2023 Packer 53-man Roster Discussion

[CheezWizHed]

I wanted to get this out prior to the preseason games just to get the discussion going.  Obviously, players splashing or flopping on the field will effect the fringe players, but that is the fun in discussing them. 🙂

QB (2) - Love and Clifford (McGough/or waiver pickup on PS) - Easy prediction after the Packers cut Etling.  I still think a vet QB would help Love more than Clifford, but it is pretty clear what is happening here.

• None. Curveball option: I wonder if Carson Wentz or Matt Ryan might consider signing to the PS to act as a player/coach for Love? If either is considering coaching at the next level, but want to stay in shape for a potential QB injury opening this year, it might not be a bad option. 

RB (3) - Jones and Dillon are locks.  

• Bubble: Goodson, Taylor, Nichols ( and others).  What I want is Goodson.  I think he has a lot of upside and could be a starter.  Publicly, the Packers are leaning towards Taylor due to ST.  Still Taylor to the PS makes more sense since no one is going to claim him (and we can still promote him to the gameday roster).  Goodson might get nabbed on waivers.

WR (5) - Watson, Doubs, Reed, Wicks, Toure are locks

• Bubble: Melton, Heath and Dubose (some others more remotely).  Seems like they have a bunch of WRs with similar upside on the bubble (though dissimilar skillsets).  With the expected higher usage of TEs and RBs, I tend to think we keep 5 and work with whomever isn't claimed of the three on the PS.

TE (4) - Musgrave, Kraft, Davis, Deguara - Another spot that is pretty clear.  Davis sticks around because he knows how to block and for ST. Thus no one is really on the bubble, so I think this only changes via injury or a waiver claim opportunity. 

• Bubble: None.

OL (10) - Bahk, Jenkins, Myers, Runyan, Tom, Nijman, Newman - First 6 are easy. I begrudgingly add Newman as a lock due to lack of competition at G, but he still doesn't look like he improved since his rookie year. 

• Hansen, Rhyan, Jones, Walker, Tenuta (and others) - I tend to think Ryan, Jones and Walker win out the last three spots. I'm personally hoping Tom takes the starting C spot.  But even if he doesn't, I'm guessing he is the top backup.  Hansen has not improved the last couple years.  I'm hoping there is a UDFA C/G that shows some upside to stow on the PS.

DL (6): Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Brooks, and Wooden are locks

• Bubble: Ford and Slayton (and misc others).  Ford is the most likely, but Slayton splashed in pre-season last year.  Ford is probably competing against other positions (i.e. OLB or S) for his spot.  Time to show if he can hold the middle as his best trait is being a large person and they don't make many of them that big. I predict Ford makes it due to lack of experience on the line.

OLB (5): Gary, Van Ness, Enagbare are the locks here.  I know, I know... I didn't list Preston Smith.  I'm going to be controversial here.

• Bubble: P-Smith, Cox, Hollins - Hollins most likely makes it for intangibles (i.e. leadership), but low upside as a player. Cox has the upside of a starter.  Smith: strike one = Gary returning; strike two = age and contract status of a FA next year.  If LVN, Cox, and Hollins all look good in preseason, I think it will be strike 3 and I'd explore what we could get for him in a trade.  I predict Cox and Hollins make it. 

ILB (5): Campbell, Walker, McDuffie are the locks.  Pretty easy.

• Bubble: Carpenter and Wilson are on the bubble.  Both TC and Wilson are special teams guys.  Carpenter has more upside and raw potential.  ILB is a good spot for ST experts so might as well keep both. 

CB (5): Alexander, Douglas, Stokes, Nixon - Again, pretty easy.  Only question is if Stokes is healthy.

• Bubble: Valentine, Ballentine, Gaines - Gaines seems to have some play as a slot CB, but otherwise a S.  If Stokes is healthy, I see Valentine making it alone.  If not, V and B (alentine) both make it. Several others will be on the PS no doubt.

S (5): Savage - I'll explain why I have so few locks, but Savage is the only one not really questioned as a starter (sadly).

• Ford, Moore, Owens, Johnson, Leavitt - The easy button is to simply take all three of Ford, Moore, and Owens at safety plus Leavitt for ST.  But I'm guessing that whomever ends up at the #4 safety (of Ford, Moore, and Owens) would prefer to play elsewhere.  And personally, I wasn't impressed by Leavitt at all... But since the Packers seem to like him,  Savage, two of Ford/Moore/Owens, Johnson and Leavitt is how I see it.  

ST (3): Orzech, Carlson  - Despite all the print on his TC stats, Carlson has really only had one bad day and has been good otherwise; including a nice job at Family night with a large crowd and bright lights. They paid for Orzech... it is his to lose.

• O'Donnell vs Whelan - Interesting and unexpected development.  Seems like the rookie has a leg, so the question is if he can hold for kicks.  If someone's punter goes down in TC, don't be surprised to see O'Donnell traded (or perhaps even cut) to save the $1.5M cap hit.  The rookie's leg might be worth developing regardless.

Prediction: 24 offensive players, 26 defensive players and 3 ST.

Especially this year, I have a tendency to prioritize upside and starters over ST.  The team obviously likes their ST players, but if we think this is a reboot year, it might be work developing talent instead. Though I was able to keep Wilson and Leavitt and justify losing Taylor (to the PS again) while keeping some upside guys in Johnson, Jonathan Ford, Cox, and Carpenter.  

What happens as WR might impact what we can keep at DL, OLB, ILB, and S however.  If someone on the bubble really starts to stand out, that might challenge the offensive/defensive numbers. 

[True Blue Brew Crew]

TE Davis out for the year so there's a fairly good chance it's now just Musgrave, Kraft, Degura at the TE position. Davis will have to be replaced as a key guy on ST so that opened spot likely goes to a WR, LB, DB, RB as opposed to an extra OL, DL, or QB.

[CheezWizHed]

19 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

TE (4) - Musgrave, Kraft, Davis, Deguara - Another spot that is pretty clear.  Davis sticks around because he knows how to block and for ST. Thus no one is really on the bubble, so I think this only changes via injury or a waiver claim opportunity. 

Well that aged badly... Sorry to jinx you Davis. 

2 hours ago, True Blue Brew Crew said:

TE Davis out for the year so there's a fairly good chance it's now just Musgrave, Kraft, Degura at the TE position. Davis will have to be replaced as a key guy on ST so that opened spot likely goes to a WR, LB, DB, RB as opposed to an extra OL, DL, or QB.

It wouldn't surprise me to see a blocking-focused TE picked up on waivers rather than another position.  That increases the chances of other other ST only type players (Leavitt, Wilson), but this puts them really short on TE blocking. 

Speaking of Wilson... well, not the LB, but the RB.  31 was impressive out there last night.  Nice vision, cuts, and speed.  And not a small back either.  Taylor outplayed Goodson also.

[BrewerFan]

19 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

OLB (5): Gary, Van Ness, Enagbare are the locks here.  I know, I know... I didn't list Preston Smith.  I'm going to be controversial here.

• Bubble: P-Smith, Cox, Hollins - Hollins most likely makes it for intangibles (i.e. leadership), but low upside as a player. Cox has the upside of a starter.  Smith: strike one = Gary returning; strike two = age and contract status of a FA next year.  If LVN, Cox, and Hollins all look good in preseason, I think it will be strike 3 and I'd explore what we could get for him in a trade.  I predict Cox and Hollins make it. 

Smith isn't a FA for 3 more years. He's just one year into the 4 year extension he signed last year and then restructured that earlier this year converting his...~8.5 base into a signing bonus. So his dead cap is close to 20M. Probably just a little bit under.

Spotract doesn't have the numbers right. They have the restructured money excluded, but he's pretty much a lock as a result. 

Even next year you're not saving much by cutting him as he has a ~13M dead cap hit...but you could trade him(basically give him away or he could restructure and lower his base...though there's really no incentive for him to do so other than to keep playing).

 

So I think it's 4 locks and Cox Jr looked...just outstanding last night. He's undisciplined at times as most young players are...I just don't know exactly what the kids issues were for UGA and UFA to kick him off their Football teams. They'd pretty much roster OJ post acquittal if he had eligibility left. I keep seeing fights. I'm HOPING he was just an immature kid and has grown up. I thought we looked deep here though. Keshawn Banks played really well late, Hollins showed...his same speed rush with a bit more power. 

