Packers 2022 Discussion Thread

[adambr2]

5 hours ago, stoutdude04 said:

Rumors are that he needs Tommy John.

https://www.ninersnation.com/2023/2/6/23588153/49ers-brock-purdy-tommy-john-training-camp

[adambr2]

"What's your plan going forward?"

 

"Dunno, whatever A-Rodg wants us to do."

 

This is totally normal and not at all indicative of a dysfunctional and incompetently run organization.

[nate82]

32 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

"What's your plan going forward?"

 

"Dunno, whatever A-Rodg wants us to do."

 

This is totally normal and not at all indicative of a dysfunctional and incompetently run organization.

 

If those reports are true it probably means Love is gone or will be traded.  Why keep someone like Love if you are going to go with Rodgers?  Would make more sense to draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round than to keep Love and reset the cap hit for a backup QB. 

[LouisEly]

1 hour ago, adambr2 said:

"What's your plan going forward?"

"Dunno, whatever A-Rodg wants us to do."

This is totally normal and not at all indicative of a dysfunctional and incompetently run organization.

How is that different than any other pro sports league?  In the NBA, if superstars want out, they get traded.  See: Brooklyn Nets.  If Kyrie wants out, Kyrie gets traded.  If LeBron wants to play with his friends, LeBron gets to play with his friends.  If their contract is up in a year or two anyway, might as well get something for him rather than him half-arse it there because he doesn't want to be there.

[adambr2]

1 hour ago, LouisEly said:

How is that different than any other pro sports league?  In the NBA, if superstars want out, they get traded.  See: Brooklyn Nets.  If Kyrie wants out, Kyrie gets traded.  If LeBron wants to play with his friends, LeBron gets to play with his friends.  If their contract is up in a year or two anyway, might as well get something for him rather than him half-arse it there because he doesn't want to be there.

#1: The NBA is very different from the NFL in that regard. The NBA is definitely superstar controlled with very little leverage for the actual teams since they can't hope to compete without stars that want to stay there. 

#2: The Packers cannot both continue to pay Aaron Rodgers and field a contending team around him. They have given him far too much control of their future and it will affect their outlook long after he's gone. Each "run it back" attempt is going to become progressively more futile. 

[CheezWizHed]

Uh... the NFL is controlled by star QBs.  nearly every SB is won with having a star QB.  So what is the difference?

And the Packers essentially did this for 2 years with Favre until he retired, we drafted 2 backup QBs and then he unretired.... thus basically requiring us to trade him. 

It could be worse... we could be the Vikings... or the Bears... or Detroit... Its just horrible cheering for a team with back to back HOF QBs and a league leading championships...

[Fear The Chorizo]

5 hours ago, adambr2 said:

https://www.ninersnation.com/2023/2/6/23588153/49ers-brock-purdy-tommy-john-training-camp

I mean, I bet he'll be able to hold a clipboard 2 weeks after whatever surgery he gets - it's not like he'd take the starting quarterback job away from a healthy Trey Lance anyway, at least until the 49ers know Lance can't be a difference maker for them at quarterback before moving on from a 2nd overall draft pick 2 drafts ago who really hasn't played yet. 

Hoping Purdy's camp gets all available opinions and makes the best decision for him and his career longterm, not for "all parties involved"....all parties involved means the 49ers.  Throwing a football is different than a baseball, but it sure seems to me like I'd want as complete a throwing arm as possible and not just throw some chicken wire in there with super glue and call it good because it means I might be able to suit up for training camp 7 months after I got my elbow blown out for a futile quarterback "battle".    

[adambr2]

28 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

Uh... the NFL is controlled by star QBs.  nearly every SB is won with having a star QB.  So what is the difference?

And the Packers essentially did this for 2 years with Favre until he retired, we drafted 2 backup QBs and then he unretired.... thus basically requiring us to trade him. 

It could be worse... we could be the Vikings... or the Bears... or Detroit... Its just horrible cheering for a team with back to back HOF QBs and a league leading championships...

