Humans Need Water

Sweet. It only took 5 responses before someone mentioned Villar was safe on that caught stealing and 7 responses before the entire play came to light actually showing his heads up base running. Not surprising is nobody mentioning the bullet he took off his wrist/forearm yesterday that prevented not only a run from scoring but other runners potentially ending up in scoring position with a chance to get right back in the game. Maybe people should worry more about watching a game objectively vs searching for the negatives in player's they don't care for

I have no issue with the Snell signing. He's not preventing the Bucks from moving forward. He fits the scheme well, is one of our better shooters and defenders. While Monroe is great in his 6th man role his 18M is clearly a lot and he doesn't fit what this team wants to do moving forward (nor the NBA game). Add Henson/Mizra (21M between them) and that's 39M right there that needs to come off by 2018 so move those guys somehow. Delly is a contributor. Guys like him and Snell are getting 10-15M EASY in today's league. And Ben McLemore sucks

The Brewers have the talent to hold everyone off. They need to remain pretty healthy though. I can't see adding a rotation arm as doesn't make sense to me but I can see Stearns adding a solid young pen arm to team up with Knebel, Barnes, Hader. Hughes has been great for a while now and Oliver has been very solid too. Bolstering the talent by at least one arm would be great for the team overall.

Brewers weren't spending what Holland wanted so not sure why people still bring him up. Blown Saves alone would give the Brewers a 6 game lead over Pitt, 6.5 over CHI and STL. With 3 months to go it's far from being almost over. Feliz had 1 blown save. Knebel has 3. Feliz had 5 losses and 3 of those games he entered in a tie game (9th inning or later) so we have no idea if we end up winning those games or not in extra innings if he had scoreless innings. He guaranteed cost the Brewers 3 games this year (Knebel has cost us 4 including giving up a run in the 8th against Cincy recently). But he's killing it this year so we'll continue to point the finger in every other direction even though everyone has contributed in losses.

Technically no but also yes. The White Sox don't have any OF, let alone a CF, in the system even remotely close to Brinson. Brinson also has a higher ceiling than their entire starting OF at the MLB level - 2 young guys + Melky. They would absolutely want Brinson back because he fills a huge need for the next 6yrs at a premium defensive position and he's essentially MLB ready. If Brinson isn't in the deal we could still technically get it done but then you're giving up 3 Top 100 + 1 (most likely Hader, Ray, Ortiz/Woodruff). No thanks

You really hate Corey Ray don't you. Hated Clark too and this season his stats back me up vs rookie. Hernan Perez brings a better OF potential than Ray did/does Can't draft enough Pitching and winners were there for the taking. Let's say 50% of 1st round position do anything in ML. And 40% of Pitchers do anything in ML. But at the deadline it costs not only the 50% that does project to do anything in the ML but 2 more pieces of better than 50% to make the ML. It is annoying that we keep taking OFs in 1st round, and not the top rated ones at that over any SP atop the draft board with top 20 picks. Hitting on one of those SPs helps more than the position player. Clark and Ray were absolutely top rated OFs in their draft classes - both rated at the top for their bats too. What percent of Top 20 draft picks, that are starting pitchers, become #1-2 MLB caliber pitchers? What percent of Top 20 draft picks, that are premium up-the-middle position players, become better than average or better starting MLB players? The percentages will favor the position player vs the pitcher. The majority of those SPs drafted are out of HS too. You also say "OF" as if the Brewers are drafting LF or RF in the 1st Rd when in fact they're CF - up the middle premium defensive positions because that provides great value in itself. The Brewers are going to have to trade 3+ of these CF prospects/current MLB players and quality rotational arms can come back. Arms that have already reached the upper levels of the minors or are young in their MLB careers (which takes away a huge chunk of risk compared to drafting them because already seen them have success in the minors). We drafted Woodruff and Burnes but Hader, Ortiz were AA when acquired and Bickford (taken right after Clark) was in A+ and very well could have started at AA this year. And part of the reason we'll bring those arms back is because our prospects play a premium position.....2 of the aforementioned prospects were acquired for Lucroy © and Gomez (CF). Perez having more potential than Ray in the OF is insane and utterly comical. So is trading Ray (Top 40 overall) for JA Happ (35 next year in final season) when the rotation isn't even the area of need. Clark spent less than half a season in A and was injured the entire time basically. He's currently in A+ and 2.5yrs young for level (I think 3rd youngest for level in org) and has a 376 OBP, 737 OPS, 21 SB, 19% BB rate, 114 wRC+ on the season. Since June 1 he's 238/425/794 with 23.7% BB rate, 135 wRC+. Over the past 3wks he's 269/465/946 with 25.4% BB rate, 172 wRC+. I don't pay attention to the first 2-3wks after a prospect returns from injury (Ray) so since May 1 he's 247/339/718, 18 SB, 11.8% BB rate, 101 wRC+. He also plays a very good CF with a solid arm; great speed. The guy has 122 professional games under his belt and you're already calling him a bust and saying he should be traded. Ray just gave an interview on the Future Game and he discusses what he's working on as a hitter - starting with his middle approach earlier in the season and transitioning more recently to letting the ball get deeper in the zone to drive it oppo with authority. Guess what happens when you work on the latter? You tend to K more and make more outs until you figure it out. He even said that the numbers don't reflect his actual progression as a player this year. He's clearly working on things. Simply staring at numbers on the surface believing that story is reality is short-sighted. These guys aren't drafted then thrown out there to play their game applying zero instructional/developmental tools. This is all about putting them in a greater position for success long-term (ie 2016 Nottingham and Phillips), not solely what the "numbers" say. I'm not opposed to trading Ray because of our current MLB OF + 3 AAA prospects ahead of him but people "wanting" him gone I simply don't understand.

