My point was that you can talk about the manager "inspiring guys" and "guys wanting to play for him", all you want. However, if the pitching rotation flat out sucks (worst in the NL last year, near the bottom again this season), there really isn't too darn much any manager can do with that. You have an "ace" who is more like a strong #2 and a bunch of guys who are, at best, #4/5 types. Not really anything a Bobby Valentine can do with that. As for RobDeer45's comments, I don't buy that Melvin's done a great job with his budget. Yes, he's been good at picking up some diamonds in the rough (Loe, Kapler, McGehee, etc). However, he has been horribly inefficient with his budget, especially in terms of pitching. Look at all the dead money tied up in Suppan and Bill Hall. Look at all the money tied up in the signings this off-season that haven't panned out at all. We're not a low payroll team. This is a mid-market team, and at some point I would think Attnasio would question how his budget is being spent for such a low return in terms of wins.