Packers 2022 Discussion Thread

[madbad2000]

1 hour ago, PeaveyFury said:

I think the issue with that, though, is that these teams are clearly willing to move Hunt, Adams, apparently McLaurin, etc. because of that draft depth at the position. At what point does the demand for receivers in the draft start to squeeze the teams that are looking there to fill needs? At some point, these guys we think are going to be there in the mid/late 2nd might not be because everyone else is picking them earlier.

That is a very real concern which makes teams that need a WR possibly change direction.  If the Jets were thinking WR at top of 2, maybe they grab one of the alphas of the class at 10 and further mess things up. Or maybe a team like Chicago sitting at 38 decides to make a trade for one of these studs like Metcalf because they could be looking at anywhere from 8+ WR gone before their pick.  I'm very curious how things will shake out.

[nate82]

5 minutes ago, madbad2000 said:

That is a very real concern which makes teams that need a WR possibly change direction.  If the Jets were thinking WR at top of 2, maybe they grab one of the alphas of the class at 10 and further mess things up. Or maybe a team like Chicago sitting at 38 decides to make a trade for one of these studs like Metcalf because they could be looking at anywhere from 8+ WR gone before their pick.  I'm very curious how things will shake out.

Chicago is probably going to go defense or offensive line with their first pick in the 2nd round unless one of the WR drops to them.  I don't see them trading out of that pick to move up or for someone like Metcalf.  The current GM in Chicago is a question mark as there isn't much information out there on what he will do.  I am thinking he may trade out of his first pick if there isn't a CB or WR that he likes at 38 and gets an additional 2nd or 3rd pick.  

[LouisEly]

Keep in mind, it takes a while to earn Rodgers trust.  To bring in a couple of high draft picks... they aren't likely going to get on the same page quickly, or at least as quickly as a guy who has been in the league for three years. And high draft picks do bust, especially WRs (John Ross, Corey Coleman, Josh Doctson, Laquan Treadwell, Kevin White, Tavon Austin, Justin Blackmon, A.J. Jenkins, etc.)

The Packers got a 1st and 2nd for Adams... if they trade that 1st for a guy such as Metcalf or McLaurin the net effect is Adams for McLaurin/Metcalf and a 2nd plus (temporary) salary cap relief.  I don't think Metcalf or McLaurin have done enough to get Adams money, so the Packers net a 2nd round pick, cap space, and a guy who is 4/5 years younger than Adams.

The Packers are obviously in win-now mode.  I'd part with one of the two 1sts for either Metcalf or McLaurin to eliminate the bust risk..

[adambr2]

21 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

Keep in mind, it takes a while to earn Rodgers trust.  To bring in a couple of high draft picks... they aren't likely going to get on the same page quickly, or at least as quickly as a guy who has been in the league for three years. And high draft picks do bust, especially WRs (John Ross, Corey Coleman, Josh Doctson, Laquan Treadwell, Kevin White, Tavon Austin, Justin Blackmon, A.J. Jenkins, etc.)

The Packers got a 1st and 2nd for Adams... if they trade that 1st for a guy such as Metcalf or McLaurin the net effect is Adams for McLaurin/Metcalf and a 2nd plus (temporary) salary cap relief.  I don't think Metcalf or McLaurin have done enough to get Adams money, so the Packers net a 2nd round pick, cap space, and a guy who is 4/5 years younger than Adams.

The Packers are obviously in win-now mode.  I'd part with one of the two 1sts for either Metcalf or McLaurin to eliminate the bust risk..

Davante's deal is essentially 3 years/67.5M. He's almost certain to be a cap casualty after 2024.

I'd be stunned if Metcalf and McLaurin don't do better than that on an extension. 

[madbad2000]

11 hours ago, nate82 said:

Chicago is probably going to go defense or offensive line with their first pick in the 2nd round unless one of the WR drops to them.  I don't see them trading out of that pick to move up or for someone like Metcalf.  The current GM in Chicago is a question mark as there isn't much information out there on what he will do.  I am thinking he may trade out of his first pick if there isn't a CB or WR that he likes at 38 and gets an additional 2nd or 3rd pick.  

