OnTheBlack

This is akin to denying climate change because it's cold where you are in one particular area of the country. I'll be on the side of the players simply because their share of the profits are much lower than other professional sports leagues. The Billionaires as it currently stands are taking in a larger portion of the profits than I believe even they hoped for. The reason may well be that teams are smarter(or at least in part), but that doesn't mean that there shouldn't be better ways to more equitably distribute the revenue.

Until I see proof of that, I chhose to believe that this is just a message board, full of regular people who think they know what is gong on... I know there are people on visit these boards who work for the Brewers and know things. I worked for the team out of college and knew people who were higher up and know people who stuck around who know when things are going to happen. They're not decision makers and they're definitely expendable enough that if they were to start leaking things....given how Stearns likes to work, they'd probably be ex-employees though. The closest I've ever gotten to any "inside" info was being told "something big" was happening the day they extended Braun. So while I am pretty sure there are people who check in here from time to time, I'm also about 99 pct certain they're not talking about what the team is going to do(or suggesting they move Aquilar to 3rd base).

Yep. And if he played for an East Coastish team, he'd get the recognition he deserves. I think the late start of West Coast games just prevents a lot of people from seeing him play and recognizing that he could be the greatest player of all time. I actually think he's the rare player that it doesn't matter. He's talked about among the all time greats as he should be. I don't think people could talk up Trout anymore than they already do. The bigger issue for me is that he's not playing in the post-season. That's when Jeter really became the face of baseball. The Angels need to sign Machado and get into the post-season. Trout has 2 years left and then there are rumors he's going to be headed to Philly or at least back East. LA should be doing everything it can to win right now....

Cano has been a much better deal thus far than I thought it'd be when it was originally signed. This is a pretty strong argument against the collusion the players association believes is happening as teams have decided the first half production isn't worth the 2nd half albatross these contracts often bring.

It's not often I'm shocked by the stupidity of a contract in pro sports. That one is stunningly stupid. And the one thing that may bail the Pads out is their absurdly talented farm system. But just imagine if they hadn't given a 1st basemen with one big year that deal? You could offer Harper, Machado or wait a year and really go for it and offer Arenado and not pay THAT much more. At least they front-loaded that deal....that's something...right?

I took the question to be the second part. If the historical version of Babe Ruth came up today, how would he fare.

Sorry, I had to correct this, but Williams absolutely did play against minorities. He didn't really play against a fully integrated league like today, but he played until 1960 and Larry Doby debuted in the AL in 1947. Good catch. Not sure what I was thinking. I guess I was thinking about the first half of his career, or the first part of it. And then also the absence of the Latino players who have such a huge impact on today's game and the fact that there were very few black pitchers. But you're absolutely right. He did face some African-American's during his career. It's a shame though that guys like Pagie weren't facing hitters like Williams on a regular basis when both were at the top of their game or Dihigo, or what Gibson could have done vs the same pitching.

Well I'd be happy if Jeff Bezos would just take 90 pct off everything I ordered from Amazon...but I think just like Mark A might have something to say about adding ANOTHER 34 million dollars to this payroll, Bezos may have a problem with this. Also...I don't think this serves the D-backs. The Brewers weren't looking to give up prospects for someone to just take Braun when were started our rebuild. I think it makes far more sense to not make this trade, but if it DID happen, I think the D-backs would rather eat some money and get something back than actually give away prospects which only delays they're rebuilding. Especially one of their top young prospects in Smith, the guy who's likey slated to take over for Goldschmidt, Yerzy's a catching prospect that has a big upside and Young is an MLB ready lefty. This makes very little sense for either team. I have a pet peeve with people who speak in absolutes, but I'm ALMOST positive this wouldn't happen. This totally hamstrings the Brewers the next 3 years while they have Yelich in his prime and Cain at the end of his from doing anything without dumping salary. And while you'll probably respond by saying Braun's contract will be gone in 2 years, the young guys on the Brewers and their raises through arbitration will negate those savings. Unless the Brewers are going to be pushing their payroll up to the 170 million region...which I find pretty unlikely(about as Likely as the Angels waive Trout after a poor opening month)...this seems totally unrealistic other than on a video game where you don't have to worry about real life finances. Well, the D-Backs can either fork over money or fork over prospects to get rid of Greinke's contract. I'd rather have the prospects. If the Crew gets top prospects and Greinke's contract, the financial hit is mitigated. But the hit isn't as big as some think. Plus, a bit of Greinke's money ($62.5 million of the original $206 million) is deferred to the 2022-2026 timeframe. That means the Crew is paying about $24 million each of those years. So, the 2019-2021 salary comes to about $25 million a year. A lot, but I proposed dealing Anderson and Albers. Their 2019 salaries come to $9 million. So that is off the board. Anderson also had an $8.5 million team option for 2020 off the books and a $9.5 million team option for 2021 off the books. In 2021, Braun's deal is off the books as well if he doesn't exercise a $15 million mutual option. That takes the net salaries for 2019 and 2020 to $16 million and $16.5 million, respectively. The 2021 salary could be covered by Braun not taking the mutual option and Anderson's 2021 team option. Then, from 2022 to 2026, the Crew gives Greinke what amounts to roughly $6.5 million a year. So, yeah, I'd tell Stearns to take the full contract, and see what prospects he can get in return. It's almost a no-lose scenario. You didn't even bother reading my post, did you? I literally said, It's not a "no-lose" scenario, Grienke is 35 years old and was the recipient of good luck last year, his hard hit pct was WAY up from recent seasons. So what happens if Grienke loses another MPH on his fastball, is sitting at ~88 MPH, that hard hit rate either stays the same or even goes up a bit more and his BABIP goes from the .272 it was last year to the ~.300 or so it has been more of his career? Now you're paying 3 years 104 million for a 35-37 year old pitcher on a small market team in the middle of it's window to compete and you don't have the resources to add anyone else over that period of time and likely have to let a couple guys go. That's a potential loss. I do still think Greinke is going to be a good pitcher for a few years, but I can't fathom how you trade for a guy with an AAV of 34.5 per year and conclude that's a "no-lose" scenario.

