Bucks 2022-2023 Season Thread

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Yeah I'm sorry but I can't get myself to blame the play-in set up nor am I blown away by the incredible Heat.

We sucked and choked in 3/4 of games. We thought we could sleepwalk through a 1 v 8. 

Boston would have smashed us anyway. 

[adambr2]

1 minute ago, HarryDoyle said:

This team needs a minor rebuild and get younger.

They have like no way to rebuild aside from trading Giannis which I think most agree would be a terrible idea. They've hooked their anchor to their core in just about every way. 

[adambr2]

Lest I remind everyone that the Heat are missing 2 key players. 

This is an embarrassment of epic proportions. 

[OldSchoolSnapper]

1 minute ago, adambr2 said:

Lest I remind everyone that the Heat are missing 2 key players. 

This is an embarrassment of epic proportions. 

Yeah, that is truly the most ridiculous part of this circus. They don't have Tyler Herro and it made absolutely no difference. 

The level of our suckage here is absolutely historic.

[adambr2]

They could easily win the next 3 games and I don't know if I'd be over my disgust enough to get excited for the next round. 

[HarryDoyle]

1 minute ago, adambr2 said:

They have like no way to rebuild aside from trading Giannis which I think most agree would be a terrible idea. They've hooked their anchor to their core in just about every way. 

I realize it's not really possible in the NBA, just venting. With the age of this team it seems the window for a second championship is all but shut. Middleton and Holiday no showed tonight. That's inexcusable for players that are supposed to be your #2 and 3. Giannis can't do it by himself, contrary to popular belief.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'm the sucker who's telling himself all we have to do is win Game 6. Lol.

Why do I do this to myself?

[adambr2]

6 minutes ago, HarryDoyle said:

I realize it's not really possible in the NBA, just venting. With the age of this team it seems the window for a second championship is all but shut. Middleton and Holiday no showed tonight. That's inexcusable for players that are supposed to be your #2 and 3. Giannis can't do it by himself, contrary to popular belief.

In past years we had some decent bench depth that helped keep us in games when Giannis takes a breather. 

These days our bench is total garbage and it offers no margin for error. 

We have Portis and that's about it, everything else is just junk.  

DDV would look pretty good as a shooter off this bench and we traded him for the right to watch a washed Serge Ibaka sit on our bench for a couple months last season. This year it was Jae Crowder, another huge swing and miss by our FO.

[adambr2]

Against any marquee opponent, Boston, Philly, NBA Finals, Giannis guts it out for Game 2. 

The Bucks did not respect the Heat or take them seriously and have no one to blame but themselves for the position they're in. Not the NBA, not injuries. Themselves. 

[Joseph Zarr]

The issues with this team, all season long, are still glaringly obvious. Even if they win this series - which they certainly can - I remain absolutely skeptical they can do anything meaningful. There was previously just no way I was bought into their record and this simply solidifies that for me. How many games did they lose this season by double digits? In the past month they lost to the Indiana Pacers by 20 at home. I believe they lost multiple games by over 30 points and two (or more) by over 40? Boston has been and is the better team. Philly has been playing better than the Bucks over the past month. This team is too old, too slow, way too inconsistent shooting the basketball, and they have a coach who falls in love with the drop defensive strategy and just isn't capable of adjusting on the fly. It is what it is. I am grateful we miraculously got the one thing I thought I'd never see in my lifetime: A Bucks Championship. But, it certainly feels like the window for this group slammed shut with tonight's meltdown. It really did. At this point, I think it's fair to expect a coaching change is likely in the pipelines. Jon Horst has his work cut out for him, that is abundantly clear.

[adambr2]

I don't really disagree.  I'm really grateful the Bucks were able to win one. Giannis is a good enough star, but his supporting cast is old and not as good as they need to be. 

I don't know where they go from here. They don't have ammo of any kind in either draft capital or money to build around Giannis. 

[SeaBass]

Bud can't survive this if/when they lose this series. It's just too pathetic. The issues with the defense are too much, guys not motivated to kick it into gear when they need to, it's inexcusable.