We do have back to back HOF QBs. We also, for a number of reasons I've gotten into in various posts (Joe Barry, Jordan Love draft, Rodgers extension, Savage option, etc etc) don't appear to currently be an organization that is very well operated. Both of those things can be true. 

As an aside, I never understood the point of throwing out the league leading championships in a debate that has nothing to do with any historical comparisons. It's a neat historical anecdote, and I guess a nice trump card to play in the face of Vikings fans, I just don't really know what 11 championships that occurred in a different league context outside of most of our lifetimes has to do with the modern state of the franchise. I would guess that the 30 years of HOF QB play that you mentioned yielding only 2 NFL championships would be considered largely disappointing by most outside observers.

[sveumrules]

3 hours ago, adambr2 said:

We do have back to back HOF QBs. We also, for a number of reasons I've gotten into in various posts (Joe Barry, Jordan Love draft, Rodgers extension, Savage option, etc etc) don't appear to currently be an organization that is very well operated. Both of those things can be true. 

As an aside, I never understood the point of throwing out the league leading championships in a debate that has nothing to do with any historical comparisons. It's a neat historical anecdote, and I guess a nice trump card to play in the face of Vikings fans, I just don't really know what 11 championships that occurred in a different league context outside of most of our lifetimes has to do with the modern state of the franchise. I would guess that the 30 years of HOF QB play that you mentioned yielding only 2 NFL championships would be considered largely disappointing by most outside observers.

How many teams have won more than two SB in the last thirty years?

[Fear The Chorizo]

7 hours ago, sveumrules said:

How many teams have won more than two SB in the last thirty years?

By my count 9, if you count the Rams in both STL and LA.  Will be 10 after this weekend.  Most of those multiple winners are from teams with totally different rosters winning it all many years apart (Packers included), the obvious exceptions being the two Patriot dynasties, the Broncos in the late 90s with Elway, and the Cowboys in the early 90s with Aikman and a loaded roster.  Giants and Steelers seem to be the two teams who won Super Bowls a few years apart with similar core rosters that wouldn't necessarily be considered dynasties, but they had the same quarterback.

Disappointing that the Packers haven't won more titles with two straight HOF quarterbacks over the last 30ish seasons....but not really that far outside the normal NFL ebb and flow.  I would add several of the Packers' recent postseason trainwrecks likely cost them a couple additional Super Bowls during seasons where they were probably the best team in the league - the 2011 15-1 season, 2014 NFC championship debacle in Seattle,  2021 NFC title game loss against the Bucs, and last seasons stinker against the 49ers come to mind specifically.  However, the bigger disappointment would be organizations who've had HOF-caliber play from 1-2 quarterbacks over extended portions of the last 30 seasons with 1 or no Super Bowl titles to show for it.

 

[homer]

Losing Nick Collins may have cost them a 3rd Super Bowl.

[stoutdude04]

21 hours ago, adambr2 said:

https://www.ninersnation.com/2023/2/6/23588153/49ers-brock-purdy-tommy-john-training-camp

This is for sure possible,  My buddy that works with the strength and conditioning group with the Broncos is the one that told me there are rumblings of Tommy John.  Though, that was before this article was written.

 

And as I write this - he is about ready for surgery.  So we will wait and see if he needs something more or not!  Hopefully not.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

3 hours ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

By my count 9, if you count the Rams in both STL and LA.  Will be 10 after this weekend.  Most of those multiple winners are from teams with totally different rosters winning it all many years apart (Packers included), the obvious exceptions being the two Patriot dynasties, the Broncos in the late 90s with Elway, and the Cowboys in the early 90s with Aikman and a loaded roster.  Giants and Steelers seem to be the two teams who won Super Bowls a few years apart with similar core rosters that wouldn't necessarily be considered dynasties, but they had the same quarterback.

