2024 - 25 Wisconsin Basketball Thread

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

Game of runs in the first half.

I've been a little nervous about the Badgers being kind of a first half team in B1G play (Minnesota game excepted), so hopefully they back up this performance (minus the 6+ minute scoring drought) in half number 2.

 

[Jim French Stepstool]

I was wrong about the Gilmore/Gary matchup. Nebraska plays two bigs w/Gary so that matchup most likely isn't happening.

Like @Cool Hand Lucroymentioned, a game of runs. Giving up the last five in the half was bothersome. But when the ball moves on the perimeter the shots are there. If the double-teams on Crowl continue, hopefully we see a little better cutting from the weak side, and being stronger with the ball overall.

Nice things on both ends from Winter & Janicki.

[Jim French Stepstool]

8 minutes ago, Cool Hand Lucroy said:

Game of runs in the first half.

 

 

Their willingness to shoot so many threes kinda plays into that, I think. And if Nebraska continues to double the post it'll probably be more of the same. The attempts by Blackwell & Tonje to penetrate are usually being cut off well too. 

Winter w/a couple long balls. One or two more might take away the post double.

[yourout]

The Italian hammer even got some run today. 

We'll be curious if he can develop to at least be a contributor.

[RedStickBrew]

This has been one of the more enjoyable basketball seasons I have witnessed in a while. Really happy for big Steven Crowl, he has been more aggressive on both sides of the ball the last few weeks and makes this a much better team when he’s playing better

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

2 hours ago, RedStickBrew said:

This has been one of the more enjoyable basketball seasons I have witnessed in a while. Really happy for big Steven Crowl, he has been more aggressive on both sides of the ball the last few weeks and makes this a much better team when he’s playing better

Totally.

This team is FUN. And fun without abandoning the things that we've come to expect from Badgers basketball. They're up to top-50 in KenPom defensive efficiency, for example, which, while not vintage, is still very good given a top-10 offense. Not sure we've been this good offensively since the Kaminsky days.

As Jim French said, the threes are a big part of this team's style. And that anyone can shoot them definitely makes this the most modern Badger team I have seen. 

Crowl's limited athleticism is much more offset by having Winter on the floor with him instead of Wahl. And Tonje and Blackwell are better complements than Chuckie on the offensive end. Plus, he's making threes at a higher clip, and doing that from his spot just makes this offense so dangerous.

Maryland has been playing great lately. Wednesday will be a nice test. I like Gard and am impressed by his ability to adapt after basically just being mentored by Bo, so I hope he gets a couple of tourney wins. I think he deserves it, even if I've also been worried about his x's and o's. He's also clearly kept the program relevant and is better than a lot coaches at similar programs, so I'd hate for another early exit to start clouding the judgment of some.

Looking forward to Wednesday!

[Jim French Stepstool]

3 hours ago, RedStickBrew said:

Really happy for big Steven Crowl, he has been more aggressive on both sides of the ball the last few weeks and makes this a much better team when he’s playing better

I really liked how he passed out of the constant double-teams, rather than force the issue. Zero shots from the floor, I believe. When there are other scoring options on the floor that's great, and this seems like the type of team that's willing to defer to others when your shots aren't falling, or the opposition is focusing on you. Seven boards, three assists, a block & only one TO. Despite scoring only one PT I thought he was pretty solid.

[Jim French Stepstool]

1 hour ago, Cool Hand Lucroy said:

Totally.

This team is FUN. And fun without abandoning the things that we've come to expect from Badgers basketball. They're up to top-50 in KenPom defensive efficiency, for example, which, while not vintage, is still very good given a top-10 offense. Not sure we've been this good offensively since the Kaminsky days.

As Jim French said, the threes are a big part of this team's style. And that anyone can shoot them definitely makes this the most modern Badger team I have seen. 

Crowl's limited athleticism is much more offset by having Winter on the floor with him instead of Wahl. And Tonje and Blackwell are better complements than Chuckie on the offensive end. Plus, he's making threes at a higher clip, and doing that from his spot just makes this offense so dangerous.

Maryland has been playing great lately. Wednesday will be a nice test. I like Gard and am impressed by his ability to adapt after basically just being mentored by Bo, so I hope he gets a couple of tourney wins. I think he deserves it, even if I've also been worried about his x's and o's. He's also clearly kept the program relevant and is better than a lot coaches at similar programs, so I'd hate for another early exit to start clouding the judgment of some.

