is the def rep. Phillips in rf with a yelich lf cain cf swap. But its hard to imagine we paid him this much to move him out of cf where he was in the talks for a GG last year. I feel like our only true RF is Phillips. That defense would be insane. But barring a near full time switch of braun to 1b that's not our path... and talks of shopping phillips makes it unlikely. braun yelich cain it is.

Well his trade value hasn't dropped so.... Yes I watched him at 3rd. Couldn't hit the broad side of a barn throwing. Range and fielding would have played fine at 1b. Don't make him the cut off man which should be arcia at all costs anyway. Should be fine. No worse than aguilar. I laughed when he stated he tells CC that he can play SS. It's like hearing Favre say he can still play qb in the nfl. He can't play 3b... he can't play SS. As for 1b, I have zero doubts he could transition to 1b. If that's soo niave that no one would believe it could happen... well. Exhibit a... we freaking played villar at CF last year and that was beyond nonsense. Exhibit b...we got aguilar because teams felt he couldn't field 1b and played him there a bunch. Exhibit C... thames OF. Who is available at OF now? Cargo, gomez, ellsbury? Bruce Cain Yelich Ozuna Stanton are gone. JD is only an option for the mega rich. I'd dare to say Domingo is the blue chip after today. I don't think that inflates his value at all. Just like I don't believe his price will drop because keeping him would force us to bench Thames more often. You can say you haven't said you are wiser than Stearns but your entire point is that yelich cain moves today is misplaying his hand on Santana. Something you know and he doesn't get. See how hard it was for me to infer that? It's your entire point. You know better than him. He just gave away leverage on Santana and made a mistake. I'm pretty certain after the news dropped he circling back on deals that were already well in progress. Like Archer (news) and Salazar (rumors plausable fit) and maybe Duffy (plausable fit and news linking heavy talks between mke and kc earlier). If they try to jam him... you honestly think he'll cave or that a dude who supposedly negotiated several dominos and attack paths to the offseason doesn't have a built in escape route if that exact value jam scenerio actually is attempted by GMs? I'm certain he's too deliberate to get stuck or jammed. The Braun position switch makes too much sense as the backdoor. I doubt it'll be needed but I'm fairly confident Braun at RF or 1B is a switch known in that FO. Hell, Braun already hinted it in October. As for the 80-100 games. He just played 104 (2nd least of his career to the susp year) at 33 because he couldn't get over a calf strain. He's only getting older and more brittle. Call me crazy for not expecting a resurgence or better health. IE: the reason no one wants to trade for him at his contract. You want him as healthy as possible thru 2020. He's maxed at 120 games and that is likely too generous. Honestly the more I go over this the more I want them to move braun to 1b and toss perez for a trinket. If we trade santana we are going to see a ton of broxton or phillips which dents the lineup quite a bit. If we keep santana Braun is a bonus every game he plays and when he's out we still have thames aguilar to carry 1b.

Despite him saying he can still play SS and is willing to play 1b. HE BELIEVES HE CAN PLAY SS AT THE MLB LEVEL! As of OCT 2017. You think 1b is beyond him? Despite the fact that he came up at SS and 3b. Despite the fact that many big bat infielders including catchers and a number of OFs make the switch to 1b to extend their career. Despite the fact that aguilar is a dh by almost all accounts. Yeah really don't know what your hangup is. Do you badly want to pretend you are wiser than Stearns? Again, if a guy plays every day he can he isn't a utility player. If he plays more than 80-100 games with good health (which would be stunning) then Thames is a bench player. Thames wore down last year anyway. He had 1 great month then eh. Would playing Thames 60 games and have him as the premier ph option be wasting him? If gms try to depress the market on santana you just keep him. Maybe deal Thames, or Aguilar or hell cut perez. There are SPs to sign. There are 2bs all over the place. Fact is, jd is likely a red sox, cain and yelich and stanton and ozuna are gone. Best OF left on the market is very likely 1 Domingo Santana.

Great point as well. We're selling santana. Eh there are a lot of options out there. Yelich is the one we are looking at. OK yelich is gone. Well there's cain. Nope. Oh, I see. So you are selling Santana? So of spenders lost options. The non spenders just watched spenders enter their market as competition. I think the reverse leverage is unlikely, but the anti leverage is bunk. But its another viewpoint that dispels the idea that we are putting ourselves in a place to get leveraged so I like it.

