Game Thread (9/23/2022): Brewers (Lauer) at Reds (Minor) - 5:40 PM CDT

[Robocaller]

Nice win after a bad start by Lauer. Our SP really need to step it up if the team is going anywhere.

[treego14]

1 minute ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Just nasty changeups from Devin, there. Half-way to a sweep. Let's go Rockies!

[LouisEly]

1 hour ago, BruisedCrew said:

The Cubs and Pirates had a lot more to do with the Brewers situation than the Braves. 

The injuries to Woodruff, Peralta, Lauer, Ashby, and Houser had more to do with the Brewers situation than the Cubs and Pirates.

[BruisedCrew]

5 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

The injuries to Woodruff, Peralta, Lauer, Ashby, and Houser had more to do with the Brewers situation than the Cubs and Pirates.

Most teams have had a lot of pitching injuries. The teams that are going to the playoffs had depth and offenses to overcome them. 
 

Even with the injuries, the number of games the Brewers lost to the Cubs and Pirates was inexcusable. 

[willie key]

6 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

The injuries to Woodruff, Peralta, Lauer, Ashby, and Houser had more to do with the Brewers situation than the Cubs and Pirates.

Ashby and houser weren’t exactly tearing it up.    How long were lauer and woodruff really out.    I don’t remember being that long.     And when woodruff was out we were still up.   Peralta being out awhile did hurt and made a guy like Alexander pitch a lot.    Alexander had a nice 4-5 games to start out and then he should have been gone.    But he had to cover starts

but the starters above underperformed this year.  That’s just a fact

[Brewcrew82]

2 minutes ago, willie key said:

Ashby and houser weren’t exactly tearing it up.    How long were lauer and woodruff really out.    I don’t remember being that long.     And when woodruff was out we were still up.   Peralta being out awhile did hurt and made a guy like Alexander pitch a lot.    Alexander had a nice 4-5 games to start out and then he should have been gone.    But he had to cover starts

but the starters above underperformed this year.  That’s just a fact

Woodruff was out for a month. That's significant between him and Peralta and enough to alter the landscape of a playoff race when you're having to start a guy like Alexander in turn. 

[Brewcrew82]

Pujols with 699....

[LouisEly]

Just now, willie key said:

Ashby and houser weren’t exactly tearing it up.   

Through his first 10 starts of the season, Houser had a 3.51 ERA and 3.62 FIP with a .291 BABIP (so it wasn't due to good luck).  I think his arm was bothering him well before he went on the IL and he tried to pitch through it.

If you want to say that Burnes has underperformed this year, I would agree with that.

[Brewcrew82]

1 minute ago, LouisEly said:

Through his first 10 starts of the season, Houser had a 3.51 ERA and 3.62 FIP with a .291 BABIP (so it wasn't due to good luck).  I think his arm was bothering him well before he went on the IL and he tried to pitch through it.

If you want to say that Burnes has underperformed this year, I would agree with that.

Burnes also carried the rotation throughout most of the season when all these guys were injured. 

[willie key]

6 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Woodruff was out for a month. That's significant between him and Peralta and enough to alter the landscape of a playoff race when you're having to start a guy like Alexander in turn. 

Alexander pitched well for that first month.  Probably as good as peralta and woodruff would have done.   He was in the twos era for that first month as a starter.    
 

it’s utterly ridiculous the bending over backward for the pitching this year.   They are as much as fault as any part of the team

[willie key]

3 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

Through his first 10 starts of the season, Houser had a 3.51 ERA and 3.62 FIP with a .291 BABIP (so it wasn't due to good luck).  I think his arm was bothering him well before he went on the IL and he tried to pitch through it.

If you want to say that Burnes has underperformed this year, I would agree with that.

What’s the team record for losses.   Ashby could have easily matched that if he stuck around

 

that being said I would be fine with all of them back.    I think they can bounce back.   They just weren’t that good this year

[Brewcrew82]

1 minute ago, willie key said:

What’s the team record for losses.   Ashby could have easily matched that if he stuck around

Wins and losses are meaningless and shouldn't be used at all in evaluating pitchers. 

[BruisedCrew]

1 minute ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Woodruff was out for a month. That's significant between him and Peralta and enough to alter the landscape of a playoff race when you're having to start a guy like Alexander in turn. 

I didn’t say they weren’t significant. But injuries to pitchers like DeGrom, Scherzer, Carrasco, Wheeler, Flaherty, etc. were significant too.

And what about teams losing impact offensive players for extended times?

The Brewers were extremely fortunate with pitchers health last year. It was unlikely that that was going to be repeated this year. 

Injuries affected the Brewers and almost every other team this year. The Brewers didn’t have the depth or talent to overcome theirs.

 

[BruisedCrew]

6 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Pujols with 699....

