JimH5

She died today at 90. A television icon from a very influential show. RIP Jean Stapleton.

It is hard to imagine how different baseball would be if not for the work of Dr. Yocum and some of his colleagues. Lots of respectful and thankful messages on Twitter today from the baseball community, including players whose careers were saved by his work.

The 'stache, you have done some very heavy lifting on this thread. Congrats on the well-researched work.

A lot of it depends on condition. What does the tip look like? How about the tails? Is the graphic faded? How dark is the felt? Is the screening cracked? Is the pennant itself flat? Has it been crumpled? It could be worth $25, or it could be worth $200, depending on condition.

With kids in tow, I would recommend one of the chain hotels. The Holiday Inn Express is fine. I have stayed there each of the past three or four times I have been there. I have also stayed at the Best Western, which is close, too. There are nice Bed and Breakfasts, but kids might want some pool time. The Otesaga is a fine old hotel, but I think its priced beyond my means. At least it was the last time I checked. In Cooperstown, the HOF will probably take up a good chunk of time. The Farmers Museum is also an area attraction of some acclaim. I have not been there, though they sell combination tickets, which allow for admission to both. It seems not unlike Old World Wisconsin. Actually, I think the combo ticket also includes the Fennimore Art Museum, though I have not been there either. For food, Alex & Ika's is very nice. The Doubleday Café is good. I had breakfast and lunch at Danny's Market, a small deli. There's only one traffic light in Cooperstown, so if you're at the HOF, you'll park your car and be able to see all of the downtown on foot.

To me, a 65 win team is not any different than a 75 win team. There is no added pleasure in winning those extra 10 games. So if a team is destined to be under .500, then they should really cut bait.

Hope you're getting pain relief, Nottso. . . I remember that sense from Taylor-that he had straight talk about needing to temper expectations about the major league team while rebuilding the minors. I'm not really sure what to think about his drafts. They netted Corey Hart, JJ Hardy and Prince Fielder in his 3 years, so I guess that's good. But I think a team should do better than just 1 quality player per year. Otherwise it takes 25 years to recycle the roster. Melvin's drafts haven't even produced that.

I would only add that they sell memberships in the HOF. I have been a member since 1998, and two years ago I upgraded my membership to the Patron level ($175 per year). At that price, you get a very nice lithograph of a baseball scene, pencil signed by the artist. The current artist they are using is Bill Purdom, who does classic scenes. This year's litho is of Warren Spahn pitching to Willie Mays in a famous game from 1963. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Braves-vs-Giants-July-2-1963-Limited-Edition-Lithograph-signed-Bill-Purdom-/130903470073 I'm not the ebay seller on this, but this is the litho that you get with membership this year. You can't pick and choose, they just send all Patrons that litho this year, and it will be a different piece of art next year. Membership even at the individual level gets a HOF yearbook, a subscription to their magazine. It's a good deal, and a fun way to stay connected to the Hall.

I was there two weeks ago. I try to get up there every couple of years, and really enjoy the whole experience. I agree that there should be more "stuff" on display. Several years ago, they devoted more of the space to the chronology of baseball, and they had more of the ancient relics. Then for some reason, they started going with more themed displays. . .Women in Baseball. . .The Latin Experience. . .The Negro Leagues. . .The whole section on stadiums and the fan experience. . . They do constantly change things there. That wall of oversized photographs on the 3rd floor is temporary. The records room with the interactive video displays on baseball records is new. They have always had an art gallery, but I really like it and wish it were bigger and had more in it. They do have some artwork in the Research Library they could move there. Some of it is in need of change. The whole plaque gallery itself is like a mausoleum, with plaques on walls. I think once you've been through there, you kind of know what it is. The Baseball at the Movies exhibit has been there for at least 25 years. The section near the library, recognizing broadcasters and writers is pretty weak. I had great food at the Doubleday Café, and at Alex & Ika's. The town is definitely centered around selling stuff to tourists, and that stuff is of varying levels of quality. Autographed stuff, cards, caps, t-shirts, custom bats. Doubleday Field is really beautiful. I have never been there during a game, but I imagine it would be terrific. It's a pretty fun place, and definitely a must visit for baseball fans. I like to go during the offseason, when I'm pretty much alone in the place. Incidentally, I think there is a Molitor Blue Jays uni on display. Not sure if they have a Brewers one out. The HOF has so much stuff in storage and they rotate it around as they make changes. Some of the local hotels have partnered with the HOF on doing hotel packages with behind the scenes tours of the archives. I might swing for that next time.

my thoughts exactly. True, but as we learned with the teams of the past, basking only gets you so far. At some point, past glory becomes stale and you've got a team rostering guys better suited for the independent leagues. Tell me that Lalli, Betancourt, Rogers, Gonzalez, Bianchi, Prince, Narveson, Green, Gamel & Fiers have any value at all. The horrible Brewers of the late 90s had Brian Givens, Todd Dunn, Tim VanEgmond, Brian Banks, Marc Newfield, Antone Williamson, Mike Misuraca. Are today's non-star Brewers any better than that lot? Winning doesn't require all 25 roster guys to be stars, but it does require 7 or 8 of them, and it requires production from 20 or 22 of them. The season is still early, but it's looking pretty bleak for now.