Pretty distinct drop offs though. Gary to Smith to Van Ness/Enagbare at this point, then Cox, then Hollins/Banks and high effort potential STers. 

 

58 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

It wouldn't surprise me to see a blocking-focused TE picked up on waivers rather than another position.  That increases the chances of other other ST only type players (Leavitt, Wilson), but this puts them really short on TE blocking. 

What, 5 days later for Lewis? I thought of all the players, the vets, he was the ONE who it made a lot of sense to bring back. He's such as massive security blanket for a young QB. Not in the traditional sense, but just as 6 OL. And he was cheap. But you're still losing ~340 special teams snaps and Lewis may replace those on the kicking unit, but I don't see him covering kicks or blocking in the kick return game. 

Danny Glove's line from Die Hard comes to mind here when thinking of the Packers to get him to run up and down the field covering punts!

[HarveysWBs]

@CheezWizHed re:QB situation, I like the idea of stashing a vet on the PS in theory.  Ryan looked fairly washed last year, however, so who knows what he’s even thinking.  He would be great as a mentor presence, though, since he knows the system so well and played in it at a high level.  I think a Ryan pickup would be a great move.

Wentz, on the other hand, would seem to me to have less value in the role of player-coach.  From his perspective, though, I’d imagine LeFleur’s offense might be able to unlock some things for him that might just rehabilitate his career, if he could focus on staying within the architecture of the play design and just go out and execute.  It’s all between the ears with that guy, in my opinion.

[CheezWizHed]

40 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

Smith isn't a FA for 3 more years. He's just one year into the 4 year extension he signed last year and then restructured that earlier this year converting his...~8.5 base into a signing bonus. So his dead cap is close to 20M. Probably just a little bit under.

Spotract doesn't have the numbers right. They have the restructured money excluded, but he's pretty much a lock as a result. 

Even next year you're not saving much by cutting him as he has a ~13M dead cap hit...but you could trade him(basically give him away or he could restructure and lower his base...though there's really no incentive for him to do so other than to keep playing).

Doh! Good call.  Not sure what I was thinking on his contract.  But yeah, the cap hit makes him a lock for the roster. 

40 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

What, 5 days later for Lewis? I thought of all the players, the vets, he was the ONE who it made a lot of sense to bring back. He's such as massive security blanket for a young QB. Not in the traditional sense, but just as 6 OL. And he was cheap. But you're still losing ~340 special teams snaps and Lewis may replace those on the kicking unit, but I don't see him covering kicks or blocking in the kick return game. 

Just because the Bears signed him doesn't mean he stays on the team.  But I'm guessing there will be several block-first TEs available when cuts are made.

Some other notable good games:

• Clifford - Two INTs, but confident, moved well, decent arm.  The game is certainly not too big for him.
• Valentine - Lots of tight coverages. Opportunistic INT, but still has to catch it. 
• Wicks -Some good moves and speed.
• Reed - Very calm receiving kicks.  Getting behind the defense.
• Musgrave - I saw him driving a block up through the OL.  One time, but nice to see. 
• Heath - doesn't move like a "big WR" He has some wiggle.
• Carlson - Had a nice start before missing two Xtra-Pts. One snap was shaky.  I'm also curious about who was holding on his misses... 
• Jean-Charles - Lot of good coverages out there. Sticky in coverage.  
• E Wilson - Surprise best RB of the day.  Good size/speed combo. Nice cuts and burst. Could be a darkhorse candidate for 3rd RB.

[BrewerFan]

26 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

Doh! Good call.  Not sure what I was thinking on his contract.  But yeah, the cap hit makes him a lock for the roster. 

Just because the Bears signed him doesn't mean he stays on the team.  But I'm guessing there will be several block-first TEs available when cuts are made.

Some other notable good games:

• Clifford - Two INTs, but confident, moved well, decent arm.  The game is certainly not too big for him.
• Valentine - Lots of tight coverages. Opportunistic INT, but still has to catch it. 
• Wicks -Some good moves and speed.
• Reed - Very calm receiving kicks.  Getting behind the defense.
• Musgrave - I saw him driving a block up through the OL.  One time, but nice to see. 
• Heath - doesn't move like a "big WR" He has some wiggle.
• Carlson - Had a nice start before missing two Xtra-Pts. One snap was shaky.  I'm also curious about who was holding on his misses... 
• Jean-Charles - Lot of good coverages out there. Sticky in coverage.  
• E Wilson - Surprise best RB of the day.  Good size/speed combo. Nice cuts and burst. Could be a darkhorse candidate for 3rd RB.

Yup. Agreed on all of that. I said in the other thread, I think Heath may have made the team on that run blocking play in the 3rd Quarter IIRC where he drove the guy out of bounds. That is the type of thing to make the Packers coaches fall in love with him.

Jean-Charles, we've head about him for 2 camps, but this was the first time I saw it. I think we're really set at CB. 6-7 deep there. That might be the toughest spot to get a guy through waivers. 

Carlson was just so pure on those FGs and then the PATs looked much different. Like a QB or IFer short-arming the ball. Aiming almost. I think that's fixable. I feel better with him after seeing him, but you can't miss multiple PATs.

I think Brenton Cox Jr may have also put the final nail in Jackson Carman's coffin. He made him look bad. 

 

Again, this is how a young team that plays quite a few starters should look, but there were still some outstanding individual performances and...I think you hit them all. 

Musgraves was also just burning guys in the passing games, but each QB missed him. Kraft looked solid...though I'd like to see him fight harder for that pass that turned into a pick.

[CheezWizHed]

On 8/12/2023 at 11:36 AM, BrewerFan said:

Kraft looked solid...though I'd like to see him fight harder for that pass that turned into a pick.

Looked like the throw was behind Kraft and as he tried to go back (or slow/stop), the DB came in with all the momentum.  Kraft really didn't have much chance there.  Purely a QB error, IMO.

[BrewerFan]

11 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

Looked like the throw was behind Kraft and as he tried to go back (or slow/stop), the DB came in with all the momentum.  Kraft really didn't have much chance there.  Purely a QB error, IMO.

I'm not hanging it on Kraft, it was Clifford. But there was a play earlier in the game, Heath ran a comeback route. Came out of the break, the DB was about a yard behind him and on his back hip. The ball was inside a bit. If he sits and waits, looks to me like it's going to get broken up or it's a tough contested catch. It was with exactly 1:00 left in the 1st Q. Health works back to the ball. He used his body to shield the ball, came back to the QB about a yard inside and a yard back to the QB.

I'm not saying that's a play I expect rookies to make, but when they do, it stands out.

The pick was on Clifford...but the really good TEs and WRers make the game easier for the QB. 

Kraft DIDN'T use his body to shield the DB and didn't come back for it and Tycen Andeson took the ball away. 

It's not that it's Kraft's fault, it's just the type of things I'm looking for to see where Kraft's development is. 

It would have just been a really impressive play if Kraft could have worked back and used his body more...but again, I wouldn't put it at as a negative play for Kraft, just the potential to be a really positive play. 

[CheezWizHed]

Thoughts by position:

QB: Love doesn't play much, but looks pretty solid out there. Nice arm, and good decisions. Clifford is the surprise here though.  Really looks comfortable, strong decision-maker, understands our offense, and really has a good arm. Better than Brett Huntley ever was.  Better than Love looked like as a rookie. Looks like he is under-drafted as a 5th rounder instead of over-drafted as many thought. Will be a good backup with starter potential. 

RB: Goodson's injury is at a bad time.  3rd RB looks like a fight between Taylor and Wilson.  I'm cheering for Wilson

TE: Kind of quiet night.  Musgrave is ok at blocking. 

WRs: Toure looks decent at KR/PR, but I wonder if his tendency to cross the field is getting us holding penalties.  Heath is really fighting to make the team. Reed looks more like Cobb than Rodgers as a slot WR.  He should have a nice impact this year. 

OL: Walker looking good out there.  Nijman and Myers seem to be regressing... Rhyan was out there without any big issues. 3rd rounder without much competition probably means he makes the team. 

DT: Brooks really had a nice night. Wooden also looked good.  Hopefully, they don't turn into wall-flowers when all the starters are out there. 