I hope he gets 700 this weekend so we are spared the indignity of him getting it here. Maybe they’ll sit him out and hope he can get it at home. 

[LouisEly]

3 minutes ago, willie key said:

Alexander pitched well for that first month.  Probably as good as peralta and woodruff would have done.   He was in the twos era for that first month as a starter.    
 

it’s utterly ridiculous the ending over backward for the pitching this year.   They are as much as fault as any part of the team

Alexander pitched well for 18 days - June 1 to June 18, four starts,   Over his next six outings he had a 8.74 ERA.

Three of those first four starts when he pitched well were against the Cubs, Reds, and Nationals.

[Brewcrew82]

2 minutes ago, willie key said:

Alexander pitched well for that first month.  Probably as good as peralta and woodruff would have done.   He was in the twos era for that first month as a starter.    
 

it’s utterly ridiculous the ending over backward for the pitching this year.   They are as much as fault as any part of the team

Still, he pitched horribly the rest of the year, and if Peralta is healthy and in form during that time that's a huge difference. The bullpen and the offense are more at fault imo. Offense has been way too inconsistent, and the bullpen has taken a step down from what it's been the last few years. 

 

[Robocaller]

28 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

The injuries to Woodruff, Peralta, Lauer, Ashby, and Houser had more to do with the Brewers situation than the Cubs and Pirates.

plus their suckiness (relative to last year) when they did pitch.

[wiguy94]

1 minute ago, Robocaller said:

plus their suckiness (relative to last year) when they did pitch.

Before tonight our 6 SP had dropped 205 points of ERA+ from last year to this year. In addition to the massive drop in performance they had 7 IL stints two of which were 60 day IL stints. 

[Robocaller]

12 minutes ago, willie key said:

Alexander pitched well for that first month.  Probably as good as peralta and woodruff would have done.   He was in the twos era for that first month as a starter.    
 

it’s utterly ridiculous the bending over backward for the pitching this year.   They are as much as fault as any part of the team

He didn't give up many runs in his first 3 starts. He was giving up hits and it was clear his results were better than his ability. It's a GM failure that he started more than 5 games.

[Brewcrew82]

12 minutes ago, BruisedCrew said:

I didn’t say they weren’t significant. But injuries to pitchers like DeGrom, Scherzer, Carrasco, Wheeler, Flaherty, etc. were significant too.

And what about teams losing impact offensive players for extended times?

The Brewers were extremely fortunate with pitchers health last year. It was unlikely that that was going to be repeated this year. 

Injuries affected the Brewers and almost every other team this year. The Brewers didn’t have the depth or talent to overcome theirs.

 

Don't think I was responding to you, FWIW. But I agree. The Brewers didn't have enough quality pitching depth to overcome the injuries this year. We were depending on a guy like Small to be ready when called upon. Instead, he was ineffective when called up and then completely lost it in AAA. We also didn't sign anyone to account for the loss of Brett Anderson. For all his faults, he was still quite effective when healthy. 

[Brewcrew82]

6 minutes ago, Robocaller said:

plus their suckiness (relative to last year) when they did pitch.

Huh? Woodruff and Peralta haven't sucked....It was always going to be hard for our big three to be as dominant as they were last year. 

[wiguy94]

2 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Don't think I was responding to you, FWIW. But I agree. The Brewers didn't have enough quality pitching depth to overcome the injuries this year. We were depending on a guy like Small to be ready when called upon. Instead, he was ineffective when called up and then completely lost it in AAA. We also didn't sign anyone to account for the loss of Brett Anderson. For all his faults, he was still quite reliable when healthy. 

We didn't sign anyone to replace Anderson because Ashby was being moved to the rotation. 

[willie key]

Just now, Robocaller said:

He didn't give up many runs in his first 3 starts. He was giving up hits and it was clear his results were better than his ability. It's a GM failure that he started more than 5 games.

 

6 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Still, he pitched horribly the rest of the year, and if Peralta is healthy and in form during that time that's a huge difference. The bullpen and the offense are more at fault imo. Offense has been way too inconsistent, and the bullpen has taken a step down from what it's been the last few years. 

 

The bullpen is pretty bad too.    But it’s just bias at this point to not include the starters and just say it was Alexander fault.    Come on.     There is a bunch of blame to go around.     

[wiguy94]

2 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Huh? Woodruff and Peralta haven't sucked....

Woodruff went from a 163 ERA+ to a 124 ERA+. Peralta went from a 149 ERA+ to a 115 ERA+. That's suckiness compared to last year.

[Brewcrew82]

Just now, wiguy94 said:

We didn't sign anyone to replace Anderson because Ashby was being moved to the rotation. 

It was still a hit to the overall pitching depth, though. Made Small the next man up, and he didn't prove to be up for the job.