Warning Track Power

I'd prefer giving our own guy like Katin a chance first but I could definitely get behind a power bat on the bench. The problem is, realistically, who's place is he going to take? Kotsay or Counsell...doubtful. Kottaras...no. That leaves Wilson and Carroll. I think I'd prefer to roll with a backup defensive CF like Carroll instead of WMP. As for Wilson, well...then you have Counsell as the only backup IF. Discussions like this make all the more apparent as to how much the bench leaves to be desired. Counsell has truly become dead weight.

This situation is reminiscent of the Carl Pavano flirtation in the offseason. Everyday I pray I read that Beltran is traded somewhere not Milwaukee because it makes zero sense and like RockCo said, "I prefer Hart over Beltran and its not even close."

Making a list in my mind, Jamey Carroll is about the 5th name on the list of what we believe to be available SS that I would want to acquire. Carroll would be a fantastic bench player for 2011 for sure but we would have to make an additional move to fill the SS hole. It his age that scares me away. If he were 32, I could definitely get behind him but acquiring 37 year old Carroll for anything more than a super utility role would be a totally underwhelming move. 1. Brendan Ryan . . . (t)2. Clint Barmes/Rafael Furcal 3. Ian Desmond 4. Jamey Carroll I think we should be acquiring a guy to play SS for 2011 and possibly be around for 2012 and 2013. To me, this is why Brendan Ryan is the best fit at the Trade Deadline. Again, we don't need a Reyes or Tulowitzki at SS when we have Braun, Weeks, Hart, Fielder in 2011. We need a D-minded player and whatever O received is a bonus. Put another way...isn't Brendan Ryan Jamey Carroll, only 8 years younger? Why buy the older model when the newer would likely (unverified) cost relatively close to the same amount?

Maybe the numbers say something different but I can tell you that when he was with the Angels, it was like watching Axford at his worst. 2-0 and 3-1 counts are the norm. Very uncomfortable to watch and will be somone that has you as a fan Ben Sheets-ing your way through every inning.

Jason Bartlett apparently isn't available.

Blake is hurt (pinched nerve in his neck) and doesn't know when he will be back. No interest in acquiring him given his injury.

Updating where we stand from the original post: I think it is definitely becoming very clear as to where we are headed with this thing. The options I gave in that first post were: Option A - Given it is an all in season, are you expecting DM to make a big splash ala Reyes or Hardy? Option B - Are you expecting a high risk, high reward type deal which would bring in an injury prone Furcal? Option C - Do you think DM will worry more about shoring up the D and bringing in a Ryan or Jack Wilson? Option D - Or does DM go the change of scenery route and hope a Jason Bartlett revives his TB or Minnesota days? It is clear that A and D are out the window. Reyes isn't going to be traded, Hardy re-signed and it appears Bartlett is not available, according to Padres GM Jed Hoyer. It appears Option B and Option C are still in play. Option D is still sort of in play if you plug the name Ian Desmond in for Jason Bartlett. So essentially, barring some unforeseen circumstance, we have the following players available to fill the SS role: Option B: Rafael Furcal Option C: Brendan Ryan, Jack Wilson, Jamey Carroll & Clint Barmes Option D: Ian Desmond Undoubtedly Option B and Option D will be the most expensive. Option B with Furcal may be a substantial risk given his injury history, but also given what the Dodgers may ask for given his potential when healthy. Option D will likely cost something most of us won't want to deal especially considering how Desmond has played in 2011 and the likelihood of Washington overvaluing him. I know we all have our different opinions on Option C and whether or not it represents a significant upgrade or not but I believe this is the option we will see if any at all as I'm beginning to worry that DM thinks YuBet can handle SS. Any of Option C shouldn't cost too much and the upgrade to D would be significant even if the O were to take a hit (save BB and OBP). So updating where we stand less than a week to the deadline...what are you hoping for and what are you expecting? I have fluctuated through this whole thing, but I think I have finally settled on what I want from the next Brewers SS. Hoping for: Brendan Ryan Desmond will cost too much. I am thinking Furcal might too, which is why he hasn't been moved yet especially given DM's penchant for moving early in trade season. Carroll, while I like his stats, is 37 and I hesitate to have a 37 year old starting IF. I would love him as a backup, but not the starter. Jack Wilson doesn't excite me. Ryan wins over Barmes based on age. Looking at his highlight page on MLB.com and it seems like all his highlights are unreal defensive plays. We don't need anything but a .250 AVG with a +.300 OBP from our SS anyways given Braun, Weeks, Fielder and Hart. I want the D upgrade. I am craving some Brendan Ryan. Plus the dude just looks like he will be a fit for this team personality-wise. Stick him at #8 and let him play some slick D. I really REALLY hope we can get Ryan. Expecting: Jamey Carroll It is what it is but I have some serious reservations if he is acquired as the starter.