OLB: Engebare... wow.  Nice night, good improvement. Van Ness just being "ok".  Seems to be in position mostly, but not making any big plays.  Hopefully that will come. 

ILB: Not much from anyone out there.  Walker was just "ok" at best.

CB: Valentine was really up and down, but I love his aggression and not giving up when he makes a bad play.  A keeper. Thomas had some flashes also.  

S: Really a lot of mediocre.  Johnson getting a lot of play out there.  Not doing much yet, but I think he has the best upside.  Owens batted down a pass; Ford had a couple of nice tackles; no one is really grabbing the job. 

ST: Carson had a nice night. I think the kid will be good, but it will take some patience.  Seems to be improving. 

[bjkrautk]

We tend to forget just how young Jordan Love was when GB drafted him.  He's still younger than his rookie backup (24 vs. Clifford is age 25.  The NFL Draft is largely about potential, and I don't know that Clifford will be significantly better in 3 years than he is right now.  That being said, he seems like a good fit for the offense, which is more important than any concerns he might have been over-drafted in the 5th round (vs. the 7th round / UDFA projection he had going into the draft).  Clifford is still the guy who forced 2nd round pick Will Levis to transfer away from Penn State.  The sense the offense won't fall apart if Love gets hurt - without having to commit big money to a failed starter from somewhere else - is a better situation than I would have expected.

 

Other observations:

Heath is fighting for the team keeping a 6th last WR spot, which is good to see.  Will be curious if the Packers try to sneak him through to the practice squad for depth purposes; do they see value in keeping an extra LB for a few weeks while Gary reacclimates to the workload (or if De'Vondre is limited at ILB)?

I keep hoping to see Tucker Kraft making plays in the passing game.  I know his primary role is blocking, but the opportunity should be there for a 2-way TE after the Davis injury....and the lack of targets is an admittedly a premature concern.

Nice to see Brooks and Wooden both flashing potential in the same game.  Don't know when I've felt as good about depth on the DL (knock on wood).

 I don't feel like I have any good read on our safeties, either in who's going to play or in who's any good.  

[homer]

I could see them trading for a safety or picking someone up after cuts.

[CheezWizHed]

I'm pretty convinced Heath is going to be the 5th WR at this point (Wicks still making the squad at 6th).  He seems to have a bit more speed than Lazard... though maybe that is just watching him vs backup CBs.  I wouldn't be surprised to see him get playing time this year in 3 or 4 WR sets so they can still do running plays. 

Safety... ouch.  Neither Ford nor Owens has done much... Johnson is contributing as much as these two with much less experience.  But that doesn't make him starter material yet.  Seems like Moore has fallen behind and his injury isn't giving any chances of catching up. Yeah, I'm hoping Gute can pull out some old Wolf magic and trade for a starting safety for a 7th round pick. Savage/<mystery pickup>/Ford/Johnson would be "ok" this year.  But still weak unless the pickup somehow comes through huge. 

I have fears that Wooden and Brooks turn into pumpkins in the regular season against starting OL because they can't stop the run... But still, it is encouraging to see them playing well. There is certainly some talent there.

[BrewerFan]

On 8/20/2023 at 8:28 PM, CheezWizHed said:

Thoughts by position:

QB: Love doesn't play much, but looks pretty solid out there. Nice arm, and good decisions. Clifford is the surprise here though.  Really looks comfortable, strong decision-maker, understands our offense, and really has a good arm. Better than Brett Huntley ever was.  Better than Love looked like as a rookie. Looks like he is under-drafted as a 5th rounder instead of over-drafted as many thought. Will be a good backup with starter potential. 

RB: Goodson's injury is at a bad time.  3rd RB looks like a fight between Taylor and Wilson.  I'm cheering for Wilson

TE: Kind of quiet night.  Musgrave is ok at blocking. 

WRs: Toure looks decent at KR/PR, but I wonder if his tendency to cross the field is getting us holding penalties.  Heath is really fighting to make the team. Reed looks more like Cobb than Rodgers as a slot WR.  He should have a nice impact this year. 

OL: Walker looking good out there.  Nijman and Myers seem to be regressing... Rhyan was out there without any big issues. 3rd rounder without much competition probably means he makes the team. 

DT: Brooks really had a nice night. Wooden also looked good.  Hopefully, they don't turn into wall-flowers when all the starters are out there. 

OLB: Engebare... wow.  Nice night, good improvement. Van Ness just being "ok".  Seems to be in position mostly, but not making any big plays.  Hopefully that will come. 

ILB: Not much from anyone out there.  Walker was just "ok" at best.

CB: Valentine was really up and down, but I love his aggression and not giving up when he makes a bad play.  A keeper. Thomas had some flashes also.  

S: Really a lot of mediocre.  Johnson getting a lot of play out there.  Not doing much yet, but I think he has the best upside.  Owens batted down a pass; Ford had a couple of nice tackles; no one is really grabbing the job. 

ST: Carson had a nice night. I think the kid will be good, but it will take some patience.  Seems to be improving. 

I did a whole 53 somewhere else. I had Wilson on it. I think we both agree there are players that fans see during camp and they get worried about losing them, but every team has that, especially at RB. But Wilson is different. I genuinely believe he's gonna be a starting RB for the Packers and an explosive one.

[BrewerFan]

The 53 is obviously the key to begin with, but NFL rosters now with new rules allowing you to promote two players each week and up to 3 times per player each year. So the practice squad takes on more importance than it has in the past, and the Packers use it as well as anyone. 

My 53

Offense(25)
QB(2)-Love, Clifford
Clifford has had one of the best camps to just ease concerns about the need for a vet. Reminds me of Taylor Heinicke.
I feel really good about Jordan Love. The patience he's shown, pocket presence, the way he's allowing his WRers to clear the backers or just hold the ball if necessary(see the Jayden Reed throw that was a dime) or just willing to go through is progressions and then check it down like he did with the 11 yard pass to Wilson.  He's also giving his WRers a chance when they're 1 on 1. The throw to Doubs was not the spectacular throw they made it out to be, but if you have good WRers and they're in man coverage, they have an advantage. 

RB(3)-Jones, Dillons, Wilson
Every year we get worked up about a RB. They won't clear waivers, etc...I think this year is different. Wilson is 5'11 230. He's the fastest back we've got and the difference between him and everyone else, he makes the right read. He presses and then finds the cutback lane or he just takes it outside if there's a good block. Taylor is gonna lower the shoulder and if it's blocked for 4 yards, he'll get 4. Wilson has looked like a replacement for AJ Dillon. Goodson is a nice back, but he just goes down way too easy. Nobody else of note here. Nichols hasn't played. 

FB(1)-Deguara
Just call him a FB at this point.
(I've heard they like Pearson a lot, but with only 2 TEs, I think you have to keep him).

TE(2)-Musgrave,Kraft
**I believe they'll add a 3rd almost immediately. If not the day or so after the cutdown, then by week 2. Deguara can also play
TE. Austin Allen looks like he moves well. He gets in the way blocking, but I think he needs to add 10-15 pounds to be that #3 TE in GB. But Musgrave is like 7/11, always open. Kraft hasn't stood out, but his blocking is high effort. 

WR(6)-Watson, Doubs, Reed, Toure, Heath, Wicks
I think these 6 are locks. Every chance Matt LaFleur or Gutekunst gets to talk, they bring up Toure. I see a little Robert Brooks in him. Just smooth. 
Heath has talked about wanting to fill in as "the goon," in the WRer room. Wicks seems to be giving him a little competition and Watson is also a very willing blocker.

Reed has STRONG hands. That catch vs the Pats was impressive. The ball was up and away from his body, good velocity on it and he snatched it out of the air with a CB on him. He just attacks the ball like a much bigger man.

OL(11)Bakh, Jenk, Myers, Tom, Nijman, Rhyan, JRJ, Walker, Jones, Tenuta, Telford
**Tenuta goes on IR immediately after the 53 man. They've said it'll be a lengthy injury, but I don't think they want to put him on IR and lose him for the year and I also don't think they'll waive him injured as he's been impressive.

This is where I'll likely be wrong. Tenuta I think makes the 53 and then goes on IR. I can't see them wanting to risk losing him.
Telford has looked good.
Bakh, they say he looks good, I'll take their word for it. Jenkins is all the way back. JRJ looked good taking snaps at C. Tom is a long time starter in GB. He's even showing a little edge.
Walker and Rhyan have looked VASTLY improved from last year. 

