2022 NFL Discussion Thread

[Fear The Chorizo]

The Vikings are hiring old friend, Ed Donatell, to be their defensive coordinator.

 

His Green Bay legacy for the sadists out there:

 

Yeah that hurt and was inexcusable, but it didn't lose the game either. You can lay that blame on Favre and one of the worst throws I've seen in my life. His performance in the Raiders game a few weeks earlier when Favre's dad died was the worst thing that could've happened. Favre was throwing those exact same passes into double and even triple coverage and completing them. I wonder if Favre would've thrown that pass against the Eagles if those passes had been intercepted in Oakland.

 

He absolutely would have, unfortunately....that was the year Ahman Green was an absolute monster and the Packers were a run 1st team. Teams had to crowd the box to stop the run and it opened up 1 on 1's with walker and Ferguson on the outside. Green bay dominated that game at the line of scrimmage and had no business losing it. The 4th and short stop inside the Eagle 5 at the end of the 1st half ( kick the FG and take the points with the lead!!) changed how they played offense the rest of the game and some disguised coverages led to some poor passes late.

[PeaveyFury]

Final MVP voting wasn’t close at all:

Rodgers 39

Brady 10

Cupp 1

 

Wonder if Hub Arkush was the Cupp vote…..

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Final MVP voting wasn’t close at all:

Rodgers 39

Brady 10

Cupp 1

 

Wonder if Hub Arkush was the Cupp vote…..

 

I'd bet he was a Brady vote. He desperately didn't want Rodgers to win it, and had to know that the only way that would happen is if he could convince enough other writers to vote for Brady.

[nodakfan17]

Looks like Rodgers may be confirming something early….

 

 

A pretty hollow award when the 4x MVP can't seem to win super bowls, or get to them for that matter.

Meh. It is what it is. QB success can be measured in different ways. I personally think he has a good case to be considered a Top 10 QB of all-time, but would leave him out of the Top 5 due to the lack of championships. That doesn’t change the fact that he’s been an absolute joy to watch in the regular season.

[jerichoholicninja]

Kamara claims that Greene called one of his friends "ugly".

 

This was his defense for him and his friends nearly killing a person.

[TURBO]

Rodgers was not 4 to 1 better than Brady this year.

 

No, I don't think Brady should have won it based on winning the Super Bowl last year, that is asinine. He should/could have won it based on the fact it was probably his best season he ever put together, which is saying a lot for the actual GOAT...

 

I thought Taylor might get a vote or two, but none?

[TURBO]

Kamara claims that Greene called one of his friends "ugly".

 

This was his defense for him and his friends nearly killing a person.

 

He should get a lifetime suspension, but we know that isn't going to happen.

 

Hopefully he gets some jail/prison time.

[nodakfan17]

I thought Taylor might get a vote or two, but none?

Missing the playoffs may have hurt his candidacy.

[patrickgpe]

Rodgers was not 4 to 1 better than Brady this year.

 

No, I don't think Brady should have won it based on winning the Super Bowl last year, that is asinine. He should/could have won it based on the fact it was probably his best season he ever put together, which is saying a lot for the actual GOAT...

 

I thought Taylor might get a vote or two, but none?

 

If Rodgers got 4x more votes than Brady, that doesn't mean that he is 4 to 1 better than Brady. It means that 4x more writers thought he had a better season.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Looks like Rodgers may be confirming something early….

 

 

A pretty hollow award when the 4x MVP can't seem to win super bowls, or get to them for that matter.

Meh. It is what it is. QB success can be measured in different ways. I personally think he has a good case to be considered a Top 10 QB of all-time, but would leave him out of the Top 5 due to the lack of championships. That doesn’t change the fact that he’s been an absolute joy to watch in the regular season.

 

A chance to be top 10? He is 100% top 10 and more like unanimously top 6. There are people out there who already thought he was #2, but unfortunately for him, losing NFCCGs will hurt his legacy in that regard more than simply going 7-9 would have.