Before all of these draft picks and WR getting traded, I believe the Bears were set on WR and OL with their 2 2nds.  With the way things are looking and the likely run of WR and OL in the mid to late first, he may decide it's not great value to take his 6 or 7th best Wr or OL.  I would be mildly shocked if they go defense at 39. Everything is aimed at building up the supporting cast around Fields.  Poles has already shown to be a patient person and he seems to have a plan in place.  If they traded 39+ for Metcalf, they can easily sign him to a big extension and pair Fields up with a younger, explosive WR that fits his skill set perfectly.  It's just icing on the cake that Metcalf grew up a Bears fan and would instantly be a fan favorite.  Barring all of this excitement, I would anticipate at least one trade down in the second round.  I see a lot of value in the end of the second through the 3rd.  If there is a run on wr and ol, there will be some great defensive prospects there at 39 that a team will want to move up to get. 

[nate82]

4 hours ago, madbad2000 said:

Before all of these draft picks and WR getting traded, I believe the Bears were set on WR and OL with their 2 2nds.  With the way things are looking and the likely run of WR and OL in the mid to late first, he may decide it's not great value to take his 6 or 7th best Wr or OL.  I would be mildly shocked if they go defense at 39. Everything is aimed at building up the supporting cast around Fields.  Poles has already shown to be a patient person and he seems to have a plan in place.  If they traded 39+ for Metcalf, they can easily sign him to a big extension and pair Fields up with a younger, explosive WR that fits his skill set perfectly.  It's just icing on the cake that Metcalf grew up a Bears fan and would instantly be a fan favorite.  Barring all of this excitement, I would anticipate at least one trade down in the second round.  I see a lot of value in the end of the second through the 3rd.  If there is a run on wr and ol, there will be some great defensive prospects there at 39 that a team will want to move up to get. 

The Bears are thin at DB, DL and LB.  Their biggest need is WR and OL but they do have other holes that they need to fill mainly at DB.  

[madbad2000]

36 minutes ago, nate82 said:

The Bears are thin at DB, DL and LB.  Their biggest need is WR and OL but they do have other holes that they need to fill mainly at DB.  

The Bears are thin across the board and that's partly a product of the redesign of the team under new leadership and the depth pieces that didn't pan out from the previous regime.  The Bears need multiple WRs and multiple OL (one G - one T) for starting positions, On defense they need a Safety to pair with Jackson,  a nickel CB, a #2 CB, one more LB (will or mike depending on where Smith plays) and need a starting punter.  They also need another depth TE, a 3rd RB and could use another DL or two for depth plus other STs/developmental pieces.

Scheme plays a big part in valuations and I like the Eberflus defense/Getsy offense coming over into Chicago.  In terms of importance for the Bears scheme: the OL (any scheme really), 1 WR (at least) with deep speed, starting LB and Nickel corner are probably the most pressing in terms of success.  The #2 CB is not as important as the middle players (S, LB, DT) within this new defense, but obviously you want the best you can find.  I would bet the Bears still sign Ogunjobi once he passes a physical to get that disruptor 3T DT and they still have money available.  Roquan Smith will be more than capable to take over that Darius Lennard role in the defense.  Which means Safety could be a sneaky play at 39 if the draft starts to really hammer DE, WR and OL.  I fully expect at least one WR in the 2nd/3rd rounds and one OL and double up at either would not surprise.  Could the defensive player go at 39?  Without a doubt, but I know this organization is laser focused on improving around Justin Fields.  No matter how good this defense is, the success of that young QB will make or break everyone.  Which leads back to the discussion of a trade for the established, young WRs.  I think the Bears could absolutely be in that mix because it hits on one of their pressing needs and they have the money to accomodate the new deal.  They have the most money available next year (as of right now) with $127M in available cap space without any accounting for roll over or further contract shedding and you reduce the risk of a draft pick bust with a 2nd round WR.  Metcalf is still only 24 years old which fits with the getting younger and pairing with a young QB.  I would say Metcalf, AJ Brown and then McLaurin as the order of preference depending on cost obviously.

 

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

If the Packers don't swing big on a trade, there are still a few names on the free agent WR market to take note of.