"excuses"? Yikes. Hiura turns 21 in less than a month and is currently at the lowest level of professional baseball in the US. Put Ray, Erceg, Diaz, Clark, etc in Maryvale at the age of 21 and they'd be killing it as well. Instead they're playing 3 levels higher (Clark being one month younger than Hiura and Diaz 9 months older). Hiura's playing 2b. That's the only position he's going to play. He's on a throwing program right now to get his arm up to speed and strengthened - one of my buddies said it was a 6 week program but I personally haven't seen or read the time frame because I don't really care. There's no doubt he's also participating in fielding drills. One doesn't need to throw to do that and it makes zero sense that he's not fielding at all given he'll actually be playing the field over his career. As long as his arm is fine I could see Stearns sending him to AZFL to mix in time between 2b and DH. Starting next year, barring any arm setbacks, he's going to fly through the system because his bat is currently the best in the system

What evidence did you see that Phillips was equal to or better of a prospect than Brinson

Cooper's road numbers are 288/340/815 (8 doubles, 6HR vs 15/9 at home). I think Cooper can be an equal or better overall hitter than Aguilar just clearly doesn't have his power and that comes in handy. If the Brewers think Cooper can step up and replace Aguilar I can see Stearns trading Aguilar by the deadline. If Cooper struggles though that could hurt the team as Aguilar has stepped up big spelling Thames over the past couple months. I could easily see something like this happening or trading 1-2 prospects. But I think a lefty reliever should be added.

When you are a bench bat and only manage 2 hits in an entire month...bye. You can't afford to have such slumps. Successful bench players avoid such slumps. Bandy did not and now he deserves to go. By "entire month" you mean 10 games (38 AB)? Because that's what it was. And his final 8 games in May heading into June he was hitting 259/375/782. Applying the same simplistic measures you are then Perez should have been cut after his first 15 games on the season when he was hitting 179 - had 7 hits and 3 came in one game (other 14 games he was hitting 114 with 1 XBH). Aguilar had a 1-29 stretch early as well. And they're "backups" too like Bandy. In an ideal world Bandy should have been starting this year in AAA as he needed more time there to work on some things after last year. But we didn't have that luxury with Susac on the shelf 10 days into ST nor another MLB catcher on the roster. He way overplayed his skill set in April, played to that of a backup (what he is) in May and way underplayed his skill set in his 10 starts in June. If Vogt didn't become available then Bandy would still be on the team. They preferred him to Bandy because he's a veteran and lefty who's had success at the MLB level very recently. The veteran presence behind the plate will help down the stretch. He's also coming from a bottom tier hitting park into one of the better park's overall as well as a top park for lefty power hitters (which is why nobody should be shocked about Shaw's HR numbers as he went from one of the worst lefty power parks to one of the best). Vogt makes sense from those perspectives and nothing else as he's no longer starter caliber. I personally don't care who the backup catcher is as I watched Maldy be garbage for way too many years in that role; they can rotate between several guys for all I care just as long as Pineapple gets plenty of PT. I still think Susac becomes a player for the MLB team potentially by year's end otherwise starting next spring and he's got some heat on this thread for being "atrocious" in AAA. Past 2 months - 227/313/797, 99 wRC+, 11.6% BB, 31.3% K Past 1 month - 239/346/823, 109 wRC+, 14.8% BB, 24.7% K Past 2.5wks - 279/389/970, 142 wRC+, 16.7% BB, 18.5% K