Royce Newman-I have not watched the All-22 this year, so I'll defer to those who have. I've seen multiple reliable sources say he's looked good the first two games. I don't see that, but...what do I know?

DL(6)-Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Wooden, Brooks, Ford
Top 5 locks, Ford has looked MUCH more explosive this camp. You drafted an edge in Brooks(despite the IDL body) and Wooden(a smaller DL). But mostly Ford has been with the 1's with Clark out and has quietly been one of the most impressive players at camp. Packers absolutely MUST get more out of Kenny Clark this year than they did last year. He is playing out of place IMO. He should be a NT, I wrote another 2 paragraphs on that, but the point is, he needs to play better.
I expect a big jump from both Slaton and Wyatt. Brooks and Wooden have shown their athletic ability on the inside. And as I said, I think Ford looks Night and Day different from this time a year ago.

Edge(5)-Gary, LVN, Smith, Enagbare, Cox Jr
Final spot between Cox and Hollins. Hollins is the more athletic guy, probably a better STer, but Cox Jr has just been a really good pass rusher and physical vs the run. Impressive how he can stack much bigger OL. 

-Deep and talented. LVN looks SOO similar to Rashan Gary at the same point in their career. Just relentless bull rushing, then turning and running and making plays downfield you don't expect a 270-285 pound man to make. I think he'll help vs the run, but he's our #4 right now. And people will say that's a bad pick if the 13th overall pick is 4th on your depth chart, but Gary has established himself as a premiere edge, Smith a very good one. Enagbare was very good as a rotational OLBer last year and this year he's taken what appears to be that big 2nd year step. I wouldn't be surprised to see Gary with 12+ sacks, Smith with 8-12 and Enagbare with 8.  I would consider it a success if Van Ness looks better week 14 than he does now and he's part of a rotation that helps improve their run defense. 

MLB(5)-Quay, Campbell, McDuffie, Eric Wilson, Tariq Carpenter
Wilson is just a good, solid backup and with Campbell banged up, I think you need him.
Quay needs to play smarter, play more physical. Much of that is the DL playing better and keeping OL off him. Pleeease Joe Barry, send Quay Walker on blitzes beyond the delayed blitz out of nickel on 3rd and 55 where he just waits a second to rush and the offense runs a little pop pass in the zone he vacated. He's the type of guy you have looping around Gary while he's bull rushing a OT, or run a little stunt with.
Campbell is a bit of a question mark. Came back down to Earth last year.
Carpenter  is a STs player. He's a liability if he's getting snaps. 

McDuffie though, he can bring the hit stick and play the run. Limited vs the pass.

CB(5)-Jaire, Douglas, Nixon, Valentine, Jean-Charles
I've heard at least one respected Packers writer say that Carrington Valentine has not just been the Rookie of the Camp or the surprise player of camp, but the BEST player of camp. He then went out and gambled on that TD pass to Boutte vs NE, but he's physical, he's been like Gorilla glue in coverage and he also looks like a VERY exciting young player. 

The Packers are hell-bent on not making Douglas a safety. Why? I don't know. Woodson was making that transition. Maybe it's just calling it safety, but Douglas should play less man coverage and more robber or zone. You can mix those up. Not every play has to be Cover 4 or Cover 0.

When Stokes comes back, ease him back in, but if Valentine is the player we've seen, if he's a player capable of starting, you need Jaire, Stokes, Valentine, Nixon and Douglas on the field together. Put them out there with Savage. 

Ballentine loses out to Jean-Charles, but it's a coin-flip and I think Ballentine ends up on the 53 sooner than later and will be a ST standout and competent depth piece.
Stokes starts on IR. 

Safety(4)-Savage, Moore,Ford, Johnson
I'd be looking at the waiver wire. This is just not a good group. I'm already pretty sure that they'll keep at least one more in Leavitt, but these are mine.
Anthony Johnson at least has shown signs. Ford plays hard. Savage plays stupid(ok, that was mean, but it's year 5 bud. You gotta know what you're doing and you can't dive at a RBs feet from 5 yards away. We've all seen your talent...this is your contract year.

--This is a black hole on this team. If the Packers start off say...5-2 I would look for the Packers to try and make a trade to pick up an established vet like Adrian Amos provided. 

He's to hoping that Anthony Johnson Jr can step up and be productive, OR Joe Barry is creative with his secondary use. I'd like to see the same ideology here as we use with the OL. The best 4,5 or 6 depending on package.

STs(3)
K-Carlson
P-O'Donnell
Wheelan has been the "talk" of the camp insomuch as anyone talks about a punter, but he hasn't looked good in the regular season. I could see him making the PS just because it's important to have continuity for the holder, but he has to do more than just see how far and high he can kick it in the modern NFL. You need to be able to pin them inside the 5-10 and he's not there.
LS-Orzech
When you get 300K as a SB and you've been reliable in camp...seems like an easy call, but can't say that I've noticed him...which is about as much of a ringing endorsement as I can give him.

In reality, I'm guessing they keep at least 5 safeties and Leavitt is one, Moore likely another. 
We probably keep Austin Allen until we find another TE.
We're also more likely to go with 9 OL than 10.

Last 5 in;                Last 5 out
Wilson                    Leavittt
Jones                      Moore
Telford                   Newman
Cox Jr                     Hollins
Jean-Charles          Allen
(Telford 6th)

Most likely to be claimed if not on the 53
Emanuel Wilson-Again, we see it every year, very few RBs are claimed, but I think he's just different.
Caleb Jones, Walker(I think he's a lock at this point) and Telford.
Brenton Cox Jr-I think it's more palatable for a team to claim him after the draft and after a very productive camp. Still has a lot of red flags, but his pass rushing ability is undeniable(and he's been very good vs the run). 

 

Practice Squad-16
This is more about which positions they'll keep and about the positions they'll try and keep depth at and some of the players they'll want to keep around.

QB-Someone. McGough seems obvious as he's here, but he hasn't shown anything. One of the players with a missed opportunity during the unfortunate injury vs the Pats. ****MOST importantly, Bolden was fine.
I don't really understand cutting Danny Etling. I guess the Packers felt good about Clifford and we can see why now, but...I think he's a very good #3 QB and he's athletic enough he can give you a lot of different looks on scout team.

RB-Patrick Taylor
He probably gets elevated while Wilson is inactive early given  his STs role.
Tyler Goodson-Great speed, he's got NFL size. I was excited about him coming out of Iowa, but just goes down too easily. Has big time speed though. 

FB-Pearson

WRer-Dre Miller
6'2 230LB WRer who moved to TE and now back to WRer with GB. Just too good of a fit.
9.6 RAS score, 19 reps on the bench, 4.50 40, he's got elite quickness at TE, good at WRer. But as I think he's worth developing.
Grant Dubose-Another bigger WRer. 7th Rd pick. 6'2 200, physical. Just haven't seen enough, but I think they'll want to get at least a couple WRers to the PS.
Deuce Watts, Bo Melton, Cody Chrest
Just a ton of young, athletic depth at this position. Dre Miller was just added recently to the PS, but he just seems like a great fit. Deebo Samuel size, better athletic ability, but he's only been here for a couple weeks. But...he certainly fits the mold. Could he be a TE/WRer hybrid? Is he willing to do the dirty work?  

I don't know who the 3rd will be or if they go 4. Cody Chrest put up a 9.77 RAS. Elite speed(4.38). He's got a bigger frame, made a tough catch. 16 reps on the bench is solid. Whoever the best gunners are will end up making this team. 

TE-Austin Allen, and again, they'll likely sign someone. Guys like OJ Howard are still out there.

OL-Royce Newman is a lock if he clears waivers and isn't traded. I think someone picks him up.
G/C Jean Delance MASSIVE 36 3/4 inch arms, good athletic ability. An outstanding developmental project.

I have a LOT of OTs making the roster, so I imagine this will be IOL heavy.

 

DL-Chris Slayton
Flashed last year. Hasn't really gotten snaps this year, but you need at least one DL.

MLBer-Marvin Pierre 9.08 RAS
Another incredible athlete. Signed with Elijah Hamilton after the Bengals game. Played DE in the XFL, but at 6'1 222, he'll need to play in space. Explosive, fast and again, will need to earn a shot on STs.

