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    Well, Then: Brewers Projected for Just 80 Wins By PECOTA


    Matthew Trueblood

    And this is the system that usually likes them!

    Image courtesy of © Benny Sieu-Imagn Images

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    Hmm. Ah. Well... uh-oh. The annual PECOTA projections roll out at Baseball Prospectus this week, and they are (to say the very least) unfriendly to the Milwaukee Brewers. Despite coming off two straight NL Central titles, the Crew come in with just 80.2 projected wins. The model only estimates that they have a 26.1% chance to reach the postseason, and it sets the rival Cubs a full 10 games ahead of them.

    At first blush, this is crazy. While the Brewers have failed to build out their core this winter the way some might have hoped, and while they did trade Devin Williams in December, they return a lot of the players who have helped them win 185 regular-season games since the start of 2023. They have one superstar whose season was cut short last season, but who should be back as some facsimile of his former self, in Christian Yelich; another just tapping into his full potential, in Jackson Chourio; and a third already in full bloom, in William Contreras. They still have a deep bullpen, and they added rotation depth in the Williams trade, acquiring Nestor Cortes from the Yankees.

    PECOTA isn't buying it. It doesn't like Chourio to explode, the way most of us expect. On the contrary, with a .251/.301/.413 line (103 DRC+, where 100 is average and higher is better), the system expects him to take a step back. It's fairly easy to reject that projection, not as some product of bias or incompetence (after all, head PECOTA architect Jonathan Judge is a noted Brewers fan—and a BF reader! Hi, Judge. Good luck today, buddy) but as one of the errors a good model has to make in order to better fit the data and career arcs of a multitude of players. Sometimes, to project 1,000 players as well as possible, you have to get a few badly wrong, and Chourio might be such a case.

    Even if you mentally bump Chourio's production up a couple bushels full of runs, though, the Crew doesn't magically leap up to the Cubs' level. This model is calling them out for being built too much around depth, without being especially deep; too much around defense, despite having a player sliding up the defensive spectrum into a key defensive position; and too much around contact, at the expense of power.

    Pitching-wise, the system sees them as above-average. The problems lie on offense, where they have the ninth-lowest projected runs total. Only Rhys Hoskins and Contreras project to reach 20 homers, and in Contreras's case, it'll be close. Eight different Brewers are projected for sub-.400 slugging averages in at least 250 plate appearances, and of those, a staggering five (Tyler Black, Brice Turang, Sal Frelick, Blake Perkins, and Oliver Dunn) have sub-.350 figures. 

    It's not hard at all to cobble together a case that the model is underselling the Crew. Garrett Mitchell (.665 projected OPS) could outperform his projection by a huge margin, as could Chourio. The system is not blind to the team's good defense, but it seems to be pessimistic about Turang's glove, projecting just 1.7 Defensive Runs Prevented from a player who was a run better than that by that framework in 2024—and is estimated, by other sources, as being worth as much as 15 or 20 runs with the leather. Projection systems aren't always right.

    Still, this sends a pretty important early signal. The Brewers will have a tougher path to the NL Central title this time around, if they can manage to win it at all. They have some flaws that they have allowed to fester, heavily prioritizing the traits they believe they can acquire and develop best with their limited financial resources and excellent support staff. Maybe they need to get more aggressive in the endgame of the offseason than previously thought. Maybe they're already much better than this system can see. Either way, though, you'd prefer to see them sitting higher on the projected standings than they are, with spring training right around the corner.


    EDITOR'S NOTE: A previous version of this article erroneously stated that PECOTA projected the Brewers to win the division last year. That was incorrect. Although they later rose in the projected standings as Opening Day approached, at this time last year, PECOTA had Milwaukee pegged for third place; it was FanGraphs's projections who were high on the 2024 Brewers. We apologize for the mistake.

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    My guess is the Brewers own internal projections show many more wins than PECOTA’s does for MKE. 81 wins would be a non-contending season and the team would definitely not tolerate that.

    I’m confident in 3 things:

    Firstly, that the team is not done improving the roster before OD.

    Secondly, the team is confident they can improve the roster in-season if needed.

    thirdly, this team will be serious contenders for another Central title when all is said and done.

