Protect the Prospects

[edfunderburk]

While I’m severely disappointed that we didn’t add a middle of the order RH power bat or a true CF, I’m grateful that we didn’t trade away several of our top prospects - namely Chourio, Frelick, Mitchell, Small, & Turang.

I like Tristan Peters as much as I like Joey Wiemer … so I am perplexed by the Trevor Rosenthal trade - especially since he was a free agent as recently as two weeks ago. 

A puzzling & underwhelming trade deadline for sure.

[titletownking]

It’s a massively underwhelming trade deadline and quite frustrating. I never ever wanna hear Mark cry poor again. 

[liveforoctober]

15 minutes ago, edfunderburk said:

While I’m severely disappointed that we didn’t add a middle of the order RH power bat or a true CF, I’m grateful that we didn’t trade away several of our top prospects - namely Chourio, Frelick, Mitchell, Small, & Turang.

I like Tristan Peters as much as I like Joey Wiemer … so I am perplexed by the Trevor Rosenthal trade - especially since he was a free agent as recently as two weeks ago. 

A puzzling & underwhelming trade deadline for sure.

I guess I'm a little confused. Which middle of the order bat could we have added that wouldn't have cost the prospects you didn't want to give up?

[edfunderburk]

Just now, liveforoctober said:

I guess I'm a little confused. Which middle of the order bat could we have added that wouldn't have cost the prospects you didn't want to give up?

In previous posts, I said I was okay with Wiemer & Small being traded … I wanted to protect the others I listed in the first paragraph. 

End of the day - I’d rather exit the playoffs with the team we have than with a rental that costs us any the these future Brewers. 

Does that help with your confusion?

[beekay414]

Honestly, I would've given up anything sans Chourio to go out and get some type of impact bat. 

[liveforoctober]

2 minutes ago, edfunderburk said:

In previous posts, I said I was okay with Wiemer & Small being traded … I wanted to protect the others I listed in the first paragraph. 

End of the day - I’d rather exit the playoffs with the team we have than with a rental that costs us any the these future Brewers. 

Does that help with your confusion?

Well, sure. But you said you were severely disappointed we didn't add anyone. But also now that you'd rather exit the playoffs with our future intact.

So more or less you are dissipointed no team would give us a productive power bat for a package built around Ethan Small and Joey Wiemar.

[True Blue Brew Crew]

Not to be too much of a downer but I can't help but wonder if they're destined to see the fruits of all these home grown hitting talents they held on to in 2022 right about the time all the pitching walks out the door.

Happy to dream of the future batting order but I can't shake the feeling they're going to squander pitching rarely seen around here.

[sveumrules]

34 minutes ago, titletownking said:

It’s a massively underwhelming trade deadline and quite frustrating. I never ever wanna hear Mark cry poor again. 

When did he cry poor the first time?

[Playing Catch]

25 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Honestly, I would've given up anything sans Chourio to go out and get some type of impact bat. 

I've got this weird feeling that the Pirates/Cubs demanded Chourio for Reynolds/Contreras, thinking that Stearns would cave, and being okay with the risk that he wouldn't.

[titletownking]

Just now, sveumrules said:

When did he cry poor the first time?

“We were in the red” “we stretched the budget to sign Cutch” not sure of your motive here. 

[beekay414]

Just now, Playing Catch said:

I've got this weird feeling that the Pirates/Cubs demanded Chourio for Reynolds/Contreras, thinking that Stearns would cave, and being okay with the risk that he wouldn't.

Reynolds, I'd understand, but I likely don't pull that trigger unless the other prospects going back are fliers. I would've tried to overwhelm them with a depth package but that would go against what our organizational philosophy seems to be now. We're basically going to be Tampa Bay north and we'll only make moves when they are cost efficient.

[sveumrules]

4 minutes ago, titletownking said:

“We were in the red” “we stretched the budget to sign Cutch” not sure of your motive here. 

I guess I don’t equate statements about the team’s economic reality to be crying poor.

My motive is to find out what others consider to be “crying poor” because I couldn’t recall any instance of Mark A doing so.

[edfunderburk]

51 minutes ago, liveforoctober said:

Well, sure. But you said you were severely disappointed we didn't add anyone. But also now that you'd rather exit the playoffs with our future intact.

So more or less you are dissipointed no team would give us a productive power bat for a package built around Ethan Small and Joey Wiemar.

Yes … thank you … you should write my posts for me … that’s what I wanted to happen ??

[liveforoctober]

13 hours ago, edfunderburk said:

Yes … thank you … you should write my posts for me … that’s what I wanted to happen ??

I mean, that's exactly what you implied .... you just inflated the delivery to join the outrage I think.

[Jopal78]

15 hours ago, edfunderburk said:

In previous posts, I said I was okay with Wiemer & Small being traded … I wanted to protect the others I listed in the first paragraph. 

End of the day - I’d rather exit the playoffs with the team we have than with a rental that costs us any the these future Brewers. 

Does that help with your confusion?

Wiemer just moved up to AAA and has a shot to play in Milwaukee this year. Teams don’t move those type of players at the deadline.

The other teams in MLB aren’t stupid either. They know Ethan Small can’t command his stuff against AAA hitters and have the video tape of his MLB starts. Players aren’t traded on pedigree.

I don’t think you can call Attanasio cheap, they did take a 5 million dollar gamble on Rosenthal as well as another multi-million dollar gamble on Lamet. Also, Stearns isn’t stupid, he’s knows what he’s got better than any of us, and fair to say didn’t view upgrades to what he has as worth the price. Time will tell if he’s right or wrong on that.

[StearnsFTW]

nm

 

[edfunderburk]

3 hours ago, Jopal78 said:

Wiemer just moved up to AAA and has a shot to play in Milwaukee this year. Teams don’t move those type of players at the deadline.