OLBer-
Justin Hollins-Good chance he and Brenton Cox are flipping spots here, but if it's Hollins here, he's got a strong chance to catch on elsewhere. 6'5 and long with a REALLY good burst. Along with Patrick Taylor, I think he'll be active early in the year as a core STer. 

Keshawn Banks has gotten a lot of reps the first two weeks. Maybe that's an indication they like him, but I don't think he's a priority.

CB-
Elijah Hamilton and yet ANOTHER of Gutey's RAS superstars. 6'2 CB who's fast, strong...3 cone grade was .95. So terrible for the CB position. I could see the Packers moving him to Safety or having him just play STs.

Corey Ballentine-Assuming he's healthy and not released injured, I think he's a lock. He's very close to swapping places with Shemar Jean-Charles here as it stands. He's stood out when on the field but how quickly he's back on it will play a big role in his chances to make the 53.

William Hooper-Not a RAS star, but he's not afraid to stick his nose in there and take on contact. What you're looking for, again, as a STer.

Safety-Waiver Wire Pickup 
First and foremost, the Packers have to be scouting the hell outta every other team and find a safety. Their best safety as we speak is the guy who was benched last year in Savage.
Tarvarious Moore and Owens have been running with the 1s, so as likely as not that he ends up on the 53, but if not, the Packers will try and bring him back. It's a coin flip between the two or both.

Bennie Sapp Jr has been impressive, flying around. He reminds me a bit of Ford a year ago, but I just don't have a good feel for what they're doing at Safety. 
Leavitt is entirely unimpressive to me, but if he's Bisachi's guy, he'll probably stick around.

Innis Gaines, Kiondre Thomas, I don't care, just find SOMEONE.

 

STs-Daniel Wheelan 
I think he WILL be on the PS. I think they view him as their punter of the future, he's just a bit raw. 

 

International Player Practice Squad
The first player
Kenneth Odumegwu -6'6 260 pounds. The former Soccer player who then turned to Basketball is an intriguing prospect. In it's early stages, the NFL Africa development program spearheaded by former Giants great Osi Umenyiora.

Just a flier, but the Nigerian has a ton of physical ability, but will take a couple years before hopefully becoming the first of many to make the transition to American Football. 

 

[BrewerFan]

14 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

I'm pretty convinced Heath is going to be the 5th WR at this point (Wicks still making the squad at 6th).  He seems to have a bit more speed than Lazard... though maybe that is just watching him vs backup CBs.  I wouldn't be surprised to see him get playing time this year in 3 or 4 WR sets so they can still do running plays. 

Safety... ouch.  Neither Ford nor Owens has done much... Johnson is contributing as much as these two with much less experience.  But that doesn't make him starter material yet.  Seems like Moore has fallen behind and his injury isn't giving any chances of catching up. Yeah, I'm hoping Gute can pull out some old Wolf magic and trade for a starting safety for a 7th round pick. Savage/<mystery pickup>/Ford/Johnson would be "ok" this year.  But still weak unless the pickup somehow comes through huge. 

I have fears that Wooden and Brooks turn into pumpkins in the regular season against starting OL because they can't stop the run... But still, it is encouraging to see them playing well. There is certainly some talent there.

I agree with all of this. Heath may not have run as fast a time as Lazard, but he's a smoother athlete. He's also not as physical a blocker, but he's absolutely willing. He just looks so much more fluid out there. 

He's already taking pride in being "the Goon." He looks faster and he looks bigger than the 6'2 he's listed at. I placed a lot of emphasis on RAS scores on my write up, but...those tell you a small part of the story. Some players are just better athletes than their testing shows.

Safety is not safe. That's...all you can say there.
I wrote about it, but if Valentine is as good as he looks and he's been even better during practice and Nixon has earned the slot job...well, damn, one Stokes comes back, just play 4 or even 5 CBs. It's Barry's 7th year. I get rotating guys in and out can potentially lead to communication issues, but what's the alternative? Sitting Valentine while playing Owens at Safety because you need 2 safeties? Just coach 'em up and hopefully Gutekunst can find more talent.

Brooks and Wooden aren't going to be beating starting OL off the snap or re-setting the LOS as they have the last 2 weeks, but at least we see some flash. Wyatt looks night and day different from last year. Slaton looks quicker.

So I wouldn't put a ton of stock into those two other than...there is some natural and instinctive ability there(especially Brooks with his pass rush).

 

Thoughts on Ford there? He's been in early and then they've taken him out. That would suggest to me, he's already earned his spot in the rotation wheras Wooden and Brooks probably won't be getting more than 10-15 snaps a game, if active, so they want to give them as many snaps as they can in the pre-season now.

[CheezWizHed]

On 8/22/2023 at 11:34 PM, BrewerFan said:

The 53 is obviously the key to begin with, but NFL rosters now with new rules allowing you to promote two players each week and up to 3 times per player each year. So the practice squad takes on more importance than it has in the past, and the Packers use it as well as anyone. 

My 53

Offense(25)
QB(2)-Love, Clifford
Clifford has had one of the best camps to just ease concerns about the need for a vet. Reminds me of Taylor Heinicke.
I feel really good about Jordan Love. The patience he's shown, pocket presence, the way he's allowing his WRers to clear the backers or just hold the ball if necessary(see the Jayden Reed throw that was a dime) or just willing to go through is progressions and then check it down like he did with the 11 yard pass to Wilson.  He's also giving his WRers a chance when they're 1 on 1. The throw to Doubs was not the spectacular throw they made it out to be, but if you have good WRers and they're in man coverage, they have an advantage. 

RB(3)-Jones, Dillons, Wilson
Every year we get worked up about a RB. They won't clear waivers, etc...I think this year is different. Wilson is 5'11 230. He's the fastest back we've got and the difference between him and everyone else, he makes the right read. He presses and then finds the cutback lane or he just takes it outside if there's a good block. Taylor is gonna lower the shoulder and if it's blocked for 4 yards, he'll get 4. Wilson has looked like a replacement for AJ Dillon. Goodson is a nice back, but he just goes down way too easy. Nobody else of note here. Nichols hasn't played. 

FB(1)-Deguara
Just call him a FB at this point.
(I've heard they like Pearson a lot, but with only 2 TEs, I think you have to keep him).

TE(2)-Musgrave,Kraft
**I believe they'll add a 3rd almost immediately. If not the day or so after the cutdown, then by week 2. Deguara can also play
TE. Austin Allen looks like he moves well. He gets in the way blocking, but I think he needs to add 10-15 pounds to be that #3 TE in GB. But Musgrave is like 7/11, always open. Kraft hasn't stood out, but his blocking is high effort. 

WR(6)-Watson, Doubs, Reed, Toure, Heath, Wicks
I think these 6 are locks. Every chance Matt LaFleur or Gutekunst gets to talk, they bring up Toure. I see a little Robert Brooks in him. Just smooth. 
Heath has talked about wanting to fill in as "the goon," in the WRer room. Wicks seems to be giving him a little competition and Watson is also a very willing blocker.

Reed has STRONG hands. That catch vs the Pats was impressive. The ball was up and away from his body, good velocity on it and he snatched it out of the air with a CB on him. He just attacks the ball like a much bigger man.

OL(11)Bakh, Jenk, Myers, Tom, Nijman, Rhyan, JRJ, Walker, Jones, Tenuta, Telford
**Tenuta goes on IR immediately after the 53 man. They've said it'll be a lengthy injury, but I don't think they want to put him on IR and lose him for the year and I also don't think they'll waive him injured as he's been impressive.

This is where I'll likely be wrong. Tenuta I think makes the 53 and then goes on IR. I can't see them wanting to risk losing him.
Telford has looked good.
Bakh, they say he looks good, I'll take their word for it. Jenkins is all the way back. JRJ looked good taking snaps at C. Tom is a long time starter in GB. He's even showing a little edge.
Walker and Rhyan have looked VASTLY improved from last year. 

Royce Newman-I have not watched the All-22 this year, so I'll defer to those who have. I've seen multiple reliable sources say he's looked good the first two games. I don't see that, but...what do I know?