    • Like 2
    Ro Mueller
  • Brewer Fanatic Contributor
  • Posted

    Replace Adames with a player similar to the value he delivered last year.

    Fangraphs had him at 4.8 WAR in 2024

    Their projections for this year:
    - Bregman - 4.0
    - Chisholm - 3.7
    - Neto - 3.7
    - Bichette - 3.6
    - Westburg - 3.6
    - Arenado - 3.2
    - B. Lowe - 3.1
    - Alonso - 2.8
    - Bohm - 2.8
    - Vientos - 2.7
    - Muncy - 2.7
    - Suarez - 2.4
    - M. Garcia - 2.4
    - McMahon - 2.3
    - Jung - 2.3
    - McNeil - 2.3
    - Arraez - 2.2

    While I expect a veteran to replace Adames (as a third baseman), they won't be all that good. The Chourio projection is significantly low, and expect growth rather than negative regression from most of the youngsters...I also see this group as an 81 win team. That's mostly because I think most of the pitchers will be worse, and Woody will likely be a shadow of his former self.

    The Brewers have won at least 86 games every full season going back to 2017.

    Not sure if BPro has a historical projections easily accessible, but the Brewers are an MLB best +71 wins over the eight full seasons in the FanGraphs database. The Dodgers are second at +54 wins so it’s by no small margin either.

    Posted this on the message board side with regards to the ZiPS Chourio projection, but I’ll drop it in here too as I think it does a pretty good job illustrating the range and likelihoods of various potential outcomes for Jackson next year…

    • Like 1

    Circling back around to the Chourio projection, I was curious how other 20 year olds who got regular playing time ended up performing in their age 21 seasons.

    Using the leaderboards at FanGraphs it looks there have been 32 players in the Expansion Era to have gotten at least 400 PAs in their age 20 season with Chourio coming in at 117 wRC+ (10th) and 3.9 WAR (9th), not too shabby.

    For the comparisons below I lopped off 1970 Jack Heidemann who was clearly overmatched for his whole career and 1980 Lloyd Moseby (had a nice run with 118 wRC+ and 22.0 WAR from age 23-27 though) at the bottom of the list, then Mike Trout/AlexRodriguez at the top of the list since they were clearly in a whole other league of their own, plus 2019 Juan Soto & Vlad Junior since their age 21 seasons were in the shortened 2020, which leaves the following 25 players...

    1989 Gary Sheffield
    20: 405 PAs | 82 wRC+ | -0.4 WAR
    21: 547 PAs | 118 wRC+ | 2.9 WAR

    2008 Justin Upton
    20: 417 PAs | 106 wRC+ | 0.6 WAR
    21: 588 PAs | 130 wRC+ | 4.9 WAR

    2014 Rougned Odor
    20: 417 PAs | 91 wRC+ | 1.0 WAR
    21: 470 PAs | 107 wRC+ | 2.5 WAR

    1997 Edgar Renteria
    20: 691 PAs | 81 wRC+ | 1.0 WAR
    21: 580 PAs | 90 wRC+ | 0.9 WAR

    1976 Robin Yount
    20: 690 PAs | 72 wRC+ | 1.1 WAR
    21: 663 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 2.4 WAR

    1978 Clint Hurdle
    20: 481 PAs | 111 wRC+ | 1.2 WAR
    21: 204 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 0.0 WAR

    1971 Cesar Cedeno
    20: 649 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 1.3 WAR
    21: 625 PAs | 163 wRC+ | 7.8 WAR

    1972 Buddy Bell
    20: 505 PAs | 93 wRC+ | 1.5 WAR
    21: 689 PAs | 100 wRC+ | 3.6 WAR

    1986 Ruben Sierra
    20: 411 PAs | 103 wRC+ | 1.6 WAR
    21: 696 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 0.9 WAR

    2010 Starlin Castro
    20: 506 PAs | 99 wRC+ | 1.8 WAR
    21: 715 PAs | 109 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR

    1975 Rick Manning
    20: 535 PAs | 102 wRC+ | 2.1 WAR
    21: 606 PAs | 116 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR

    1992 Ivan Rodriguez
    20: 454 PAs | 85 wRC+ | 2.3 WAR
    21: 519 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 2.4 WAR