1... he stated he's willing this offseason. Quote basically says... Im up for anything but 3rd. I never liked 3rd. I still tell CC i can play SS. I actually believe i can play SS i liked SS. If its 1b I'm in... for a few games or longer if the personnel requires it. What's best for the team, just not 3b. 2... aguilar isn't capable but we had him there last year. How would braun be different? Playing a dh at 1b isnt better than playing an ex 3b LF at 1b. 3... braun plays left for yelich, right for santana and left sliding yelich to cf for cain. I thought Ive said that 20 times already. Guess you missed that. 4... he's not a utility player. 1 stearns thinks playing multiple positions makes you more valuable so he now plays 3. Makes him better. Braun how you feel, you wanna go today... yup... ok one of 4 dudes is sitting. He plays every time he can... and if that leads to Thames playing less games... oh well. If he can go 120-130 thames loses starts. He's not the utility player. He's a multi position starter. If he's starting you choose someone to sit. If he's resting or hurt 60-70 games no harm. But you start your lineup with question 1, is braun going. Question 2, who needs a rest between the 3 of and thames. If none... its thames and its thanes every time vs a lefty. If this leverage scenerio plays out, and it won't, because we aren't forced to deal anything, this is what you do. Other teams will realize that's a real enough option to blow the bs used car salesman logic that won't play out to bits. Teams want Santana. They aren't going to get cute about it and risk not getting him over a dumb assumption that the additions made his price go down.

Him houser williams should be late game work in CS.

Burnes - Starter like him over Woodruff Ortiz - Starter too young for me to be concerned FPeralta - ready to fast track him into the pen... arm angle talk concerns me with starters durability but the RHP Hader talk makes me wonder if we could use him as a psuedo deadline addition T. Williams - Reliever sink or swim active roster or CS closer. Medeiros - too soon. Love the potential in kodi and he improved. 3 years for him to click and if not then fast tracked as a loogey. I think the latter is reality but I'm pulling for him. Ponce - Starter and I expect this to happen fast. Back end guy but ready soon. I'm crazy. Diplan - pen. Dominate in the pen this year or off the 40 man. Bye. Lemons - Starter, but realistically, way too early to tell. Bickford - fast track him in the pen Pennington - pen Lopez - bust Kirby - no idea. Houser - pen. Him and williams fight for 7th spot with gallardo. If a fa or trade add houser williams to AAA as set up and closer. Wilkerson - new improved espino 2.0. AAAA stashed emergency arm. Derby - espino 3.0 Perrin - espino 4.0 Then there's Webb - too soon Supak - pen murphy - too soon herrera - too soon Browns - zach starter daniel rp but too soon Nick Ramirez - AAAA pen stash Owensby - pen So yeah I love our stocked up milb pitching and I'm ready to fast track some much needed relief help. Peralta Houser Williams should be pushing for a spot this year. Knebel Hader Suter are safe in the pen. Logan is a 1 year loogey. Barnes needs to improve to hold his spot. Jeffress needs to show up in mke form to see his next 2 years. Gallardo is toast because of houser or williams or a FA 1 year add like Oh. Peralta jumps into the mix mid season... August adds of Williams and Houser and Bickford is on their tail.

1) We're not getting Mejia for Domingo. That speculation can stop now. 2) A Duffy, Santana swap would be straight up. Royals are going into a rebuild so they'd rather save money and get the cost controlled bat to replace Cain (I know he doesn't play CF but that's not the point). 3) I'm fine with a Salazar for Domingo swap. I really am. I'd just prefer to go after the workhorse who consistently throws 200 IP and provides insane production compared to cost over the volatile arm regardless of what it costs. Well he's controlled 4 years and he looked pretty great at the plate last year. We just gave brinson plus diaz harrison and yamamoto for a 5 year controlled guy who is clealy more of a total package. But is yelich diaz harrison and yamamoto better? Brinson mejia are ranked similarly. Its a pipe dream. But its not as impossible as you make it out to be. If duffy is a straight swap I'll chose that option as my 1st want. I doubt it would be straight. If it takes ortiz like id expect then I'd prefer salazar straight. Nelson (hope) duffy anderson davies chacin is very good. Burnes woodruff ortiz behind that leaves our window and options wide open.

