Brewers (Misiorowski) vs Braves (Perez): 6/19/26, 6:15pm

[adambr2]

4 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

I will say it again so maybe you can sleep tonight. He was fast tracked to the big leagues because of his bat. Fine by me. Other aspects of his game need work because he doesn't have a ton of experience such as going back on fly balls at the wall. There are tiny holes in his game that a 4 year college kid who then plays 2 years in minors doesn't have. That's all. He's not a perfect player yet. 

Who called him a perfect player?

no one said he is. That’s a strawman argument. He is not perfect. He does have aspects of his game that are still in the development and improving stages.

None of that means he was rushed up to the bigs or did anything wrong in the 9th inning.

 

[Brewcrew82]

7 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

I will say it again so maybe you can sleep tonight. He was fast tracked to the big leagues because of his bat. Fine by me. Other aspects of his game need work because he doesn't have a ton of experience such as going back on fly balls at the wall. There are tiny holes in his game that a 4 year college kid who then plays 2 years in minors doesn't have. That's all. He's not a perfect player yet. 

He's been way above average to excellent by defensive and base-running metrics, too. Where are you getting this from? 

I mean what more do people want from a 22 year old whose production relative to his age is literally only matched by the all-time greats at this level. 

[adambr2]

7 minutes ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

I think the Suarez changeup was part of the reason for pulling Pratt back for Frelick. I'd have let Pratt hit, but there was enough reason behind the move to not have an aneurysm about it. Frelick wound up having a decent AB from the neck-up that ended unsuccessfully. Had a number of those.

What really ticked me off was taking the bunt off w/Ortiz after Pratt stole 2nd. Don't care if he was already in scoring position, don't care if it was 2-0.

Obviously needed the pitch to Dubon to be 6-8 inches higher.

The way things went it's kinda fitting that Eli White, from 200 ft away, puts his throw in a spot where you couldn't walk it into the glove any better. Perfect peg.

The damning truth is that as long as Mitchell is healthy, Frelick just isn’t a great fit to be on the MLB roster right now. He doesn’t have a skill set that plays well off the bench. Mitchell is better in just about every regard as a starter. 

So you’re left with a starter who doesn’t do anything particularly well and even with the matchup he wasn’t a great option off the bench in the 8th.

With Lara signed long-term and no service time considerations anymore, there’s nothing left other than MLB track record to continue with Frelick up over Lara, and even that argument is losing steam quickly. 

[wiguy94]

1 hour ago, yourout said:

It wasn't down. It could have been a little higher but it wasn't down. 

He was sitting on a fastball and he has a very short swing.

I agree with you. He was way out in front of the cutter low and away on the previous pitch. Clearly was selling out for a FB. Played into what the hitter was swinging for. Think on most nights you could get away with it but tonight Misiorowski wasn't getting his FB up as much as he usually does. If that FB is at the top rail of the zone you probably get a pop up or swing and miss but he just wasn't hitting those spots tonight. Should have doubled up on the cutter away. 

[Jim French Stepstool]

2 minutes ago, yfinn6 said:

This organization isn't going to keep him in the minor leagues with that bat when his glove isn't "Gold Glove Caliber". 

Saying he was rushed to the big leagues is crazy town talk when he's been one of our better offensive players, which is why he was here early. Like he's supposed to rob a homerun that is clearly over the fence or he's supposed to slide the right way? This guy is responsible for so much offense on the team it's picking nits on plays that he only has so much control. Robbing a homerun is really hard, and hopefully he'll figure it out. Sliding incorrectly? The ball got there when he did. There wasn't anything to change that would've changed the outcome other than Chourio being like 2 steps faster to initiate the slide you've brought up. 

 

Agreed. And re the slide---when the throw comes to a catcher & the contact---in this case Chourios' knee---is almost simultaneous, the ball popping loose is pretty commonplace. Just a hell of a throw, hell of a tag. And without blocking the plate, either.

[Bulldogboy]

5 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

Who called him a perfect player?

no one said he is. That’s a strawman argument. He is not perfect. He does have aspects of his game that are still in the development and improving stages.

None of that means he was rushed up to the bigs or did anything wrong in the 9th inning.

 

He was rushed to the show because his bat was ready ahead of the rest of his game. Period. My opinion you can have yours. Watch him play every day. Outside of hitting what else is above mlb average?

[Bulldogboy]

8 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

He's been way above average to excellent by defensive and base-running metrics, too. Where are you getting this from? 

I mean what more do people want from a 22 year old whose production relative to his age is literally only matched by the all-time greats at this level. 

I was waiting for you to jump in with nonsense talk per usual. I love baserunning metric talk. 😆 

[Brewcrew82]

Just now, Bulldogboy said:

I was waiting for you to jump in with nonsense talk per usual. I love baserunning metric talk. 😆 

I mean saying Chourio was rushed to the show is straight up nonsense to any reasonable observer lol

[adambr2]

1 minute ago, Bulldogboy said:

He was rushed to the show because his bat was ready ahead of the rest of his game. Period. My opinion you can have yours. Watch him play every day. Outside of hitting what else is above mlb average?

Both his baserunning and defense grade out as above average.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jackson-chourio/28806/stats/batting
 

so in SPITE of having things to work on the other non-hitting parts of his game already grade out at an acceptable level with room to improve.

[Bulldogboy]

13 minutes ago, yfinn6 said:

This organization isn't going to keep him in the minor leagues with that bat when his glove isn't "Gold Glove Caliber". 