[adambr2]

I hope we can also LOL at ourselves now for acting like the only reason we didn't make the NBA Finals last year was because Khris Middleton got hurt. 

[adambr2]

Any chance if Khris opts out this offseason that Giannis asks for a trade after this debacle?

I wouldn't blame him and he could easily hold his head high and say he accomplished what he wanted to accomplish here. 

[CheezWizHed]

59 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

I hope we can also LOL at ourselves now for acting like the only reason we didn't make the NBA Finals last year was because Khris Middleton got hurt. 

We took Boston to game 7 without our 2nd best player.  Problems this year doesn't change what happened last year. 

[adambr2]

6 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

We took Boston to game 7 without our 2nd best player.  Problems this year doesn't change what happened last year. 

Honestly, what difference does it make? Middleton isn't a playoff difference making player. The gap between our best and 2nd best player is massive. The fact that Middleton is our 2nd best player speaks volumes to the issue of this team's roster construction.

As an aside, probably a good time to note that we were offered Butler for Middleton several years ago. 

[BruisedCrew]

9 hours ago, adambr2 said:

I hope we can also LOL at ourselves now for acting like the only reason we didn't make the NBA Finals last year was because Khris Middleton got hurt. 

I think this is an incorrect and illogical leap.

First, I’m not sure anyone thought Middleton’s injury was the ONLY reason the Bucks didn’t make the finals. But, it was reasonable to think that the injury made their path much tougher and might have been the difference in a 7 game series with the Celtics.

This is a different year, and I think that with his multiple injuries Middleton is not as much of an impact player as he was even two years ago. Holliday is two years older too and may also be declining. 

It does look like the window has closed on this collection of players being championship contenders. Even if they recover to win this series (which I don’t expect) they would have trouble with a younger, hungrier Knicks team and would be no match for the Celtics or Sixers. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

2 hours ago, adambr2 said:

Honestly, what difference does it make? Middleton isn't a playoff difference making player. The gap between our best and 2nd best player is massive. The fact that Middleton is our 2nd best player speaks volumes to the issue of this team's roster construction.

As an aside, probably a good time to note that we were offered Butler for Middleton several years ago. 

I think part of that gap has to do with the fact the Giannis is arguably the most complete and best player in the entire league, so there will always be that gap.

The Bucks are a victim of the current NBA climate in terms of building rosters - Milwaukee's not a destination for marquee players to want to come and play, so they've still got to try and build through the draft and their sustained run of success has sapped them of consistent lottery picks to bring in young impact talent.  

[OldSchoolSnapper]

6 hours ago, adambr2 said:

Honestly, what difference does it make? Middleton isn't a playoff difference making player. The gap between our best and 2nd best player is massive. The fact that Middleton is our 2nd best player speaks volumes to the issue of this team's roster construction.

As an aside, probably a good time to note that we were offered Butler for Middleton several years ago. 

Dude I know we are rightfully p'd off, but Middleton had some absolute monster moments in that Finals run. He's been a big disappointment this year though, there's no doubt about that. It's maybe 50/50 we lose to Boston anyway last year with him but I would have loved to have him. He is the only good Iso scorer on the team.

The gap between Giannis and any 2nd best player would be massive, but I don't feel like roster construction is why we can't win the Finals. It could always be better, but we are witnessing an incredible show of ineptitude right now. This isn't just a 1v8, they are missing 2 core players. It's unfathomable. And while I was wrong that we'd beat them without Giannis, we absolutely SHOULD have, without Herro, if we have 3 borderline all-stars, a DPOY and 6th man candidate.

Bud should 100% hang for this. It's just completely outrageous.

[CheezWizHed]

6 hours ago, adambr2 said:

Honestly, what difference does it make? Middleton isn't a playoff difference making player. The gap between our best and 2nd best player is massive. The fact that Middleton is our 2nd best player speaks volumes to the issue of this team's roster construction.

As an aside, probably a good time to note that we were offered Butler for Middleton several years ago. 