Im sorry, you're wrong, we are fine, let it go. Again Pina vogt Thames braun (75 to 80 games) Addition villar Arcia sogard Shaw Yelich cain santana (braun subs for all 20-25 games) Phillips to CS... pick 2 of aguilar perez broxton. Villar sogard can cover 2b ss 3b rest days. You literally release perez and add a 2b like harrison or walker and the offense is stacked and ready to kill. Lets not pretend aguilar can play 1b worth a damn. Thames is mediocre. Braun could be bad there and barely make an impactful change to the defense. Braun started in the infield and couldn't throw accurately. But even now he's more of an infielder than our dh aguilar. If they try to leverage it, tell them to grow up and or suck eggs and horde talent. Sign cobb and blow the gms trying used cars salesman bs a kiss.

Stearns isn't an idiot. Even someone with the most basic knowledge of baseball transactions knows this. Stearns was very aware of what Santana would fetch before ever acquiring Yelich or Cain. I understand this and I went to a state college...people on this forum with high school diplomas understand what you are saying. I am pretty sure a guy with a Harvard education working in a baseball front office for years didn't screw up such a basic concept. HH19 said he would be traded soon...I don't think that is due to insider information, but the obvious notion that Stearns has already figured this out. Stearns isn't just going to find himself with a 4th OFer that put up 3-4 WAR last year with no idea where to send him. Stearns will get appropriate value for Santana. That is why he just got two big time OFers to replace him. If you thought about this don't you think he thought about this? If someone on a baseball forum can think of it I can bet the GM getting paid millions thought of it too. Phillips can go back to the minors. Broxton isnt exactly a big deal. If anyone even tries to pull the... well you are overloaded at of... you have braun say at fan fest hes getting comfortable with his new 1b glove. Yelich cain santana broxton fits Thames Braun (with braun as the LF sub) fits just fine. The leverage talk is incredibly overblown. And if they pull that crap you put braun at 1st and ride cain yelich santana shaw braun/thames. As many state... braun fragile. No one in the OF is lacking control and the one we truly don't want is Braun. No one has to move. Except aguilar who we scooped as a FA anyway. The glut can be simply solved by moving Broxton or Aguilar. Hell if Broxton has options you can stash him and phillips. Cain or yelich man cf. Braun can play rf or lf. Perez lf... villar maybe. Thames lf. People say we have 6. We have 3... braun who mentioned 1b this offseason and can barely play 100 games... a prospect... and a guy. If you count braun at 1st we have to decide on aguilar or perez. Perez or broxton or aguilar are the ones who became unnecessary today. Braun could rest yelich cain (yelich to cf) santana and replace aguilar at 1b and get to just about 100 games. Broxton stays as def rep pr. Or aguilar stays as a power ph and because villar sogard can sub at everything but 1b... perez goes. Instead of struggling every damn time braun goes down he'd merely be a plus when healthy.

We assume: Santana gets salazar maybe plus Santana and what for duffy Santana and what for archer That's my deciding factor 100%. If archers going to cost santana burnes ortiz they can keep him. Will duffy cost santana and 1 of them? Salazar is possibly a buy low overstock for overstock fit. The other question is if santana can fetch mejia... wouldn't we want mejia cobb over santana and ortiz for duffy? About the same cap.

The more I think about it the more I want a santana salazar swap. Archer will probably demand more pitching prospects. I prefer to have an electric injury prone dude and depth over just archer. Adding salazar while keeping burnes woodruff ortiz would keep our options open.

About the strike out reduction I'll keep repeating it I guess. Last year in our skid there seemed to be a serious pattern to it. Add to the fact that the astros did a massive K reduction last offseason and I think we saw the issue but didn't alter because we didnt think we'd be ready yet. Now that they are diving in the first thing that had to be cut out was Ks. I think the astros struck out under 1 time per inning on average and we had a string in our bad streak where we were nearing 12. There was a big yet simple and small sample correlation in W vs L at 11k and under/over 3 walks. I dont know where the exact line is in the analytics but i think there is a saturation point on Ks around 10 per game where it submarines an offenses scoring potential. We replace villar broxton with cain walker/harrison and trade santanas ks for yelich we take off about 225 to 250. That number I believe puts us on the good side of the threshold.