The other teams in MLB aren’t stupid either. They know Ethan Small can’t command his stuff against AAA hitters and have the video tape of his MLB starts. Players aren’t traded on pedigree.

I don’t think you can call Attanasio cheap, they did take a 5 million dollar gamble on Rosenthal as well as another multi-million dollar gamble on Lamet. Also, Stearns isn’t stupid, he’s knows what he’s got better than any of us, and fair to say didn’t view upgrades to what he has as worth the price. Time will tell if he’s right or wrong on that.

At no point ever have I referred to Attanasio cheap … not sure what you are referencing

a “rental” to me is someone that is only hear through the end of the year & then becomes a free agent

[edfunderburk]

5 hours ago, liveforoctober said:

I mean, that's exactly what you implied .... you just inflated the delivery to join the outrage I think.

I’m agreeing with you … watch the tone … not sure why you feel the need to judge my intentions or motive

I've stated that I’m glad we didn’t trade away top prospects … that has been my consistent viewpoint for weeks

I could give a rat’s rear end what you or any others on this forum think about my posts … I don’t understand the “join the outrage” comment

[owbc]

I think the "We're going to squander generational pitching" narrative is a bunch of baloney that is fed by our historically miserable pitching. 

All of the other serious pennant contenders have equal or better pitching than us. What we call "generational" is what they expect to see every year.

There's nothing special or generational about being in the top-10 in the league in pitching. It should be the expectation for a team that is run as well as the Brewers are. We did not get lucky to have the talent we do, it was acquired and managed through a series of smart decisions.  The names on the jerseys change but the standard of excellence remains the same. 

 

[True Blue Brew Crew]

51 minutes ago, owbc said:

I think the "We're going to squander generational pitching" narrative is a bunch of baloney that is fed by our historically miserable pitching. 

All of the other serious pennant contenders have equal or better pitching than us. What we call "generational" is what they expect to see every year.

There's nothing special or generational about being in the top-10 in the league in pitching. It should be the expectation for a team that is run as well as the Brewers are. We did not get lucky to have the talent we do, it was acquired and managed through a series of smart decisions.  The names on the jerseys change but the standard of excellence remains the same. 

 

WHAT? So you think it's possible to ever rise up to what teams like the Dodgers, Yankees, Mets, Padres, etc can assemble when those teams can buy the best on the market? What the Brewers have right now is absolutely on par with the best one can ever expect them to assemble. The only way for the Brewers is developing them in your system and acquiring via trade before they break out. Developing Burnes, Woodruff, Williams, Ashby and trading for Hader, Peralta, and Lauer is no easy to match order. So many things had to break right to get to this point. Avoiding injuries, improving spin rate, honing control, developing new pitches that work, and quite simply having all those pieces converge at the same time is an endeavor with really long odds. Injuries alone can derail the best laid plans. The Brewers have no room for error and can't simply BUY another 1, 2, or even 3 starter whenever things go wrong.

There is something very rare and special for the small market BREWERS when they're able to have a sustained run of years with pitching like this.

[True Blue Brew Crew]

You can look no further than the Brewers current top 10 prospects. It's not exactly littered with the next wave of arms anyone is projecting to replace the Brewers current top arms. The next wave is full of position players and hitting prospects. A lot is going to break right for the Brewers to sustain their current level of pitching. So much had to break right to get where they are now.

[BallFour]

Can't wait to see this place after the Brewers inevitably trade Woodruff and Burnes for pitching prospects in the next two years.

[Jim French Stepstool]

20 hours ago, edfunderburk said:

 

I like Tristan Peters as much as I like Joey Wiemer … so I am perplexed by the Trevor Rosenthal trade - especially since he was a free agent as recently as two weeks ago. 

 

When you factor in everything--speed, defensive ability, arm, power--I value Wiemer much, much more than Peters. I wouldn't be swayed by Wiemers' recent struggles. Having said that I think Peters is too much to give for Rosenthal, but that dead horse has enough club marks on it.

[owbc]

28 minutes ago, True Blue Brew Crew said:

WHAT? So you think it's possible to ever rise up to what teams like the Dodgers, Yankees, Mets, Padres, etc can assemble when those teams can buy the best on the market? What the Brewers have right now is absolutely on par with the best one can ever expect them to assemble. The only way for the Brewers is developing them in your system and acquiring via trade before they break out. Developing Burnes, Woodruff, Williams, Ashby and trading for Hader, Peralta, and Lauer is no easy to match order. So many things had to break right to get to this point. Avoiding injuries, improving spin rate, honing control, developing new pitches that work, and quite simply having all those pieces converge at the same time is an endeavor with really long odds. Injuries alone can derail the best laid plans. The Brewers have no room for error and can't simply BUY another 1, 2, or even 3 starter whenever things go wrong.

There is something very rare and special for the small market BREWERS when they're able to have a sustained run of years with pitching like this.

Tampa Bay Rays MLB ranking in ERA+:

2022: 6
2021: 10
2020: 6
2019: 4
2018: 10 
2017: 11

The Rays show that sustained pitching excellence can be achieved by a small market with a low payroll. It can also be done without a Cy Young and reliever of the year winner on the pitching staff. 

Saying that the Brewers' current pitching was a product of mostly luck and timing is taking credit away from the front office, coaching, and analytics staffs for what they have achieved. 

Any yes, as BallFour notes, the next generation of pitching will be acquired by trading the current generation of pitching. Hader was the first step in that process but there will be more trades to come. 

[True Blue Brew Crew]

6 minutes ago, BallFour said:

Can't wait to see this place after the Brewers inevitably trade Woodruff and Burnes for pitching prospects in the next two years.

No doubt that's the direction they'll have to go. They have to target pitching and the ones they get back will have to pan out.