MKE81

While I did list a bench and pen I've already changed it twice, and will probably do so again now after thinking about some other things, but I absolutely agree with you. It makes more sense just to predict the starters given the bench changes annually due to later acquisitions. Pen as well even though I think it's a safe bet to accurately list half our pen for next year. I have this same lineup for starters except with McCarthy also listed as a 6th starter.

Position players - Susac, Carter, Villar, Arcia, Perez, Santana, Broxton, Puig - Pina, Rivera + 3 Arms - Guerra, Nelson, Davies, Peralta, Anderson, McCarthy - Thornburg, Barnes, Knebel, Suter + 2 (I like Torres back) Braun, Scooter, Maldy, Garza, Blazek, etc all gone. There will of course be other acquisitions or freak injuries that will change this prediction again and again

Anyone who actually reads this board knows that statement is obviously false. Even if its falsity weren't obvious, you haven't even tried to back it up. Making an obviously false, unsupported claim about how true and well-supported your own views are makes you look not very credible. When your false, unsupported, self-aggrandizing claim also insults the "majority of people on this board," it makes you look . . . just not good. There's strong, serious evidence that Garza has declined sharply over the past several years. People have made those arguments, and the arguments the other way, very well on this board. You should read it sometime. Your first line is false. People on this board have made comments about how Brewers fans not on this board know absolutely nothing, in general about how baseball teams operate as well as the Brewers. Back it up? So you want me to post a hundred links? You're a big boy so go do what big boy's do - research. Glad to see you speak on behalf of the majority of the board being insulted. Garza is a prime example of what I was referring to (I have read it, on several threads, hence not only my statement you quoted but also the rest of that same comment I made that you chose not to quote). Take your head out of the sand and you'll see it too. Peralta is another. Nottingham another. BRAUN another (go read the Alex Gordon thread where both players were compared heading into this season based on performance/comp/value/injuries - the general consensus was Gordon is better, especially for the value, and Braun needs to be dumped immediately (including citing the value of his contract, which the majority of people here were wrong in that regard as well given his contract clearly is a better deal than what folks got in FA this year and it'll only get better for Braun). I said Braun was better than Gordon in every aspect of the game over their entire careers except defense, and continues to be, and I literally was laughed at. I'll even cite Flores as another example based on my comment - people look at his overall numbers and say he's not even a halfway decent backup OF and has no career. Yet if you watch him play you see a guy who can play all 3 OF spots average or above average (depending on position) with a decent arm, understands the strike zone, puts the ball in play line to line and has some pop and base stealing ability. He's had a lot of success in the upper minors and needs a bit more MLB experience (see Hernan Perez). But he's written off because he's 24 and didn't perform amazing this year in his first year at this level. "There's strong, serious evidence that Garza has declined sharply over the past several years." Not sure if you're actually stating this or alluding to other people making this remark. But if it's you saying this then you're a hypocrite on the basis of your response to me. Since this topic is about Garza lets look at your (or others) statement while using statistics. Lets define "several" as past 3-4yrs. I think we can agree on that number. 2013 - 155.1ip, 150h, 42bb, 136k, 3.82 ERA (3.88 FIP) *split between Cubs/TX - TX 4.38 ERA and had 1 terrible start otherwise 3.93 with TX in line with career* 2014 - 163.1ip, 143h, 50bb, 126k, 3.64 ERA (3.54 FIP) 2015 - 148.2ip, 176h, 57bb, 104k, 5.63 ERA (4.94 FIP) *had 26 starts and if i recall correctly he was injured too playing a factor but i could be wrong. but in 21 of those 26 starts he had a 4.03 ERA, which means his FIP is going to be lower than that most likely given the difference between his overall ERA and FIP. 5 starts ballooned his ERA to 5.63 so he wasn't this unbelievably horrendous pitcher the overwhelming majority on here speak of* 2016 - 101.2ip, 117h, 36bb, 70k, 4.51 ERA (4.32 FIP) *missed first 2.5 months due to freak injury then came back and took 1.5 months to settle in (first 2 good, next 5 not good starts). since then, over the past 2 months and 12 starts, he's sitting at 65.1ip, 66h, 23bb, 48k, 3.72 ERA. in 10 of those 12 starts he's sitting at a 2.65 ERA. see above regarding FIP over these past 2 months* So, based on statistics, it's clear to see that he's essentially performed at his career norms the vast, vast majority of the past 4yrs. Where exactly is this "strong, serious evidence" spoken from with such conviction? To touch on Peralta as well, he showed promise/potential in 2012/2013 then took that next step in 2014. Last year, similar to Garza, he wasn't nearly as bad as what everyone says and complains about. in 16 of his 20 starts he had a 3.34 ERA. Those other 4 starts took his ERA up to 4.72. But when you look at his overall numbers it looks like he sucks. Like Garza, when they have a bad start, it's usually a terrible start (6ER in 3ip) that greatly affects the ERA, etc. Peralta this year started out terrible the first 13 starts - his velocity was down, control wasn't there and that all contributed to his poor performance; clearly things were wrong and needed to be corrected. But poor performance isn't always indicative of one's ability. Clearly when he came back his velocity and control were back - changes were made and his past 9 starts he has a 3.12 ERA, which is consistent with 80% of starts in 2015 and all of 2014. And he's 27. So basically everyone saying Garza and Peralta suck are looking at everything, over the past year or so, on the surface without digging into it further. These numbers don't lie. The only "strong, serious evidence" here is the general consensus on this site saying both aren't good. Hence my comment. Now, I agree that both players need to be traded but only because they're 1-2yrs out from FA. It's consistent with what Stearns is doing.