Looking forward to Wednesday!

Yeah, if you're top ten offensively, you don't necessarily need to have a Dick Bennett-level defense to thrive. Gard has talked about trying to get up to top 25 KenPom defensively. I don't know if that will happen, but I think they're trending really well defensively given the increase in offensive pace.

Didn't see their game today, but both Maryland bigs were terrific vs Illinois last week. Huge test for Crowl, Winter, Gilmore, Amos & maybe Ilver.

Totally agree re Gard & his adaptations. On the offensive side, I think hiring (and actually listening to) Kirk Penney has a lot to do with that.

[Jim French Stepstool]

7 hours ago, yourout said:

The Italian hammer even got some run today. 

We'll be curious if he can develop to at least be a contributor.

Both the wife & I trace back to the "old country", so we're pretty interested in seeing what Greppi can do. From the few minutes I've seen of him, he seems to have that Euro-style game----catch, pass, move, sees the floor well. Appears to be strong & physical enough too.🍕🍕🍕.

[Playing Catch]

9 hours ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

Both the wife & I trace back to the "old country", so we're pretty interested in seeing what Greppi can do. From the few minutes I've seen of him, he seems to have that Euro-style game----catch, pass, move, sees the floor well. Appears to be strong & physical enough too.🍕🍕🍕.

I, too, like how Greppi moves. I'm not a scout, but that's always the first thing I pay attention to with a big. Can they run the floor, and are they nimble enough to set good screens, have some moves around the hoop. I was really excited about Gus Yalden for those reasons... alas. That was a huge knee brace Greppi was wearing.

In my humble opinion, the Badgers can play with anyone in the country, 1-4. But it's that 5 spot where the elite teams still give the Badgers a lot of trouble. Michigan gave them fits with Wolf, and particularly Goldin. Illinois with Ivisic. UCLA, in a flukey sort of way gave them trouble with Mara having the game of his life. This isn't to denigrate Crowl or Winter. Since league play started, they've been absolutely terrific. But they are still a bit slight (Winter), or athletically limited (Crowl) to keep up with NBA-like 5s.

This Maryland game Wednesday should be a great test. East coast road environment, pressure defense with athleticism everywhere, and a really impressive combo at the 4 and 5 with Reese and Queen. I'm probably setting myself up, but I'm really excited, and I'm expecting a win because the Badgers have the coaching advantage. But both teams match up with each other. The Badger bench will need to be huge, as they have been all season.

 

[Jim French Stepstool]

8 hours ago, Playing Catch said:

 

This Maryland game Wednesday should be a great test. East coast road environment, pressure defense with athleticism everywhere, and a really impressive combo at the 4 and 5 with Reese and Queen. I'm probably setting myself up, but I'm really excited, and I'm expecting a win because the Badgers have the coaching advantage. But both teams match up with each other. The Badger bench will need to be huge, as they have been all season.

 

Reese & Queen have been very productive. What makes it tough is MD is getting them the ball, and doing it in the right places. Almost all of their work is done down low, and Gillespie has 17 assists in their last two games. Hopefully Blackwell & McGee can make the entries tougher, and it looks like Crowl can mostly anchor down in the paint defensively which is good.

Would be nice to get one of the bigs in foul difficulty. This would be a terrific road win, and perhaps a springboard.

[Oxy]

19 hours ago, Playing Catch said:

I, too, like how Greppi moves. I'm not a scout, but that's always the first thing I pay attention to with a big. Can they run the floor, and are they nimble enough to set good screens, have some moves around the hoop. I was really excited about Gus Yalden for those reasons... alas. That was a huge knee brace Greppi was wearing.

In my humble opinion, the Badgers can play with anyone in the country, 1-4. But it's that 5 spot where the elite teams still give the Badgers a lot of trouble. Michigan gave them fits with Wolf, and particularly Goldin. Illinois with Ivisic. UCLA, in a flukey sort of way gave them trouble with Mara having the game of his life. This isn't to denigrate Crowl or Winter. Since league play started, they've been absolutely terrific. But they are still a bit slight (Winter), or athletically limited (Crowl) to keep up with NBA-like 5s.

