Fear The Chorizo

it's a sunk cost - only way it's worse is if they actually don't release him and we have to suffer through two more months of Winker actually being put in the lineup in 50% of their games and otherwise wasting a roster spot.

probably not much at all - most of the prep baseball talent that would actually make anything with an NIL deal in college are going to be 1st round bonus babies. Outside of football and basketball, the only other college/h.s. athletes making bank with NIL deals are doing so because of being eye candy or because their dad is among the best basketball players ever.

Agreed - I think the best scenario for the Brewers between now and the deadline is for those two clubs to tread water in the standings by beating each other up. If either of them really gets on a roll and makes up 3-4 games in the standings for the division lead before the deadline, they could turn into last minute buyers. Longterm, both could benefit from selling at the deadline, too - I'd rather see them stand pat or do some sort of confused buy/sell retooling at the deadline that doesn't make them dramatically better now or in the future.

I didn't denigrate Hader at all either, my main point is if the Brewers need to make these type of trades to acquire as much value as possible before key players get too expensive for their budget/leave via free agency, they did really well for themselves by trading Hader in July 2022. And, since it's impossible to prove a point about something that didn't happen (in this case whether or not the Brewers would've made the playoffs by not trading Hader last year, and if that even would have set them up better longterm as an organization than where they are now), I'll just agree to disagree with your overall take that appears to be the Brewers would've been better off by not trading him last July and leave it at that.

If on Opening Day this season we knew that the Brewers would have this lineup for a game in mid-July and we had to guess what their record would be at this stage of the season, I think we'd all be off by about 15-20 wins.

Probably seeing Luis Urias as the team's new primary DH...which frankly I'd be ok with despite knowing there are other better internal options not currently on the 40 man.

Hader blew up in about the same number of games with the Padres as the list you mentioned above...the difference is the Padres had the horses to slug their way into the playoffs and their starting pitching got hot, and the Brewers couldn't hit or pitch consistently enough in innings 1-8 for them to be a viable playoff team. Would you at the very least acknowledge most of the Brewers warts with starting pitching and offense down the stretch had zilch to do with Hader being on or off the roster?

With how Contreras has been hitting and the general absence of consistent hitting beyond him and Yelich right now, I get the move to keep him in today's lineup with Caratini catching Burnes. I don't like it for longterm wear and tear with Contreras as the season wears on, but I have to live with the team I root for opting to carry a primary DH who frequently sits despite facing what should be platoon-friendly RHP so they can keep a right handed hitting catcher in the lineup when Burnes pitches. Now, as to the question why Winker is still on the roster at all, does not compute.

seeing a 175-lb dripping wet 19 year old rope lasers off and over the wall to right field is so fun...Chourio doing that in AA is fairy tale-level stuff.

Hader's 2022 August would've also poured gasoline onto the Brewer's slide (19.06 ERA in 8 games - he was actually held out of action for a bit to get right). He definitely got back to his dominant self last September and thus far this season...but he was in the middle of an extended blow up last year at the worst time. I'd call the trade in retrospect a win-win for both clubs and for Hader, as he's likely set to become a generationally wealthy man next offseason.

It’s been a track meet when he’s behind the plate this season.... It's been a track meet in general across most of the league this season - bigger bases, pickoff throw rules, and a general push towards fielding rosters with more speed have all contributed to more stolen bases. The Brewers stole 96 bases last year...this year they're already at 78 despite a roster full of hitters who can't get on base - do all the catchers they face throw terribly, too?

Ugh...Burnes was average down the stretch last year, Peralta/Ashby were injured/ineffective most of the 2nd half, Lauer sucked, and they weren't close to being good enough offensively to do anything last year in the playoffs. Having Hader around would've done nothing at all to change those things. Would it have kept Lauer and Williams from pouting? Maybe. Let's think about what not trading Hader would have the Brewers looking like right now...for starters they wouldn't be leading this division, and there'd be rumors daily about what the Brewers will get for Hader when they trade him at this year's deadline - "if they're lucky, maybe they could wind up with a quality young catcher, an advanced starting pitcher prospect, and some controllable young bullpen pieces...but that'd be too high an asking price for a 2 month rental." Burnes would probably also be on the block, and that once in a generation starting pitching would be gone at least a full season earlier than it will be now.

Under my logic Rowdy Tellez would be a good 1B when he hits 30 HR in a season and catches the ball when it's thrown to him, including picking balls out of the dirt. I don't consider Miller to be a good 1B because he can't hit like a good one can. I could care less what a guy's range factor is at first when everyone else across the defensive infield can go get it at an elite level for their positions. In my book the Brewers need to find a way to build a more balanced roster that includes a mix of premium defenders and more offense at corner IF/OF positions - not having enough impact offense at the traditional positions teams rely on for scoring runs leads to getting dominated by pitching in the postseason. Owen Miller as their everyday 1B is the exact opposite approach I want them taking, even if it's like putting an extra MIF on the dirt defensively.

Any capable middle infield defender would be near the top of the 1B defensive list if they played there...the Brewers are among the very few teams to sacrifice offense at that position after their primary 1B option both sucked and is injured, though. And not being proficient at scooping is a big problem for 1b defense even if advanced metrics do a poor job of quantifying it - just ask pitchers and infielders making uneven throws whether they enjoy having to get extra outs in an inning or rack up throwing errors.