Saying he was rushed to the big leagues is crazy town talk when he's been one of our better offensive players, which is why he was here early. Like he's supposed to rob a homerun that is clearly over the fence or he's supposed to slide the right way? This guy is responsible for so much offense on the team it's picking nits on plays that he only has so much control. Robbing a homerun is really hard, and hopefully he'll figure it out. Sliding incorrectly? The ball got there when he did. There wasn't anything to change that would've changed the outcome other than Chourio being like 2 steps faster to initiate the slide you've brought up. 

 

Insane response 

[Bulldogboy]

Just now, adambr2 said:

Both his baserunning and defense grade out as above average.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jackson-chourio/28806/stats/batting
 

so in SPITE of having things to work on the other non-hitting parts of his game already grade out at an acceptable level with room to improve.

OK I guess you win. You submitted me with stats. You got it

[wiguy94]

20 minutes ago, jason21nl said:

And it still took a miracle for the catcher to hold on to the ball.  That’s a good baseball play all around.  Minus our catcher not directing the runner where to slide or our star 2b moving up to second on the throw.  

Yeah I have no idea what Turang was doing to not end up on 2B there. If they cut it and throw you out at 2B the game is tied which is a good outcome. In that specific situation there's not reason not to go to 2B

[Jim French Stepstool]

3 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

The damning truth is that as long as Mitchell is healthy, Frelick just isn’t a great fit to be on the MLB roster right now. He doesn’t have a skill set that plays well off the bench. Mitchell is better in just about every regard as a starter. 

So you’re left with a starter who doesn’t do anything particularly well and even with the matchup he wasn’t a great option off the bench in the 8th.

With Lara signed long-term and no service time considerations anymore, there’s nothing left other than MLB track record to continue with Frelick up over Lara, and even that argument is losing steam quickly. 

I'll stand by the decision to hit him for Pratt there, but as I said IMO it wasn't a slam dunk either way.

Big picture, you have a point; I wouldn't mind seeing Lara. But he's 7-42 in June & had a week or so of not playing when he signed the contract. And if none of that happened & he stayed hot it would've been Perkins getting demoted, not Frelick. Barring injury I just don't see anything happening with this OF until Lockridge makes it back.

[yfinn6]

3 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

Insane response 

What a compelling argument!

[trwi7]

9 minutes ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

Not one playing in his fourth game vs a change of that quality, IMO. Frelick worked himself into a great count, then had Suarez get a glove on a ball that might've otherwise made it through. As I said I'd have rolled with Prtatt, but it wasn't a slam dunk call. Lots of 3-1, 3-2 counts for hitters tonite that didn't end up in baserunners. Add that one to the list.

Yes against one playing his fourth game.  There's a reason changeups are mostly used against opposite handed hitters.  You use a changeup as a RHP to a RHH and it moves right into the hitters wheelhouse..  Just look at his splits this year.  .525 OPS allowed vs RHB, .345 vs LHB.

[adambr2]

12 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

He's been way above average to excellent by defensive and base-running metrics, too. Where are you getting this from? 

I mean what more do people want from a 22 year old whose production relative to his age is literally only matched by the all-time greats at this level. 

In late 1977, Robin Yount was the exact same age as Jackson Chourio is now in years and days.

At that time, Yount had accumulated 6.9 WAR in his career,

Jackson has accumulated 7.9 WAR so far. And Yount had already completed 4 seasons. He was “rushed” up to the big leagues at 18 years old.  

I mean Jackson has accomplished things that literally no Brewer in history had accomplished by his age. I have no idea how this is even a discussion.

[Yaz19]

What is all of this talk about Chourio being rushed???!!!!!!!

[Brewcrew82]

10 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

He was rushed to the show because his bat was ready ahead of the rest of his game. Period. My opinion you can have yours. Watch him play every day. Outside of hitting what else is above mlb average?

Literally everything. https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jackson-chourio/28806/stats/batting, https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/jackson-chourio-694192

You have nothing other than your "opinion" which is easily falsifiable in this case. 

[adambr2]

2 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

OK I guess you win. You submitted me with stats. You got it

Whatever it takes I guess, because holy hell this is one crazy hill to die on.

[Bulldogboy]

2 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Literally everything. https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jackson-chourio/28806/stats/batting, https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/jackson-chourio-694192

You have nothing other than your opinion which is easily falsifiable. 

Believe it or not that all we all have. You have zero baseball knowledge outside your couch so we will have to leave it there.

[wiguy94]

2 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

Whatever it takes I guess, because holy hell this is one crazy hill to die on.

Be ready for him to mention how everyone told him he was wrong any time Chourio doesn't have a good moment the next few weeks like he did with Mitchell when I said Mitchell didn't need to pick it up.

[endaround]

I guess Chourio has become the Brewers' best player because that is the only thing that makes sense to blame him for that play in that fans always blame the team's best player for all loses. Chourio was tagged right when he began his slide. He was out by a good 3 feet. There isn't some special slide that would save him. With only one out he probably shouldn't have been sent.

[Bulldogboy]

2 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

Whatever it takes I guess, because holy hell this is one crazy hill to die on.

No you are right Chourio is basically a cross between Buxton in the field and prime Ricky Henderson on the bases. 

[Brewcrew82]

2 minutes ago, Bulldogboy said:

Believe it or not that all we all have. You have zero baseball knowledge outside your couch so we will have to leave it there.

Yes playing college ball gives me zero baseball knowledge outside my coach. Insane. 

[jason21nl]

I think Ortiz makes the play that Pratt kinda held back on but Pratt has already been more fun to watch than both Ortiz and Rengifo that I’m OK with the play not being made…even if not making the play hurt us