    1978 Alan Trammell
    20: 504 PAs | 90 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR
    21: 520 PAs | 87 wRC+ | 0.4 WAR

    2009 Elvis Andrus
    20: 541 PAs | 81 wRC+ | 3.3 WAR
    21: 674 PAs | 75 wRC+ | 2.1 WAR

    1999 Adrian Beltre
    20: 614 PAs | 100 wRC+ | 3.4 WAR
    21: 575 PAs | 116 wRC+ | 3.9 WAR

    2015 Carlos Correa
    20: 432 PAs | 136 wRC+ | 3.4 WAR
    21: 660 PAs | 123 wRC+ | 4.1 WAR

    1976 Butch Wynegar
    20: 622 PAs | 113 wRC+ | 3.6 WAR
    21: 617 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 3.0 WAR

    1997 Andruw Jones
    20: 467 PAs | 96 wRC+ | 3.7 WAR
    21: 631 PAs | 113 wRC+ | 7.0 WAR

    1975 Claudell Washington
    20: 635 PAs | 120 wRC+ | 3.8 WAR
    21: 530 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 0.1 WAR

    1988 Roberto Alomar
    20: 611 PAs | 107 wRC+ | 3.9 WAR
    21: 702 PAs | 110 wRC+ | 3.8 WAR

    2013 Bryce Harper
    20: 497 PAs | 137 wRC+ | 4.1 WAR
    21: 395 PAs | 115 wRC+ | 1.6 WAR

    2018 Ronald Acuna Jr.
    20: 487 PAs | 142 wRC+ | 4.4 WAR
    21: 715 PAs | 125 wRC+ | 4.8 WAR

    2010 Jason Heyward
    20: 623 PAs | 134 wRC+ | 4.7 WAR
    21: 456 PAs | 96 wRC+ | 1.9 WAR

    2013 Manny Machado
    20: 710 PAs | 102 wRC+ | 5.0 WAR
    21: 354 PAs | 111 wRC+ | 2.3 WAR

    1990 Ken Griffey Jr.
    20: 666 PAs | 132 wRC+ | 5.0 WAR
    21: 633 PAs | 148 wRC+ | 6.9 WAR

    So all told I'd say something like 17 of those 25 players (or 19 of 27 if you include Soto and Vlad Jr) have had at least HofVG careers, which is a pretty nice ratio, and I'd break down their progressions from age 20 to age 21 as such...

    QUANTUM LEAPERS (4 for +17.4 WAR)
    1971 Cesar Cedeno (+6.5 WAR), 2008 Justin Upton (+4.3 WAR), 1997 Andruw Jones (+3.3 WAR), 1989 Gary Sheffield (+3.3 WAR)

    NICE GAINERS (4 for +6.8 WAR)
    1972 Buddy Bell (+2.1 WAR), 1990 Ken Griffey Jr. (+1.9 WAR), 2014 Rougned Odor (+1.5 WAR), 1976 Robin Yount (+1.3 WAR)

    BOUT THE SAMERS (10 for +1.7 WAR)
    2010 Starlin Castro (+0.9 WAR), 2015 Carlos Correa (+0.7 WAR), 1975 Rick Manning (+0.6 WAR), 1999 Adrian Beltre (+0.5 WAR), 2018 Ronald Acuna Jr. (+0.4 WAR), 1992 Ivan Rodriguez (+0.1 WAR), 1988 Roberto Alomar (-0.1 WAR), 1997 Edgar Renteria (-0.1 WAR),1976 Butch Wynegar (-0.6 WAR), 1986 Ruben Sierra (-0.7 WAR)

    LIL STUMBLERS (2 for -2.4 WAR)
    1978 Clint Hurdle (-1.2 WAR), 2009 Elvis Andrus (-1.2 WAR)

    BIG DROPPERS (5 for -13.0 WAR)
    1975 Claudell Washington (-3.7 WAR), 2013 Bryce Harper (-2.5 WAR), 2013 Manny Machado (-2.7 WAR), 2010 Jason Heyward (-2.8 WAR), 1978 Alan Trammell (-2.3 WAR)

    • Like 5
    • Love 1
    25 minutes ago, sveumrules said:

    Circling back around to the Chourio projection, I was curious how other 20 year olds who got regular playing time ended up performing in their age 21 seasons.