WOW. Davis does "well" in the field yet you criticize Braun as a fielder. I'm literally speechless. I also didn't realize making factual points is "whining". Good to know moving forward. And your analogy isn't even remotely logical. Someone who commits a lot of errors can improve upon that in a variety of ways - they might have the athleticism and soft hands to be good but struggle at the moment for whatever reason(s) but the potential to be good is there. Whereas Davis' arm is what it is. There is no room for improvement and the older he gets the worse his arm will get. Apparently you can't comprehend that people think Davis is a "good player" solely based on his power (ignoring defense) while I called him a defensive liability solely due to his arm. You don't seem to understand that as a fielder you track/field the ball and throw the ball. When you're average (at best) at one of those and the worst in MLB at the other I'd say that's a recipe for being a huge liability. I didn't say he was a "bad player" because of his arm - I said defensive liability. Players constantly took the extra base on Davis for years and the final weeks last year they started to go from 1st to 3rd at will on singles that were hit directly at him. Is it easier to score from 2b vs 1b? What about 3b vs 2b? If you don't think Davis is a massive liability on the defensive end then you're delusional. The arm is one of the 5 tools for a reason. Additionally, everything I've said for forever about him relates to his entire skill set. Hitting tool - 93% of his ABs he's completely and utterly worthless (statistics prove this) and the other 7% is him hitting a HR. Defense - decent first step and takes solid routes which allows him to be average at tracking/fielding the ball. Arm - worst in MLB for OF. Speed - average at best. How exactly does this make up a "good player", or in your words, someone who is "very underrated"? He's a DH and not a fit whatsoever for the NL. His slash line is also lower when he's in the field running around exerting energy as opposed to being a DH. These are ALL reasons why he was traded prior to this season combined with Santana needing a spot. Did you know that whatever Fangraphs says is the Bible? Probably did