Maybe just a hint of hyperbole to this, but I think your point is legitimate for most players. I'm sure the legends of how little effort Ruth put into the game are exaggerated, but if the stories are to be believed, Cobb worked his arse off. Of course if you believe Ty Cobb stories, he was a horrible racist and not a guy who's family was forced from their home for being abolitionists and then advocating for civil rights and then latter becoming a huge Jackie Robinson fan who said baseball should have been integrated looong before him because one idiot drunk wrote a book and didn't worry about fact checking.

How is a discussion that multiple people find interesting and engaging pointless?

Same here. I was worried he'd be aggressively pursued by the next big market East Coast team in need of a GM. I love the continuity and I love the random FA signings that come out of nowhere and that nobody has reported on.

Yes.

In my opinion, if you are going to sign a player to that kind of contract, he should be a solid ambassador for the game and for your team. Machado isn't even a solid ambassador for himself. Yeah, he's probably going to put up good numbers wherever he goes. He's a top 5 offensive player in the game. But his shenanigans in the playoffs last year were not isolated incidents. He's a douche. I don't really care about most of the stuff Machado has done. But the things that make me dislike him(though I'd get over it if he were a Brewer) is how he just doesn't run hard. He saved the Brewers a run last year IIRC because he jogged to 1st after a GB to SS where the ball was bobbled. I don't care about bat flips and other cocky things. I love Gomez and if you look at lists of most hated players from when he was here, he was on nearly every one. But you didn't see Gomez jogging on a grounder. Still, give me a guy with his defensive ability and the ability to square the ball up as much as anyone in baseball....if I'm being honest, I could find a way to root for him if it got my team over the hump. But...since it's not going to happen, I can continue disliking him.

Well I think virtually everyone is out on the contract as it stands. I believe this is a complete non-starter unless the D-backs want to send at least 40 million along with Greinke....and probably more. As for his personality, I think that's a bit of a cheap shot. I think it's widely accepted that he lands somewhere on the "spectrum" without playing psychologist. That said, I actually find him refreshing. He doesn't suffer fools, says what's on his mind and is a pretty fierce competitor who has evolved from a dominant power pitcher, to a Maddux-esque control pitcher with very good secondary stuff. One thing that has been overlooked a touch is the fact that he's probably not as good as his numbers suggested last year and we should expect something of a regression from him and he seemed to benefit from a bit of good luck.

I agree - which is why I have no problem acquiring him. Not only does he become arguably the best starter on the staff, but he may be a good mentor for Burnes, Woodruff, and Peralta (among others). The Crew's had them to a point where they all won't be super two, and the better they do... the higher the return if they end up being dealt down the road. Besides that... I'd be happy to take his full salary provided the Diamondbacks give the Crew some prospects. Diamondbacks get: RHP Chase Anderson RHP Matt Albers C Mario Feliciano OF Trent Grisham RHP Phil Bickford Brewers get: RHP Zach Greinke C Andy Yerzy LHP Alex Young 1B Pavin Smith Well I'd be happy if Jeff Bezos would just take 90 pct off everything I ordered from Amazon...but I think just like Mark A might have something to say about adding ANOTHER 34 million dollars to this payroll, Bezos may have a problem with this. Also...I don't think this serves the D-backs. The Brewers weren't looking to give up prospects for someone to just take Braun when were started our rebuild. I think it makes far more sense to not make this trade, but if it DID happen, I think the D-backs would rather eat some money and get something back than actually give away prospects which only delays they're rebuilding. Especially one of their top young prospects in Smith, the guy who's likey slated to take over for Goldschmidt, Yerzy's a catching prospect that has a big upside and Young is an MLB ready lefty. This makes very little sense for either team. I have a pet peeve with people who speak in absolutes, but I'm ALMOST positive this wouldn't happen. This totally hamstrings the Brewers the next 3 years while they have Yelich in his prime and Cain at the end of his from doing anything without dumping salary. And while you'll probably respond by saying Braun's contract will be gone in 2 years, the young guys on the Brewers and their raises through arbitration will negate those savings. Unless the Brewers are going to be pushing their payroll up to the 170 million region...which I find pretty unlikely(about as Likely as the Angels waive Trout after a poor opening month)...this seems totally unrealistic other than on a video game where you don't have to worry about real life finances.

