Keston Hiura has a .984 OPS in Nashville

[YelichPosse]

2 minutes ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

From that article, that CC quote about not being sure there are enough at bats at DH for Hiura due to Winker being on the roster is downright maddening.  

Agreed, based on STATS alone. Huira at his worst, is better than Winker is this year.... yikes.

[brooks_quichenick]

Not very encouraging. Hopefully Keston gets traded to a team that will give him another MLB opportunity as a DH.

[Fear The Chorizo]

2 minutes ago, brooks_quichenick said:

Not very encouraging. Hopefully Keston gets traded to a team that will give him another MLB opportunity as a DH.

Or Arnold does what he should do and get Winker out of the organization so CC can't sharpie his name in the lineup anymore.

[Frisbee Slider]

6 minutes ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

From that article, that CC quote about not being sure there are enough at bats at DH for Hiura due to Winker being on the roster is downright maddening.  

Could the CC quote be a dog whistle for removing Winker from the roster?

[YelichPosse]

1 minute ago, Frisbee Slider said:

Could the CC quote be a dog whistle for removing Winker from the roster?

That would be well played!!! He may finally be in a place where he's going to take time off after this year so just start to keep it real... haha.

[igor67]

I was trying to figure out how to do worse than Winker's .247 SLG, and was disturbed to learn that JBJ is still playing and has put up a 

397 OPS I thought baseball was a family game. In any event prior to this year even JBJ always beat that terrible of a SLG

[CheezWizHed]

18 minutes ago, igor67 said:

I was trying to figure out how to do worse than Winker's .247 SLG, and was disturbed to learn that JBJ is still playing and has put up a 

397 OPS I thought baseball was a family game. In any event prior to this year even JBJ always beat that terrible of a SLG

There is our new trade target to upgrade our DH position!

[Frisbee Slider]

38 minutes ago, igor67 said:

disturbed to learn that JBJ is still playing

He was released last month.

[KeithStone53151]

50 minutes ago, Frisbee Slider said:

Could the CC quote be a dog whistle for removing Winker from the roster?

Ya know, I've wondered if CC is subtly sending messages to Matt Arnold in this manner. After Rowdy went down, CC said something like "we're going to see a lot of Miller at 1b". I wondered if that was his way of saying "I need a 1b that hits better than Miller". This I would consider very similar.

[treego14]

1 hour ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

From that article, that CC quote about not being sure there are enough at bats at DH for Hiura due to Winker being on the roster is downright maddening.  

Yeah, Winker is a stinker, and CC’s logic is an insult to a thinker!

[Fear The Chorizo]

49 minutes ago, KeithStone53151 said:

Ya know, I've wondered if CC is subtly sending messages to Matt Arnold in this manner. After Rowdy went down, CC said something like "we're going to see a lot of Miller at 1b". I wondered if that was his way of saying "I need a 1b that hits better than Miller". This I would consider very similar.

If not for CC's history of giving infinitely long leashes to marginally decent veteran hitters who are struggling before changes actually get made, I'd think there's smoke to this line of thinking.  IMO I think CC still has flashbacks to the end of his playing career and is trying to find a player to break his 45 AB hitless streak to get his name out of the record books for that feat.

[Outlander]

Considering Miller is the only player currently on the team that has played 1B this season I would hope the front office would know Miller would see a lot of time at 1B if they don't trade for/call somebody else up.

[KeithStone53151]

15 minutes ago, treego14 said:

Yeah, Winker is a stinker, and CC’s logic is an insult to a thinker!

For all our discussion regarding Hiura, the fact that he'd play Miller over Hiura at 1b right now is laughable and shows one of CC's glaring and massive weaknesses as a manager...his obsession with middling utility players that can't hit.

[Brewcrew82]

22 minutes ago, KeithStone53151 said:

For all our discussion regarding Hiura, the fact that he'd play Miller over Hiura at 1b right now is laughable and shows one of CC's glaring and massive weaknesses as a manager...his obsession with middling utility players that can't hit.

To be fair, Counsell cares about defense, (as he should given our roster construction), and Hiura is an absolute butcher in the field. 

And it's not like Hiura (post-2019) has been that much better of a hitter than Miller. xWOBA's from the last two season are very similar and Miller makes a ton more contact than Hiura. 

[brewcrewdue80]

On 7/9/2023 at 4:55 PM, nate82 said:

These are all of the players that are better than Hiura in the International League:

What Hiura is doing in AAA is nothing and means absolutely nothing.  If he were in the teens with his K% I would start to think he has turned things around but he is not doing that. 

At best Hiura is probably the same as Perkins and Topa but both Perkins and Topa have an advantage over Hiura they can actually field a position Hiura can not.  When you have a bench player and that is what Hiura is having that bench player only being a DH is going to hold that player back.  Hiura would have to be at the level of a Manny Ramirez, David Ortiz or Prince Fielder to be valuable.  He is not anywhere close to that even replacing Winker with Hiura doesn't really move the needle all that much.  If anything it probably makes the team worse. 

