82brewcrew82

You just called out exactly what I'm saying. The PITCHERS are having trouble executing. Nobody asked you to buy it but yeah, that is what I'm saying. I mean, at this point you're just making my argument for me. No, Hook doesn't actually make the pitches and if you think there is a single pitcher in professional baseball that doesn't understand the concept of pitching 0-2 then I have a bridge to sell you. They shouldn't have to be told and if they do I'm 1000% sure that Hook is not telling them to groove pitches in 0-2 counts. That is just a ridiculous notion. It's not a matter of listening, it's a matter of having the talent to execute. Are you really going to look at the Isle of Misfit Toys that constitutes our bullpen right now and claim he hasn't improved a pitchers performance? What about Woody? There are others. What about the much improved performance of late? There is plenty of evidence including the release and/or demotion of multiple pitchers that played big roles last year. Not wanting to see it is antoher story.

Fine, get another one. It won't matter unless the talent level of the pitching staff is improved as well.

I thought it was funny as well. The thing that made me chuckle is what does it matter if you have a large payroll and money coming off the books if you are just going to be stupid about how you spend it like they have to this point.

They still have tons of talent, a large payroll, and tons of money coming off the books the next 2 offseasons. I just don't see how we're in any position to be criticizing that teams chances going forward. They are in pretty good shape to stay competitive for a while. Meanwhile we're getting by on smoke & mirrors. It's a Brewers message board. In part at least, we exist to criticize other teams and their modes of operation. In my mind, the Cubs are a far larger embarrassment than the Brewers this year even if they get in. With that payroll and that talent, In my opinion they should have won more and be competing on the same level as the Dodgers year over year. The Dodgers outclass them by a lot and frankly, I don't think the baby bears are anywhere near a dynasty or all that scary of team in general. We've outplayed them two years running including a division title on their ground. The only reason a Cubs fan comes on a Brewers board is fear.

He deserves credit for not letting things completely go down the drain I give you that but this is where we as fans can't be swayed by mediocrity. If you think this team can and should pitch better than you should be open to making a change. I am. I think the team has spoken pretty clearly on this. The releases of pitchers like Chacin and Jeffress that played such major roles last year were let go, not the pitching coach. Clearly the team thinks the pitchers failed to do their job, not Hook.

Gotta love that Braun cockiness.

I never said I wanted Hook back. I couldn't care less as to whether he is here or not. I also never said pitching coaches don't matter. I happen to think the talent level of the actual pitchers matters more. I think he's done a decent job given the injuries and talent level and apparently so do others so your wrong on that too. Would you like to bring DJ back? Is he a good pitching coach? Explain why his staff has dropped a run in ERA in the second half while, in theory, upgrading talent from Roark to Bauer? I do watch the games and I see pitchers failing to execute pitches. Simple as that. Keep Hook, fire Hook, I really don't care one way or the other but the reasons for getting rid of him that you have presented in this thread have been pretty easily refuted and/or lack statistical proof. This started with your statement that the gopher ball Hader gave up was a "Chris Hook special" as if that were a thing. Even if it were a thing it was a ridiculous statement. That home run was on Hader and his inability to execute on that pitch.............period. You claimed they weren't pitching better of late. A notion that was dispelled by other posters and statistical evidence. Once that was refuted you resorted to a "my eyes tell me" argument about walking batters and 0-2 counts, none of which you can back up. There are plenty of folks that will tell you that I've been overly critical of the pitching and up until the last few weeks I haven't wavered from that stance (I'm still skeptical) but credit where credit is due. They are pitching better and if Hook gets the blame early, he gets the credit late. You don't like Hook and that's fine but I see no indication that the Brewers are unhappy with him and I'd be willing to bet he is back next year......anecdotal evidence aside.