He's certainly athletic enough. I did bring it up as a possibility before Broxton came on strong and they traded for Brinson. If versatility is his ticket to a long major league career, I'm sure he's not going to fight it. I'm still amazed that last October the Brewers took him off their roster. What were they thinking? I liked him last year when he only played two positions and hadn't flashed HR power but did show gap power. They were very fortunate he took them up on their offer for a AAA contract and didn't sign elsewhere. They were thinking that Perez has shown the inability to drive the ball and steal 30+ bases, not just last year but the previous years he had MLB stints as well. He was also 15lbs heavier last year and definitely not as strong as he is now. Is it really that difficult to believe? He made a slight swing change in the offseason. He worked extremely hard to put himself in the best position possible to take his game to the next level. Everything he's shown this year he didn't flash at all last year outside of good defense in the IF. I liked him as well last year as a backup because he plays good defense, is versatile and hits for a solid average for a role player. Plus he's young. There's no way you, or anyone else, thought he was going to hit 13HR with 31SB. Perez should not be seen as a "core player" with this org because he isn't one. Core players are players that you need. You don't need a Perez. But they're good to have. He's absolutely valuable given his versatility in the field combined with some pop and speed *now*. If Scooter is traded and nobody else is signed as a FA then I can see him starting at 3b but if he's in the super utility role he's not spelling Villar, Arcia, Carter much at all OR anyone in the OF if Braun/Puig, Broxton, Santana are healthy. And if we have a solid 4th OF next year Perez is competing with that person for PT in the OF too. He'll still get plenty of time on the field though. He should still be a Brewer for the next 2-3yrs+ for sure given the current state of the org.

4 of the past 5yrs McCann has essentially been 235/310/740 with 21HR, 65rbi (HR/RBI total last year was a fluke). And you want us to trade for him and pay him 17M/yr for that production behind the plate? Minus the HR total I'm pretty sure Susac and Pina, individually, would exceed those numbers for a very cheap amount. Not to mention Susac was a Top 100 in 2015 and will be 27 next year. He needs to be given the opportunity to earn that starting job next year plus we have around 5yrs of control too. We are paying Carter peanuts to hit 35-40HR at 1b with a higher OBP, OPS. So we're supposed to have McCann mix in there because he's a lefty? Labeling a 33yr old (next year) McCann as the "perfect fit" for this team blows my mind regardless if you want to win now/every season. And, no, it won't be until 2020 where the effects of the young kids will be felt. By 2020 Santana, Broxton, Brinson, Phillips, Cordell, Arcia, Susac, Hader, Ortiz, Davies, Woodruff, Lopez, Barnes, Magnifico all will have had 2-4yrs of MLB experience. The effects will start to be felt in 2018. By the end of 2019 we'll also see Bickford, Ray, Nottingham, Diaz. If Kirby, T.Williams, Kodi are sent to the pen they'll be up around that time too.

YES. Fangraphs must not have written an article for people on here to read detailing how an OF plays 9 innings of defense per game and how important that side of the game is. Davis, due to his arm, is one of the biggest defensive liabilities in MLB. His OBP is pitiful. His BA is decent. He's been 247/305 past 3yrs with no defense - if Stearns acquired this type of player you all would be whining about how much you hate him. Instead, he's being labeled as "good" and "very underrated" because you focus on one tool and literally ignore everything else. He's neither of those. Why aren't those 2 descriptions thrown around about Carter then? He's on base more and has 37HR, 88rbi while actually playing a position in the field.

Giannis and MCW will be running point along with Delly. Where exactly does Ennis fit in? He sucks too. The offense needs to run through Giannis and Parker. Not Middleton then Giannis and Parker - this will be a blessing in disguise. You don't lose the 3pt shot either with Delly, Teletovic, Terry + Vaughn if he reaches his potential. Monroe needs to be traded before the season. He just doesn't fit at all on both ends.

Broxton is under team control through I believe 2022. I'm always open to the idea of trading anyone but if he does turn out to be a 20 HR/50 SB player with top tier defense that he was looking like in the 2nd half, you need an amazing return to deal him after 2017. Like, better than the Gomez or Lucroy returns. You're most likely never going to see a Gomez/Lucroy return for Broxton (definitely not a Lucroy). Lucroy is a 2x AS and top 3-5 catcher in MLB. Gomez is a 2x AS with a GG in CF. Broxton is 27 next May and only has 1.5 months of quality MLB production and will never win a GG and most likely will never be an AS. I like Broxton, always have since the day of the trade and even more when I saw him in ST. The reality is he's not staying in CF because Brinson is taking that spot. And Santana/Phillips can put up similar or better numbers (outside of SBs) while playing solid defense in their corner spots having strong arms (Phillips with a plus arm). I'll take the guys who are 2-4yrs younger with higher ceilings. Then in 1-2yrs after that you're dealing with Ray and Clark not to mention anyone else acquired somehow. For clarification purposes, I would have no issue trading Santana and keeping Broxton. I just think you'll get a fine return from power/speed CF while being able to still have corners who are young and talented.