    Using the leaderboards at FanGraphs it looks there have been 32 players in the Expansion Era to have gotten at least 400 PAs in their age 20 season with Chourio coming in at 117 wRC+ (10th) and 3.9 WAR (9th), not too shabby.

    For the comparisons below I lopped off 1970 Jack Heidemann who was clearly overmatched for his whole career and 1980 Lloyd Moseby (had a nice run with 118 wRC+ and 22.0 WAR from age 23-27 though) at the bottom of the list, then Mike Trout/AlexRodriguez at the top of the list since they were clearly in a whole other league of their own, plus 2019 Juan Soto & Vlad Junior since their age 21 seasons were in the shortened 2020, which leaves the following 25 players...

    1989 Gary Sheffield
    20: 405 PAs | 82 wRC+ | -0.4 WAR
    21: 547 PAs | 118 wRC+ | 2.9 WAR

    2008 Justin Upton
    20: 417 PAs | 106 wRC+ | 0.6 WAR
    21: 588 PAs | 130 wRC+ | 4.9 WAR

    2014 Rougned Odor
    20: 417 PAs | 91 wRC+ | 1.0 WAR
    21: 470 PAs | 107 wRC+ | 2.5 WAR

    1997 Edgar Renteria
    20: 691 PAs | 81 wRC+ | 1.0 WAR
    21: 580 PAs | 90 wRC+ | 0.9 WAR

    1976 Robin Yount
    20: 690 PAs | 72 wRC+ | 1.1 WAR
    21: 663 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 2.4 WAR

    1978 Clint Hurdle
    20: 481 PAs | 111 wRC+ | 1.2 WAR
    21: 204 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 0.0 WAR

    1971 Cesar Cedeno
    20: 649 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 1.3 WAR
    21: 625 PAs | 163 wRC+ | 7.8 WAR

    1972 Buddy Bell
    20: 505 PAs | 93 wRC+ | 1.5 WAR
    21: 689 PAs | 100 wRC+ | 3.6 WAR

    1986 Ruben Sierra
    20: 411 PAs | 103 wRC+ | 1.6 WAR
    21: 696 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 0.9 WAR

    2010 Starlin Castro
    20: 506 PAs | 99 wRC+ | 1.8 WAR
    21: 715 PAs | 109 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR

    1975 Rick Manning
    20: 535 PAs | 102 wRC+ | 2.1 WAR
    21: 606 PAs | 116 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR

    1992 Ivan Rodriguez
    20: 454 PAs | 85 wRC+ | 2.3 WAR
    21: 519 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 2.4 WAR