When you're including Peralta in the rotation on July 3 you know your argument doesn't hold water. They need to part with him as soon as he's off the DL as Suter or Blazek could easily take his spot. Guerra has had back to back rough outings so we should negate everything prior and become reactionary as a strategy? Davies last 13 starts he has a 4.08 ERA (would be 3.46 over 12 starts if remove that 7 run outing a few games back) - 3 shutouts, 4 starts with 2ER, 2 starts with 3ER (should be 3 as last start shouldn't have given up 4ER, should have been 2-3 if not for defensive misplays that don't show as errors). Garza will most likely be gone in 3-4wks and Woodruff is available to take his spot. Then you have Hader still next year followed by Burnes and Ortiz shortly thereafter. All these guys have higher ceilings than anyone currently in the rotation. I get wanting to help stabilize but more people need to think about external vs internal (Woodruff). He's ready to go. He's young, cheap (financially and doesn't cost prospects), throws several pitches for strikes, pounds the zone leading with his mid-90s fastball. Based on his makeup, the moment doesn't ever seem too big for him.

His adjustment from starting out almost in the stride compared to squaring up the batter now has made a tremendous impact on his game. His bulldog approach/mentality has always been awesome but this minor change he made has allowed for an increase in velocity and everything else to just fall in place more consistently. I still don't see him up in the rotation until late 2018 at the very earliest but probably 2019 (that's assuming everyone across the board is healthy and not having an imploding season).

Clark is also very, very young for level and was injured last year. While his K rate is high, partially because of his age, he's still a contact bat. I'd be curious to see how many of his walks are due to poor pitching control vs working the count/fouling pitches off earning that walk.

UGH facts are the worst, aren't they? I like Lucroy but he's a FA next year and will be 32. We have Pina, Vogt, Susac, Bandy between MLB/AAA and control them for 2-4yrs still. I don't see where the issue is for us at this position. Nottingham's work and effort is paying off big time and he could be in AAA next year too. I've always been a Susac guy and after the injury then migraine issues he seems to be getting back on track (hitting 364 last 11 games through tonight so far with 9bb, 8k, 5 doubles, 3HR). Don't count him out moving forward.

So you'd leave your hottest hitter in the 8th spot? Even if you take his entire season's work as the baseline, he belongs near the top, not the bottom. Yes. I'd absolutely leave him at the bottom. He's 22yrs old. It's his first full season. He should be at the bottom the entire year to get him acclimated and comfortable - it's a spot where there's little pressure and it allows him to work on things as there will be adjustments made throughout the entire year. Arcia's been leading the league in hitting since May 18 and since then Sogard has a 417 OBP, Thames 310, Shaw 389, Santana 375, Aguilar 361, Perez 264. Braun has been back 7 games now and he's the best hitter on the team. It's not like the top has been struggling to get on base since Arcia started killing it. He also helps out pushing the order forward with the pitcher behind him.

Arcia absolutely should not have made it. In addition to the huge RBI difference Shaw is also hitting like 25-30pts higher than Bryant but is 35 or so behind him in OBP. OPS is almost identical. I believe Shaw has more doubles and HR too. And he's on a 1st place team. It's a joke Shaw is not in the final 5 as Bryant shouldn't be there. Molina on the team is complete garbage too. Maybe he handed pencils that stuck to the punch hole next to his name. Hopefully Knebel gets an early inning so I don't have to wait around 4hrs until he enters

A lefty that throws 95 is equivalent to a righty that throws 100. Look how dominating Hader is a 94. Quintana had a 1.78 ERA in June. He got off to a slow start this year which was in part attributed to all the trade talk surrounding him. He's been remarkably consistent his entire career and is one of the best LH pitchers in the game over the past 5 seasons. Guaranteed Rate Park is a launching pad. Compares to Miller Park as a hitter's park. Quintana's got excellent stuff by the way. His career K rate is a solid 7.5 per 9 and this year it's 8.9 per 9. Over his career, Quintana has been the victim of poor run support. But he's touched 200 innings for 4 straight years and he's on pace to get close to that this year. I'd do Ray and Derby in a heartbeat. Not sure that would get it done but Ray and Woodruff might and I'd do that too. Brewers have a boatload of OF. Coulter and Cordell offer would get laughed at. Only guys I'd consider untouchable are Brinson, Ortiz and Burnes. Quintana would make this team a threat not just to get to playoffs in 2017 and 2018 but he'd give them a shot at advancing teaming with Nelson and hopefully a healthy Anderson in the playoffs. As Mark Sweeney said during yesterday's game. Rebuild is one thing but they need to "honor the guys on this roster that put them in this position." Adding a quality arm like Quintana, says to this team, "We believe in you guys". Surrendering 2 of your better prospects and possibly a 3rd marginal one is a cheap price for a guy who's a 21.5 WAR player over his first 6 seasons. Worst case is they don't contend in 2018 and you deal Quintana a year from and likely get 50% of what you paid to get him back. Everyone on the planet would do Ray/Derby except the team that's getting them. Brinson is a must + 1 of Hader/Ortiz/Woodruff + 1-2 more depending on certain factors (one being who is part of the 2nd group listed). They want something close to their Sale return for a pitcher that definitely isn't as good as Sale. I could care less what Mark Sweeney says. I can make the argument that Stearns sitting on his hands doing nothing says to the team you've been in 1st place through 4 months and we believe you can continue to stay there the rest of the way. Instead of adding Quintana and losing several top tier prospects the Brewers could always trade Garza (he's the most logical for several reasons) and insert Woodruff. I don't know what other people see in Woodruff but I see a guy who has the talent to absolutely mirror Quintana's career averages except with a lower Whip, H9 and higher K9.