Pigpen would be proud of that kind of filth... Part of me wonders if Uribe's up auditioning for a club or two as trade bait at the deadline - but a much bigger part of me wants him to remain in Milwaukee for a long, long time.

oops forgot about that one...well, CC is still on the podium, lol

If not for CC's history of giving infinitely long leashes to marginally decent veteran hitters who are struggling before changes actually get made, I'd think there's smoke to this line of thinking. IMO I think CC still has flashbacks to the end of his playing career and is trying to find a player to break his 45 AB hitless streak to get his name out of the record books for that feat.

But i bet he can't throw as hard as EDC or tag as cool as Javy B.!

Or Arnold does what he should do and get Winker out of the organization so CC can't sharpie his name in the lineup anymore.

From that article, that CC quote about not being sure there are enough at bats at DH for Hiura due to Winker being on the roster is downright maddening.

I'll start with the obvious caveat that Cleveland plays in the equally awful AL Central, and despite being 1 game under 0.500 sit just 1.5 games out of 1st place in that division. One would think they could be buyers this deadline - however they've got key pitching injuries that aren't going to be sorted out until after Aug 1, making them a team that will likely either stand pat or look for minor bullpen/hitting upgrades to try and eek out a playoff berth that likely winds up going nowhere in the postseason. That being said, there are the annual trade rumors about Jose Ramirez, the switch-hitting 3B/DH who puts up a mid- to upper-800s OPS in his sleep. He signed a 7 yr extension last year I believe (that also includes a NTC), but the remaining 5 years on that deal aren't awful for a guy who can flat out hit and still play a solid 3rd base before transitioning to an everyday DH as he gets into his mid 30s late in the contract. Don't get me wrong, he'd cost a ton in prospect capital to acquire right now and his contract would take up a sizeable amount of team payroll for the next 5 seasons....but if the Brewers are serious about making a significant roster/offensive upgrade for longer than a rental to dramatically improve the lineup, I'd make sure Cleveland has absolutely zero interest in trading Ramirez - at this deadline or this offseason. It would also take Ramirez waiving the NTC, but he may view Milwaukee as a similar market to Cleveland and prefer playing in those type of environments. What would a trade package from the Brewers need to look like for Cleveland to make this trade right now? Start with Black, Misiorowski, and one of the advanced Brewer outfield prospects/young players (Frelick, Mitchell) and add what more? I know it's likely a pipe dream and it would be an incredibly steep price in terms of prospect capital - but I feel like this is the caliber of player the Brewers need to go after via trade if they want to make a difference in postseason aspirations with the time they have left before Burnes/Woodruff find more lucrative pastures a couple offseasons from now. There's a history between these two teams making splashy deadline deals (or near deadline deals), it's a pipe dream but this is the time of year to dream big!

To be fair, at least this take was from a couple weeks ago - seems like the AS break and taking part in some of those festivities with the futures game may have gotten him going just a smidge. As others have said, his hitting approach at the plate is unicorn-like for a kid in AA. Given his 'meh' 1st half based on the standards he set for himself across 3 minor league levels last year, if Chourio winds up anywhere close to an 0.800 OPS at the end of this season as a teenager his lofty prospect status isn't going anywhere. My gut tells me by year end his OPS will be well above 0.800.

I'm surprised 5 other posters got a word in before this showed up on a Rockies trade rumor thread here. Count me out on a Raptor reunion

This can all be true, but it's not as cut and dry anymore. With the reduced total in minor league teams organizations have under their wing and slight changes to the length of minor league control teams have over signees before they have to add to 40 man rosters, there has been a shift to improved prospect talent playing a full year or more in AAA and it not being mostly a haven for AAAA players. The combination of the lost minor league development seasons due to the COVID year and these rule changes are both improving the overall talent level across AAA. Pitching-wise, I'd still agree that AA has more talented arms organizations are trying to develop into starters, but AAA bullpens tend to resemble what hitters will face in MLB because organizations keep their veteran reliever backup options there. Factors like the league and competition organization's affiliates face, state of a team's farm system overall, etc. currently determine if AA or AAA currently has more MLB-caliber prospects playing in it. I also think there's value for just about every prospect to get some experience at the AAA level to get accustomed to playing in stadiums with at least a bit larger fan attendance and "brighter lights" than alot of high A and AA ballparks that at times resemble regular season college baseball crowds. Specific to Black, I don't think it matters what level he's in provided he's playing everyday defensively to see if he can develop into a viable MLB thirdbaseman - right now AA is perfect for him because of that.

I believe he also recently got HBP in the head, luckily avoiding some serious damage but something of note. K rate for the year right at 24%. Even through his recent scuffling it's not like he's going ofer with 3-4 K's a night. If he's healthy, Hiura should already be in Milwaukee compared to what they have taking those DH at bats currently. Winker sits at 66 wRC+ at present with zero indication he's regained any power potential post- offseason surgery to justify counting on him to return to anything like he was offensively 2021 and earlier. Unfortunately for him as a player, he's washed.