slappzilla

It's not ludicrous at all. Take it to the correct thread and I will lay it out all day. Most people here are informed brewer fans. It's not hard to lay out next years rotation. Even if you want to include Marcum in it, it's tough to call it a contending rotation in a pitching favored league. I'd love the Brewers to compete, but I'm not going into the 2013 season blindly thinking they will. Actually, nevermind. I forgot the Brewers are a lock to resign Greinke. We got 2013 covered.

This isn't the thread to debate it, but the Brewers will not compete next year. Not with the rotation they're going to roll out. You can only have so many xfactors. 2013 Brewers are the 2010 Brewers. Seriously. For that reason, I wish Segura would not have been brought up till June 2013. He's only 22. I don't care what anyone says, min wage Ransom or some other min wage .600OPS guy would not hurt the Brewers that much for the first 2 months of the season, unless you expect Segura to be a .800OPS guy right out of the gate which is a bit of a stretch.

I do not want to pay Aramis what he is owed in 2014 ($16M) and the installments after 2014. I don't mind what he's owed next year ($10M) but I also don't see the Brewers contending next year, that's why I'm all for trading him. After next year the Brewers may not be able to shed him just for his contract even. Deal him now while you can get something.

Like someone else just said, I see them as a $85-$90M team. I'm pretty sure that falls into the small market category. Maybe it's mid-market, I don't know how they differentiate. To me, market size is measured on revenue brought in. The Yankees can afford what they afford because of the $$$ they bring in. The Brewers are a $85-$90M team because of the revenue they bring in. If they had (or do for you still beleivers) made the playoffs this year, and put together back to back years of postseason appearances, I think they would have brought in enough steady revenue to jump to a $100-$110M team.

I'm seriously hoping to see a tweet later on today that includes the words "KRod" and "DFA'd". No one is taking on the rest of his contract. Gonna have to cut him Suppan/Bill Hall style.

Segura starting tonight https://twitter.com/MikeVassallo13/status/232564873068961792/photo/1

I am afraid of the the same thing.

Ransom has a .716OPS. He's not as bad as people make him out to be. That being said, as long as bringing up Segura now doesn't make a difference on his service time, I don't see a problem with it. Like molitor fan said, if they want to determine whether they need to bring AGON back next year....if Segura shows he can handle the load, that frees up a good chunk of money for other resources next year.

Tom ‏@Haudricourt #Brewers announce they are calling up SS Jean Segura to take place of Cesar Izturis, who was claimed off waivers by Washington. It's official Now the discussion is....too early? good move? How does this effect service time?

quoting myself to correct something... Just noticed Segura's been in the minors since 2007 (he started in the Angels farm system at 17). He's performed at every level. If you look at what the Angels did with Segura in their farm system from 2007 till now, it doesn't make a lot of sense. In 2009 he played 7 games at the AAA level, but then in 2010 and 2011 he went back to playing in the A and AA levels? http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=segura001jea I don't know how it would effect service time and what not, but maybe bringing Segura up now wouldn't be the worst idea after all?

Melvin loves him some Yuni. Not joking. Brought it up in the Yuni DFA thread. People keep saying Segura coming up. Doubtful. Keep Segura down on the farm till at least June 1st of next year. Let Ransom and Bianchi or maysonet or whoever fill in at SS rest of the way.

Melvin making room for Yuni

It's a poor point when pertaining to the topic at hand. You could say that about any big name FA ever that didn't take a midseason offer before hitting the FA market.

^ agree with all of that, especially the first part. Gamel and Aoki is the way to go and if the Brewers can get a Segura type prospect for Hart you have to do it I think.

You're not the first person on these boards to mention new TV money so I'm sure there's something to it. Not only the Angels, but the Dodgers as well I think signed a new big TV deal that opened up the flood gates to get them more money. I mean the Angels went seeds to the wall in spending this year.

You can't put Davis and Morris in the same category as Fiers. Not yet at least. I agree though that going from bottom of the league to roughly mid-table in just one season is something Brewers fans should be absolutely psyched about. My issue is the Brewers don't seem to have any future all stars in their system. Out of the top 100 prospects, how many do you think the Brewers would have in the top 50? One, maybe two (segura, Thornburg or Peralta), and how many do you think they'd have in the top 100? That's why I'm saying the future is hardly solid. Lots of core, average players and maybe a couple of good players like monty said. Hope is that next year some of these guys really step it up and move into top 50 status or even top 20 status. There's no hurry to rush anyone up, seriously. I wouldn't even bring Segura up till June 1st at the earliest next year.

You could say that about anyone walking the face of the earth. Seriously, the risk he took by not taking what the Brewers offered him was minimal at best.