    1978 Alan Trammell
    20: 504 PAs | 90 wRC+ | 2.7 WAR
    21: 520 PAs | 87 wRC+ | 0.4 WAR

    2009 Elvis Andrus
    20: 541 PAs | 81 wRC+ | 3.3 WAR
    21: 674 PAs | 75 wRC+ | 2.1 WAR

    1999 Adrian Beltre
    20: 614 PAs | 100 wRC+ | 3.4 WAR
    21: 575 PAs | 116 wRC+ | 3.9 WAR

    2015 Carlos Correa
    20: 432 PAs | 136 wRC+ | 3.4 WAR
    21: 660 PAs | 123 wRC+ | 4.1 WAR

    1976 Butch Wynegar
    20: 622 PAs | 113 wRC+ | 3.6 WAR
    21: 617 PAs | 95 wRC+ | 3.0 WAR

    1997 Andruw Jones
    20: 467 PAs | 96 wRC+ | 3.7 WAR
    21: 631 PAs | 113 wRC+ | 7.0 WAR

    1975 Claudell Washington
    20: 635 PAs | 120 wRC+ | 3.8 WAR
    21: 530 PAs | 94 wRC+ | 0.1 WAR

    1988 Roberto Alomar
    20: 611 PAs | 107 wRC+ | 3.9 WAR
    21: 702 PAs | 110 wRC+ | 3.8 WAR

    2013 Bryce Harper
    20: 497 PAs | 137 wRC+ | 4.1 WAR
    21: 395 PAs | 115 wRC+ | 1.6 WAR

    2018 Ronald Acuna Jr.
    20: 487 PAs | 142 wRC+ | 4.4 WAR
    21: 715 PAs | 125 wRC+ | 4.8 WAR

    2010 Jason Heyward
    20: 623 PAs | 134 wRC+ | 4.7 WAR
    21: 456 PAs | 96 wRC+ | 1.9 WAR

    2013 Manny Machado
    20: 710 PAs | 102 wRC+ | 5.0 WAR
    21: 354 PAs | 111 wRC+ | 2.3 WAR

    1990 Ken Griffey Jr.
    20: 666 PAs | 132 wRC+ | 5.0 WAR
    21: 633 PAs | 148 wRC+ | 6.9 WAR

    So all told I'd say something like 17 of those 25 players (or 19 of 27 if you include Soto and Vlad Jr) have had at least HofVG careers, which is a pretty nice ratio, and I'd break down their progressions from age 20 to age 21 as such...

    QUANTUM LEAPERS (4 for +17.4 WAR)
    1971 Cesar Cedeno (+6.5 WAR), 2008 Justin Upton (+4.3 WAR), 1997 Andruw Jones (+3.3 WAR), 1989 Gary Sheffield (+3.3 WAR)

    NICE GAINERS (4 for +6.8 WAR)
    1972 Buddy Bell (+2.1 WAR), 1990 Ken Griffey Jr. (+1.9 WAR), 2014 Rougned Odor (+1.5 WAR), 1976 Robin Yount (+1.3 WAR)

    BOUT THE SAMERS (10 for +1.7 WAR)
    2010 Starlin Castro (+0.9 WAR), 2015 Carlos Correa (+0.7 WAR), 1975 Rick Manning (+0.6 WAR), 1999 Adrian Beltre (+0.5 WAR), 2018 Ronald Acuna Jr. (+0.4 WAR), 1992 Ivan Rodriguez (+0.1 WAR), 1988 Roberto Alomar (-0.1 WAR), 1997 Edgar Renteria (-0.1 WAR),1976 Butch Wynegar (-0.6 WAR), 1986 Ruben Sierra (-0.7 WAR)

    LIL STUMBLERS (2 for -2.4 WAR)
    1978 Clint Hurdle (-1.2 WAR), 2009 Elvis Andrus (-1.2 WAR)

    BIG DROPPERS (5 for -13.0 WAR)
    1975 Claudell Washington (-3.7 WAR), 2013 Bryce Harper (-2.5 WAR), 2013 Manny Machado (-2.7 WAR), 2010 Jason Heyward (-2.8 WAR), 1978 Alan Trammell (-2.3 WAR)

    I think Andruw Jones is a nice comp at the plate for Chourio...at least I hope he is. Jones was a vastly superior defender....and not just compared to Chourio. The projected decline is puzzling to me.

    There are a lot of variables at play for the Brewers at this point and their guess is also likely banking on the fact that at some point not being able to be competitive with payroll is going to hit is some year(s) more so than others.  Counting on Yelich to be healthy, counting on Woody to be healthy, counting on a closer WILL take the place of DW counting on Hoskins not stinking etc etc.

    I believe PECOTA had the Brewers pegged for 79 wins last year.

    Maybe this goes against my affinity for nerdy baseball things, but projections have always been one of those things I just don't really care about. I respect all the good, hard work that has been put into them, but there are just always going to be so many things that a projection system can't account for.

    They can at least lead to some good discussion though, especially at a slower point in the offseason.

    • Like 3

    Projections are really underselling the Brewers defense, expecting just about everyone to regress. Which, I feel fairly confident saying, won't happen. There's also all the things that projections can't account for even if they get the player projections right. That is the in-season additions, promotions and demotions. Bullpen usage, platoons etc, things the Brewers do well. 

    But fundamentally I think the projections themselves are missing something with the Brewers. Perhaps it's the defense. Perhaps it relates to DRC+ and contact hitters. I remember the very early versions couldn't understand hitters like Ichiro, and viewed their performance as just luck. Adjustments over the years has made it somewhat better, but it would still treat a bunch of young speed+contact type hitters very conservatively. 