I get the statement Hiura has no business being called up due to having 0 defensive value.  But We are staring at a Sub .600 OPS Winker with the exact same problem.  no defensive value.  Heck he bats Lefty and has been sitting games now vs LH pitching.  Winker is a platoon player now.  So, all that said, Replacing his suck for Hiura to bat DH with 0 defensive implications that just may actually provide some RBI/HRs you know scoring runs should be embarked on.  I mean people complain about Hiura's misuse and his reverse splits.  So him having a career .840 OPS vs RH pitchers isn't worth replacing Winker's current 565 OPS vs RH pitchers when he's used as a platoon bat now?   Everything in Winker's statcast numbers are worse than his worst season ever last season.  There's not one shining bright spot to put any faith in him turning it around.  His k% is up to 25.5%  

Like I just want both sagas to end.  Winker good bye.  Hiura called up given every chance to remain in the bigs batting 5 games a week.  If he can't hang then good bye to him too. 

[AdvantageSchneider]

1 hour ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

If not for CC's history of giving infinitely long leashes to marginally decent veteran hitters who are struggling before changes actually get made, I'd think there's smoke to this line of thinking.  IMO I think CC still has flashbacks to the end of his playing career and is trying to find a player to break his 45 AB hitless streak to get his name out of the record books for that feat.

Is Chris Davis our manager?  He currently holds the record at 54. 

 

[Portage Plumber]

1 hour ago, Brewcrew82 said:

To be fair, Counsell cares about defense, (as he should given our roster construction), and Hiura is an absolute butcher in the field. 

And it's not like Hiura (post-2019) has been that much better of a hitter than Miller. xWOBA's from the last two season are very similar and Miller makes a ton more contact than Hiura. 

Miller is a butcher at first.

[Brewcrew82]

17 minutes ago, Portage Plumber said:

Miller is a butcher at first.

That's a fallacy. Among players with 150 innings at 1B this year, Miller is #1 in Fangraphs dWAR, #2 in UZR/150, top 10 in OAA, and top 12 in DRS. He's quite literally been among the best fielding first basemen in baseball. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

1 hour ago, AdvantageSchneider said:

Is Chris Davis our manager?  He currently holds the record at 54. 

 

oops forgot about that one...well, CC is still on the podium, lol

[KeithStone53151]

2 hours ago, Brewcrew82 said:

To be fair, Counsell cares about defense, (as he should given our roster construction), and Hiura is an absolute butcher in the field. 

And it's not like Hiura (post-2019) has been that much better of a hitter than Miller. xWOBA's from the last two season are very similar and Miller makes a ton more contact than Hiura. 

Hiura in 600+ mlb innings at 1b between 2021 and 2022 is an average defensive 1b when you consider UZR, DRS, range, etc. I'll take an average defensive 1b that can hit over a borderline GG defender at 1b that can't hit. Owen Miller had the month of his life in May driven by a near 400 BABIP and has since regressed to the AAAA talent he is. The fact Miller is hitting cleanup today is absolutely laughable and a testament to the incompetence of CC. How does he not realize that Miller can't hit? I get that our lineup is not good, but I believe literally ever hitter in the lineup today is better than Miller. He should be batting 9th today, really he should go back to his utility role and get glued to the bench barring injury.

[rickh150]

4 hours ago, YelichPosse said:

Agreed, based on STATS alone. Huira at his worst, is better than Winker is this year.... yikes.

Didn’t matter how bad Cutch hit righties last August/Sept…. He played.

[Brewin]

Miller is a well below average at 1st base defensively. 150 innings isn't a large enough sample size to say he is "among the best fielding first basemen in baseball". In fact, the eye test tells you he is much closer to the opposite IMO

[Brewcrew82]

4 minutes ago, Brewin said:

Miller is a well below average at 1st base defensively. 150 innings isn't a large enough sample size to say he is "among the best fielding first basemen in baseball". In fact, the eye test tells you he is much closer to the opposite IMO

The same thing applies if you extend it across the 800 innings he's played there the last two seasons. It's been his most frequent position in the majors. 

He's got excellent range for a first baseman and has gotten to balls that Rowdy could never dream of getting to. 

"Eye test" is deceiving, because he's been unable to scoop up a couple of throws, whereas Rowdy was generally able to do that well. But there's much more to fielding the position. 

[rickh150]

58 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

The same thing applies if you extend it across the 800 innings he's played there the last two seasons. It's been his most frequent position in the majors. 

He's got excellent range for a first baseman and has gotten to balls that Rowdy could never dream of getting to. 

"Eye test" is deceiving, because he's been unable to scoop up a couple of throws, whereas Rowdy was generally able to do that well. But there's much more to fielding the position. 

The range is much better with Miller there, absolutely.
But preferably we need a big bat at first and that isn’t Miller. He could start at 3B or 2B for us, which is saying nothing. Just want a bigger bat at first, and a call up or the trade deadline should bring us that easily.

[Brewcrew82]

2 minutes ago, rickh150 said:

The range is much better with Miller there, absolutely.
But preferably we need a big bat at first and that isn’t Miller. He could start at 3B or 2B for us, which is saying nothing. Just want a bigger bat at first, and a call up or the trade deadline should bring us that easily.

Yeah. I’m not saying Miller should be our 1B because his bat isn’t good enough. I’m just saying that Hiura probably isn’t our solution there, either. He’d be better off at DH.