DL(6)-Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Wooden, Brooks, Ford
Top 5 locks, Ford has looked MUCH more explosive this camp. You drafted an edge in Brooks(despite the IDL body) and Wooden(a smaller DL). But mostly Ford has been with the 1's with Clark out and has quietly been one of the most impressive players at camp. Packers absolutely MUST get more out of Kenny Clark this year than they did last year. He is playing out of place IMO. He should be a NT, I wrote another 2 paragraphs on that, but the point is, he needs to play better.
I expect a big jump from both Slaton and Wyatt. Brooks and Wooden have shown their athletic ability on the inside. And as I said, I think Ford looks Night and Day different from this time a year ago.

Edge(5)-Gary, LVN, Smith, Enagbare, Cox Jr
Final spot between Cox and Hollins. Hollins is the more athletic guy, probably a better STer, but Cox Jr has just been a really good pass rusher and physical vs the run. Impressive how he can stack much bigger OL. 

-Deep and talented. LVN looks SOO similar to Rashan Gary at the same point in their career. Just relentless bull rushing, then turning and running and making plays downfield you don't expect a 270-285 pound man to make. I think he'll help vs the run, but he's our #4 right now. And people will say that's a bad pick if the 13th overall pick is 4th on your depth chart, but Gary has established himself as a premiere edge, Smith a very good one. Enagbare was very good as a rotational OLBer last year and this year he's taken what appears to be that big 2nd year step. I wouldn't be surprised to see Gary with 12+ sacks, Smith with 8-12 and Enagbare with 8.  I would consider it a success if Van Ness looks better week 14 than he does now and he's part of a rotation that helps improve their run defense. 

MLB(5)-Quay, Campbell, McDuffie, Eric Wilson, Tariq Carpenter
Wilson is just a good, solid backup and with Campbell banged up, I think you need him.
Quay needs to play smarter, play more physical. Much of that is the DL playing better and keeping OL off him. Pleeease Joe Barry, send Quay Walker on blitzes beyond the delayed blitz out of nickel on 3rd and 55 where he just waits a second to rush and the offense runs a little pop pass in the zone he vacated. He's the type of guy you have looping around Gary while he's bull rushing a OT, or run a little stunt with.
Campbell is a bit of a question mark. Came back down to Earth last year.
Carpenter  is a STs player. He's a liability if he's getting snaps. 

McDuffie though, he can bring the hit stick and play the run. Limited vs the pass.

CB(5)-Jaire, Douglas, Nixon, Valentine, Jean-Charles
I've heard at least one respected Packers writer say that Carrington Valentine has not just been the Rookie of the Camp or the surprise player of camp, but the BEST player of camp. He then went out and gambled on that TD pass to Boutte vs NE, but he's physical, he's been like Gorilla glue in coverage and he also looks like a VERY exciting young player. 

The Packers are hell-bent on not making Douglas a safety. Why? I don't know. Woodson was making that transition. Maybe it's just calling it safety, but Douglas should play less man coverage and more robber or zone. You can mix those up. Not every play has to be Cover 4 or Cover 0.

When Stokes comes back, ease him back in, but if Valentine is the player we've seen, if he's a player capable of starting, you need Jaire, Stokes, Valentine, Nixon and Douglas on the field together. Put them out there with Savage. 

Ballentine loses out to Jean-Charles, but it's a coin-flip and I think Ballentine ends up on the 53 sooner than later and will be a ST standout and competent depth piece.
Stokes starts on IR. 

Safety(4)-Savage, Moore,Ford, Johnson
I'd be looking at the waiver wire. This is just not a good group. I'm already pretty sure that they'll keep at least one more in Leavitt, but these are mine.
Anthony Johnson at least has shown signs. Ford plays hard. Savage plays stupid(ok, that was mean, but it's year 5 bud. You gotta know what you're doing and you can't dive at a RBs feet from 5 yards away. We've all seen your talent...this is your contract year.

--This is a black hole on this team. If the Packers start off say...5-2 I would look for the Packers to try and make a trade to pick up an established vet like Adrian Amos provided. 

He's to hoping that Anthony Johnson Jr can step up and be productive, OR Joe Barry is creative with his secondary use. I'd like to see the same ideology here as we use with the OL. The best 4,5 or 6 depending on package.

STs(3)
K-Carlson
P-O'Donnell
Wheelan has been the "talk" of the camp insomuch as anyone talks about a punter, but he hasn't looked good in the regular season. I could see him making the PS just because it's important to have continuity for the holder, but he has to do more than just see how far and high he can kick it in the modern NFL. You need to be able to pin them inside the 5-10 and he's not there.
LS-Orzech
When you get 300K as a SB and you've been reliable in camp...seems like an easy call, but can't say that I've noticed him...which is about as much of a ringing endorsement as I can give him.

In reality, I'm guessing they keep at least 5 safeties and Leavitt is one, Moore likely another. 
We probably keep Austin Allen until we find another TE.
We're also more likely to go with 9 OL than 10.

Last 5 in;                Last 5 out
Wilson                    Leavittt
Jones                      Moore
Telford                   Newman
Cox Jr                     Hollins
Jean-Charles          Allen
(Telford 6th)

Most likely to be claimed if not on the 53
Emanuel Wilson-Again, we see it every year, very few RBs are claimed, but I think he's just different.
Caleb Jones, Walker(I think he's a lock at this point) and Telford.
Brenton Cox Jr-I think it's more palatable for a team to claim him after the draft and after a very productive camp. Still has a lot of red flags, but his pass rushing ability is undeniable(and he's been very good vs the run). 

 

Practice Squad-16
This is more about which positions they'll keep and about the positions they'll try and keep depth at and some of the players they'll want to keep around.

QB-Someone. McGough seems obvious as he's here, but he hasn't shown anything. One of the players with a missed opportunity during the unfortunate injury vs the Pats. ****MOST importantly, Bolden was fine.
I don't really understand cutting Danny Etling. I guess the Packers felt good about Clifford and we can see why now, but...I think he's a very good #3 QB and he's athletic enough he can give you a lot of different looks on scout team.

RB-Patrick Taylor
He probably gets elevated while Wilson is inactive early given  his STs role.
Tyler Goodson-Great speed, he's got NFL size. I was excited about him coming out of Iowa, but just goes down too easily. Has big time speed though. 

FB-Pearson

WRer-Dre Miller
6'2 230LB WRer who moved to TE and now back to WRer with GB. Just too good of a fit.
9.6 RAS score, 19 reps on the bench, 4.50 40, he's got elite quickness at TE, good at WRer. But as I think he's worth developing.
Grant Dubose-Another bigger WRer. 7th Rd pick. 6'2 200, physical. Just haven't seen enough, but I think they'll want to get at least a couple WRers to the PS.
Deuce Watts, Bo Melton, Cody Chrest
Just a ton of young, athletic depth at this position. Dre Miller was just added recently to the PS, but he just seems like a great fit. Deebo Samuel size, better athletic ability, but he's only been here for a couple weeks. But...he certainly fits the mold. Could he be a TE/WRer hybrid? Is he willing to do the dirty work?  

I don't know who the 3rd will be or if they go 4. Cody Chrest put up a 9.77 RAS. Elite speed(4.38). He's got a bigger frame, made a tough catch. 16 reps on the bench is solid. Whoever the best gunners are will end up making this team. 

TE-Austin Allen, and again, they'll likely sign someone. Guys like OJ Howard are still out there.

OL-Royce Newman is a lock if he clears waivers and isn't traded. I think someone picks him up.
G/C Jean Delance MASSIVE 36 3/4 inch arms, good athletic ability. An outstanding developmental project.

I have a LOT of OTs making the roster, so I imagine this will be IOL heavy.

 

DL-Chris Slayton
Flashed last year. Hasn't really gotten snaps this year, but you need at least one DL.

MLBer-Marvin Pierre 9.08 RAS
Another incredible athlete. Signed with Elijah Hamilton after the Bengals game. Played DE in the XFL, but at 6'1 222, he'll need to play in space. Explosive, fast and again, will need to earn a shot on STs.

OLBer-
Justin Hollins-Good chance he and Brenton Cox are flipping spots here, but if it's Hollins here, he's got a strong chance to catch on elsewhere. 6'5 and long with a REALLY good burst. Along with Patrick Taylor, I think he'll be active early in the year as a core STer. 

Keshawn Banks has gotten a lot of reps the first two weeks. Maybe that's an indication they like him, but I don't think he's a priority.