It might, but I wouldn’t count on it. That would leave the Brewers at 87-75. To get to 88 wins: The Cards only have to go 5-8 The Nats have to go 6-8 The Cubs have to go 7-6. Yes, there are 10 head to head games with two of those teams. So that guarantees 10 losses, but also guarantees 10 wins. The Nats have 3 at Miami and 5 at home against the fading Phillies. They might easily get 5 or 6 wins in just those games and not need any against the Cards or Indians. If they get swept by the Cards that just puts the Redbirds that much closer. The Cubs have 3 at home against the Reds and 3 at Pittsburgh. They could get 5 of the wins they need right there and need only 2 of 7 against the Cards to get to 88. If the Cubs only win 2 against the Cardinals, that would give the Cardinals 88 wins right there. They also have the games against the Nats and fading DBacks to add more wins. I still think 89 is the target. Anything less than that and the Brewers would need help from teams like the Pirates, Reds, and Marlins and that is dangerous. Good breakdown, thank you.

You should be able to go to MLB.com. Maybe you need a subscription but the radio and tv replays are available.

If you ignore the past you are doomed to repeat it. They most certainly should look at the past and learn from that experience going forward. It matters a great deal. Figures. Go ahead and tell me how ruminating on the stretch of games he’s wanting to do if we don’t make the playoffs is related to your take on ignoring the past, doomed to repeat. If that sentiment has to be explained, it probably isn't worth explaining to the person that needs it explained.

Do you have any statistical evidence that this is accurate and/or that it happens more than league average or is this just your opinion? Watch the games bro. If you think Hook needs to stay which is what you said we disagree. We shall see what happens. I say he's gone. Not your bro. I watch about 150 games a year and I see pitcher after pitcher missing spots and failing to execute. If you want to fire Hook, fine. I never said he was a great pitching coach but I'm certain he isn't telling pitchers to groove pitches. This won't get better until the pitchers get better and you can change pitching coaches all you want.

If you ignore the past you are doomed to repeat it. They most certainly should look at the past and learn from that experience going forward. It matters a great deal.

I'm confused, that wasn't this board?

Do you have any statistical evidence that this is accurate and/or that it happens more than league average or is this just your opinion?

Your comment was literally that the gopher ball Hader served up was the fault of Chris Hook. That is incorrect. The pitching staff isn't good because it isn't good. Not because Chris Hook makes a significant difference one way or the other. You can change the goal posts all you want. just to follow that up, they have pitched to a 4.27 ERA over that last 28 days and a 3.62 ERA over the last 14 days. Both are significantly better than their season number. That just so happens to coincide with one of (if not THE) their winning-est stretches of the year. So yeah, you are both wrong and peddling an inaccurate narrative. I have been one of the biggest critics of this pitching staff from day one but if Hook gets the early season blame he gets the late season credit.

Your comment was literally that the gopher ball Hader served up was the fault of Chris Hook. That is incorrect. The pitching staff isn't good because it isn't good. Not because Chris Hook makes a significant difference one way or the other. You can change the goal posts all you want.

Not at all false but continue your narrative that a pitchers failure to execute is on the pitching coach.

Neither one of those statements is true. The pitching staff has performed very well of late and that would indicate he needs to stay.

STRIKEOUT...........Chris Hook special to end it.

Yeah, Hook told him to throw a meatball and miss his location. That is 100% on Hader. Ridiculous. Oh yeah my bad he's good. I forget. Regardless, it's ridiculous statement.

Yeah, Hook told him to throw a meatball and miss his location. That is 100% on Hader. Ridiculous.

Awsome!!!!

This was his crazy attempt at reverse, reverse jinxes. He's a genius! It wasn't but he will play it off that way.

They have to think about catcher, third. short and first (at least from the right side) in addition to some arms. One of those offensive positions is going to be subpar offensively. I'd rather it be Arcia.

I will be happy when Arcia is off the team. When a player struggles as badly as Arcia, I'd like a little less playful enthusiasm and a little more grouchy self criticism. But Arcia plays with the looseness of a productive star, even though he's an easy out. At least he isn't on your lawn.