BrewerFan

Cortes was traded JUST before the deadline. He doesn't have to be happy, he's under contract and making an issue of it is only going to make him look bad at this point. Plus, we would have used him to start. But I don't care about trading Cortes. That's beside the point. Ok... still not my issue. And his elbow only needs to hold up the rest of this year, but that's still not the point. They took on all the risk that he'd get injured again anyway by paying his salary... but that you prefer Patrick over Cortes, I don't know how that pertains to anything I've said. I started off disagreeing that Quintana was "immaterial," because of the depth we have at SS. Is Ebel "immaterial?" I mean... of course not. That'd be a silly argument to make. I am forgetting a lot of that because there's a lot of revisionist history here. I don't remember anyone clamoring for another OFer(one that hasn't even played much CF). Perkins had been back for about 2 weeks by then and he'd been well on his way in AAA. He's been running just fine. Collins planned paternity? No, I don't buy that as particularly good reason. ....right. Yeah, no, I understand that. I never said he wasn't "expendable." I did say he wasn't "Immaterial," because of the depth we have at SS. Well... by that logic, you would have gone out and gotten Suarez as and given up Henderson or whomever they needed, right? The whole "tool large a hole in his bat to ever get to the bigs..." is nonsense. Again, 18 years old. He'll be 18 when next season starts, but you've deemed his swing irreparably damaged? C'mon... This doesn't seem to be getting through, but it's also trading him when he has...no value. I'm also curious how you can state Preller was "enamored" with Quintana and then talk about how he's "at best" a utility man 4 years from now. How many Shortstops do they need to find before you start to realize... if they're "enamored" with someone, you should probably hold onto him? They've traded away several elite Shortstops under Preller, they have more than a couple on their roster who could be or did play Shortstops and moved so they could get called up earlier like Merrill or due to injury with Tatis Jr. This started because you said "Quintana was immaterial because of MLB best SS depth." That's what I disagreed with. I can hold two thoughts at once. 1-The Brewers front office is... incredible. One of the best at player development in the game. The Padres are pretty damn good as well, they just keep trading their young studs, but... setting that aside. 2-I can ALSO disagree with a transaction... such as not protecting Shane Smith, trading Reece Olson. I've also been wrong about trades.

Yeah, I'm not down on how last year ended, I'm just... not sure they are as physical as Detroit and Philly, maybe throw SF in there. Plus, I've not been sure how they were going to make up for the lack of depth at CB, how they were going fill the hole left by Slaton when they already got pushed around. That and it's kinda hard to see how this team will mesh as they haven't played together but I do see studs all over the field. Safety they have an elite duo. Their LBers I think will be better... namely because of Cooper, but I'm hoping Walker can step up. On offense, I just haven't seen Banks and the OL(I keep wanting to say Brooks there). How that meshes. I'm not even sure what the starting OL is. I like the RBs. I really wish Lloyd was healthy as I think he adds an element you don't have. Same with the pass catchers. I love Kraft, Reed, Golden looks great. Wicks just needs to catch the ball and I'm confident he's going to be a big part of this offense. Musgrave has been...mocked a bit on here, but I'm high on him, just needs to stay on the field. I usually have a much better feeling about the team at this point of the year, but I just don't know what to expect. The definitely have a lot of talent. A lot of guys we haven't seen. What's the OL to start the year? They go with Walker/Banks/Jenkins/Morgan/Tom? Yeah, the Offense I'm not worried about aside from maybe looking shaky early. It's about just how explosive can they be. Can they keep some of those guys healthy, can they eventually get Watson back... can Love take that next step? I still think he CAN be an MVP caliber QB. So I guess most of my questions are defense related... but I like Hafley and it wouldnt' surprise me to see the Packers season kinda mimick the Brewers with a slower start and then picking up steam. I like your scenario the best. Just come out and put it on Detroit and go wire to wire!