This Maryland game Wednesday should be a great test. East coast road environment, pressure defense with athleticism everywhere, and a really impressive combo at the 4 and 5 with Reese and Queen. I'm probably setting myself up, but I'm really excited, and I'm expecting a win because the Badgers have the coaching advantage. But both teams match up with each other. The Badger bench will need to be huge, as they have been all season.

 

100%.  The advantage of super bouncy athletic bigs can be mitigated by Winter and/or Crowl hitting a couple of 3s early in the game.  Draw them away from the basket and open up cutting/driving lanes....or just have Winter and Crowl keep nailing 3s all game (something that Beilein mentioned after the last game...he wished our bigs would hunt the 3 pt shot a little more).

Pretty much 100% of college bigs with those athletic traits are defensive specialists with little skill game and little offensive game outside of receiving the ball under the hoop after their defender helps or getting an offensive rebound and dunking it.  If our guards can stay in front of driving perimeter players then our bigs can stay in proper defensive position and it relegates bigs to being screeners. Then again we've struggled guarding bigs off the pick and roll and they often end up hanging on the rim.

Wednesday is a huge game.  If Maryland plays their best I think we lose unless we hit 20 threes.  Fouls will be HUGE of course....on the road I doubt the whistle benefits UW.

[Playing Catch]

17 hours ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

Would be nice to get one of the bigs in foul difficulty. This would be a terrific road win, and perhaps a springboard.

 

5 hours ago, Oxy said:

Wednesday is a huge game.  If Maryland plays their best I think we lose unless we hit 20 threes.  Fouls will be HUGE of course....on the road I doubt the whistle benefits UW.

I think there's a universe, too, where the post-players matchup is a wash. In this scenario, I would like to see Blackwell and Tonje take another step forward. I would like them to play more like McGee. Under control, but aggressive. Smart. Calm. But strong. Be strong. Being strong with the ball is vital in these games, because you know you're going to get raked if you take one step towards the hoop.

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

11 hours ago, Oxy said:

100%.  The advantage of super bouncy athletic bigs can be mitigated by Winter and/or Crowl hitting a couple of 3s early in the game.  Draw them away from the basket and open up cutting/driving lanes....or just have Winter and Crowl keep nailing 3s all game (something that Beilein mentioned after the last game...he wished our bigs would hunt the 3 pt shot a little more).

Pretty much 100% of college bigs with those athletic traits are defensive specialists with little skill game and little offensive game outside of receiving the ball under the hoop after their defender helps or getting an offensive rebound and dunking it.  If our guards can stay in front of driving perimeter players then our bigs can stay in proper defensive position and it relegates bigs to being screeners. Then again we've struggled guarding bigs off the pick and roll and they often end up hanging on the rim.

Wednesday is a huge game.  If Maryland plays their best I think we lose unless we hit 20 threes.  Fouls will be HUGE of course....on the road I doubt the whistle benefits UW.

I think Maryland is tough and interesting matchup, but it definitely feels like a game of bigs vs. guards. In those spots, I'd usually go with the guards, but that's going to require good games defensively from Crowl and Winter, with the both of them being able to stretch the floor on the offensive side.

I'll be interested to see how we rotate. Does Amos get more minutes, do we go small and try to create dribble penetration, kickouts, and fouls, etc.?

Should be a really fun game.

[Jim French Stepstool]

11 hours ago, Oxy said:

100%.  The advantage of super bouncy athletic bigs can be mitigated by Winter and/or Crowl hitting a couple of 3s early in the game.  Draw them away from the basket and open up cutting/driving lanes....or just have Winter and Crowl keep nailing 3s all game (something that Beilein mentioned after the last game...he wished our bigs would hunt the 3 pt shot a little more).

 

Big if, but IF Crowl &/or Winter can hit a couple from deep early it would certainly benefit the dribble drives. What makes it a big "if" is we usually don't start out that way--the 3PT attempts from the bigs usually have been coming as a result of Tonje, Blackwell or McGee penetrating effectively enough to warrant keeping a big near the lane. then a kickout. I agree somewhat with Beilein in the case of Winter. Crowl is stronger & has recently had a pretty good nose for the ball off the boards. Especially in this game, I'd rather see the 5th-year 7 footer do some successful dirty work.