Sorry guys...The only way I am trading a Gamel, Thornburg or Peralta or package of them is if it is for a David Wright or Ryan Zimmerman at 3B or Hanley Ramirez at SS. In fact, I would be more than comfortable on July 21, 2011 trading that package and almost entirely emptying our farm system for David Wright or Hanley Ramirez. Having three cornerstones on offense with Braun, Weeks and Wright/Ramirez would keep the window open a lot longer and assuming we could sign Greinke and/or Marcum, I would feel real nice about our team for the next 3-4 years.

I would say this is one of the most likely candidates the Brewers trade for. If they do make a deal for an OF, I expect it to be someone of Johnson's ilk. Nyjer will play a majority of the time anyways. An expensive RH ala Marlon Byrd in a platoon doesn't fit IMO. Like I said in the other thread, the Cubs would have to pay a majority of his $6.5MM in 2012 for me to even listen given that Nyjer will play most of the time anyways. I'd welcome Reed because that dude is hustle through and through. I've always admired the way he plays the game.

I'm much more in the corner of trying to acquire Byrd, Reed Johnson or Kosuke Fukudome as a backup OF for the rest of the season than going after Beltran. Byrd is signed through next season though with a $6.5MM contract. Kind of expensive for somone who would likely be your 4th OF even this season. Same thing with Fukudome, who is owed about $7MM for the rest of this season. Cubs would have to eat a lot of cost for me to do it but both players would be very good fits for the Brewers this season given Gomez's injury and Braun's nagging one. I'd prefer Fukudome and if the Cubs would eat $4.5-5MM of his salary and we'd be on the hook for $2-2.5 I think I would do it.

Maybe we can leave Yuni B. in Arizona when we leave?

Uh oh...according to Haudricourt, Brett Carroll will wear #15. Looks like Furcal is going to have to bargain for it when he comes to Milwaukee. And in other news, Ben Sheets just bit his nails to the bone.

I seriously doubt we would re-sign Beltran in your scenario, mainly because the Brewers will need the cash to re-sign Greinke and/or Marcum. I could absolutely see Hart or Braun moving to 1B and us going after an OF, but I don't see us spending the amount of $ necessary to re-sign Beltran (at least $10+MM per year and more likely $13-$15MM) given Greinke and Marcum's impending free agency after 2012.

I'm praying you're wrong. I'd be ok if we made a move at 3B for a platoon type (Ian Stewart) for the rest of 2011 and opening the position for compeitition in 2012. What I am not ok with is Betancourt being the starting SS for the rest of 2011. I would be absolutely dumbfounded if DM believes we are better off at SS with Betancourt than Jamey Carroll, Rafael Furcal, Clint Barmes, Brendan Ryan, Jason Bartlett...etc.

So many reasons this makes no sense to me... 1. Any acquisition of Beltran would likely require us to part with Peralta, Thornburg or Gamel. No thanks for a 2 month rental without arbitration picks 2. He's blocked by Braun and Hart at the corner OF and he's not a CF. I have no interest in dealing Hart for a guy who will leave in 2 months. If we deal Hart it shouldn't be for his 2 month replacement. 3. If DM is deadset on using trade chips like a Thornburg, use them to upgrade a true need position like 3B or SS. If he's going to create a Gamel, Thornburg and Peralta package I'd much rather see David Wright at 3B or Hanley Ramirez at SS (or someone of their talent level) then Carlos Beltran in the OF. He isn't the difference maker that those other two or their equivalents are. A Beltran deal will frustrate me to no end.

I think it will be one or the other. A Brewers-Dodgers trade seems to make too much sense not to happen at this point.Agreed. I prefer Furcal. I'm still very leery of a 37 year old being counted on to be the everyday SS. But I guess the same can be said for a 33 year old injury prone one too.