Disappointing that the Packers haven't won more titles with two straight HOF quarterbacks over the last 30ish seasons....but not really that far outside the normal NFL ebb and flow.  I would add several of the Packers' recent postseason trainwrecks likely cost them a couple additional Super Bowls during seasons where they were probably the best team in the league - the 2011 15-1 season, 2014 NFC championship debacle in Seattle,  2021 NFC title game loss against the Bucs, and last seasons stinker against the 49ers come to mind specifically.  However, the bigger disappointment would be organizations who've had HOF-caliber play from 1-2 quarterbacks over extended portions of the last 30 seasons with 1 or no Super Bowl titles to show for it.

 

9 teams have won more than 2? I haven't even looked and I'm not sure there is one other than New England.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Pats, Cowboys (0 in last 27 years) and Broncos.

[NeedMoreFans]

If 1993 is the cutoff year, I believe the list of multiple Super Bowl winning teams is:

1. Cowboys
2. Packers
3. Steelers
4. Rams
5. Ravens
6. Buccaneers
7. Patriots
8. Giants
9. Rams
10. Broncos

[sveumrules]

Even with "only" two Super Bowl wins in the last 30 years, the Packers have still been the second best team in the NFL over that stretch.

I would have loved to win another couple two tree, sure, but I'm guessing once Rodgers is gone we'll be crossing our fingers for one Super Bowl over the next few decades and odds are we'll be significantly worse than the second best team in the NFL over the next 30 years.

[homer]

53 minutes ago, NeedMoreFans said:

If 1993 is the cutoff year, I believe the list of multiple Super Bowl winning teams is:

1. Cowboys
2. Packers
3. Steelers
4. Rams
5. Ravens
6. Buccaneers
7. Patriots
8. Giants
9. Rams
10. Broncos

Since 1993 the other winners are: KC, Philly, Seattle, New Orleans, Indianapolis, San Francisco

That means 1/2 the league hasn't won a title in the last 30 years. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

1 hour ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

9 teams have won more than 2? I haven't even looked and I'm not sure there is one other than New England.

I guess I was stating 9 teams (going on 10) have won at least 2 in the last 30 yrs - reading comprehension is hard for me in the morning!

And yeah, that also indicates half the league is in a title drought spanning at least 3 decades....so much for NFL parity

[NeedMoreFans]

1 hour ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

I guess I was stating 9 teams (going on 10) have won at least 2 in the last 30 yrs - reading comprehension is hard for me in the morning!

And yeah, that also indicates half the league is in a title drought spanning at least 3 decades....so much for NFL parity

Comparing other leagues since 1993 (I think my count is right):

MLB: 16 teams have won

NBA: 12 teams

NHL: 15 teams

So about half of the teams winning is pretty standard amongst all of the big four sports, with the NBA being the worst in terms of parity. 

[LouisEly]

4 hours ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

Pats, Cowboys (0 in last 27 years) and Broncos.

And only one for the Broncos in the last 24 years.

Drew Brees only won one.  Dan Mariono, Phillip Rivers, Matt Ryan, Warren Moon, Dan Fouts, and Fran Tarkenton never won one.

[GAME05]

A HoF QB makes it tough to recognize mediocrity within the rest of the organization when you're always practically 10-6 by default.

[CheezWizHed]

I'm not sure I'd pretend the cupboard was bare and Rodgers just carried a 4-13 team to the playoffs every year.   Obviously, late TT drafting was bad. But I thought Gute did really well in rebound.  Signing Amos, 2 Smiths, and Turner that one year were all good and smart signings.  He has had some "ok" drafts and some good drafts. 

If he'd have been able to work with the Pack on Rodger's second contract (not the rookie, not the millstone that we have lately), I think he'd have done really well.  

 

[DR28]

Jones will be back for 23 season, agreed to reduced salary... $11 M I believe.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Whether its Rodgers or Love QB-ing next season, I think it's the right move to hang onto Jones on a restructured contract to make his 2023 cap number tolerable