rickh150

Suter?

On Tuesday's telecast in SD, DS was interviewed by Rock and BA in the 3rd inning (AtBat). From DS, Brewers are getting a "very quality prospect" back as PTBNL in Lucroy trade. I have my doubts as the actual quality of this prospect, but for him to say "very" in front of "quality" leads me to believe that this could be a pleasant surprise.

Doesn't MLB have a 10/5 rule, meaning a player with 10 years of service time and 5 consecutive years with said team cannot be traded? With Braun wouldn't his 10th year be this year? I know he came up in May of 2007, I believe, so not a full year there, and the PED suspension knocked off some time too. According to Cotts, Braun has accrued 8.1 years of service time before the 2016 season started.... Not sure how accurate that is.... Any help with rule or Braun's service time would be appreciated. Anyhow, the decision or unofficial Brewer deadline to move Braun could possibly be this offseason (or the deadline next season). After 10 years, we'd be letting him dictate where he goes to an extent, if we wanted a trade. Or he could just say I'm staying put and collect his 19 million per year. To me this offseason will be very intriguing because of Braun. I hope he is kept because he is old bones and has so much history with the franchise. The 2008 and 2011 seasons are a lot about him, really. More importantly, he's been surprisingly somewhat healthy and productive. However, my heart and mind are playing tug of war here too. If we can get a couple top prospects back without eating much salary, that seems like a logical and fitting move as we rebuild. Our next big move is Braun, to trade or not to trade..... and the countdown to 10 years of service time continues, which is coming up sooner than we think.

Nice story and pretty cool ranking! Congrats go to DS on this huge undertaking and massive overhaul.... Like others, in my mind, this isn't a #1 system yet because sooo many top 20 guys are struggling. Top 10? Yes. Top 5? Maybe. Nonetheless, great turnaround from 2 seasons and a huge confidence boost to Brewer fans everywhere!

If I'm managing, the team, Villar especially. gets a stop sign (hand to belt signal/ indicator) in spots when I simply don't want him stealing. No need for a big lead off. We have gotten double digit outs on these types of plays.... All on CC Not only does this happen, when Villar is on base in these situations ( mind you he gets his freedom and pitch count to run most of the time) the first base coach talks to him personally about the stop sign being on (when at second, 1st base coach brings him different batting gloves or something). When he graduates this step, he would then have to indicate to the 1st base coach that the stop sign signal is on ( from 3rd base coach). When he does this step well, only then has he proved to be treated like every other sane Ballplayer. The stop sign would still be in use for the entire team. We are looking for solutions to this never ending saga. I offer a solution that would work. The team is getting hurt from these easily fixable, individual mistakes, and I tire of calling them out...... Oh, how I tire........ Anyhow, in regard to the two unforced errors last night, I don't have huge issues with him getting picked off first in that situations. Base stealers get picked off for being aggressive.... that happens. I have issues with him almost getting picked off later..... Again. Get a clue. I have issues with a coaching staff not setting proper boundaries for this man so he doesn't hurt the team. I have issues with him stealing at his will and not valuing an out enough. I have issues with him overrunning 3rd last night when he himself plays SS and knows that deep SS throw to 3B is a possible option for an out. I am at breaking point and the cringe of Villar on the bases could be turning to a twitch. Doubting CC's ability to communicate and teach this man anything...... Need to see change or trade this guy this offseason while the iron is hot.

Why isn't Susac backing up Posey in SF? Did they want him playing everyday in AAA or was it performance based?

With two more UNFORCED outs on the bases Tuesday (pickoff at 1st, caught over running 3rd), Villar has over a game's worth of outs by himself on the bases. The positive is that he didn't get chucked at 3rd with 2 outs and that he continues to get hits.... Just frustrating. Moreover, he continues to steal or attempt to steal 3rd with no outs and two outs..... Again, I blame CC for it all. He himself has refused to put up stop signs for the train wreck of a base runner.

Does so many things well..... Yet again has two unforced errors on bases. Terrible.

Swinging 3-0, needless stolen base attempts in certain situations, air mailing cutoff men, ..... We'll see if we ever get a disciplined approach.

I hope Braun is around when we reach the playoffs again..... That being said, his contract and age stick out even more now on a rebuilding team. If DS can get value for him, he's gone.

Corey Hart and his crowd pleasing long foul ball. Ha! Great memory when sitting down left field line! Cranked and turned on it a ton.