That should not be enough to keep him around. It's been nearly a month since he's drawn a walk. He shouldn't be kept around due to his veteran presence or his Wisconsin roots either (ask Augie how that worked for him in '82).100% agree. Just living in the reality of the situation and what I believe will happen and not what I think should happen. In the WTP should happen world: 1. Trade for a SS and utility IF. Since we've been on Furcal and Carroll today, I'll go with them. 2. Trade for a change of scenery 3B like Ian Stewart. I love this guy. I know most would cringe at this suggestion but I think he will turn it around and probably could be had very cheap. Great buy low candidate for 3B. 3. DFA Betancourt and Counsell Lineup: Furcal, Morgan, Braun, Fielder, Weeks, Hart, McGehee, Lucroy Bench: Carroll, Stewart, Kottaras, Kotsay, Gomez

Counsell isn't going anywhere in 2011 unless he retires. Brewers won't force him out I don't think. In 2012, maybe. Dude can talk a walk though, 10 in 90 PAs in 2011.

Have to agree with end here. The Dodgers already have Yuniesky Betancourt on their roster. His name is Juan Uribe and he is gettin $21MM from 2011-2013. YUCK! What would a Furcal or Carroll deal likely look like though? I don't believe the Dodger have any young 2B coming up, nor do they have a ready LF to place next to Kemp and Ethier. Jerry Sands looks like he could take over 1B for Loney and Juan Rivera isn't the answer. I wonder if they would take a 2B, OF and a mediocre pitching prospect for Furcal and Carroll?

I think this is great news for the Brewers. Betemit's offensive ouput at 3B wouldn't have offset his subpar defense. Any upgrade at 3B should start with defense and any offense needs only to be better than Casey's IMO.

Last I heard out here in L.A. is that Casey Blake doesn't know when he will be back. His pinched nerve in his neck is lingering. This may be too big of an injury risk to take. Maybe a waiver wire deal in August. If Furcal and/or Carroll are the targets, my ideal would be: 1. Trade for both 2. DFA YuBet The tough call comes down to Counsell/Wilson. Wilson has shown some value thus far, whereas Counsell hasn't shown much but is a fan favorite.

Hit major league pitching. Carroll's .277 career BA, .356 career OBP is much better than what Josh Wilson can produce. Wilson has a career .281 OBP in MLB. That is horrid Right- but he's closer to 40 than 30. I would expect his numbers to be below his career norms. He has no power whatsoever either. Seems like giving up something of value for him as a utility guy (You guys don't seriously want Carroll starting at short, do you?) would be a waste as Wilson is younger, and to this point has outperformed his career stats by a lot. If they are going to get an old guy from the Dodgers, it had better be Furcal. He's better in the field, and there's a decent chance he could recapture something at the plate. RockCo you summed my feelings up perfectly. I love Carroll but not as anything more than a super utility IF. If we're dealing with the Dodgers, Furcal should be THE target. However, I would like to get Furcal AND Carroll with Carroll taking over Craig Counsell's super utility role on the team moving forward.

I merely offered the name as a suggestion. Given that half the season is already gone, he's owed approximately $7mm. No way i take that salary on but id gladly take on $2.5-3 given Brauns injury status. Just so I understand, you wouldn't help an in division rival with a marginal propsect even if it improves our club in a push to make the playoffs? If thats your stance then we just plain disagree.

I think the Cubs should begin rebuilding in earnest. I know they have a lot of bad contracts but the situation isn't hopeless for moving pieces. Dempster is a real good pitcher for a contending team. Pena could be a good 1B for a team like the Pirates or Angels. Byrd or Fukudome would be a nice 3rd or 4th OF bat for those teams losing the Beltran sweepstakes (cough Brewers). I think Ramirez will eventually be moved, maybe in August. Zambrano and Soriano...their deals almost make it impossible but you never know.

Again, Desmond has a .269 OBP this season. His career OBP in over 900 MLB at-bats is .295 Understood. However, he is only 25 and in his 2nd full year in the bigs. In 2011, Desmond's OBP is .269 and Betancourt's OBP is .262. I said the AVG/OBP/OPS would likely be a push in 2011, but gaining the ability to swipe a base and the D at SS would be worth it, assuming it doesn't cost something ridiculous.