Packers 2024 Off-Season Thread

[BrewerFan]

1 hour ago, OldHeidelberg said:

Nixon back 3 yrs/18 million. I hope they plan on him paying safety.

I'd hope so...I wonder if they'd pay him 3./18 to play a new position(well see what the GTD money is).

He's just really limited playing the slot. He's a really good athlete, just tight. Doesn't have the fluidity to cover smaller quicker WRs. He does have the ball-tracking skills and I believe the tackling skills to play safety...and the Packers need both depth there, and they also need their safeties to be able to play both in the box, the slot and CF. 

Nixon could do that.

Still hoping for one more FA signing. Fuller, Whitehead...whoever...

[LouisEly]

Playing slot corner is really difficult.  It's very difficult to cover shifty slot receivers and trying to react to what they are doing.  Slot receivers also usually line up off the line of scrimmage or motion across/out, making it very difficult to jam them at the LOS or play bump and run press - they almost always get a free release. 

They're also paying Nixon to be an All-Pro kick returner.  Packers were 5th in average KO return yardage and through the middle of December had the 2nd best average starting field position.

[OldHeidelberg]

There are some proposed kickoff rule changes that could mean more returns for Nixon as well, maybe the Packers know these will be implemented.

[Joseph Zarr]

Pretty big fan of the Nixon re-up. He does a lot for the team. Had stretches of really good ball. I think he'll benefit from a D-Coordinator who knows how to cater to a secondary player's strengths as well. They still likely need another CB in the first 4 rds.

[CheezWizHed]

22 hours ago, LouisEly said:

Keep in mind, the Vikings couldn't make that offer until after Jones was released.  When the Packers offered, it was the Packers offer or get released - no other teams to compete with.

Once Jones was released, it was the Vikings versus any/every other team's offer so the Vikings - if they really wanted him - had to buck up the offer to ensure that they made a better offer than anyone else.  Thus why free agents often get overpaid - they're competing blindly against everyone else.

Teams never know what other teams are offering or will offer.   Even if a player is a FA, I'd be willing to bet that almost if not every offer has a NDA attached to it.

Jones was signed one day (or less?) after he was released.

Do you think the Vikings really waited until after Jones was released to make the deal?  Or was some illegal tampering happening where Rosenhaus had an inkling of what Jones could get?  I'd bet on the latter. 

[CheezWizHed]

16 hours ago, Joseph Zarr said:

Pretty big fan of the Nixon re-up. He does a lot for the team. Had stretches of really good ball. I think he'll benefit from a D-Coordinator who knows how to cater to a secondary player's strengths as well. They still likely need another CB in the first 4 rds.

This is a good point. Nixon's overall coverage numbers weren't great, but he did have individual games where he looked very good...and others where he stunk.  A better DC (with better plans and communication) might improve the back-end there.

[LouisEly]

51 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

Do you think the Vikings really waited until after Jones was released to make the deal? 

Yes, 1) because it's tampering if they do, B) if Jones or Rosenhaus makes any reference to his market value they are going to suspect tampering and report it to the League, and 3) there was no indication that the Packers were going to release Jones until after they signed Jacobs, and nobody knew they were going to sign Jacobs until the day they released Jones.  There was very little window for the Viqueens to make any offer, much less anticipate Jones being released as opposed to the hundred other players who were released that day.

It's also possible that the Viqueens made a quick, above-market offer for Jones because Jones kind of knows their playbook.

 

[CheezWizHed]

20 minutes ago, LouisEly said:

Yes, 1) because it's tampering if they do, B) if Jones or Rosenhaus makes any reference to his market value they are going to suspect tampering and report it to the League, and 3) there was no indication that the Packers were going to release Jones until after they signed Jacobs, and nobody knew they were going to sign Jacobs until the day they released Jones.  There was very little window for the Viqueens to make any offer, much less anticipate Jones being released as opposed to the hundred other players who were released that day.

It's also possible that the Viqueens made a quick, above-market offer for Jones because Jones kind of knows their playbook.

 

A) Rosenhaus knew he was being asked to cut Jones' salary.

2) Rosenhaus doesn't need to use another offer to negotiate the pay cut with the Packers.  Just to know if he wants to accept it a pay cut or not. 

D) They created a "legal tampering" period because of all the illegal tampering that occurred.  Yet, every year people sign massive contracts on the first day of legal tampering... do you really think people aren't illegally tampering again?

[LouisEly]

4 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

They created a "legal tampering" period because of all the illegal tampering that occurred.  Yet, every year people sign massive contracts on the first day of legal tampering... do you really think people aren't illegally tampering again?

The legal tampering period is for known free agents.  Teams know for a month who is going to be a free agent, thus why the contracts are ready.  I guarantee they aren't preparing hundreds of contract offers for players who may potentially be released but are still under contract.

[CheezWizHed]

Maybe I'm wrong, but the tampering rules prevent the two sides from talking.  Sure, teams will have a game plan of who they will target, the budget for those FAs, and a contract proposal.  But you can't negotiate, send proposals, feel out how much they want, etc...

It seems like many of these contracts are signed so quickly that it infers there was previous discussion already happening to get the two sides to a mutual understanding. 