I guess it's really not all that important what he did his first two years(even setting aside he was playing NT in a 3-4), but if you want to go by PFF, he graded out well his 2nd year(almost identical to his 3rd year). Of course by PFF he graded out poorly last year whereas Next Gen had him graded out much higher. I'm JUST looking for a guy who doesn't get out of his lane and can eat up a couple blockers. Close up that lane, create congestion and let the pursuit come. I thought he did that well early and then he he broke out vs the Giants in 2022. That's when he just dominated that OL... as well as the Eagles. But again, that was as a NT and in a different role. But since my point is... I think given the cost to sign him, it would have been worth bringing him back, the last two years are more relevant. I like Wooden and Brooks just fine. Brooks especially, but they're both pass rushers and far more 3 techniques than 1 technique's like Slaton...and I would guess Clark would play much more as a 1Tech with Wyatt as the 3, but the back injury is a concern. I don't like Brinson there. So Stackhouse is going to have to step up.

That's a fun little exercise, but it's not at all something I'm going to put much weight in. That the LA Scouting thought he was worth 1.7M 2 years ago, that he's an 18 year old Switch Hitting SS who's 6'2 with a projectable frame and who just turned 18 during this season, THAT'S my reason. January of 2024, he was the highest rated LA player we'd EVER signed aside from Lara back in '14. Trade Deadline 2025, we move him+Nestor Cortes+money for... Brandon Lockridge? I can't buy the argument that Lockridge was worth a free #5 pitcher and that lottery ticket. I'm pretty certain Lockridge wouldn't have gotten a vote in the Brewerfanatic July Prospect voting either, but he is a 28 year old OFer who's #1 skill is his speed(and it's not even close to his other tools). Feranando Tatis Jr wasn't a top 30 prospect when the White Sox traded him. Peralta wasn't a top 30 prospect when he was traded. I'm also not saying he's going to be Tatis Jr, but I am saying... I'm not trading a kid that young who had the tools he did for such a little return. I put that argument in the same pile I put the 'Quintana was useless because we had Pratt, Made and then...Pena I guess could be a SS.' It's the type of trade you PROBABLY won't care about in 2-3-4 years, but it's not like you got any value for him now anyway. So I'd rather see you keep that player...especially as it's not like he's blocking anyone in LowA next year, and see if the tools you JUST thought was worth 1.7M develop.

Has he played Guard in the NFL? I thought this was more tackle depth(particularly RT since Tom can...move anywhere if necessary). 6th rd pick in two years. Hard to complain about that. Plus he's...related to Dolly! Somehow... not exactly sure how, but his Aunt is her cousin... that's something! I still don't know what this OL will look like. I really wish they played a half in the 2nd pre-season game as they generally are not super cohesive as a unit early in the year, but it's hard to argue with LaFleur. I wonder if they make this move if not for Glover and Monk's injuries. I think they'll designate Monk to return. Monk and Lloyd? I hope I'm not missing someone. I'd LOVE to see Lloyd healthy. Adds another element. I think he and Musgrave need to be able to stay on the field and contribute this year. If they can AND they get Watson back week ...I don't know, 10-12(that's optimistic, but not as optimistic as he and his Dad have been) with all these other weapons? There seems to be less enthusiasm and talk about the Packers than in a while. I guess some of that could attributed to the Milwaukee Ueckers, but so many injuries keeping so many of the young guys out and seeing a LOT of young guys who won't make the roster hopefully makes this pre-season a dull one, but pays off in the regular season. I think the most exciting stories to me have been Melton at CB and maybe this is boring, but just the REALLY good, steady play of guys like Gary, Valentine, Morgan... guys who are so important to this team.

I think every Defense needs that big DT to play the run on early downs to really be able to stop the run. He went to a very similar defense as we have in Cincy. Brooks and Wyatt are just... not physical enough. I think it's more likely we see Clark as the 1 Tech and less on 3rd downs this year if Stackhouse can't hold up. I also just have a different opinion of him his first couple years. I thought he was always stout when he needed to hold the point. Getting him moving latterly vs some ZBS and... maybe he could get washed out, but we were pretty good when teams ran right at him. I'm confident in Hafley... but his scheme is going to have to do a lot of heavy lifting to make up for some inadequacies in personnel this year.