 

I think most pundits will end up putting around #4-6 at the end, behind Brady, Manning and Montana and then him right there or a couple random guys.

 

If he is able to get a second at some point, he would probably be a unanimous top 3.

[adambr2]

Kamara claims that Greene called one of his friends "ugly".

 

This was his defense for him and his friends nearly killing a person.

 

Wow, seriously Kamara?

 

They called your friend "ugly?" I was hoping for at least some reasonable defense. Maybe "they kept getting overly physical with a female acquaintance and we defended her." I could at least see his perspective if that were the case. At LEAST give them something to work with like "they called us a racial slur."

 

They called my friend ugly? Really?

 

Lock the thug up.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Rodgers was not 4 to 1 better than Brady this year.

 

No, I don't think Brady should have won it based on winning the Super Bowl last year, that is asinine. He should/could have won it based on the fact it was probably his best season he ever put together, which is saying a lot for the actual GOAT...

 

I thought Taylor might get a vote or two, but none?

 

Not even remotely close. And in fact, probably not even in his top 5. He was pretty much career median this season.

 

These seasons are either a lot better or a bit better:

2007

2010

2011

2012

2016

2017

 

Then there are a few others that are probably slightly better, or about the same.

 

I don't mean this to be as condescending as it may come off, but you really have to learn to see beyond volume stats and look at efficiency.

 

The vote wasn't close because he wasn't all that close to Rodgers, which I tried telling you 6 weeks ago, but you are hung up on volume stats.

 

His quality of play the last 2 years, while really, really good, was magnified by the fact that his last one in NE was arguably the worst of his career. They had a good defense that season and he just looked old, and appeared to be holding them back. The narrative was that he was fading fast. Of course, that wasn't entirely true, and I'm not sure what he found in Tampa but obviously he was still productive.

 

The best year of his career though? That's absurd.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Rodgers was not 4 to 1 better than Brady this year.

 

Agreed, but 4X as many writers thought Rodgers had the better season than Brady did - which is absolutely correct. I'm guessing the final voting would've been a bit closer had Brady not had that clunker at home against the Saints on national TV right before Christmas and Hub's stupid reasoning for publicly not planning to vote for Rodgers a few weeks later when most pundits shifted heavily towards Rodgers getting the MVP nod. Any writers on the fence about Rodgers v Brady probably went heavily towards Rodgers because they didn't want to deal with the perception the didn't vote for Rodgers solely due to the COVID drama Hub cited.

[nate82]

I still have Marino as the greatest QB ever and no SB championships don't count as being the greatest QB it just means the QB were on good teams overall. If we go that route then Aikman is in the top 5 which I doubt anyone would put Aikman in the top 5 as a QB the same with Young.

 

My top 5 QB:

1. Marino

2. Favre

3. P. Manning

4. Brady

5. Rodgers/Montana

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I have Manning lower than most because I simply watched the guy play a lot of awful games and throw a lot of really bad interceptions. Brady is pretty underwhelming to me on the eye test but the results are so ridiculous there is no point even trying to suggest an alternative. If Rodgers had a 2nd title he would be my #2, I still consider him the most physically gifted to play, but it's same deal with Brady where his shortcomings in the postseason have just become too common to ignore any longer.

 

I would go

 

1. Brady

2. Marino, I'm with you here, a truly transcendent talent, just way beyond his peer group

3. Rodgers

4. Montana

5. Manning

[Fear The Chorizo]

I personally feel like Rodgers is the most talented quarterback in league history in terms of the complete package - arm talent, athleticism, pocket presence, ability to dictate the game. That obviously hasn't equated to him winning a fistful of rings because of how difficult it is to sustain success in the NFL and win all the big games when those opportunities are there. Seems like Maholmes' career may wind up mirroring Rodgers with getting a title early on as a starter with the assumption more were sure to follow, but then the team he's on is set to go through inevitable roster churn and salary cap difficulties - basically leading a really good but flawed enough team that isn't an overwhelming title favorite.