If you told me 3 days ago it's Brinson (Top 20) + PTBNL (as in a legit prospect such as Mendez or others ranked around him) for Lucroy I absolutely wouldn't be underwhelmed. I'd be ecstatic. We aren't talking about a Top 75-100. We're talking about a Top 20. There's a difference. And we'll most likely be getting a higher ranked prospect in their system so I wouldn't classify that as "change". But thanks for doing my thinking for me. And the vast majority of people on here had 3-4 Top 100 players coming back from CLE for Lucroy alone. Not 2. If it ends up being a Top 20 + Top 150 guy then great. If it ends up being Top 20 + Mendez (67) then outstanding. "According to reports" we were taken? What reports? And did those reports include the PTBNL because that person is also involved in this trade? Finally, you can doubt/criticize players all you want but don't tell anyone on this board your criticism had anything to do with their injury history or performance history because clearly that wasn't factored into your original comments. Your comments were a fat AA pitcher and a 240 AA hitter - insinuating we received nothing of value in return that will help us at the MLB level down the road My "criticism" (such a mean and unfair word) had everything to do with current stats at AA (not great- Brinson IS hitting roughly 240 and Ortiz ERA is 4ish), physical appearance (250 pound pitcher), and injury history (Brinson-shoulder). I don't personally know any of these guys... No hard feelings one way or another. I expected a return like you honestly.... More prospects in the top 100ish ( just for Lucroy alone) because a large majority of these great prospects fizzle out. Play the odds. For Luc and JJ?? Definitely needed more top guys and guys with less question marks. Brinson won't stay in that glorified top 20 of yours long with those stats at AA. Hopefully, he fully heals and does better soon. How many overweight young guys get trimmer as they age? Small number. Also, That PTBNL is not going to be a top ranked anything most likely. Rarely are. Yet, maybe DS can find a nugget. Who knows? I had no problem with the Smith trade, by the way, because I didn't read many negatives about the prospects coming back... just a lot of positive comments/stats/rankings on each. Reports... ok, my apologies...tweets/messages/notes from beat writers and news media outlets covering MLB and the trading deadline. Also, how can you be satisfied with the deal when you wanted so many top 100 guys back just for Lucroy, not even mentioning JJ? Is Brinson that good in your mind? Why? Have you seen him play? Any footage? Or are your thoughts based on stats, rankings, andexpert opinions? Also, if you value quality so much, why didn't you mention you wanted THE prospect instead of a bunch of guys in the top 100?

1. Hader 2. Bickford 3. Arcia 4. Isan Diaz 5. Phillips 6. Erceg 7. Brinson 8. Ortiz 9. Ray 10. Clark 11. D. Williams 12. Ponce 13. Woodruff 14. Suter 15. J Lopez 16. Reed 17. Nottingham 18. Webb 19. Kirby 20. Perrin 21. Gate wood 22. Harrison 23. F. Peralta 24. Lara 25. Burnes -- Yamamoto -- Taylor -- M Diaz

Garza???? Claimed? Ha! What team takes on that salary? We would dump him sooooo fast!

I too like the direction of the team, and DS has done fine work overall. I just question this trade. Another top arm or bat in the PTBNL would surely help though.

No, no........ Melvin is done taking blame (or credit). This is on DS.

You seem to want to create this very heavy trade market for Lucroy with a bunch of prospect laden teams all bidding hard for Luc which simply didn't seem to exist in reality. Just because lots of posters on a Brewers internet forum for months now have been coming up with a bunch of pretend trades for Lucroy, involving numerous teams where we land multiple top 100 prospects in return for him alone doesn't mean that's going to be a reality of what is available/being offered. Outside of Cleveland and Texas, there didn't look to be another interested team who also had a deep farm system, and Lucroy vetoed a trade to one of those teams. Maybe you should stop believing that what fans post on sports forums involving pretend trade proposals is something that real GM's actually get to work with. Not only that, just because certain prospects are rated with a number by scouting services, that doesn't mean teams and their scouts share similar positions. This trade with be graded out in time based on how Brinson and/or Ortiz end up developing, not whether you think they rated high enough on various prospect lists. Same for any trade. Everyone loves the Smith trades and it could end up a bust. This is a tough business for GM's. Thanks for clearing that up. Fans are not GMs, ok. If the market was SO bad like you yourself write, why trade these guys now? Pretty simple, really. If Lucroy wasn't traded, Stearns could have said the market simply wasn't there at this time and he would have been no doubt applauded by DS loyalists here for not selling Lucroy short. Jeffress could have been kept for at least 3 and a half years or possibly dealt at some point or in this crazy relief pitcher market. Instead, everybody and his uncle knew the trade was coming, allowing Texas to get the best upgrade, arguably, on the market and a top pen piece for two highly regarded, but still very questionable AA players not playing great now and a PTBNL. And according to previous posts, not everyone in the Brewers front office is sold on Brinson either, showing that this really isn't what we wanted. It's what we took. This trade seems forced. Again, I hope one of these guys turns out to be not just good, but an All Star. If not, we will remember this trade as a flop.

Did he earn his way up? No. Bad precedent.... Yet, I am excited to see him play.