Slaton was one of the biggest bargain signings of the year for the Bengals. Perhaps he wanted to move on, but he was among the best run stuffing DTs in the league last year. The Packers obviously didn't... value that or felt they could replace that with their scheme(which is obviously pretty vanilla yet)... but for 2/14 and 5M GTD that was a player I'd have liked to see them retain.

I don't know about the original point. You can call the field what you want. I think most people still prefer Miller Park. I think calling it Uecker Field is... going to be a little odd and unlikely to catch on as... it was never called Uecker Field. But I do KINDA take issue with this statement. Yeah, Uecker was the most well known and one of the most revered Men in Baseball history. He's not the guy who went and pulled the franchise from Seattle and then fought to keep it here. He's... loved. That what is important. I don't think you need to parse out who is more important or the "backbone" between he and Selig as I'd argue as important as Uecker was, there's no Bob Uecker in Milwaukee without Selig, no Yount and I Bernie is a mascot. He passes retires, we don't notice. Being loved and remembered as Uecker will is...enough, no? Grand Gestures are nice, but... it's how people remember you that is important. Uecker field or AmFam or Miller Park, we all will remember Uecker and he'll always be loved in Wisconsin as... perhaps the biggest personality to come out of the state and Mr. Baseball.

No. That's silly. Ebel isn't "immaterial" because we've got a loaded system ahead of him. I don't see how you could say the same about Quintana? You can't have too much talent in your farm system(at the most important positions). Having Pratt and Made doesn't make Quintana immaterial. Lockridge looks fine. It made no sense to trade away a kid who turned 18 two months ago because you have good players ahead of him. You certainly didn't trade him for much value. You traded him for a guy who's likely not going to stay on the roster when Chourio is back. All for the privilege of moving Cortes? I don't know what he'll become, but I know we gave up a guy one year ago we were VERY high on and who will still be 18 next year during the draft. So maybe a BIG older for an average HS draft pick.

.... the OP is literally advocating moving him to AAA to see how he handles THAT, not to the show right now.

Yeah, he doesn't look quite the same as of late(which was to be expected). This team looks flat and you look and they're still 4.5 games up on... MLB. So we just need Chourio to come back and get back in a groove. I like Bauers also. He's an outstanding defender and usually puts together good at bats... I guess. I mean, for being a backup, he's fine. He'll walk and hit for some power. He's not a star, but just to give Vaughn a break here and there, he's alright.

I would think they'd try going to a 6 man and just limit him to 4-5IP the rest of the way. When he's throwing strikes, he's still unhittable. He was humming along vs the Cubs and walked 3 guys. Then had to give in. Same thing the previous start. HBP, 3 walks. Guys aren't really hitting him, he just needs to settle back in. I'm not that worried about him. He'll get right again and... then probably be on a short leash in the playoffs. Wouldn't mind seeing Myers back in there, but... that pitching depth is dwindling. I wonder if Wichrowski or Hardin could come up and get some innings out of the pen or if we just bring Patrick up and start looking for chunks instead of slotting guys in. DL Hall and Henderson being hurt-hurts the Brewers. Two veterans who seemed like very important pitchers come October and I'm not sure where either stands. Henderson seemed like HE was destined for that Burnes, Woodruff type role. I don't think you're going to see "the Hader role" again but the closest would be Uribe if we had a SU man, which is why I was hoping if we made a big trade and gave up a lot, Pratt, Quero, Henderson, one of them and then 2-3 more good prospects, it'd be for...Duran, Felix Bautista, etc...and then Castro or O'Hearn. But...we didn't. So hopefully we get those guys back and then you get what you get out of Mis. When he starts losing it, you go to the pen.