[Jim French Stepstool]

14 minutes ago, Cool Hand Lucroy said:

I think Maryland is tough and interesting matchup, but it definitely feels like a game of bigs vs. guards. In those spots, I'd usually go with the guards, but that's going to require good games defensively from Crowl and Winter, with the both of them being able to stretch the floor on the offensive side.

I'll be interested to see how we rotate. Does Amos get more minutes, do we go small and try to create dribble penetration, kickouts, and fouls, etc.?

Should be a really fun game.

Looking at Reese & Queen, this feels like a game where we actually COULD play Winter & Crowl together more than we usually do. Reeses' scoring position is always inside the arc, and Queen tries maybe one 3PT per game but has only made a couple all year. I love the strides Amos has made, but he's probably not quite physical enough yet to increase his minutes vs these guys. Barring foul difficulty I think the minutes will be meted out in the usual way.

As well as their bigs are playing, the key might be making things tough on Gillespie, who is on a roll. Make him put up tough shots & disrupt his decision-making. It'll take different people rotating on him to try to wear him down. Janicki could be an X factor there.

[Underachiever]

6 hours ago, Playing Catch said:

 

I think there's a universe, too, where the post-players matchup is a wash. In this scenario, I would like to see Blackwell and Tonje take another step forward. I would like them to play more like McGee. Under control, but aggressive. Smart. Calm. But strong. Be strong. Being strong with the ball is vital in these games, because you know you're going to get raked if you take one step towards the hoop.

The highlighted is what I consider to be the problem with Blackwell. I don't think he is that strong with the ball. It comes from not really being a point guard, but I think asking him to play like McGee is a potential problem.

[Jim French Stepstool]

3 hours ago, Underachiever said:

The highlighted is what I consider to be the problem with Blackwell. I don't think he is that strong with the ball. It comes from not really being a point guard, but I think asking him to play like McGee is a potential problem.

IMO it's a real tribute to the coaching staff that they've been able to acclimate Blackwell to the PG role while still giving him enough freedom & opportunities to average 16PPG or whatever it is.

I agree that you don't really want to do anything to halter his aggressiveness and yes, it'll probably mean a few more TO's than we'd like. It seems like a no-brainer that when they're both in the game McGee would be the primary ballhandler, but that hasn't always happened. Without looking it up, it does seem the TO #s have been a little high lately. Hopefully it's just a blip.

[Playing Catch]

16 hours ago, Underachiever said:

but I think asking him to play like McGee is a potential problem.

Yeah, I guess what I meant is that he plays like a senior, which is probably too much to ask.

I forget, though, that Blackwell played mostly point in high school.

[Underachiever]

1 hour ago, Playing Catch said:

Yeah, I guess what I meant is that he plays like a senior, which is probably too much to ask.

I forget, though, that Blackwell played mostly point in high school.

Right, and Zach Baun played quarterback in high school. I just don't think that Blackwell has the handle that you want a Big 10 PG to have. He's great, probably my favorite player, but it's a shortcoming we have to live with because the rest of his game is so good.

[yourout]

We got a flopper.

[yourout]

Lucky to get to half only down 1 after the turnovers and fouls.

[Jim French Stepstool]

Twenty minutes in, it looks like this is going to be a tough one to get, as I suspected. But I don't feel too terrible about this because we had our hands tied behind our backs through a large chunk of the half w/Blackwell & Tonje on the bench, and there have been many times in the past where there is a TO issue & it gets cleaned up really well in the 2nd half. If that happens & neither of the above two pick up their 3rd quickly, we got a shot. 

MD is doing a great job of stopping the dribble drive. Keep looking for Crowl in the post. And clean up the 2nd & 3rd looks.

[Oxy]

I have more confidence in Frelick hitting 20 homers this year than I do in these refs in the 2nd half.  I don't necessarily this we'll get screwed royally, just that they will be bad.

[Jim French Stepstool]

2 minutes ago, Oxy said:

I have more confidence in Frelick hitting 20 homers this year than I do in these refs in the 2nd half.  I don't necessarily this we'll get screwed royally, just that they will be bad.

It almost looked like they allowed a lot of physical play then decided "whoops" & started blowing the whistle more. We'll see I guess.

Tonje definitely needs to be judicious on the drives.