I know you're kidding, but it's not like it's been THAT long since players were smoking during games under the dugout. Wasn't Mark Grace a chain-smoker?

Well...first of all, I don't agree that Mantle would be dominant today. I don't believe that Mantle would even make it to the big leagues. But going back to Babe and Cobb? I think Babe Ruth would pretty good at slow pitch softball and that's about it. It's a completely unfair comparison though. Babe Ruth played with a 40/36 bat(which is basically a full grown Maple tree). I think he'd hit much worse than an average pitcher today. And I think Ottavino was 100 pct right. He'd strike Ruth out 100 times out of 100 times. This is assuming that you're literally talking about taking the 1920 version of Babe Ruth and not changing his workout, not changing anything and then just planting them into a lineup today. People are soooo much bigger, stronger, faster now than they were then it's not even funny. Even in the past 50 years I believe the average height has gone up 2 inches in the United States. Ruth was facing what almost would amount to BP today with some spitballs and some curves thrown in, but nothing close to the same velocity and nowhere NEAR the same spin. This doesn't change anything in MY personal opinion when it comes to the greatness of Ruth or of Cobb...or of Mantle or Mays. They still compare with the greatest of all time. I still think Ted Williams is the greatest hitter ever. You have to take into account he didn't play against any minorities, but he also missed roughly 5 full years serving as a pilot in both WW2 and the Korean War...5 years in his PRIME. That's probaly another 200 home runs, 800 more hits, 600 more RBI's...which I get aren't as important...but still. I think it'd be even more interesting to compare the greats of the 70's, 80's to today and see how they'd fair with the shifts, the increase in strikeouts, how they'd adjust to the left handed specialist or use of bullpens just in general. Would Mike Schmidt, Yount, or some of those have the same success.

I still don't see how them saying shoring up 2nd makes it "clear" that they've been working over the 2nd base market hard. As someone else said, if they were as desperately working to find someone to play 2nd, they could have found someone. I think they view the top 2B prospect in baseball as a slightly more viable option than "option Z."

Should this be in blue? I don't see any plausible way that the Brewers would ever intentionally plan on using Aguilar at 3rd base outside of an extreme situation. This is like having an emergency QB. He's there in an emergency...but if you actually plan to use him there....well, that's just a bad plan to put it as gently as I can. I'd rather use Braun at 3rd than Aguilar. I also don't see Hager as a viable option. About 5 guys would have to fail or get hurt before he should get a crack at it and at that point, Hiura will be up and if he fails out of the gate, then they can always find a team that's struggling and make a trade at that point.

I agree 100 pct. On both the beer and not caring about the naming. I do care in that it's going to bring more revenue to the Brewers and as such will hopefully increase the money we can spend. But I'll still call it Miller Park just like most people still call all the buildings you listed by their original names.

He's a pretty solid player. I do want to see if he can get to 3,000 hits. He probably won't, but he's still young enough and close enough that it's a real possibility and something I'm really rooting for.

Because he won't be cheap and he reaches base about 30% of the time. And he adds little versatility. For the money we're likely to spend on Moose, I'd prefer we go after Marwin Gonzalez. Especially since Hirura is likely to be ready in the near future, and Gonzalez is a switch hitter who can put up decent numbers vs lefties(not great, but better than Moose) while covering basically every position on the field. You're also asking Shaw to become a full time 2nd basemen and while it worked OK last year for a couple months, I don't like the move long term. We've already got a good left handed 3rd basemen. We don't really seem to have the luxury of adding another one IMO.

I wouldn't be 100 pct against this if that 35 million was closer to 55 million. I love Greinke, but he's not Greg Maddux and I don't think he's duplicating last years success and low BABIP. Still a very good pitcher, not the guy we traded for the first time and not worth ~23 million per year. I'd have much rather signed another D-back, Corbin if we were going to pay a pitcher that type of money. A power lefty.

Seems like a good starter. I do wonder how engaged Rodgers will be trying to learn a new offense for the first time since he came into the league. I think that may reinvigorate him and hopefully get his level of play back to where we've expected it to be his entire career as opposed to last year when he just missed too many wide open receivers.

Well, he's been real up and down, but the safety market in general has been so bad that I think you're looking at a 5th probably at best for HaHa. I could be wrong, but when Mathieu signs a 1 year 7.5 million dollar deal and he's a much more versatile player who's been more productive, I don't see HaHa getting a big multi-year deal. Even Burnett. 3 years and 14.5 million for how reliable he'd been is pretty cheap and I don't think HaHa is a better player than Burnett was when he signed. Again, I'd be happy to bring Burnett back. Maybe you end up drafting someone else and he starts ahead of Burnett, but you need two new safeties IMO and edge rushers, depth on the OL among other positions. So having a smart, solid defender like Burnett would make a lot of sense.