I dont think anyone worries about his past, fit, or if he earned this contract. 32 33 34 35 rumored buyout 36. Plus talk of his defense already starting to decline. I love Cain but even I'm worried about that age range.

Its dropped because so has he. I really doubt hes a real upgrade over pina now. At least not one I'd pay 8 mil for. I see the jump up from villar sogard to harrison or walker as a better use of money.

Give them back Broxton and raise them perez. Harrison has a 2 year club option after this one. That's interesting. Either way you go villar broxton santana to harrison cain yelich... there goes 225-250 ks on the year. I like that.

We get mejia for Santana I'll be over the moon. Mejia and Huira are they types that can make a good offense turn nuclear. Mejia Huira Arcia Cain up the middle... assuming cain doesn't implode and arcia improves a bit is very good. We currently talk cain yelich santana shaw braun thames as a 6 stack and completely ignore C 2b and SS. Santana is likely to go but if you end up with a stud in mejia or huira that lineup stays lethal even with say huira phillips in place or 2b santana. Or huira mejia in place or 2b C.

Simply took it as... likely to happen soon.

Santana for salazar + (hope we get our sell high buy low) And no plus does not mean mejia. Santana for mejia straight up would make me slap happy. Broxton perez for 2 lottery tix is the 2nd small hot deal. Sign walker Pina vogt Thames aguilar Walker Villar Arcia sogard Shaw Yellich Cain Braun Phillips Anderson salazar davies chacin woodruff Knebel Hader Jeffress Barnes Logan Williams Suter Still want one more legit RP. A set up man to keep hader from being locked into a mere set up role.

That would add about 50 hits if you give around a .340 BABIP I think 150 is pretty bullish, but yah we are talking 100 less strikeouts. That is amazing in just two moves. Props to Stearns for making such a massive difference to such a huge problem on this offense. Broxton strikes out over 200 times if he gets the ab cain or yelich did. 150 less yelich cain from broxton santana is pretty accurate.

My assumption is that they have a deal for Santana lined up, but were only going to execute it if they could land Yelich. I think the Santana move happens fairly quickly now. I imagine Broxton will be dealt as well. If not, maybe Phillips is packaged with Santana for a high-end starter. In any case, I think the next move has already been made. Just needs to be executed. The more that's leaking out makes me think they have multiple santana deals lined up and are going down the list of what they want most. Archer is domino A but there's likely a B (salazar) and maybe a C.

We dont need to unload him. Phillips has options. Braun could move to 1b. Broxton or aguliar are the pieces that don't fit currently. You are giving their leverage way too much credit.

For sure, but archer anderson davies are 4 year control. Nelson is 3. Chacin is 2. We got woodruff burnes and ortiz who should all hit the mlb before Nelson leaves. We could very well be trying to open a 4 year window. Weak at 2b... hoping huira can get here by year 3.

Stearns is taking advantage of the inefficiency in the market (less players in FA due to them saving for next year) and selling high on prospects (highly sought after commodities). In a couple three years we'll have a new crop of hopefully good prospects ready to go. In my opinion anyway. Its also about what those OF do. Going from broxton santana to yelich cain cuts out roughly 1k per game and adds obp and defensive range. This is about team composition more than anything else. Cain at 80/5 might be seen as a fair market fa signing when typically fas are overpaid. Add in, from my knowledge of talent evaluators they dont change their mind on someone simply because they had a good year. You look at what we gave up to get santana hader phillips houser and you realize that santana wasn't supposed to be a big deal. He blew up last year at the plate. Can't play 1st, isnt good in RF. Houston couldn't have valued him that high and you'd assume that didn't change. Stearns might have thought they were wrong but also might see him as sitting at the ultimate sell high point of his career. His opinion has a set value and expectations. If he can get a lot more for him than that value then you move him. You dont do the yelich trade cain deal without having the next move in place. Maybe its braun to 1b. Maybe its santana out. Only dude thats blocked at this current moment is mavrick who i see as a big armed colby rasmus.

You'd think playing back in Miller Park could up the HR totals a little bit. I like the deal! Plus he has been a winner on an up and coming team like this before. Can never overlook the importance of leadership as a tangible to what else he offers the club! Don't forget he's been 360 obp a few times recently. I think his numbers there look a touch low throughout.