The answer is Brinson. Offensively has great potential but worst case he's average and a 15/15 player. He's a plus defender with plus, accurate arm in CF - he's a true CF who's known for his defense first. So whenever Brinson is ready he's taking over CF. Stearns knows teams value up the middle guys, which is why he acquires so many CFs as that's where the better return on trade is. Broxton needs a full year in CF to bring a good return given he's a legitimate defensive CF with big speed on the bases and will hit 15-20HR. So based on right now I think Braun is traded in the offseason then Broxton and Puig are traded before 2018 opening it up for Santana/Brinson/Phillips with Cordell as 4th. I think Clark will be traded at some point. Ray I can see taking one of the starting corner spots when he's ready, which won't be until 2nd half of 2019 or 2020.

Oh right it was PEDs. The magical drug that makes you triple your homerun total. How many did Braun hit in 2011? It was like 100 or so right? Name another player in MLB history that didn't take PEDs that has a minor league track record of not being an elite power hitter (by far his best season was 24HR in AA at the age of 24), hits 22/16/23/22 over his first 4 MLB seasons (those numbers are after extrapolating his ABs to match his 54HR season and also include his first couple prime years) then increases his HR production by at least twofold through age 35. I'll be waiting... Bonds, Sosa, McGwire, BRADY ANDERSON apparently didn't benefit one bit from drugs. There are different PEDs. Not all PEDs are steroids. Not all PEDs work equally in each sport. There are varying effects. I'm all for giving people the benefit of the doubt but defending Bautista as if he just magically put it together the past 5-6yrs is wishful thinking given his track record. Assuming Braun is being truthful regarding using to stay on the field down the stretch and playoffs then of course it makes sense his numbers stay consistent with his track record. Same as Palmeiro. Again, not all drugs have the same effects. Not all players use the same amount over the same time frame.

Since when have Carl Crawford, Ian Kinsler, Matt Kemp and similar ever been in the same category of Braun? Braun has produced elite numbers every season in his career minus the injury/suspension years. None of those others players come close to his offensive talent and longevity. Thats why Braun will never fall off a cliff offensively during his contract. The same people who see him declining in 2-3 years are the same people who evaluate solely through Fangraphs articles and box scores. The same people who we're begging he be traded as a salary dump because he had surgery in the off-season and other minor injuries preventing him from playing 155 games. I'll take Braun and 140 games over 95% of the MLB and 155-162 games

Mitch is a fine player. Liked him at UWM. But he's not MLB caliber. Should have a nice solid professional career in the minors

He struggled his first couple months at the age of 19. Final 3 months of the season he hit the ball like a Top 20. At 20 he absolutely owned A ball and he's a lefty playing SS (although he will end up at 2b). But as long as he's listed as a SS/2b (had 2x as many innings at SS than 2b) he should have a spot on the list that reflects that. I think Top 50 assuming he's strong in the AFL. If he stumbles then I see him Top 75 between Bickford/Phillips on the list.

