BrewerFan

I've said most of this year it looks like Burnes in 2019. Everything is there, he's got all the stuff, he's just not attacking and then gets behind, has to throw a strike and throws is right over the middle.

There isn't one. Dallas and teams like the Giants, 49ers... I mean, we all know which cities, but they'd dominate the game and the NFL would probably be worse. Just think if a team could sign every player they wanted. The Rams... who certainly look scary enough, they'd probably be spending 300-400M more than the Brewers(if not more) and guys like Myles Garrett, they wouldn't sign extensions or restructure so often because if they hit FA without the danger of the franchise tag. I'm just thinking, but a OL with Tristan Wirfs and then Trent Williams, Creed Humphrey and I don't care enough to keep going and listing two OGs, but basically the 90s Cowboys.

This is still.... AWFUL. You just can't trade these types of players UNLESS you're getting a Yordan Alvarez for 3 playoff runs back. That's the type of trade you include him in. And seconds before I even heard about this trade, I said it on another thread, the ONE type of prospect I'm not trading... is a talented young player with a massive upside. That's what Frias is. I'm also just qualifying the "trade him for that" package for all the "but we have 2 OFers." We have Chourio and Lara is going to be paid like a very good 4th OFer, so... I'm thinking if he came in next year and took the step that was expected of him RIGHT as he's turning 19... the Brewers probably could have found a spot for him. But hey, we're trying to not bel like the Dodgers. We didn't think it was fair we got all the young LA phenoms. Chourio, Made, Pena, how many do we really need... I mean, all of them? It's a bit much. So we thought... expiring pitcher. In the division... to the team that REALLY broke our hearts all those years.

Ok, Logan Henderson and Coleman Crow. I'd take River Ryan over Henderson.

Ya know... it'll PROBABLY be nothing. Just like John Smoltz for Doyle Alexander was PROBABLY going to be nothing. Just like Fernando Tatis Jr for James Shields was PROBABLY going to be nothing. Yordan Alvarez for JoshFields Ryne Sandberg Pete Crow-Armstrong ... this is the type of trade that'd transfer that "devil magic."

It absolutely connects. There's nobody who genuinely believes it doesn't connect. There's not a person on here today who knows a thing about the Brewers prospect who would have said, "Ragsdale and that 18-year-old with the 117 exit velo's who's 6'2 and still filling out and on a similar trajectory as Chourio, give STL THOSE two players(or ALL players) for a nice solid starter and an injured reliever. Not a person would have been doing the 'well maybe team A valued Johnny at this level but Team B Valued him a this level so I guess we can't be sure.' It's annoying we made this trade. It was out of character and it was obviously the Brewers panicking... it's SOOO much more annoying to see the intellectual dishonesty and see how dumb people can play about this. Finally, I'm not sure what the hell "I promise you, MOST big-league GMs are very fluent in uncertainty and very aware that the error bars around prospect evaluations are massive." You're promising ME that "Most" GMs(big league ones) are fluent in uncertainty. Do you know which ones are NOT fluent? Also, since this an appeal to an authority, but mostly in a "well if they did it, then they know," type of appeal to authority, do you care to share with me what unique insight you have into the mindset of GMs and can you also tell me which are NOT fluent in uncertainty.

Louis... c'mon. Are you seriously not only using one stat like complete games to put pitchers in one group and then saying if you're complaining about the cost... well, we could have just not done anything and then people would also be complaining. So you think it was either do nothing OR we HAD to give up Frias for a rental and an injured reliever?

It's the only way I can think of Matt Arnold right now...

You just asked a rhetorical question and then answered it...

Ok, so if the Brewers do it, it's right because... they're the Brewers and they're on the inside and know these players. That's... that's the argument here? Also, please do explain how it's "high and mighty" with the "value based thinking," because you think you gave up a premium prospect, an 18-year-old in full season ball for a rental and an injured reliever? Of courser that line of thinking is dumb though. It's just objectively dumb. If YOUR argument is they traded Ragsdale or Frias because... welp, they already paid Lara 31M so.... it doesn't matter what you trade Frias for! This type of thinking would have applied to Jackson Chourio when we had Frlick, Black, Wiemer and Mitchell all in the top 100 and a young prospect in Jackson Chourio who you could have traded for any marginal improvement because it's "high and mighty" to try and get VALUE for a prospect and it's "dumb" to trade prospects for pennies on the dollar... and to a division rival because you have other players at that position in the big leagues. Of course the fact that you have other players at the position has nothing to do with with it, the fact that you traded him for pennies on the dollar is the more relevant issue here. The Cubs got Gausman for two prospects, neither were even CLOSE to Frias and we added Ragsdale. But that doesn't matter because... talking about value, again... "high and mighty." Can you explain how? Now, how high and mighty am I being where I say "I didn't want to trade Made for Skubal?" Is that the highest and mightiest?

And the 18-year-old in Wilson was a part of that?

See Gausman, Kevin. Or... ya know, MOST of the pitchers traded. That's how.

Top 100 on Baseball America, but care to explain what an "armchair evaluator" is? That's generally where scouts watch tape OR players play. From... an armchair.

There were dozens of examples I wanted to use... but the worst part of this is how we found yet ANOTHER gem and he was performing exceptionally well for 18... And if you trade him in the offseason or when you're NOT rushed, you probably get fair market value. If you keep him 2-3 years, who knows, maybe HE becomes your 3rd OF... given the big cannon he has for an arm and talent he has. Also, YES, this Front Office is GREAT. My wife's also beautiful. If she's got stomach poisoning and craps down her leg, I'm not going to pretend she didn't because she's been great in the past and is otherwise great. I'm going to say..."that's disgusting... why would you do that(if you could help it) and I REALLY wish you would not have hit that cashmere rug." I don't have a Cashmere rug, but I want to articulate the scope of his bad they shat themselves here.

