FVBrewerFan

Yea, but if they had one less in the BP, they could have the same problem with pitchers in extra innings. Although it would be fun to see Thames pitch an inning.

Could it be there's now a "book" on Thames? Nobody knew how to pitch him in April, maybe now they do. I really don't think the training staff would have him play LF if he was injured. Is he hurt? Maybe, but if any of you have had a bad knew, hip, whatever, sometimes it's something that's always there and doesn't necessarily get better with rest or worse playing with it.

He got hit by a pitch, not sure what he's supposed to do about that.

Yes, the same Scooter Gennett who had an OPS of .728 playing full time last year.

Is it time for a new Manager? Who knows how much, if any, the coaching staff is to blame. But too many guys under-achieve every year. Maybe a new manager would be worth a try??

I had an issue at the time letting Gennett walk also. If they could have traded him for even a couple mediocre prospects I would have been ok with it. And I get it, Aguilar can only play one position, so having Scooter would have really hurt the flexibility. But having Thames, Franklin, and others out in LF not sure Gennett would have been much worse for a game here and there. SS and 3B were covered by Villar and Perez, so it really could have worked. But what's done is done. Villar could go the route of guys like Listach or Segura. Some early success, then hit the skids. Segura bounced back in a big way, Listach never did. It's so hard to project players with limited experience, especially when the results vary so wildly. But Villar still has 2/3 of the year, so let's just see if he can turn it around. At some point maybe DeJesus gets a shot. Either way, I don't think it's a given Villar will not be back next year. They can always give him through May or so, and if Dubon is ready he can come up then.

How do you have any idea what Thames medical condition is? While not perfect, I will trust the Brewers medical staff over random fan forum posters.

Let's not over analyze 3rd party sources who know Haders mom. They need to limit his innings, that's all.

He didn't play in either games of the double header Yes, he is day to day. Today was not that day.

No doubt CS has an impact on so.e more than others. But I also really wonder about player development in this organization for pitchers. And in hindsight, quite seriously, would they have been better off just not having a AAA affiliate until they find a decent location? Just add another A affiliate for 2-4 years?

Fun fact, Suter has more flights between Milwaukee and CS than innings pitched. I don't see Ray or even Clark dropping much, but Erceg will. Lots of guys doing just enough. Hope to see my "Suter" make it next poll, Dustin Houle.

Yea, and that's why I get as little food as possible. If the food is great, maybe I would be sure to buy item "x" more often. Or if it was cheaper, I would buy nachos, brat, etc. But don't try giving me expensive, bad (or inconsistent quality) at the same time. I literally rather hit the McDonald's drive-through after the game.

No, not unless he's packaged with Cravy.

It's been....3 games... Yea, does this mean we're not a lock for the WS anymore?

Any OF worth anything is either protected already or won't need to be next year. But I'm open to a trade as long as it's not for a rental. Any pitcher would need to have a few years of control. If they make a Sabathia or Greinke type deal, I will rip up my David Stearns Fan Club membership card. If we are stocked well in the OF with good to great prospects, we can't protect all of them. Right now, we have eight on the 40 man: Braun, Broxton, Santana, Franklin, Brinson, Reed, Cordell, and Phillips (nine if we count Perez). With an influx of talent that will need to be protected in the next two years ACROSS THE BOARD, and with several of our players under team control (actually all of these OF under control for the next five years plus), trades plural have to be made. I don't want us getting robbed royally thru Rule 5. No trades need to be made at the deadline this year to manage the 40 man roster. That shouldn't (and won't) be a factor. Do you know how much junk is on the 40 man? Reed and likely Franklin won't be on the 40 man next year. Garza will be gone. They have Espino, Cravy, Hauser, etc. Now, will they need to move 2-3 OF within the next couple years? Yes.

I agree 97%. 3% consists of the possibility that Stearns comments were "GM speak" that really doesn't mean anything at all.

Any OF worth anything is either protected already or won't need to be next year. But I'm open to a trade as long as it's not for a rental. Any pitcher would need to have a few years of control. If they make a Sabathia or Greinke type deal, I will rip up my David Stearns Fan Club membership card.

Nobody has said we have drawn conclusions, that part is straw man territory.

wRC+ is fine, I used to follow that more until I realized 99% of the time it meant virtually the same thing as OPS+, and for that matter plain old OPS. As Austin said, as a quick look OPS almost always tells most of the story. I mean, if someone has an OPS of .600, wRC+ isn't going to save you. But when evaluating prospects, it's fun to look deeper into K rates, BB rates, LH/RH splits, all that stuff. Just to get a sense of what's going on with a player. I think all we're saying is it's nice to see eye-popping numbers from top prospects, not numbers that are a little above avg for the Carolina league. As a top pick, and top prospect a player needs to be way above the average. (With the caveat, yes he could still get there by the end of the year.) At this point, guys like Clark, Ray, and Harrison are both just a two week hot stretch away from looking a lot more sexy. Erceg, Nottingham, and Lara would need a lot more than that to catch up at this point.