Forget about Puig for like 5 seconds. I am not talking about the Dodgers finding a better deal surrounding dumping Puig. I am talking about finding a different big time player to acquire. In the off season there are going to be more players on the block. There are going to be other big time players on the block. Now will any of those players be attractive to the Dodgers and will they be interested in those players at their price tags? I don't know and none of us do. Yes, but once again I am not talking about it in such a general sense. A week or two after the world series very little is going on and teams are still processing the prior season. It is very similar to trading for players in June. The market just isn't there yet and nearly every team in every case will wait till the deadline or in this case around the winter meetings when teams actually start to move/sign players. Neither team has any motivation to complete this trade before things pick up in the off season. You can attempt to reframe your position to a general stance all you want but you still can't answer the question. Who are these "many teams" with these "big time players" LA could acquire that would prevent Braun from becoming a Dodger? You want me to ignore Puig and that's the problem because he's part of the Dodgers offseason plan. If we eliminate Puig from the conversation and apply your thought process then it still leaves LA with Puig on their roster and they don't want that. You're failing to comprehend that LA wants Puig 100% gone so if this trade happens then Puig is replaced with Braun and that's where it ends all the way down to the financial landscape not even changing. Literally, nothing changes other than 2 players swapping teams. How does that affect anything else the Dodgers want to do? LA would still have 60M+ coming off the books to resign their FAs, target new one's or make additional trades to fill in the pieces. All the other players are still potential trade candidates for the right offer (but if they're fielding offers involving Puig they'll have to get better than Braun to take it). But LA doesn't need to find a "different" player they like better, as in an alternative to Braun, they need to find additional players to compliment the existing pieces. It doesn't matter if you were speaking in generalities or not regarding the second point. It doesn't change the fact that something better can always come along afterwards. It's no different than anything else in life.

1. Puig means little. The real problem is the Dodgers finding a better option or at least something they like more than Braun. They liked Braun in August, but then again he was the only option you could get for that kind of caliber player. It is impossible to know if that will happen or not so early. 2. I don't see the Dodgers rushing to do a deal early in the off season. It isn't like teams will be lining up to get Braun. Dodgers will be like any team and assess what they have and their options after the season. It takes two to tango and there is little reason for the Dodgers to rush into a Braun trade and watch a better option pop up weeks later. I don't think Stearns will jump on the phone sounding desperate to get it done either. He will wait till other teams start to hop on the phones in December to see what other offers are out there. That being said I think the deal happens around the winter meetings. A lot can change quickly though. 1. Yes. That's the point I've been making since the beginning. The Dodgers are going to have problems finding someone equal to or better than Braun. Which is why you can't answer the question I've posed several times now about who are these "many teams" that are going to get involved for Puig. When Braun is sitting right in front of your face you don't kick the tires for a better offer. The Dodgers want nothing to do with Puig anymore and they get Braun to replace him. If someone calls they're going to pick up the phone but they're not calling every team fishing for offers. Correct, it's a 2 way street. Everyone knows what the Dodgers are getting for Puig (Braun). Very, very few are in a position to compete with that where it makes sense on their end to pursue. But everyone also knows that it's taking Puig + 2 talented prospects to get Braun. Meaning if the Dodgers want Braun they can't sit on their hands because every day that goes by is a chance for one other team to try to acquire Braun then they're still sitting with Puig more than likely taking a worse offer to rid themselves of him. Same goes for Stearns too though - given the size of Braun's contract (will turn into a deal for a team) not everyone can take that on in combination with his no-trade list. There are obstacles to overcome in getting rid of Braun so when you have a deal in your face that returns Puig + 2 talented prospects you're going to take it (especially if you like the prospects). The Dodgers don't need to rush just like Stearns doesn't need to sound desperate. What they need to do is have a conversation around who the 2nd prospect is and then it's a done deal. 95% of the work is already completed as it was almost finalized last week. It just makes an insane amount of sense on both sides all the way down to greater LA is where Braun grew up and currently lives and they're a playoff team. If the trade happens during winter, and not right after the WS, it's because both teams agreed to speak at that point in time - it's already been discussed. And a better option can always pop up after a trade is completed. That can be said regarding every trade. Also, while it would be fantastic to land De Leon, I don't think that's happening due to looking at what we got in return for Lucroy. Different positions, age, salary, years of control between the two players, and Braun is better, but for Lucroy you basically got Brinson (Ortiz/Cordell for Jeffress falls more in line with Bickford/Susac for Smith). So getting a 26yr old MLB established Puig (all-star talent) in return already I find it difficult to believe a top of rotation arm, who's rated 1 spot ahead of Hader, is coming along with him in addition to another prospect. I don't care how much LA wants to get rid of Puig I can't see them parting with De Leon unless we're adding someone (of course I hope I'm wrong). Now, I can understand a case for one of Alvarez/Buehler/Sheffield/Sborz as the higher rated prospect given age/level and I'd personally be extremely happy with that. That's what I'm expecting best case if this trade happens but I'm always hoping De Leon just like everyone else.