Of course it seems we should have gotten more - when almost everyone offers unrealistic proposals and you see the actual return it's underwhelming. I said earlier this afternoon, based on Lucroy to CLE and Smith's trade, that if we're offering Lucroy/Jeffress we should net Gallo (because his name was in every rumor so assumed it was him instead of Brinson) + Mendoza or Ortiz + whoever else is added. I wasn't referring to 5 guys added. I was expecting 2. Which leads me to believe the 1 coming back will be a legit prospect. I thought that was realistic and a very good trade then and I still do - I think it could be a great trade depending on who the PTBNL is. Nobody should be critical of Stearns as of yet. He's literally done nothing to warrant any criticism in my opinion (some will disagree). Lucroy wasn't playing today because the deadline was this afternoon and other teams already gave offers the day before. So if one offer falls through then there's still interest from the other team's. Lucroy not traveling to SD has no barring on anyone's thoughts or strategy. Everyone knew he was on the trade block still because he was literally just traded 30hrs ago to CLE. Ortiz a fat pitcher with 4 ERA in AA. Feel free to disregard his 1.74 ERA in A (18/19yrs old and 3yrs young for level) and 2.6 ERA in A+ the first half of this season (20yrs old and 3yrs younger than competition). Or the fact he barely walks anyone with 8.3 K/9 rate. In 6 of his 9 starts at AA he's posting a 28ip, 26h, 8er, 7bb, 26K (2.57 ERA). He's pitching just fine and still learning/growing. As a 20yr old Brinson destroyed A ball. As a 21yr old he destroyed A+ then had a very solid AA then a brief AAA stint destroying it then posted a 300/408/983 line in AFL. Posted massive numbers across the board last year at several levels. This year he's injured, as everyone's said, which is affecting his performance. It doesn't change his tools. He's a legit defensive CF as well - this year he's still playing AA at almost 2yrs younger for the level. If I told you two days ago that we'd get, in essence, Brinson and PTBNL for Lucroy, my guess is that you'd be underwhelmed. No one would have agreed to that trade from Brewerfan...... None. The consensus was two top 100 guys and change..... Not 1 and change. We all expected more. If you blame the market, so be it, but we didn't have to move him. Even a year from now, I think one team could have given us a similar package ( 1 top 100 prospect) for a few months of Lucroy. Lucroy was traded to Cleveland and then not. Case closed. He plays with the team, he travels with the team. Why tip our hand by telling everyone in the world that we are NOT ONLY LOOKING to trade him today, but also his bags are packed, he's virtually said his goodbyes, and the team basically has moved on literally and figuratively from him. Even Luc said it would be "awkward" finishing the year in Milwaukee. The Rangers could now play hard ball with us. According to reports, Boy did they. Before the Cleveland trade, no pitcher included with Luc. After, Jeffress is added. Also, the Rangers knew that they could assumingly stand their ground in the last hour because it seemed like we simply were going to get rid of Luc today. If you want me to give Brinson and Ortiz the A ball gold star stickers, you got it. Brinson and Ortiz get them, no question. Am I not allowed to doubt their potential based on the AA stats, physical appearance, and injury history NOW? A reminder.... We just gave up a year and a half, top 5 catcher and a controllable top 30 reliever. I would expect not only more coming back, but also fewer question marks attached to them. Again, I hope at least one of them is an AllStar. Otherwise, it would seem we got taken a bit.

Seems like we should have gotten more.... Even those here that praise the deal wanted WAY more than this and have posted wish lists that included WAY more for JUST Lucroy. For whatever reason, some refuse to be critical of DS even in the slightest. Uh.... it's ok to be underwhelmed here a bit and still like DS and the direction of the team. Also, it seems like we were dealing from a place of disadvantage because Texas, along with everyone else in the baseball world, figured Lucroy was being dealt because of the debacle yesterday. Lucroy wasn't even with the team today.... Talk about showing your hand. It's very difficult to be excited about a fat AA pitcher in the 4's ERA and a somewhat injure prone AA .240 hitter who strikes out. We are banking on a lot of things to go right to justify giving up a 31 year leader, All star catcher, and our closer who could have been an Allstar this year, who has 3 and a half years of control left. To me, the Indians deal was a little better. These two top 100 players we received also appear to be trending down with so so years. I really like the Smith trade.... Can't say the same here. One of the two really, really have to perform well (All Star) to make this trade a good one. Let's hope one does....

Any relation to Bruce Suter???

2. Nope.

Still, no. The guys that came up to fill in the rotation were lights out for the second half. The truly sad part of that team was Krod and Axford, guys who excelled the prior year. We make the playoffs easily if we could save a game that year.

A. Reasonable?....probably not. Most would see 80% of these guys as fringe MLB players, at best. Archer and Teheran are somewhat proven MLB starters. It would depend how long is left on each of their contracts (which I didn't look up) Yet, I hear ya. Prospects are waaaaay overvalued now. B. No, because SP is the big key for all teams, especially small markets. It's how the A's excelled with Hudson, Mulder, Zito, Harden, etc. For as much press thatKC's pen got the last two years, the SP held strong down the stretch each year. Again, it would depend on contracts, for me, and how much time would be left on each.

If we are going to package Jeffress, a top 5 reliever on the market, WITH Lucroy, the best bump at a position in the market, WITH a Davies or Guerra, we better get what we want in their system...... Only a day ago we were talking about getting 2 top line players plus throw ins JUST for Lucroy. Now, seeing what relievers are netting in trades, we are willy milky throwing in Jeffress, who has another 3 years of control???? And a SP??? Don't trade just to trade, DS. Easy....