1. Will Fuller - 27 - Miami - Has the lid-lifting speed that the team seeks, and has ties to MLF from Notre Dame. Fuller is a very obvious injury risk, though. The guy simply cannot stay on the field, which explains why he's likely looking at a minimum-type deal while still in his physical prime with obvious physical gifts and talent.

2. Sammy Watkins - 28 - Baltimore - If the Packers are looking for a (very) poor man's version of what Davante Adams brings, Watkins might fit the bill. He's a complete WR with decent speed and size, good hands and strength/blocking ability. He's another major injury risk, though, and his heart has been questioned in the past. 

3. Jarvis Landry - 29 - Cleveland - He's more of a slot guy than an edge receiver at this point in his career. With both Cobb and Rodgers on the roster and in that role, he might be redundant. He's a guy who excels at finding holes in the defense, and is a heady player. He's the type of receiver that Rodgers seems to like.

4. Odell Beckham Jr. - 29 - Los Angeles - Obviously the most talented WR left on the board, but coming off an ACL tear in the Super Bowl, you have no idea when (or if) he'll even make it back for the 2022 season. He'd be the ultimate dice roll.

5. T.Y. Hilton - 32 - Indianapolis - Is he done, or is there one more productive season left there? I personally think he's done.

6. Mohamed Sanu - 32 - San Francisco - If the Packers want another slow-footed possession guy who isn't going to complain about his role, he might be an option. 

7. Julio Jones - 33 - Tennessee - Hurt a lot the last few years, but when he's been available, the talent is still there. If you can keep him healthy, there is probably still #1 WR upside there. Big IF though.

8. A.J. Green - 33 - Arizona - Ditto to the write-up for Jones. 

I kind of expect one of these 8 names to be on the Packers' roster by training camp.

[PeaveyFury]

Good breakdown!

Landry has always felt like the best 'fit' based on, as you said, the type of guy Rodgers historically likes, and he's still got a level of youth to him that may make a multi-year deal attractive and not an immediate dead-cap situation. Problem is, that also makes him possibly the most costly option, which is limiting to the Packers this year for obvious cap reasons.

Which probably moves the focus back to Fuller, due to the MLF familiarity, really young age for a FA WR, and the possibility he'd take a 'prove-it' type deal with escalators due to performance milestones, etc. But, if he was truly willing to take such a deal, my gut is that he'd be signed already.

[madbad2000]

Part of me thinks that Landry really wants back into Cleveland and may be waiting on a Baker trade to clear up his funds.  

[Matt Breen]

I read Landry was looking for some pretty serious money. Which makes sense. He's 29. This is probably his last big payday. And as madbad2000 noted, I read he's interested in a reunion with the Browns. Probably won't happen until the Mayfield situation is figured out.

[Matt Breen]

Question - in the NFL - can teams include money in a trade to cover salary? I was wondering where Baker Mayfield would end up. He's got a guaranteed salary of $18M or so. Reportedly teams are interested in him - but not at that price. Could the Browns work out a deal - and pay down some of that salary as a way to facilitate a trade? I'm just not sure of the NFL rules.  Thanks.

[madbad2000]

48 minutes ago, reillymcshane said:

Question - in the NFL - can teams include money in a trade to cover salary? I was wondering where Baker Mayfield would end up. He's got a guaranteed salary of $18M or so. Reportedly teams are interested in him - but not at that price. Could the Browns work out a deal - and pay down some of that salary as a way to facilitate a trade? I'm just not sure of the NFL rules.  Thanks.

I don't know with 100% accuracy, but I don't think there is a mechanism in the NFL to include salary in a trade like in MLB.  I do think they would have the ability to manipulate money to do something similar.  Lets say the Panthers would take on Mayfield for $5M per this year but he would hit $18M with a trade.  I would think the Browns could do something like convert $13M to a signing bonus which hits their salary cap and only leaves $5M left on his deal for 2022 once he is traded.  There are probably restrictions in terms of some contract details with 5th year options, etc....but it would seem like a possibility to do that type of deal.

[Matt Breen]

The Athletic had a short article about the Adams trade. Seems Adams was dead set on getting out of Green Bay. He had told the team he wanted to leave - but the organization thought that was just posturing to get a new contract. But he made it clear it was not. 