He is one of the few players we have that consistently can get his own shot, which was a major problem when Giannis was shut down. He was also an All Star player last year.  No way to know he would've tipped the scales but seriously a bad take to say he'd have no impact.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I think there are some pretty over-dramatic takes. I think this series is just an unreal choke and it's that simple. I'm sure Holiday and Middleton are worse than they were 3 years ago, but this was a team capable of winning again. Holiday has been much of the same guy he's always been. A strong defender and boom or bust offensively. Midds had a bad season overall, but he has always been a bit inconsistent.

Ultimately when this series ends, IMO the blame lies with 3 guys - Bud, Holiday and Middleton. 

I still can't wrap my head around Lopez dropping 33 in a game Giannis played...and we lost...to the Heat. With Bud I don't know where to start. We can pick apart his rotations all day but the way he allowed last night to unravel without a timeout until it was way too late, just incomprehensible. He's a dope. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

45 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

I think there are some pretty over-dramatic takes. I think this series is just an unreal choke and it's that simple. I'm sure Holiday and Middleton are worse than they were 3 years ago, but this was a team capable of winning again. Holiday has been much of the same guy he's always been. A strong defender and boom or bust offensively. Midds had a bad season overall, but he has always been a bit inconsistent.

Ultimately when this series ends, IMO the blame lies with 3 guys - Bud, Holiday and Middleton. 

I still can't wrap my head around Lopez dropping 33 in a game Giannis played...and we lost...to the Heat. With Bud I don't know where to start. We can pick apart his rotations all day but the way he allowed last night to unravel without a timeout until it was way too late, just incomprehensible. He's a dope. 

Couldn't agree more - tactically, Bud's approach works well in the regular season but it's not a good approach to consistently winning playoff series against a specific opponent.  yes, the Bucks won a title with him as coach - but they've also found ways to underperform in the playoffs much more frequently, same as what his results were with some very good regular season Hawks teams.

I still think the Bucks win this series - it took an all time playoff performance from Jimmy Buckets to eek out a win at home in Game 4, and it's not like the Heat have got key players coming back to take the load off.  Wouldn't surprise me in the least for the Bucks to win game 5 at home, blow the doors of Miami in game 6, and cruise to a game 7 series win.  I think if the Heat do win this series that Bud is going to get canned, and rightfully so.

[HarryDoyle]

1 hour ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

Couldn't agree more - tactically, Bud's approach works well in the regular season but it's not a good approach to consistently winning playoff series against a specific opponent.  yes, the Bucks won a title with him as coach - but they've also found ways to underperform in the playoffs much more frequently, same as what his results were with some very good regular season Hawks teams.

I still think the Bucks win this series - it took an all time playoff performance from Jimmy Buckets to eek out a win at home in Game 4, and it's not like the Heat have got key players coming back to take the load off.  Wouldn't surprise me in the least for the Bucks to win game 5 at home, blow the doors of Miami in game 6, and cruise to a game 7 series win.  I think if the Heat do win this series that Bud is going to get canned, and rightfully so.

Didn't Bud lose a 1-8 matchup when he was in Atlanta too? If that's true, being on the losing end of two of these is not something I would want on my resume.

EDIT: I guess not. I could've swore he did. Maybe I'm thinking of someone else.

[nate82]

Bud is basically done if he loses this series.  The off season would be really interesting if Middleton opts out and the Bucks are not able to come to terms with him. 

If Middleton leaves the Bucks won't be able to replace him with anyone other than a league minimum player.  It is basically Middleton or no one for the Bucks.  The Bucks could try and do a sign and trade where Middleton gets max money going to whatever team wants him.  Maybe the Bucks could con the Knicks into giving up one of their 2024 1st round picks along with Randle and Fournier to balance out the salaries for Middleton. 

[CheezWizHed]

Khris is probably the most likely of the big three to need to be replaced.  I worry about extending him long term.  

If the Bucks are to pull this series out... G is going to have to really turn it up.  I missed last night, but his last few games (in regular season too) have had some bad passes, dumb fouls, etc.. Time to earn the MVP title