Joe Block = vanilla. And not Small Batch, Organic, Hand Crafted Full Flavor Vanilla. . .but more like vanilla ice milk served in a paper carton with a wooden paddle spoon.

This thread is fabulous. I am so glad that we can find comedy in this miserable team.

That stadium plan is fantastic! I hope it goes through as planned. I'm tired of stadiums that look like they were built to pay homage to bygone days.

There's nothing wrong with it. Making money is a good thing. They are providing a service for all of the Brewers fans who don't live here, or who don't have the time to get to the stadium to buy one themselves. And there's nothing wrong with someone buying something for resale and then seeing the bottom fall out of the market for it, and then being stuck with 1 or 50 of them.

I was knocking back a couple of brews with my Brewer savant friend tonight, and this discussion came up. He quickly pointed out that I was wrong, and that the Brewers have in fact drafted one twenty game winner. In the realm of Brewer trivia, this would be a great & difficult question... any guesses for bragging rights? Did he win 20 games for the Brewers or someone else? Matt Morris drafted in the 26th round in 1992. Cards drafted him 12th overall in 1995. He won 22 games in 2001. Great trivia question! That one took some digging...

Perhaps I'm using BR.com's play index incorrectly, but if not, the recent numbers are even more depressing: Since 2000, there have been 175 pitcher seasons where the pitcher has produced a WAR of 5.0 or higher. The Brewers have had 2 of those. (Sheets in 2004 and D'Amico in 2000). Sabathia had a 4.9 in the Brewers portion of that one season. Hard to see how they can win a pennant or World Series if there system can't produce a stud pitcher.

Mike Caldwell, Jim Colborn and Teddy Higuera have been the only 20 game winners, and none of them were Brewer draft choices. RA Dickey had a 5.8 WAR (BR.com) season last year, and only 5 times have the Brewers had someone exceed that. Higuera 3 times, the great Ben Sheets season & Caldwell's 1978. 6 other guys did it last year alone (Verlander, Price, Kershaw, Harrison, Cueto & Sale). The Brewers have never been able to draft and develop a top quality pitcher. In franchise history, only Higuera and Sheets have a career WAR greater than 20, and there are at least 30 currently active pitchers in the majors who have done that.

Indeed, Geno. I've internet-known you a long time and was delighted to see you back here. You're a smart and funny guy. You write interesting and thought provoking posts, and I enjoy seeing what you have to say. This isn't going to change that. I just thought I read into your post that Roenicke bugs you by being a wuss, and you were questioning if his faith had anything to do with it. To me, it seemed weird to see you preface your statement with, "not to be a douche about it, but. . ." and then follow it up with something that sounded to me to be douchey. Like wondering if a hardcore Christian was unable to do an effective job at managing a baseball team. And that was what set me off. A sidenote. . .there was a thing in the paper today about some Milwaukeean working with the cast of The Book of Mormon, which I understand to be a very funny musical. It just dawned on me how mean-spirited it is to mock other people for having a different spiritual view than my own. So I think I read your post with that sense of guilt/enlightenment, etc. bouncing around in my head. But enough of the God talk. Let's get back to more bad stuff about Ron. I heard he doesn't even sing in church! He just mouths the words!!

A little tough to "not take that the wrong way." This isn't the place to denigrate any religion. I also wish Roenicke would show some other emotion other than the golly-gee-whiz one which seems to constantly come from his interviews. I'd like to see him rip someone once in awhile, but it's early May, and he's got to be with those players for 5 more months, so I can see why it might be best to not get fiery. I don't know of any manager who goes off on his team this early in the year. He reminds me of Tom Trebelhorn with his attaboy optimism. Sometimes I wish we had a grouchy old coot, but maybe that's just because I am one.

I live midway up on a wooded hill, and I have a neighbor below me who likes to burn yard waste. The resultant smoke is unavoidable, and there are several days a year when we have to close the windows to seal out the smell of burning leaves and sticks. The rotten thing is, the nicest days for opening up the windows and letting fresh air in also seem to be the nicest days for this guy to be outside, poking away at his smoldering leaf pile. So we close the windows and complain to ourselves about the goof down the hill. You have a right to smoke on your property, but understand that not everybody is going to be happy about it. I wouldn't take it personally. It's not about you. They just hate the smell of smoke. By going to the landlord, they tried to avoid a conflict, but it's a pretty weak move, too. The best solution for everyone is for you and your guests to quit smoking. But until then, your neighbors have to put up with it.

I heard this podcast today from Mike Francesa, talking with legendary broadcaster Bob Wolff. http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/nyc.podcast.play.it/media/d0/d0/d1/d2/dP/dD/d5/12PD5_3.MP3?authtok=5562076560814471741_9GMthCkedYPfdafhISYFLut3nwk Wolff donated his archives to the Library of Congress, the library had them restored, and Wolff plays a few of them during this interview. Mickey Mantle, Jackie Robinson, Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth. . .terrific stuff. These have been locked away in his basement all this time.. This podcast runs about 35 minutes. It's a terrific listen to some of the old tapes. Wolff is 92, but he's still pretty sharp, and the tapes are awesome.