The team even said they would top the Raiders contract offer - but Adams wanted out - hence the deal. They said Adams became 'enamored' with playing for the Raiders and with Carr. 

Link (subscription required): 

https://theathletic.com/3232215/2022/04/06/howe-notebook-inside-the-davante-adams-trade-baker-mayfields-status-saints-maneuvering/

[Joseph Zarr]

17 minutes ago, reillymcshane said:

The Athletic had a short article about the Adams trade. Seems Adams was dead set on getting out of Green Bay. He had told the team he wanted to leave - but the organization thought that was just posturing to get a new contract. But he made it clear it was not. 

The team even said they would top the Raiders contract offer - but Adams wanted out - hence the deal. They said Adams became 'enamored' with playing for the Raiders and with Carr. 

Link (subscription required): 

https://theathletic.com/3232215/2022/04/06/howe-notebook-inside-the-davante-adams-trade-baker-mayfields-status-saints-maneuvering/

Indeed and, really, just as one suspected (if they were being reasonable). I completely understand it for Davante - as I said at the time. And, in the end, I think it is simply the best thing for both parties. I'm really not all that into paying 30 yo WR's that amount of money - historically, it just typically doesn't pan out - and you just don't want to force a player to play for your team if he simply doesn't want to play and doesn't care about more money. We get the draft picks, and we can add some more talent. Sometimes, we can say: Win and Win.

Davante is an easy professional athlete to root for. The ultimate professional in preparation and he never once caused a single problem while with the Packers. I wish him all the best in Oakland and I'm excited to see what comes of the new flexibility and draft capital on the Packers side of things.

[Matt Breen]

Brandin Cooks signed a 2-year extension with Houston. 

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2022/04/texans-extend-wr-brandin-cooks

Odd as you wouldn't think Cooks would be the kind of guy a rebuilding club would need. Of course, perhaps the Texans think they are closer to competing than I do. 

It takes a potential piece off the WR playing board for Green Bay. Even if we didn't trade for him, it means other teams in need of a WR will be looking to fill that spot via the draft, free agents, or other trades.

 

[Joseph Zarr]

Just a quick 2 video stack of why the Packers are so adamant about keeping and paying Aaron Rodgers for as long as he is willing to play in the NFL and, specifically, play in Green Bay. The man is legitimately on another Level in terms of thinking the game in the game and executing. The 2012 vid Ben Fennell posts is such an incredible brief look into how much the QB carries in each and every play.

 

This is the Good stuff.

Edit to Add: You have to imagine, for a Head Coach with all that is going on in-game and within the Team, to have an asset like Aaron Rodgers' football brain at the helm managing the offense is just a dream scenario so you can focus in on all the other details and minutiae.

[young guns]

Sounds like anyone hoping for a trade for DK can move on.  Jets offered a package around the 10th pick, reportedly, and they were told by the Seahawks they are not trading him nor even listening to offers.

https://12thmanrising.com/2022/04/06/seahawks-dk-metcalf-trade-speculation/amp/

[HarryDoyle]

22 hours ago, Julio Muchacho said:

Just a quick 2 video stack of why the Packers are so adamant about keeping and paying Aaron Rodgers for as long as he is willing to play in the NFL and, specifically, play in Green Bay. The man is legitimately on another Level in terms of thinking the game in the game and executing. The 2012 vid Ben Fennell posts is such an incredible brief look into how much the QB carries in each and every play.

 

This is the Good stuff.

Edit to Add: You have to imagine, for a Head Coach with all that is going on in-game and within the Team, to have an asset like Aaron Rodgers' football brain at the helm managing the offense is just a dream scenario so you can focus in on all the other details and minutiae.

That's all well and good, but if you want to be considered one of the greats, you eventually have to deliver multiple Super Bowl appearances if not championships instead of underwhelming playoff performances like he has delivered the past few years.

[Joseph Zarr]

45 minutes ago, HarryDoyle said:

That's all well and good, but if you want to be considered one of the greats, you eventually have to deliver multiple Super Bowl appearances if not championships instead of underwhelming playoff performances like he has delivered the past few years.