Ok, I hate this trade as much as the Trojan's hated Helen after she told the Prince to accept that gift horse and not look in it's mouth(that's just basic history)... BUT... May is not a below average starter. He's an extremely talented started who... I would VAGUELY understand if he were under team control, but he's not below average. It's either a Gm2 or Gm3 starter.

Great. You made a TOTALLY different argument than I made. Frias is not on Baseball America's top 100, EASILY the best and more comprehensive list... because he's "the shiny new thing." It's because at 17/18, the 6'2 left hander was putting up exit Velo's in the 115+ range. And I don't care that he's further away. Dusin May is NOT further away from Free Agency. I'd have MUCH rather given up... Tyler Black. So proximity has nothing to do with it, though... you're making both arguments here. 1-There are guys on top 100 lists who shouldn't have been. ok... why shouldn't they have been? Because they end up being a bust? Or because they were NEVER deserving? If you want to say the prior, no kidding. If you want to say the later, I don't agree(particularly with BA). 2-The bottom line, THEY GROSSLY overpaid. It's just that simple.

Can we PLEEASE stop saying this. Why not trade Made and Pena using this logic? We have SS locked up? 2nd-Luis Lara's 8 year 31M deal does NOT mean that if we develop another Jackson Chourio, but a slightly bigger version and left handed... and already showing massive power in Low A at 18,,,, it doesn't matter if we trade him way in a MASSIVE overpay. And no, the Brewers are NOT "damned if they do, damned if they don't." They're damned... if they do some STOOPID ****. You can trade away good prospects. You PROBABLY should try and trade them when their value is HIGHER(like Ragsdale, so fine with that one)... and not the guys who have freakish ability and are already top 100 prospects at 18. Who do have that fits that description? 1-Chourio 2-Made 3-Pena 4-Frias...er... that's right, the Cards have him... because they took a salary dump in Dustin May this off-season and turned it into two guys with good upside, one guy with MASSIVE upside. This is not a reasonable trade, this is a moronic trade. But hey, lets trade Braylon Payne and Josh Adamczewski next year for rentals because "2 of the 3 OF positions are already locked into long term deals with Chourio and Lara. You guys also do realize we have BACKUPS in the OF and... ya know, FUTURE trades to consider, right?

You don't trade guys like Frias unless they're being valued as BLUE chip prospects. You have enough other guys with a lot of upside... there's absolutely ZERO reason to do this trade. Jordan Walker and O'Brien should be coming back for this joke of a deal.

This trade seems like something the Padres ACTUALLY DID.... except THEY traded James Shields and they got back the young 18-year-old dynamic prospect. I like May. He could play a big role. But... you could have just gotten Soriano if you were going to do this.

No, Baseball America is not in the habit of ranking an 18-year-old in the top 100 because he's the "shiny new toy." Braylon Payne would have been a top 100 prospect if they were looking for the "shiny new toy." They ranked him in the top 100, which is pretty rare for them for an 18-year-old kid... because he's huge tools. And if he has a ways to go to be considered a prospect, why'd the Cards even want him? Why trade for a couple of non-prospects? Also, Frias is hitting .367/.438/.582 in his last 10 games, so... he seems just fine to me. Of course, just keeping your head about water at his age is pretty impressive, but he's done more than that. This is antithetical to what the Brewers do... and I REALLY hope this doesn't come back to bite them in the ass the way the James Shield trade bit the White Sox....

This is the worst trade I've seen the Brewers make since... I mean, I HONESTLY cannot remember. I hated Mitch Hanniger for Parra, but my GOD does that look pale in comparison(I also like Logan Schafer more, but nothing like this).

That does nothing for me though. There's a LOT of prospect the Brewers won't be able to make use of... but you don't give up THIS type of prospect capital for THESE players...

Yeah, he is. He's our 3rd best starting pitcher now. But this upgrade is NOT Frias, Ragsdale type good. What the hell are we doing! The ONE..."rule" I have with these trades, don't EVER give up teenagers who've shown some upside. Frias may end up a bust... OR he may end up Fernando Tatis Jr. I'd honestly rather we gave up Adamczewski. This is jsut sooo much. It feels like it HAS to be one or the other.

Uh... WHAT?!? .... no. That's... absolutely insane. Frias was a top 100 prospect(per BA) and Ragsdale was a 70 speed guy who was hitting .300/.430 with a 1.100+ OPS AND he had 12 HRs and 31 SBs is in AA. That's... a JOKE. This cannot be the whole deal. This is absolutely insane.

WHAT!!!! Oh NO!!!! I'll ONLY be happy with getting a guy with a 3.14 FIP and a very good SU man if the Brewers gave up a TON to get him! Hell, forget Knoth, give them Pena, Payne, Fischer... and then a PTBNL in case they want one of the players we drafted. Hell, throw in BOTH Ebels! That'll mean it's a better trade! No offense, but I don't get how people complain we haven't made a move(before the deadline ends) and then we add a REALLY good starting pitcher... one who's had health issues and is now back throwing upper 90s and has elite stuff. He's a great fit and his BIGGEST addition may be pushing Sproat to the long role out of the pen. Sproat has great stuff, but he's not refined enough yet to be a starter. But this is a good reliever, a igh leverage reliever and a good starter.... And you absolutely seem like a troll.