Mike Cameron

[MNBrew]

Considering the Brewers took on cash as part of the deal for Greinke, I can't imagine there's much more wiggle room in the payroll.

The $2M is basically to pay for buying out Betancourt's 2012 option. That's been mentioned in many places.

 

When the salaries in a deal like this are so lopsided, including cash to buy out the lousy guy's option is not an uncommon practice.

 

I like Cameron, but he's usually good for 1.5 to 2 months of "hot" and 4+ months of "not." I can see Melvin & Co. waiting a while before making such a move to see a) what we've got going in '11 in real life, and b) what other options may become available on the trade market.

[Funketown]

I did. Your argument using the low OPS of 'starting' outfielders from the World Series teams right? I think that penciling in Dickerson for an OPS of even 74 is taking somewhat of a leap of faith. He's that bad. I see no upside, and he is one of the oldest position players that the Brewers have, what am I missing on this guy? I'd rather give Gomez a chance to play everyday and twice on Sunday.

What do you base this on? Yeah, he sucked in a few PA's last year. I don't see how penciling in a guy who has a career wRC+ of 101 to put up an OPS+ of 74 is a leap of faith. He was average in 2009.

[RockCoCougars]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something? What makes you think that he is a valid option to start in center field? Please don't give me AAA stats either. I'd much rather take my chances with Gomez who is younger, better defensively, faster, probably has almost as much pop in his bat and at least has some upside. The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

[PeaveyFury]

The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

 

I don't think anyone is calling for Dickerson to be the full time starter, most want a platoon for the reason you mentioned above.

[logan82]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something? What makes you think that he is a valid option to start in center field? Please don't give me AAA stats either. I'd much rather take my chances with Gomez who is younger, better defensively, faster, probably has almost as much pop in his bat and at least has some upside. The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

You mean other than actually being able to get on base right?

[greeg35]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something?

Sounds more like he might have killed your dog. Again, no one is saying he is an all-star just a good bet to be a solid part of a platoon needed as a result of getting Greinke.

[DocBrewPack]

I think whatever money Melvin has to play with should go to improving SS. I can happily live with Gomez playing CF, if he can improve some at the plate, play excelent D, and steal some bases, im happy. I think he fits well with Roenicks way of playing so maybe he can have a break out year. Worse case senario, we keep him stuck at 8th in the order where he cant really hurt us much.

[igor67]

We could actually have enough bench space to do some decent platoons and let the manager manage a bit, since we don't need to have 3 long men in the pen with all of these starters and competent relievers.

[RockCoCougars]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something? What makes you think that he is a valid option to start in center field? Please don't give me AAA stats either. I'd much rather take my chances with Gomez who is younger, better defensively, faster, probably has almost as much pop in his bat and at least has some upside. The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

You mean other than actually being able to get on base right?

His OBP last season was .267. Yeah, I know.... small sample.

[logan82]

I think whatever money Melvin has to play with should go to improving SS. I can happily live with Gomez playing CF, if he can improve some at the plate, play excelent D, and steal some bases, im happy. I think he fits well with Roenicks way of playing so maybe he can have a break out year. Worse case senario, we keep him stuck at 8th in the order where he cant really hurt us much.

This is the kind of thinking that lets guys like Corey Patterson hang around in the majors for a decade. Come to think of it Corey Patterson is a pretty good comparison for Gomez. The main difference being that Patterson actually posted a .320+ OBP by the age of 24. 1400 MLB PA without little sign of improvement is all I need to let me know Gomez is what he is. A really poor hitter with speed.

[endaround]

What is really funny is Dickerson hit .289 in August before basically being buried in September

[logan82]

What is really funny is Dickerson hit .289 in August before basically being buried in September

Macha had a tendency to bury guys for no apparent reason.

[endaround]

Well there were a bunch of callups and Cain was getting a bunch of starts

[Bombers]

Personally I think SS is the bigger issue but don't forget a lot of people think Hart could play CF and then Gamel could play right

[Funketown]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something? What makes you think that he is a valid option to start in center field? Please don't give me AAA stats either. I'd much rather take my chances with Gomez who is younger, better defensively, faster, probably has almost as much pop in his bat and at least has some upside. The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

I don't think anybody said Dickerson should start in center, simply that he isn't a bad option as a platoon player with Gomez, or at least to get 50-60 starts backing up Gomez. Do you have anything to back up your notion that he's absolutely worthless other than that he struggled in 100 plate appearances last season?