Huh. That’s certainly a Take.  It is a take I do not agree with nor understand, admittedly. I am grateful to watch Greatness on a consistent basis. And, whether you think he is ‘One of the Greats’, I think you will find the vast and overwhelming opinion is: He is One of the Greats. But, also, I respect your right to have an opinion. 
 

He has excelled in a fashion I simply have never achieved in my Life and I respect his abilities beyond measure not to mention his innate ability to overcome his early career adversity. I could, personally and again just my opinion, care less about the perception of what an athlete is supposed to do or has to do to qualify in fans’ minds of what constitutes their measure of Greatness. I simply believe it is a redeemable quality to appreciate what you have, what you’ve witnessed, and what you’ve enjoyed while you have it. I have no idea what comes after his career at the GBP qb position but, man, we’ve been so blessed for 3 decades unlike nearly all other fan bases. 

 

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

On 4/6/2022 at 7:58 AM, Ron Robinsons Beard said:

2. Sammy Watkins - 28 - Baltimore - If the Packers are looking for a (very) poor man's version of what Davante Adams brings, Watkins might fit the bill. He's a complete WR with decent speed and size, good hands and strength/blocking ability. He's another major injury risk, though, and his heart has been questioned in the past. 

Some unsubstantiated rumors are floating around Reddit and Twitter that Watkins is in Green Bay currently, and that the Packers plan to sign him if he checks out physically. Nothing concrete at this point, though. Due to Watkins's injury risk, I don't think he should ever be looked at as a potential #1, but he certainly has the talent to be a complimentary #2 type who could break out for some huge games. 

[NBBrewFan]

On 4/8/2022 at 2:38 PM, Julio Muchacho said:

Edit to Add: You have to imagine, for a Head Coach with all that is going on in-game and within the Team, to have an asset like Aaron Rodgers' football brain at the helm managing the offense is just a dream scenario so you can focus in on all the other details and minutiae.

Why does it only work one way?  In MLFs first year with Rodgers learning a new system he was pretty pedestrian.  In fact that was the third year (2017-2019) with Rodgers approaching the normal age where QBs retire that he was being paid to be one of the best QBs and he just wasn't there.  The Packers were concerned enough to draft a possible replacement then he puts up 2 of his best seasons running the MLF offense (an offense that doesn't skip a beat when their #1WR is out) and back-to-back MVP.  Was it simply the drafting of Love that put a bug in Rodgers butt? If that's the case it has paid 100% dividends, but can you simply say it's all Rodgers and not the scheme/system he's been under.  In fact the data supports it's more likely the scheme taking him to that next level. I'm not trying to diminish Rodgers talent as I am trying to argue that he's benefitted from a better system, playcalling, etc. so it's not a one-sided progression, it's a partnership and Rodgers should also be thanking MLF for putting in a system that he can take full advantage of.  And to be slightly critical of Aaron, there were multiple times when Aaron tried to do it all in the Niner playoff game by forcing the ball to a double/triple covered Adams while other receivers (running their scheme/system) were open.  That's part of winning championships - staying within your system and plan. I think it's a valid criticism, but it shouldn't impact any conclusion that he's one of the greatest ever.

[PeaveyFury]

4 hours ago, Ron Robinsons Beard said:

Some unsubstantiated rumors are floating around Reddit and Twitter that Watkins is in Green Bay currently, and that the Packers plan to sign him if he checks out physically. Nothing concrete at this point, though. Due to Watkins's injury risk, I don't think he should ever be looked at as a potential #1, but he certainly has the talent to be a complimentary #2 type who could break out for some huge games. 

NFL Network has now confirmed that Watkins is on a FA visit to Green Bay today.

 

 

[homer]

17 minutes ago, PeaveyFury said:

NFL Network has now confirmed that Watkins is on a FA visit to Green Bay today.

 

 

And he's signed to a one year deal. Meh. He'll be great week 1, float the rest of the season, and then maybe make an impact in one playoff game.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

2 minutes ago, homer said:

And he's signed to a one year deal. Meh. He'll be great week 1, float the rest of the season, and then maybe make an impact in one playoff game.

Always has had the talent, but has had trouble staying on the field. But he's young enough at 28 that there should hopefully be some juice left. Like I mentioned above, his heart/effort level has been questioned in the past, so I guess we'll see if playing with the MVP energizes him.