t I would also, but... I don't know what yo do with Turang. If you go by WAR, I mean, 7 years and 100M is probably a reasonable ask on his behalf and then 25M TOs with a 10M buyout. You're loving at 9 WAR over the last 2 years and he's just starting to hit for power. Meanwhile, you have 3 guys who can play SS ranked in the top 100, a guy they still have listed at 3B but is 1B in Adams in the lower half and then two more 3B prospects in Fischer/Wilken and another 1B crushing in in AA in Burke. So Turang has been my guy, my favorite for a long time, but as valuable as I think he is, he's going to start arbitration this year, so that will increase his contract and we're getting pretty far in. 6 years 60M with 2 TOs at 18M would be... where I'd go. I don't think it's where he'd go. Frelick is a big of a difficult read as well. He's important to the team... I just don't know what a fair contract is for the Brewers. I do hope they keep their powder dry for Made and Pena as both look like just...studs. And they have so many other guys who... I just think the more guys you sign early, even if you get a guy like Keston Hiura who turned down something like 7/42 IIRC. But if you do this with Mis, Made, Quero, Pena, maybe Pratt, Fischer, Burke(you'll know better by the time they're in AAA or starting their MLB careers) you make up for it when a couple guys really hit.

Sure. I mean, I found someone on here last year who said they'd rather be able to sign an extra reliever or a Hunter Renfroe type player every year than invest 10M into the Latin American Scouting and Development program. It was either a former player who spent the 1988 season with the Milwaukee Brewers and put up a negative WAR...but did have two AS games on his resume as well as an NCLS MVP... or it was someone who just arbitrarily picked that players to use as a handle. But yes, people will argue whatever nonsense you'd like(and this was AS Chourio was playing...mediocre earlier last year and I've not seen him on the board since). So you could argue any point... but you would have a VERY weak argument. And to be clear, Woodruff's 4 1/3 in which he gave up 3 ERs among which includes the 1st runner he LOB that was allowed to score by the Pen this year. But no, my opinion on him hasn't changed after ONE unremarkable start or since I very recently advocated TRYING to re-sign him should he be open to a 3 year deal in the 25M range... Misiorowkski? Well hell, all you need to do is go and look at my post on wanting to sign HIM, I said these types of blow up outings were inevitable for a kid with his stuff, but command or just even control issues at times. The only real question for me is how the Brewers order their #3 and #4. Do they go with Mis+Ashby(hopefully Hall is an option by this point) and try and get each through ~3 innings, maybe 4 if Misi is really rolling, or do they just go with Priester with the understanding that the whole Pen is available at that point and you could get 4 outs from Uribe or 4 from Megill. Henderson's status is also very consequential as I think HE plays up better in the pen also having two exceptional pitches, but lacking a 3rd. But in any event, there's really no argument who THIS team's ace is. I'd love is Woodruff came back JUST a bit more and MADE it a strong argument or Mis just went off down the stretch. Preister has done about as much as he can...short of raking up some more 10-12K games, but he's a guy who is going to give up GBs and that's fine. So the only real arguments I could see would be is Priester the #2, Woody the #3, and what exactly is your plan for Misisorowski? Just let him loose in the post-season and if he goes 3 or 7, as long as he's effective? And then I suppose there's Quintana. I could see the Brewers starting a game with him and THEN going with Misiorowski after he serves as almost an opener, but maybe goes through the lineup once before you bring in the righties and then go back to lefties to cover those 7 innings. That's a long way off though. Freddy is cemented not only in the top 3, but pretty much as the #1 at this point. Question marks are pretty much all just health. -Hall the Obligque, is it a grade 2? Or Grade 1? These always seem to be worse and longer than initial prognosis. -Henderson -sore elbow or headed toward the same outcome as Robert Gasser -Gasser... unlikely, but can he pitch his way into Hall's spot?

Yeah, so... pretty much the same thing at that point. I'd like to see Turang in there at SS. That's your best lineup. Durbin/Collins can stay in the lineup. You're losing a lot of defense in LF, but... it's not like you have Eloy Jiminez out there, so... it's not a huge downgrade. This lineup is going to get a BIG boost from Chourio and I think it's possible we get one from Hoskins. He's a dude who's played big games and... he was really raking earlier this year. Then got cold a bit and then injured, but I still think he's a good hitter.