[Ennder]

Personally I think SS is the bigger issue but don't forget a lot of people think Hart could play CF and then Gamel could play right

Our defense is bad enough without doing something like this.

[brewerfan82]

Are you guys Dickerson's agents or something? What makes you think that he is a valid option to start in center field? Please don't give me AAA stats either. I'd much rather take my chances with Gomez who is younger, better defensively, faster, probably has almost as much pop in his bat and at least has some upside. The only advantage I can see for Dickerson is that he hits LH.

You mean other than actually being able to get on base right?

His OBP last season was .267. Yeah, I know.... small sample.

Are you talking about the same guy everyone else is? I think everyone's getting kind of confused by your intense opposition to him, haha. Dickerson had a bad season last season with only 106 sporadic plate appearances, but even including that season his 3 year major league numbers look pretty decent:

 

.267/.356/.403

8 HR

20 SB / 6 CS

101 OPS+

4.9 Batting Runs Above Average

11.9 Fielding Runs Above Average

3.2 WAR

 

... in 527 PAs

 

Doesn't seem like the awful player you've been describing... Plus, although it was bad last season, your .267 OBP is just wrong (.271 with Brewers, .250 overall, but like you said, small sample size)

[kramnoj]

One of the supposedly best managers in baseball couldn't get squat out of Gomez.

 

Gardy got 2 Wins out of Gomez in 2008. I'd take that in CF in 2011.

[RockCoCougars]

I don't hate Dickerson, I just feel that he's no where as good as some here think. In my view, he's a 25th man at best, and if he sees extensive playing time, it doesn't bode well for the team. As far as Gomez goes, I think he needs to be given one more chance for regular playing time this season, considering that Hardy was wasted for him. He's fine in the field, at least. I agree with those who feel that shortstop is a more immediate problem.

[Funketown]

I don't hate Dickerson, I just feel that he's no where as good as some here think. In my view, he's a 25th man at best, and if he sees extensive playing time, it doesn't bode well for the team. As far as Gomez goes, I think he needs to be given one more chance for regular playing time this season, considering that Hardy was wasted for him. He's fine in the field, at least. I agree with those who feel that shortstop is a more immediate problem.

Could you substantiate this view rather than just saying things like "Dickerson didn't even hit a ball hard last year"? I just don't understand why you think he is so terrible.

[Hofbraunhaus]

Personally I think SS is the bigger issue but don't forget a lot of people think Hart could play CF and then Gamel could play right

I agree that SS is the bigger issue but the thought of Hart in CF and Gamel in right makes me shudder. Let's hope it doesn't come to this.

 

[RockCoCougars]

I'm just going by what I saw. He brings nothing to the table from what I saw. He demonstrated no power whatsoever, and struck out at a pretty high clip, in line with his (admittedly brief) career. In 61 at bats, he scored 2 runs and drove in 5). He's a fringe player in my view, and I don't like the idea of him getting significant playing time- in a strict platoon, he'd get most of the at bats since he's a lefty. I'd rather go with Gomez, who at least showed some flashes of being a player last year (granted these were brief and sandwiched between lots of poor play). Maybe I'm wrong, and Dickerson just needs an opportunity, but I'd rather give Gomez the job to lose before completely giving up on him. His track record hasn't been very good with much more playing time, but he's still pretty young.

[kramnoj]

I'm just going by what I saw.

 

What you saw was a player that had missed a good chunk of 2010 with an injury. We have little reason to believe that what we saw is representative of his true talent level given how well he performed in previous years.

[chadomac]

Just brought this up in the other thread... but... Marco Scutaro and Mike Cameron? I could be wrong, but they're both bench players for the Red Sox now. Maybe that would be a possible deal? I guess I don't know what the Red Sox would want, though. The prospects are becoming thin.

[brewerfan82]

2B Rickie Weeks

SS Marco Scutaro

LF Ryan Braun

1B Prince Fielder

RF Corey Hart

3B Casey McGehee

CF Mike Cameron

C Jonathon Lucroy

 

SP Zack Greinke

SP Yovani Gallardo

SP Shaun Marcum

SP Randy Wolf

SP Chris Narveson

 

?

 

Yes, please.