That is great and all but he already has power to block most trades. The only teams not on his no trade list that are even possible landing spots are the Dodgers and a long shot the Giants. If a trade doesn't work out with the Dodgers he might as well have 10-5 rights. I am simply saying a trade may not materialize period if the Dodgers go a different route which is a very possible thing. I don't think he is all but gone as the off season will give them many other good options. Possible? Yes. Very Possible? Disagree. Who are these other teams you think are going to get involved since you think there will be so many? You said the White Sox and Os put in claims too so there's interest on their end. But who are they trading that's equal to or better than Braun? I think Stearns is immediately on the phone the moment he's able to and gets this finalized. Clearly he's happy with one of the prospects he's getting in return and everything else is already in place - just need to finalize that 2nd prospect. I just don't see LA kicking the tires everywhere before making a decision with the Brewers. They're getting rid of a headache in Puig and McCarthy's spot getting Braun in return for 4-5yrs. No reason to look elsewhere unless you want a "not as good of a player as Braun" to give up lesser prospects.

Good points. He was solid last year with good BB/K ratios and take away one bad outing in April his ERA would be almost a full run lower (2.78). This year had a 2.32 ERA in setup role and since Smith/Jeffress trades he's 7-8 on saves (blown save other night shouldn't even be looked at as that) with a line of 17.2ip 2h, 0er, 6bb, 20k as closer. Same BB rate as last year but increased K rate by 3 per 9. The question for Stearns is if you get a great offer during winter do you pounce on it or do you let him go the first half as closer assuming he continues to pitch very well becoming an All Star while then having spent almost a full season in that role. He'll be 28 with 2.5yrs of control remaining at the break. If it plays out this way how much more do you think you can get for him next break vs this winter? I don't see a significant increase in value even with the All Star designation so I'd be inclined to take the trade over winter if it's great. People know what he can do

You don't have to if you don't want. He has top notch range and it's hard to argue that. UZR has his range at 4.2 runs below average on the year at SS. His range isn't good. His UZR/150 is the worst SS this century. He's bad. And he's been bad at 3B so far too but that has only been 330+ innings vs 2250 at SS. Are we still talking about Villar here? Do people watch games with their eyes closed then open them up when looking at Fangraphs believing whatever they say? That's the only explanation. Villar has great range. I'm perplexed as to how someone believes otherwise. One can have great range and be a great defender while another player can have equally great range and be a poor defender. Range has nothing to do with the act of fielding a ball.

You are delusional if you think Ryan Braun and his contract will be bringing back top quality pitching. Yea, because guys that OPS .914 grow on trees. And, as others have walked through in great detail, his contract is very reasonable. It would be a lot for the Dodgers to take on, which means the Brewers may need to take on a salary dump player like McCarthy from the Dodgers to make room. Once that is resolved, now you're just talking about value. And Ryan Braun is worth a top pitching prospect any way you slice it. I hear you but with a talent like Puig coming back, especially given his age, I don't know if it's a given. If Stearns lands De Leon it's an incredible deal but I don't see it happening unless we're kicking something else in.

I never saw that so I stand corrected. My 2nd point, the more important one clearly, still hasn't been addressed though....