    There's also the bullpen which PECOTA is pretty down on. To be hoenst, they're really down on most things. Normally when I look at a preseason projection there's a mix of players I think the projections overrate, and underrate. With my bias as a fan, naturally I find more projections I'd bet the over on than vice versa. But looking at the Brewers PECOTA projections the only optimistic one I see is Woodruff, and that's injury related. 

    Last year it was 79 wins at this stage, and ended up with 93. I think it'll be off by a similar margin again. At the very least I'd wait until opening day to take projections more seriously. I think another infield move (Which I expect to happen) will have a big effect, even if it's not an amazing player. Currently BP are predicting the Brewers will spread a lot of playing time between various poorly performing players there. I expect reality to be quite different. 

    • Like 2
    59 minutes ago, Lathund said:

    Projections are really underselling the Brewers defense, expecting just about everyone to regress. Which, I feel fairly confident saying, won't happen. There's also all the things that projections can't account for even if they get the player projections right. That is the in-season additions, promotions and demotions. Bullpen usage, platoons etc, things the Brewers do well. 

    But fundamentally I think the projections themselves are missing something with the Brewers. Perhaps it's the defense. Perhaps it relates to DRC+ and contact hitters. I remember the very early versions couldn't understand hitters like Ichiro, and viewed their performance as just luck. Adjustments over the years has made it somewhat better, but it would still treat a bunch of young speed+contact type hitters very conservatively. 

    There's also the bullpen which PECOTA is pretty down on. To be hoenst, they're really down on most things. Normally when I look at a preseason projection there's a mix of players I think the projections overrate, and underrate. With my bias as a fan, naturally I find more projections I'd bet the over on than vice versa. But looking at the Brewers PECOTA projections the only optimistic one I see is Woodruff, and that's injury related. 

    Last year it was 79 wins at this stage, and ended up with 93. I think it'll be off by a similar margin again. At the very least I'd wait until opening day to take projections more seriously. I think another infield move (Which I expect to happen) will have a big effect, even if it's not an amazing player. Currently BP are predicting the Brewers will spread a lot of playing time between various poorly performing players there. I expect reality to be quite different. 

    Out of all the pitcher and position player projections on PECOTA's depth chart only Woodruff and Yoho feel optimistic. The SP outside of Woodruff feel like fair projections. The bullpen projections are some of the worst things I've ever seen. All of Contreras, Yelich, Chourio, Ortiz, Mitchell's projections seem shockingly low.

    I feel like if they nailed the Brewers SP projections that I'd bet my life savings on the Brewers finishing with over 80 wins.

    Chourio will not hit less than 20 HR barring injury.  He is simply too good.  A projection saying he will be below 20 is kind of a joke and I'd be shocked to end up eating my words on this.  Assuming he plays a full season (with normal off days) he may hit north of 30 but certainly not under 20.

    Regarding the rest, I have my concerns about how we replace Adames' production, whether Yelich is really able to be the player we saw early in 2024, whether Woodruff will really give us anything and whether Hoskins can bounce back.  I'm assuming that two of those 4 things will pan out with my bets right now being on Yelich playing well and Hoskins having a bounce back season.

    On 2/3/2025 at 7:11 AM, SF70 said:

    My guess is the Brewers own internal projections show many more wins than PECOTA’s does for MKE. 81 wins would be a non-contending season and the team would definitely not tolerate that.

    I’m confident in 3 things:

    Firstly, that the team is not done improving the roster before OD.

    Secondly, the team is confident they can improve the roster in-season if needed.

    thirdly, this team will be serious contenders for another Central title when all is said and done.

    I have never gone into a season like this one.   I do not believe the Brewers need to add anything to be great in 2025.  I think the 2025 season will prove that the Brewers homegrown are more than talented enough to carry this team through and that constantly shopping for the free agent or trade fodder to help the team do this or that is pointless and harmful for this team.    

    The Brewers are STACKED with talent from the Bigs through low A .  The bats they need are already rostered and trading anyone off this list of men seems defeatist.   I do not think this Brewers team needs a thing to be champions.   They have the best prospect list in team history and trading those guys off for short term returns just is not where this team is headed.     I think stick, stay and make it play.