It's not over... But even if they do, I'll roll the dice with Mis vs Rea and Priester vs... a guy we seem to hit well. There seems to be a "oh no, he it starts," feeling in this game thread. It's 2 games. We're still up 7 IF we lost and we haven't lost yet. Not worried. Just a couple good ABs here and put some pressure on them.

If he's playing through it, it's a bone bruise(I... would think) and that's better than a pulled muscle. One is just pain tolerance and the other is just...patience and healing.

Well... the Cubs are playing like the Brewers here. Things are falling for them...and they're executing.

And start 'em off with a strike WAY up in the zone.

...could you though?

Ok... but how do we make that distinction? Ohtani came over as a pro as did Sasaki, but they didn't meet their own standards in Japan to do so without being posted by their teams. Similar to...many Cubans who've come over. So it has to be more about your status in the league you were in before you came over more than prospect vs pro. He didn't meet the requirements in Japan, so MLB honors that? Talk about a stupid move BTW. He could have waited a year, gotten... maybe not Yamamoto type money if he had shoulder issues, but more if he didn't and even if he had shoulder injuries, he'd have signed a BIG contract. Likely a 9 figure contract.

Wait a second, the MOST data driven guy here and your arguments are that this is an "easy answer," because; -Frelick is really good in RF -Neither Frelick, nor Chourio have much time in CF... but in the sample size we do have, Frelick IS the better defender according to the metrics, but the best long term alignment long term is Jackson in CF...so might as well give him time there? I'm not entirely sure why we're concluding the best long term alignment is with Chourio out there when we certainly can't do so now, but...alright.

I don't know if I did this. But I'm just... kinda at the expecting 86 wins in a year things go poorly and 94-95 in a year things go well. I'd have probably said 93-94(maybe I did, don't recall if I even guessed). But hell, when they had that one month, 6 vs the Dodgers, they had the Mets, the Cubs, the Marlins who were hot, the Mariners, the Royals... I didn't even give one. I usually overshoot it, but I thought 14-12 was optimistic(I don't recall the exact number of games, but I thought with the ASB it was 26. And...they BLEW right past that! I wasn't even worried about the division in May. I thought we'd figure it out...and NEVER did I expect THIS to happen. I thought we'd be in a race and run 'em down like '18. Hey, lets play two today...and start a new WINNING streak!

And Chourio is 86. So... 85.6 vs 86. Marginally better. Even if Frelick was 90, you're not putting him in RF if he's a better CFer(which I think he is). As I said earlier, I think Chourio may be worse in the corner OF spots. As for Yelich... yeah, he's... obviously the worst, but he wasn't part of the discussion. A better example would be Perkins. He's got a stronger arm than either. You're not putting him in RF because of his arm strength. There really isn't a big enough difference in ANY of our OFers to designate them as LF/RF/CF based on their arm. There's no Khris Davis or Jay Buhner out there(Yelich is lower this year, but he's made very few throws, even he's been...comparable to Collins in the past and his max velocity has decreased substantially as the season has gone on, likely due to that lingering back issue he's finally addressed).

Yeah, I found it. They're going to "listen to offers," and it all seems odd to me. He's been asking for days off and some in the organization are upset. Well...the organization JUST extended him. Unless the Yanks want to part with some top prospects(which would make sense) or...the Dodgers... which would make less sense with them being in the division. A cost-controlled superstar, they'll get a few top 100 prospects back and I'd imagine a top ~20 or so. Seattle could actually be a great landing spot as well. Teams that either have the equity to afford it, OR that have the money to... not have to worry about prospects. 2B/3B has been an issue. Marte is an elite glove and one of the top hitters in the game in the midst of a HOF career. I'm still almost tempted with that player/contract to inquire about him if nothing else. Not Made or Pena, but Pratt+ 3-4 guys, but... I wouldn't want the guys we'd have to give up most likely.