Agreed, forget Braun and Garza for the moment. What if they're "in it" come July and get a really good offer for Knebel, Broxton, or Thames? That's when it gets interesting.

I get rebuilding, but I don't get wasting opportunities when they present themselves. If the Brewers are fringe wildcard contenders in July, then I could probably get behind a trade like this one. However, if they somehow found themselves in 1st place by 4 or 5 games, as a fan I would expect them to trade some of those future pieces to get proven talent and solidify their position for a post season run this year. If the point of rebuilding is to possibly be in contention at some point down the road, why would you waste the opportunity when you know you are in contention now? I think there are many that want to believe that there is some magical rebuild formula that will allow the Brewers to contend for 4, 5, 6+ years. Remember not that long ago when the Brewers had all that home grown talent on the roster? They already had a one time #5 BA prospect in Ben Sheets on the team, then they added a #8 and #11 in Weeks and Fielder along with a #16 in Gallardo. They had other highly touted prospects like Hart and Hardy join the MLB team around the same time. Seemed like it was going to be a golden age with possibilities of contending for several years in a row. In reality the success was a sporadic (2 playoff appearances), Fielder eventually became not affordable (and not really a good fit in the NL), Weeks never really fully lived up to his prospect status and had injury issues, same with Gallardo. Sheets became injury prone. Hart fizzled out. In reality, I'm not counting on the Brewers to be in solid contention in July. However, if they are, I don't understand why you would not ride that success because you are afraid of risking future success that may or may not happen. Well, right there you proved it to yourself. That's why it's important to continue to add talent to the system, so we're not relying on a handful of players. Keep improving the system, and you'll have more talent across the board at the MLB level, and every level down the system. So if someone fails, there's someone waiting in the wings. Is any of that a guarantee? Of course not. But we're seeing a glimpse of what could be this year, with the OF situation. Now imagine if the plan is carried out in full, where this depth exists at nearly every position- including pitching. That's how they CAN be competitive for years, and yes, still make strategic trades and FA signings. As for this season, need to see how it plays out for another two months. I mean, if they're 20 games over .500 at the end of July I have no problem tweaking the plan. But it would take a lot for me NOT to trade Braun, Garza, anyone at all in the BP, Broxton, Villar, or anyone else if the right offer is made.

"Year" being the key. Checking my calendar, we are still 8 days short of June on this one. I have no idea how well any of those guys were doing 42 games into their various years. Mostly because it's not important. Also not sure what you mean by "explained by wRC+" - what statistic should players be limited to when describing them? I think wRC+ does a lot better job than OPS, if for no other reason than it neutralizes run environment. Which is why I acknowledged that in great detail in my full post. But all we know are the results so far. I can't say I will be excited in August once his numbers improve, because that is an unknown. For example, I doubt I will move him down in my Top 25 mid-season if his numbers are the same- maybe a tick. Just like Phillips last year, many practically wrote him off but I just bumped him down a bit. All I'm saying is results to date (which is all we have) are nothing to be excited about. Even more true with Erceg. In the case of Clark, his ability and willingness to walk will really serve him well as his power increases and his hit tool gets better.

Except when people are saying they are less than impressive it is looking at what they think those players should be doing vs. what they actually are doing. Those are players people want to be hitting .280/.350./.500 Now all things considered I am not too terribly dissapointed with either of them. Both are hitting for a solid .750 OPS. Not terrible...not that good(considering we drafted them so high). Hopefully one of them can take the next step. Yea, sometime soon I will go back and look at the MiLB numbers for Fielder, Braun, Weeks, Hart, etc. But what I remember is those guys had great numbers every year. Not years that needed caveats, or explained by wRC+, etc. Maybe that's not fair, different era, different parks, etc. But generally speaking, if you look at the big bats in MLB, those guys produced big time every year in the minors. So when I see Clark, Ray, Erceg, etc. not tear it up, I don't get too excited about them. But there's a long way to go this season, so it's not like I'm giving up on them. It also doesn't mean a player can't have a mediocre year and then turn it on the next and take off from there. All it means is I look at what Clark has done this year, and it's meh.

Another conversation is see happening in July: DS: "Mark, should we abandon the plan to make sure attendance doesn't go down by 5% in September?" MA: "No."

Yea, this also assumes Mark A can't adapt to different circumstances. As long as we're purely speculating, I would speculate he is on board with whatever Stearns wants to do. Mark A is a smart man and realizes this team is at a different place than it was when he first bought the team. Shiny new stadium, new Owner, a core of players in their prime, 25 + years removed from 1982 WS season, etc. We can debate it, but it did make sense to try to "go for it" at that time. This season is very different, and I think Mark A is 'all in" on Stearns plan to build a team that can have sustained success.