Because things simply change. Once the off season hits the Dodgers will likely have other options they will explore. I have no doubts the teams will revisit this trade in the off season, but there is a reason the trade didn't happen. The teams simply couldn't agree on the return going back to the Brewers. Now yes they did run out of time, but there is no guarantee that more time would have lead to a better outcome. Regardless who knows what will happen in the off season as they could easily go a different route. Bob Nightengale of USA Today was on the Dan Patrick radio show this morning and he said this deal was almost completed but held up due to the deadline and they were still trying to agree on the 2nd prospect. He said Puig is gone for sure in the offseason and there's no reason not to revisit and both teams can get this deal done. That Puig has been a clubhouse cancer for both players and coaches - shows up late to meetings and BP. They want nothing to do with him anymore. My point has always been twofold - (1) nobody else claimed him and everyone knows what he's capable of. Sure, more teams might have the opportunity given things are always changing. But now everyone knows what was offered for Puig. It was Braun. A player who ranks in the Top 10 in the entire NL in BA, SLG, OPS and is 17th in OBP. Also ranks 12th in HR, 14th in RBI while having 80-110 fewer ABs that the Top 5 guys in those categories (outside of Carter). Give him Bryant's ABs right now and he's hitting 32HR (3rd), 97RBI (4th) plus would rank 15th in SBs. He very well might be the only 30/15 player in the NL and one of five in all of MLB IF he reaches 30HR. Again, (2) name another team where it's plausible they'd be willing to give up this quality of player in order to take on all that is Puig, McCarthy's salary + land 2 prospects (chances are not elite one's either)? THIS is why I think the deal gets done with the Dodgers in combination with they already agreed to all the parts outside of the 2nd prospect. I'd assume one of the prospects is still pretty strong and the other halfway decent. IF Puig turns it around next year, at age 26, and keeps moving forward in the right direction then teams will trade for him and you'll get Top 100s in return - he'll be hitting his prime. McCarthy is what he is and he'll be traded or walk in 2yrs. The trade makes sense on both ends and it might be the only way to the top prospects you want from Braun - which is through Puig turning it around.

Completely agree. Puig, while being a nut job and clubhouse cancer, is still an elite talent. There is no way the Dodgers are giving up one of their best pitching/position prospects on top of that + another top 10 prospect. But it makes sense given what people expected for Lucroy. I wonder if Will Smith is possible given they have Grandal for 2yrs more + Austin Barnes on deck already.

I highly disagree. The Dodgers were the only team the Brewers got that close with and the only other team on his no-trade list that has had interest is the Giants. The talks with the Giants didn't appear to get very far. It sound like talks with the Braves got pretty interesting(Chipper Jones getting involved), but Braun can block a trade there. Sure doesn't sound like there are many teams interested in Braun with the Dodgers/Braves being the only teams getting serious. Dodgers go a different route and its questionable if a deal would happen. Everyone thought Lucroy was all but gone before the season and he was here opening day. It only takes one team in order for Braun to be gone. Also, the majority of people thought Lucroy was gone by the start of the season but also knew he could very we'll be here in April and if he was still here he was 100% gone by the deadline. He would have been gone by April but offers were low ball due to the concussion. If the Braun to LA deal was almost completed, to the point he stayed behind in LA, then why wouldn't it happen in the offseason when the parts were basically agreed upon? Nobody's kicking down the door for Puig right now and Braun is a great talent they're getting in return. Who else is going to give up an All-Star caliber player to take on Puig just to land a couple strong prospects?

I think Brinson, Hader, Ray, Diaz (top 50), Ortiz, Bickford, Phillips, Clark are locks to make it (and I'd put them in that order). Woodruff - wouldn't be surprised if he made it or didn't make it due to age level for competition. He was outstanding this year, dominated AA in 14 of his 20 starts and his talent deserves to crack the list but I think age holds him back if he doesn't given he's 24 at start of next year and could be starting in AA for 6wks before jumping to AAA (could also see him starting in AAA). If Diplan has a first half at A+ like he did this year in A then I think he'll crack the mid-season list. Same with Nottingham if he gets back on track to how he performed in A/A+ but he might need a full season at AA to grab that Top 100 spot. Erceg I think needs a full season still unless he goes gangbusters in first half then could hit mid-season list.