You're arguing points on the evils of steroids -- views with which I concur -- but then are implying that Roid Rage and chemically altered states are essentially a different level of cheating, and therefore that chemically altered state is more wrong or against the rules or the spirit of the game than doctoring the ball is. There's obviously a lapse of time between eras, but the question of cheating & morality isn't necessarily any different. I'm saying that because steroids affect one's physical makeup, because they come with dangerous risks, because they are done in secrecy and because they are illegal, that cheating with steroids is a greater crime than doctoring a baseball. Apply the same logic to the cocaine, amphetamines, etc. that plenty of current HOFers took . . . Why, then, don't those players & circumstances merit the same levels of moral scrutiny? Illegal drugs such as these have done and continue to do more harm to individuals and our society -- and on a much wider scale -- than steroids, and those drugs which are stimulants have some of the same effects as steroids. Cocaine and marijuana and even Dock Ellis's LSD are generally recognized as recreational drugs, so I would put them in a different category than amphetamines. I'm not defending their use, but I don't think people used them specifically to play better baseball. And with amphetamines, the culture of the sport was such that there was no secrecy about them. Steroid users have known all along that it is wrong, hence the need for masking agents, etc. to keep the use a secret. My point is that cheating is cheating. Agreed. But a child stealing a few coins off of their parents dresser isn't the same as Bernie Madoff stealing billions from investors. We look at the two cases differently, and dish out punishment differently. It's too simplistic (for me) to say cheating is cheating. I have to consider the context of the era, the impact, the danger, etc. It seems highly selective and contradictory that many HOFers look down at suspected or proven steroid users as cheaters . . . but don't make any fuss at all about a long-known cheater WHO WAS CAUGHT CHEATING IN A GAME (Gaylord Perry) standing among them, not to mention any of the previous generations' cocaine, amphetamine, & greenie users. Agreed, and I think that's where the 15 year rule comes in, or the various Veterans Committees. We may one day reach a point where steroid use isn't viewed upon with the same scorn as it is now. Orlando Cepeda and Fergie Jenkins had to wait for their induction. Maybe the voters of the future will look differently at steroid use.

The survey seems to be one where people self-identify as fans, so that's going to include people who are diehard every night, daily fantasy league types and someone who went to one game last year on a free ticket and had a nice time. My wife says she loves baseball, and she does, but she wouldn't know who to pick for an All Star ballot, or know who Kyle Lohse is.

JimH5, you're invoking a moral standard & applying it inequitably. And you are insisting that today's voting membership of the BBWAA be tied to the 1991 membership's interpretation of the voting rules--even though the HOF itself allows for differences in judgment through the years. Today's writers are allowed to interpret the rules as they see fit. Same as it was when Perry was inducted, or in 1936. Morality is up for interpretation. People think different things at different times in history. And people have disagreements. To some, Tom Yawkey is an immoral man for being the last of the owners to integrate African Americans onto his team. To others, Yawkey was generous and kind and a man of great character. Both sides can be right. but they sure did enable an accelerated recovery time -- THE SAME & ONLY PURPOSE STEROIDS HAVE BEEN PROVEN TO SERVE. You will never get me to believe that steroid use and the muscle mass that it enables didn't contribute to Sammy Sosa having 3 seasons of 60+ homers, or Luis Gonzalez going from having a Craig Counsell physique to 57 HR. Mark McGwire can say "The only reason I took steroids was for health purposes." But throughout all of history, no naturally healthy person ever hit 70 major league homers in a season. Regardless of his intent, or Sosa's or Gonzalez's, they were able to do superhuman things, never seen before or since. They didn't do it alone. Steroid-enhanced pitchers throwing suspect balls in smaller parks added to the totals, for sure. But there are parents who lost sons to suicide who insist that steroid use contributed to those deaths. People go into Roid Rage. Their brains are in an altered state to create that. Nobody ever went into a chemically altered state from throwing a doctored baseball. That's the only way to ensure consistency and, to me, ultimately, true credibility. I think you're doing yourself a disservice by ignoring the context of the times and the decisions of others. That Gaylord Perry is in the Hall, or Kirby Puckett, or Judge Landis doesn't take away from the HOF. If they were brought to a vote today, in today's context, knowing what we know about these men, they might not be elected. Bill Conlin might not win the Spink award. But the Hall doesn't have a cleansing policy. There are no do-overs, the same way that the official records of baseball don't whitewash away the achievements of players who cheated.

Perry's crimes happened in front of full stadiums, with opponents, umpires & media all within sight. He also altered a ball, not himself. His crimes didn't require the help of doctors making fraudulent prescriptions. So to put his rule infractions in the same category as a PED user is to ignore some very real differences. Brandon Phillips is 6'0" and weighs 200 lb. Same as me. We are not identical.