CB-
Elijah Hamilton and yet ANOTHER of Gutey's RAS superstars. 6'2 CB who's fast, strong...3 cone grade was .95. So terrible for the CB position. I could see the Packers moving him to Safety or having him just play STs.

Corey Ballentine-Assuming he's healthy and not released injured, I think he's a lock. He's very close to swapping places with Shemar Jean-Charles here as it stands. He's stood out when on the field but how quickly he's back on it will play a big role in his chances to make the 53.

William Hooper-Not a RAS star, but he's not afraid to stick his nose in there and take on contact. What you're looking for, again, as a STer.

Safety-Waiver Wire Pickup 
First and foremost, the Packers have to be scouting the hell outta every other team and find a safety. Their best safety as we speak is the guy who was benched last year in Savage.
Tarvarious Moore and Owens have been running with the 1s, so as likely as not that he ends up on the 53, but if not, the Packers will try and bring him back. It's a coin flip between the two or both.

Bennie Sapp Jr has been impressive, flying around. He reminds me a bit of Ford a year ago, but I just don't have a good feel for what they're doing at Safety. 
Leavitt is entirely unimpressive to me, but if he's Bisachi's guy, he'll probably stick around.

Innis Gaines, Kiondre Thomas, I don't care, just find SOMEONE.

 

STs-Daniel Wheelan 
I think he WILL be on the PS. I think they view him as their punter of the future, he's just a bit raw. 

 

International Player Practice Squad
The first player
Kenneth Odumegwu -6'6 260 pounds. The former Soccer player who then turned to Basketball is an intriguing prospect. In it's early stages, the NFL Africa development program spearheaded by former Giants great Osi Umenyiora.

Just a flier, but the Nigerian has a ton of physical ability, but will take a couple years before hopefully becoming the first of many to make the transition to American Football. 

 

Good stuff. I came to writeup my final list, but we are in 90% agreement... so I'll cop out writing the whole thing and write where I differ:

OL: I wasn't as impressed with the backend players and I doubt they would lose any of them.  However, I can see a potential Nijman trade - especially with Walker playing well and perhaps Jones there too. 

TE: This will be a waiver wire priority, IMO.

DL: We agree on 6, but I wanted to add that with the youth of Wyatt, Wooden, and Brooks (not to mention potential run support issues), I see Ford as important depth.

OLB: I think Hollins is a lock.  He has the least upside, but the most leadership at the moment.  The Packers obviously favor him. All 6 make it, IMO.

MLB: I hate to say it because I had high hopes, but Carpenter looks lost.  Hollins at OLB over Carpenter at MLB.

S: Moore has disappeared... Owen and Ford seem to be leading for the starter spot.  Johnson shows enough upside to not be cut.  But here is another spot for waiver wire pickups and/or late round draft pick trades.

CB: SJC has made some splash plays at CB this preseason, but I don't think it keeps his job.  Too many years of doing nothing... Another possible waiver wire spot?  Else Kiondre Thomas is the same age, but less experience and better size. 

[LouisEly]

I don't see a TE on the waiver wire making it on the 53.  Unlikely that any will be better or know the system better than Allen.  They'll sign a couple to the practice squad as a priority.  There just aren't many good ones out there period, much less good ones who will be waived by another team.

I still wonder if Walker playing over Nijman is because they think he's better or because they know what they have in Nijman and want to see what they have in Walker.  I don't see Telford or Tenuta making it.  They have enough tackles in Bakh, Tom, Nijman, Walker, and Jones.  Tenuta's injury was described as "long term", so I think they put him on waived/injured and sign him to the practice squad.  With the injury, unlikely anyone keeps him on their 53.

Wilson is forcing their hand.  If he makes it, then Carpenter/Leavitt likely both make it because of special teams.  I would put Wilson, Carpenter, Gaines, and Cox ahead of a 10th OL.  My guess is Gaines/Cox are 53/54.

[BrewerFan]

3 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

Good stuff. I came to writeup my final list, but we are in 90% agreement... so I'll cop out writing the whole thing and write where I differ:

OL: I wasn't as impressed with the backend players and I doubt they would lose any of them.  However, I can see a potential Nijman trade - especially with Walker playing well and perhaps Jones there too. 

TE: This will be a waiver wire priority, IMO.

DL: We agree on 6, but I wanted to add that with the youth of Wyatt, Wooden, and Brooks (not to mention potential run support issues), I see Ford as important depth.

OLB: I think Hollins is a lock.  He has the least upside, but the most leadership at the moment.  The Packers obviously favor him. All 6 make it, IMO.

MLB: I hate to say it because I had high hopes, but Carpenter looks lost.  Hollins at OLB over Carpenter at MLB.

S: Moore has disappeared... Owen and Ford seem to be leading for the starter spot.  Johnson shows enough upside to not be cut.  But here is another spot for waiver wire pickups and/or late round draft pick trades.

CB: SJC has made some splash plays at CB this preseason, but I don't think it keeps his job.  Too many years of doing nothing... Another possible waiver wire spot?  Else Kiondre Thomas is the same age, but less experience and better size. 

I'd agree with most of this. As I said, there are 5 or 6 cuts that I don't believe the team will make, but that I'd like to.

 

Hollins making it at edge is one. He's so athletic he should be a core STer, but I didn't realize he played only 8 STs snaps last year, but 37% of the defensive snaps in the 6 games after coming over from the LAR. I'd assume those numbers will flip. I'd like him more as an edge, but he plays lighter than the 250 he's listed at.

Wilson at RB may be a stretch, especially with what MLF said about conditioning, I just feel like he's a different back. I know people will vehemently disagree with this, but I think he may be better than AJ Dillon right now. At least AJ Dillon of '22. That's partially on Dillon who I think was a bit too cute last year. Rather than just lowing his shoulder and getting what he could, he tried to bounce it outside or make guys miss. He may have the same 40 as Aaron Jones, but he does NOT have the same first step. Wilson though...every time he's making the right play. 

MLF just said he might go with 3 TEs(Deguara being among them I assume). I'm pretty skeptical. 

I'm not sure why a guy like Maxx Williams(81.0 Blocking grade since 2015, best among TEs) is still on the street, but he's the type of player I think we need. Maybe they like Allen, but they should definitely scour the waiver wire.

 

DL- I agree. Brooks excelled at Bowling Green as a pass rusher but played his best when he was playing outside. He's not doing that in GB. Wooden also played edge. But beyond just needing Ford's size...he looks like he's quicker off the ball, more explosive. We'll see if that translates to any type of difference maker, but I agree, even if Ford is just the player he was last year, they need that depth.

Van Ness can kick inside, but they don't seem all that interested in having him get work anywhere but OLBer. I could see Gary moving around more this year, but that'd be primarily in pass rushing situations.

MLB-I'd be more confident in Carpenter to the PS or cutting him if Campbell was playing, but he really does look lost. Like he just has very little interest in sticking his nose in there vs the run. I think like Leavitt, he makes it almost exclusively as a STer. 

S-I think they'll keep 5 or 6, but I don't think there are 5 or 6 guys worth being on an NFL roster. Savage, Ford and Johnson are the only 3 I have some level of confidence in. Stokes back at CB when he's healthy...and I'd be very careful with him as he looked like a difference maker as a rookie, that should really push Douglas to safety. And again, call it whatever you want. Charles Woodson was basically a FS his last couple years in GB, but still listed as a CB. I just don't trust Joe Barry to be creative enough.

CB-That makes sense. Thomas has looked physical and willing vs the run, but it seems like he's slid down the depth chart.

Innis Gaines is another guy I thought looked good a couple camps ago, but like SJC, it hasn't translated. 

The top 4 though look really good. Jaire, Douglas, Nixon and Valentine...

 

All in all though, this is about what you expect out of a team during a transition. You could have brought Amos back cheap, but that goes against the whole youth movement. Tonyan might have been worth it, but after picking up Musgrave and Kraft, I don't see what he adds other than experience.

Musgrave already looks like the player I'd hoped Tonyan would become. 

 

I do think a 10 win season is attainable with this schedule, Love looking more than competent, Barry getting the notice that they don't need to wait until Week 13 to play more aggressively, could help. A healthy OL.

[BrewerFan]

23 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

I don't see a TE on the waiver wire making it on the 53.  Unlikely that any will be better or know the system better than Allen.  They'll sign a couple to the practice squad as a priority.  There just aren't many good ones out there period, much less good ones who will be waived by another team.