I think the $96M number I got was from seasons start. I don't know where I heard it. Cot's says $98,150,833 and that's Major League contracts plus pro-rated signing bonuses. http://www.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/?page_id=71 Either way we can agree that this year the Brewers shelled out around $100M for payroll, most ever by the team. Like I said, he wants to at least break even. In the land of owning a business, just breaking even or even taking a slight loss is a win if it's laid out right. As far as how profitable the Brewers were/are/will be this year, I don't know how to find that info. I know the Angels were able to jack up their payroll big time due to their new TV deal. I don't know how much, if at all, the Brewers can jack theirs up. There's a lot we don't know as far as what the Brewers have or don't have to spend, so all we can go off of really is previous years spending and what Melvin says. I don't think next years payroll will be as high as this year going off of what Melvin said. We shall see though. Either way, the Brewers are still a small market team. They're not going to be throwing around $120+ anytime soon unless someone knows of sum newly found cash flow that I don't.

^ this I agree with 100%. Problem is, average/good MLB players don't turn teams into playoff teams. Brewers became contenders again when the farm produced all stars like Prince, Braun, Weeks, Gallardo, Hart, etc. A bunch of average/good core players will keep them at the .500 mark.

I agree that after you laid it out, the Brewer farm system isn't as bad as I thought, but I still don't think it's better than average at this point. I still come from the school of thinking 1 out of 10 prospects actually pan out. I'd say 2 or 3 out of your list of top 10 will pan out, tops. I'm not saying that to be negative, it's just law of the land.

It's a possibility, but I'd bet that even if he finishes the year as a clunker for the Halo's, he rakes in more than the Brewers offered him via FA.

I've seen this talked about in many different threads pertaining to the Brewers signing FA's, trading guys (Ramirez), and what they'll do to fill holes next year. I think it deserves it's own thread. What sort of payroll do you think the Brewers will put out next year? This year, the Brewers put out the most ever ($96M), but Melvin stated early and often that the team went way over budget. http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/01/melvin-brewers-way-over-projected-budget.html I've seen some people saying that the Brewers can spend up to $115M next year. I'm sorry but I find that ridiculous. The Brewers are still a small market team. You have to remember that the Milwaukee Brewers are a business. Mark Attanasio did not become a millionaire by buying businesses and losing money on them. He is not going to jack up the payroll and take an overall loss in profits. Those of you who think he should throw his own money in, I'm sorry but that's just not how it works. I'm thinking next years budget will start out around $80M, with a $10M kitty set aside to be used to fill holes and what not, meaning it would max out at $90M. None of us know what the Brewers can spend in order to still make a profit (or at the least not take a loss), but we do know what the Brewers have spent in years past, what they spent this year, and what Melvin has said regarding what they spent this year. The Brewers have had a nice spike in attendance in the last couple of years, but it's hard to know if the attendance spike will remain going forward after this years stinker of a performance.

I remember listening to an interview with Melvin in the offseason, before Alex Gonzalez was signed to the team, and he did nothing but talk up what a great SS Yuni was and how he hoped to have him back. Even the guy interviewing Melvin started to list off Yuni's downfalls (crap defense, swings at first pitch, never walks, etc) and Melvin sat there and defended him like he was sticking up for a family member. I'd welcome Yuni back just because the team is done for the year (contention wise) and he'd provide some solid comic relief.

Please expand on that. "decent" is arguably a stretch. I'm sorry, but the Brewers farm system is still a bottom five system when compared to the rest of MLB. Fiers has been a great surprise, but I think the other arms in our system are still either overhyped, or too inexperienced to make any sort of impact next year. I'm all for giving them a shot in the rotation next year, but expecting them to perform at a level that would push the Brewers towards contention is highly unlikely. Let them work their bugs out in 2013, either in the bigs or AAA, and let's come out in 2014 or 2015 as a legit contender. As much as I hope I am wrong, I don't see the Brewers contending in 2013, which is why I want to trade Ramirez. That last year of this contract is $16M. I go off the mindset, if you're not going to contend, build for the future.

^ I don't know. I argued it to nausea in the Greinke thread. No one realizes the Brewers are still a small market team. People think that throwing Greinke the sort of money that Hamels got is completely doable. I've said it a dozen times and I will say it again, this years $96M payroll was an over-budget payroll. Melvin said it himself. Last year with Marcum and Greinke so they had to go for it, which is why they signed Aramis to what they did (and due to the assumption that Braun would miss 50 games). When they offered KRod arb, they assumed he'd turn it down and the crew would get the draft pick, but KRod didn't turn it down and that pushed the payroll way higher than Melvin or Attanasio wanted it. Next year the Brewers aren't looking like the contenders they looked to be this year, so no freaking way do the Brewers even come close to overspending next year in the same manner. edit: I started a thread on the topic, since it's talked about in so many different threads viewtopic.php?f=63&t=28746