    I believe will contend for a LOT more than just another Central Division.   The Cubs will challenge this season but it is still our division to lose.    What happened in 2024 was unlike any playoff loss I have ever been apart of fo the Crew.  Every other loss we took over the years was a return the to drawing board endings. 2024 was NOT that.  After 2024 all I feel is that there is unfinished business and this team should have an edge like it has never started a season with before.     The team did not lose in the playoffs because we were outmatched.   The loss was a player Vs player  moment that we lost yet anyone who watched that game saw who should have won that series and it was NOT the Mets! 

     

    We will be contending in 2025 but what we will be contending for goes way beyond another division. 

    What else is new? The rest of the MLB talks about the Brewers like a joke and this is nothing new.   The day the MLB reporter speaks of the Brewers positively will be the day the asteroid hits the earth and we all become extinct.  

    I stopped listening to these things MLB reporting puts out a long long time ago.   The reporting on MLB baseball is a filthy hole for false info.   If the Media who reports on the Brewers got 50% of the things they say right the Brewers would have already traded off Yelich, Adames, Contreras and every pitching Star they have ever had.    The MLB hates the Brewers because they are not like them.   The Brewers operate outside the norms of baseball and they succeed without subscribing to the modern whims of baseball and for that they are reported on in a very flawed way.  

     

    The gatekeepers of baseball media are the jerks who have kept Pete Rose out of the Hall of Fame.  They are why baseball is hated today.    So I have very little time for their opinions.   Hell it took me all season to read this site without being hostile.    I simply blame MLB media for the fall of MLB baseball.       The only reason for its resurgence in popularity comes from one pitcher who is not even allowed to pitch in this league and the Fans ignoring those media voices completely and enjoying the game without them.  

    • Like 1
    On 2/3/2025 at 7:50 AM, Ro Mueller said:

    Replace Adames with a player similar to the value he delivered last year.

    Fangraphs had him at 4.8 WAR in 2024

    Their projections for this year:
    - Bregman - 4.0
    - Chisholm - 3.7
    - Neto - 3.7
    - Bichette - 3.6
    - Westburg - 3.6
    - Arenado - 3.2
    - B. Lowe - 3.1
    - Alonso - 2.8
    - Bohm - 2.8
    - Vientos - 2.7
    - Muncy - 2.7
    - Suarez - 2.4
    - M. Garcia - 2.4
    - McMahon - 2.3
    - Jung - 2.3
    - McNeil - 2.3
    - Arraez - 2.2

    I think Garrett Mitchell can make up for much of the loss of Adames .  Mitchell is going to have a big season and replacing the Adames thing I believe is already in place in house with Durbin in the mix. 

    Oliver Dunn is being overlooked,  Chourio is going to go off in year 2.  Mitchell is going to have a big season,   Caleb Durbin can hit a lot of balls. There is no one available worth starting over who the Brewers have on the roster right now.    

    On 2/5/2025 at 6:24 PM, jesusoftheapes said:

    What else is new? The rest of the MLB talks about the Brewers like a joke and this is nothing new.   The day the MLB reporter speaks of the Brewers positively will be the day the asteroid hits the earth and we all become extinct.  

    I stopped listening to these things MLB reporting puts out a long long time ago.   The reporting on MLB baseball is a filthy hole for false info.   If the Media who reports on the Brewers got 50% of the things they say right the Brewers would have already traded off Yelich, Adames, Contreras and every pitching Star they have ever had.    The MLB hates the Brewers because they are not like them.   The Brewers operate outside the norms of baseball and they succeed without subscribing to the modern whims of baseball and for that they are reported on in a very flawed way.  

     

    The gatekeepers of baseball media are the jerks who have kept Pete Rose out of the Hall of Fame.  They are why baseball is hated today.    So I have very little time for their opinions.   Hell it took me all season to read this site without being hostile.    I simply blame MLB media for the fall of MLB baseball.       The only reason for its resurgence in popularity comes from one pitcher who is not even allowed to pitch in this league and the Fans ignoring those media voices completely and enjoying the game without them.  

    Wow, just wow. This is an all-time rant. Congratulations. 



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