I still wonder if Walker playing over Nijman is because they think he's better or because they know what they have in Nijman and want to see what they have in Walker.  I don't see Telford or Tenuta making it.  They have enough tackles in Bakh, Tom, Nijman, Walker, and Jones.  Tenuta's injury was described as "long term", so I think they put him on waived/injured and sign him to the practice squad.  With the injury, unlikely anyone keeps him on their 53.

Wilson is forcing their hand.  If he makes it, then Carpenter/Leavitt likely both make it because of special teams.  I would put Wilson, Carpenter, Gaines, and Cox ahead of a 10th OL.  My guess is Gaines/Cox are 53/54.

Again, I think you're probably right about the OL. 11 is probably unprecedented, but they've been so vague with Tenuta's injury...we don't know if it's a 6 week injury or is "going to miss significant time," a season long injury? 
Telford, I think people are sleeping on him. He's a large man and has graded out very highly early on.
Just a little clarity with Jones/Tenuta's injuries would make it easier. But lets say Jones has a high ankle sprain and Tenuta has a more significant one. Then I think Telford's chances are dramatically stronger.
Caleb Jones played all pre-season last year, he looked dominant vs the backups, but he's only played a few snaps this year. And he was cut last year. So his spot feels pretty tenuous. 
I wouldn't be shocked to see Newman make the roster or get traded or if Hanson makes the roster. I think they're trying to avoid that by giving JRJ and Tom snaps at Center(Newman as well which helps his case).

In any event, Walker's emergence really settles that position down.

 

We don't need a TE who's going to come in and be a focus in the passing game, we need a guy, IMO, who can block given Musgrave and Kraft's inability there. There are also still a couple pretty solid FAs. I just mentioned Maxx Williams, he's a very good blocker and he's played quite a bit on STs. He hasn't played in a similar system however. 

If SF only keeps 3 TEs, I could see Woerner or Willis as possible waiver claims.

 

I do wonder if they'll make any trades. Isiah Simmons for a 7th round pick would have made a LOT of sense IMO. I still think there's a lot of talent there. And yes, Eric Wilson has to make the roster as their #3 MLBer. McDuffie is solid vs the run, but with Campbell in a walking boot at the moment, even if he's expected to be ready week 1, they can't go into the season with Carpenter in position to get snaps on defense. 

 

Innis Gaines...I have absolutely no feel for his chances to make the roster. Having played both Safety and Corner, plus STs should help him, but they talked him up two years ago and we haven't seen much of him since. 

 

[LouisEly]

Hanson was waived/injured; he isn't making the roster.  Jones is back practicing, so he's OK.  Tenuta is still on the injured list and not practicing.

Heath was getting some reps with the 1's today.  A good sign that he's making the final 53.

[LouisEly]

QB(2): Love, Clifford (PS - McGough)
RB(3): Jones, Dillon, Wilson (PS - Nichols, Taylor)
FB(1): Deguara
TE(3): Musgrave, Kraft, Allen (PS - waiver pickup)
OL(9): Bakh, Jenkins, Myers, Runyan, Tom, Nijman, Rhyan, Walker, Jones (PS - Tenuta, Empey, Telfort)
WR(6): Watson, Doubs, Reed, Toure, Wicks, Heath (PS - Dubose, Bonds)

DL(6): Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Wooden, Brooks, Ford (PS - Slayton)
Edge(5): Gary, LVN, Smith, Enagbare, Hollins (PS - Cox, Mosby)
LB(5): Campbell, Walker, McDuffie, Wilson, Carpenter (PS - Phillips)
CB(5): Alexander, Douglas, Nixon, Valentine, Ballentine, Stokes - PUP (PS - Thomas, SJC)
CB/S(1): Gaines
S(4): Savage, Ford, Johnson, Leavitt (PS - waiver pickup)

Special teams (3): Carlson, O'Donnell, Ozrich

Last 2 in: Carpenter, Gaines
First 2 out: Newman, Cox

Center/guard depth is short, but Tom can move to C/G if needed.  Tenuta could go on IR, in which case they sign a guard off of the waiver wire to the PS.  Walker could probably play guard in an emergency too.  Real chance that they trade Nijman, in which case they keep Newman.

[BrewerFan]

1 hour ago, LouisEly said:

Hanson was waived/injured; he isn't making the roster.  Jones is back practicing, so he's OK.  Tenuta is still on the injured list and not practicing.

Heath was getting some reps with the 1's today.  A good sign that he's making the final 53.

Right, it sounds like Tenuta is out for a while. A couple months. But I'm still skeptical they'll want to lose him.

I missed the news from Tuesday that Jones was back, Hanson was out. 

That's good news and makes it more likely that Telford is waived and placed on the PS. To be clear, I don't think Hanson is a good player, I was more making the point that he was their backup C and a team virtually always carries multiple centers...which is why JRJ, Tom and Newman were getting PT there most likely. 

 

I think Heath has to be a roster lock(or as close as an UDFA can be) at this point. Just more evidence that 40 times are grossly overrated. His speed, short area quickness, all of it grades out as poor, but he plays faster. I love watching that guy play. 

[BrewerFan]

47 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

QB(2): Love, Clifford (PS - McGough)
RB(3): Jones, Dillon, Wilson (PS - Nichols, Taylor)
FB(1): Deguara
TE(3): Musgrave, Kraft, Allen (PS - waiver pickup)
OL(9): Bakh, Jenkins, Myers, Runyan, Tom, Nijman, Rhyan, Walker, Jones (PS - Tenuta, Empey, Telfort)
WR(6): Watson, Doubs, Reed, Toure, Wicks, Heath (PS - Dubose, Bonds)

DL(6): Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Wooden, Brooks, Ford (PS - Slayton)
Edge(5): Gary, LVN, Smith, Enagbare, Hollins (PS - Cox, Mosby)
LB(5): Campbell, Walker, McDuffie, Wilson, Carpenter (PS - Phillips)
CB(5): Alexander, Douglas, Nixon, Valentine, Ballentine, Stokes - PUP (PS - Thomas, SJC)
CB/S(1): Gaines
S(4): Savage, Ford, Johnson, Leavitt (PS - waiver pickup)

Special teams (3): Carlson, O'Donnell, Ozrich

Last 2 in: Carpenter, Gaines
First 2 out: Newman, Cox

Center/guard depth is short, but Tom can move to C/G if needed.  Tenuta could go on IR, in which case they sign a guard off of the waiver wire to the PS.  Walker could probably play guard in an emergency too.  Real chance that they trade Nijman, in which case they keep Newman.

This is probably closer to the final 53. I'm still skeptical Wilson makes it, much as I'd like him to. 

-Jones back and practicing is big. It's tough with guys who are 6'9 370 pounds. I may have been thinking too much about Becton's injuries and how his injuries have been longer just due to the size(And the Packers secrecy). 

-Tenuta, I don't think you'll be able to put him on the PS with a "significant injury." I still believe you put Allen on the PS, and Tenuta on the 53, then on IR rather than pay him for half a season or whatever it may be, and risk losing him altogether. I don't think there's any real risk in Allen being claimed(and MLF just said they're comfortable going with "just" 3 TEs). So you could promote him for a couple weeks until another roster spot invariably opens up. 

I also like Ballentine, again, now that we know it was a minor injury. 

 

Newman and then Wilson would be the most likely to be claimed(if they go 2 at RB which again, I think they may). 

 

Dre Miller is one guy I'd really keep an eye on. Not for a 53, but he's just got Packer WRer written all over him. 6'3 230 TE/WR hybrid. Big hands, good speed, strong...and despite signing late, he's playing more snaps on STs than any other WRer. 

[patrickgpe]

Obviously the 3 weaknesses on the team is K, #2 QB and Safety. I have no delusions that this is a SB bowl team or anything, but I'd hate to lose a game because Carlson misses a late FG. It will be interesting to see how they handle this once the rosters are finalized on Tuesday. I think you can put Anders on the PS and pick up a vet kicker. I also think they Packers should carry 3 QBs on the 53, I like Clifford but I don't think he would be ready if Love got hurt and then you really have nothing behind him. if this was  SB team with a QB like Rodgers you can probably just keep the 2 and be OK.