Am I reading this right - you're saying we should start trading the aforementioned prospects while they're still highly ranked/valued because that's not going to be the case moving forward in the short-and-long term? No. Just baffled by the idea that Ray is a mediocre prospect and a draft bust because he isn't currently OPS'ing .800+. If Ray isn't much of a prospect because of his current .251/.327/.389/.716 slash line, then the Brewers don't really have many legitimate hitting prospects in their system. lol that's what I thought you meant but didn't want to assume. And I 100% agree with you. It's that same mentality from the overwhelming majority who completely disregarded Nottingham's talent and ability solely based on one season's production (aka numbers on the surface) and the past 9wks he's been nothing short of excellent offensively (just happens to be 2-6, double, 4rbi thus far today) and has been a complete 180 defensively all season.

Am I reading this right - you're saying we should start trading the aforementioned prospects while they're still highly ranked/valued because that's not going to be the case moving forward in the short-and-long term?

Braun signed 8/45 a month into his 2nd season. But he was an advanced college player whose calling card was his bat. Arcia is the opposite. He'll cool from his excellent 6-7wk stretch here but I'd wait to see where he is during the 2019 season - evaluate the development of his pitch recognition, approach, patience, contact, driving the ball, etc etc. He would still be controlled another 3 full seasons at that point so can easily add on to take him to 29-30yrs old. He's not polished enough offensively to give the extension now as he's not a Seager or Correa type.

A good friend of mine used to contribute to FanGraphs and is still close with Cameron and others. I asked him his thoughts on WAR since people tend to use it A LOT instead of digging into the nitty gritty details (i.e. lot of other metrics combined that tell a much better story) while watching players on tv or live. He said he loved WAR when it first came out. But between now and then there have been so many advancements within analaytics that he doesn't pay much attention to it anymore. He'll still look it at but it doesn't carry anywhere near the weight it used to, in his mind. His most interesting comment was "anyone who solely uses WAR is both lazy and stupid". He also said analytics can only take you so far, which I absolutely agree with. If people don't understand what they're watching (the complexity of the game within the game - understanding all aspects of hitting, pitching, defense, strategy, etc and how small details within each of these spaces can have a huge impact) then you're going to see those people rely heavily on analytics to tell them what to think instead of merely using it as one tool to help paint a complete picture. It's why the overwhelming majority think Nottingham is a bust after last year...why they thought Santana wasn't going to be what he is (and he will absolutely get better from what he is today)...why they thought Shaw was a platoon or average player at best...why they think Braun has always been a below average OF when over the past 10yrs they've watched him play an absurd amount of games where he rarely takes a bad angle, has solid speed with a strong and accurate arm. But people believe analytics over all else because they don't know what they're looking at and we now live in a society that prefers not to put in the time/effort to learn about the game because it's easier going to a website and seeing one metric then believing it.

Cravy is garbage and he wasn't right. He's a filler and nothing more so the fact you care this deeply about him is astonishing. Milone/Marinez/Feliz are all in MLB still and for good reason. Where's Cravy sitting with his unimpressive stuff? How's that 1.5 whip and 5 ERA working for him? But yeah, he was right. You want grown men that cry and throw a fit when they don't get something they "deserve"? Yikes. I'm on board with that if they're allowed to be treated like children as well....because that's what children do. Showing "spine" isn't trash talking your boss. It's not difficult to express disappointment in a decision without acting like an entitled baby - one can still be upset and mad about the position they're in.

Did Counsell or the Brewers state that Villar was supposed to be given the start the following night but that changed as a result of his actions during the DP?

Sports talk radio is the absolute worst. Not just the callers but the hosts and their guests as well. To the point that one doesn't need to know jack about sports to understand this solely based on how they communicate. None of them are sharp individuals

Pretty much a spitting image of Jason Rogers. Maybe you could get a similar deal. Aguilar is a much better hitter than Rogers. Mechanically, approach wise, performance, etc across the board he's better. No idea what the market is for someone like Aguilar but he can be a contributor whereas Rogers most likely never will be.