 

Tom Brady is the absolute QB unicorn and has to be considered the GOAT at the position with 7 rings - what he lacks in physical talent he has made up for with just finding ways to win games (both on the field and just as importantly with his contracts over the years to limit how big an albatross he is for salary cap purposes to build around him).

[sveumrules]

Comparing QBs across generations can be tough. Back in 1984, when Dan Marino had his historic season (108.9 rating) the average QB rating was 76.1. This year, when Aaron Rodgers had a pretty pedestrian by his standards (but still league leading) passer rating of 111.9, the average QB rating was 90.8.

 

Luckily PFRef has done all the work of creating a RATE+ stat, that normalizes for era. Dan Marino's 1984 RATE+ comes in at 141, tied with 1968 Bart Starr for the 10th best mark of the Super Bowl Era. 

 

For comparison, Rodgers best season in 2011 comes in at a RATE+ of 149, tied with 1989 Marino for the second highest mark of the Super Bowl Era behind only Peyton Manning at 151 in 2004.  

 

They don't have career RATE+ numbers, but looking at single seasons & drawing an arbitrary line at a RATE+ of 119 (Rodgers mark in the 2010 Super Bowl season) here is how many seasons each QB has above that line...

 

Rodgers (9) Peyton (9) Brees (9) Montana (8) Young (8) Favre (6) Brady (5) Marino (5) Elway (2) Aikman (2)

[PinaMadness]

Kamara claims that Greene called one of his friends "ugly".

 

This was his defense for him and his friends nearly killing a person.

 

He should get a lifetime suspension, but we know that isn't going to happen.

 

Hopefully he gets some jail/prison time.

The NFL is too busy right now faking concern over the lack of black head coaches to be fake concerned about off the field crime.

[PinaMadness]

Hard to put Rodgers and Favre in the top 6 all time when they are only #2 and 3 of all time Packers quarterbacks.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Hard to put Rodgers and Favre in the top 6 all time when they are only #2 and 3 of all time Packers quarterbacks.

 

The modern-day QB position is basically a completely different position than what was played in the 1960s.

[adambr2]

The further away the eras, the more any comparison just feels like apples to oranges. Imagine trying to compare Clayton Kershaw and Cy Young. It just feels like you can't.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Hard to put Rodgers and Favre in the top 6 all time when they are only #2 and 3 of all time Packers quarterbacks.

 

He's not close to either Favre or Rodgers but ok.

 

Personally, don't believe Favre to be in Rodgers's orbit either.

[PinaMadness]

I'm just saying that after the loss to the Niners all the pundits were saying that the loss hurt Rodgers legacy and rank of all time greats, and continue to mentions only two Championships in 30 years of Hall of Fame quarterback play. I used to ignore that noise, but now I believe it. Starr didn't squander a good number of golden opportunities like Favre and Rodgers did. He took advantage of damn near every one of them.

[sveumrules]

I'm just saying that after the loss to the Niners all the pundits were saying that the loss hurt Rodgers legacy and rank of all time greats, and continue to mentions only two Championships in 30 years of Hall of Fame quarterback play. I used to ignore that noise, but now I believe it. Starr didn't squander a good number of golden opportunities like Favre and Rodgers did. He took advantage of damn near every one of them.

 

The level of competition & number of teams is drastically different than it was over 50 years ago. The opportunities Starr had were much easier opportunities than either of Favre or Rodgers had.

 

How many teams have more than two Super Bowl wins over the last 30 years?

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'm just saying that after the loss to the Niners all the pundits were saying that the loss hurt Rodgers legacy and rank of all time greats, and continue to mentions only two Championships in 30 years of Hall of Fame quarterback play. I used to ignore that noise, but now I believe it. Starr didn't squander a good number of golden opportunities like Favre and Rodgers did. He took advantage of damn near every one of them.

 

In all but one of his championship seasons, winning the championship meant either winning 1 or 2 games. In a bunch of them, you were the champion of 14 teams.