Maybe the Vikings reacted quickly by reaching out to Rosenhaus and he gave a demand.  Or maybe Rosenhaus reached out earlier and asked a "what if" question to know what the Vikings would offer if Jones was cut. 

Frankly, I find it a little weird that Jones didn't try for two years instead - unless Rosenhaus already knew people wouldn't offer it.

Either way, just saying it doesn't happen because it is "illegal" is a bit silly... Yeah, New England didn't spy on other team's signs either. 😅

[LouisEly]

I guarantee that Rosenhaus didn't sit there twiddling his thumbs once he found out that Jones was going to be released.  I'm sure that he immediately sent a message to the GMs of every other team as soon as he was informed.

It's really, really difficult in this day and age of digital fingerprints to have a "not technicallly legal" conversation about a contract with someone and have other people not know about it.  I'm sure there are discussions with known free agents whose contracts are expiring prior to the legal tampering period, but they're going to be free agents so nobody cares.  I think people will care a lot if there is a discussion about someone who is under contract and not scheduled to be a free agent.  And if an agent is willing to do that with a player on another team... he will likely do that with a player on your team, and that won't sit well.  It's not a one-way street where that happens just with one team and other teams won't care.

[BrewerFan]

20 hours ago, LouisEly said:

Playing slot corner is really difficult.  It's very difficult to cover shifty slot receivers and trying to react to what they are doing.  Slot receivers also usually line up off the line of scrimmage or motion across/out, making it very difficult to jam them at the LOS or play bump and run press - they almost always get a free release. 

They're also paying Nixon to be an All-Pro kick returner.  Packers were 5th in average KO return yardage and through the middle of December had the 2nd best average starting field position.

That is surprising, but I don't think it can be attributed to Nixon too much. He took the ball out from 5 yards deep and failed to get back to the 25 a lot.

They're average field position after Kick Returns was 23rd. I think him being able to return kicks is more of a bonus than the reason they're paying him OR they think the new rule will go through and then Kick Returns are going to play a MUCH bigger role again.

(Just a source for average starting position after KRs as I NEVER remember where I find/see these). 

[CheezWizHed]

2 hours ago, LouisEly said:

I guarantee that Rosenhaus didn't sit there twiddling his thumbs once he found out that Jones was going to be released.  I'm sure that he immediately sent a message to the GMs of every other team as soon as he was informed.

It's really, really difficult in this day and age of digital fingerprints to have a "not technicallly legal" conversation about a contract with someone and have other people not know about it.  I'm sure there are discussions with known free agents whose contracts are expiring prior to the legal tampering period, but they're going to be free agents so nobody cares.  I think people will care a lot if there is a discussion about someone who is under contract and not scheduled to be a free agent.  And if an agent is willing to do that with a player on another team... he will likely do that with a player on your team, and that won't sit well.  It's not a one-way street where that happens just with one team and other teams won't care.

Since agents have multiple clients, it is really hard to verify that they are talking about one player vs another.  Someone would be stupid to text or email a question like that.  But a "hey, I got a question" on the phone after talking about another player would be hard to verify. 

You are right about the ethics of "if you do it for me, you will do it against me"... but that used to happen regularly.  I would be surprised if it never happens now. 

[CheezWizHed]

7 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

That is surprising, but I don't think it can be attributed to Nixon too much. He took the ball out from 5 yards deep and failed to get back to the 25 a lot.

They're average field position after Kick Returns was 23rd. I think him being able to return kicks is more of a bonus than the reason they're paying him OR they think the new rule will go through and then Kick Returns are going to play a MUCH bigger role again.

(Just a source for average starting position after KRs as I NEVER remember where I find/see these). 

It would be nice to see it charted by month too.  By memory, I remember yelling at the TV during kickoff FAR more frequently in September than in December.

Initially, I think last year's accolades either made him press more or made him feel like he was invincible and it resulted in really stupid KR attempts.  That got better as the year went on and he looked much better late - with bigger legit returns too. 

[BrewerFan]

9 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

It would be nice to see it charted by month too.  By memory, I remember yelling at the TV during kickoff FAR more frequently in September than in December.

Initially, I think last year's accolades either made him press more or made him feel like he was invincible and it resulted in really stupid KR attempts.  That got better as the year went on and he looked much better late - with bigger legit returns too. 

That's probably right. He did seem to return the ball when it was kicked deep a lot less. He could have been pressing with the offense playing poorly and him in another FA year and then settled in. The Packers STs penalties didn't help either as he could take it out 5 deep, get it to the 23...not a big deal, but then there was a block in the back that put us at the 13 and that seemed to happen regularly early in the season.

 

I hate gimmicky stuff and maybe that's what the new proposed KO rules are, but they seem really interesting. What is the proposal? The KO team starts at the 40, the return team starts at the 30, there is a ref who raises his hand and the KO team can't go until the ball is touched and the kicker has to get the ball in between the 20 and the endzone. Is that right? I saw it on a short McAfee clip. Didn't make total sense as he was talking about how just a regular kickback would come out to the 35. It also kinda punishes a kicker who can give you a lot of hangtime, but it doesn't sound like it's completely fleshed out yet. 

[OldHeidelberg]

9 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

That's probably right. He did seem to return the ball when it was kicked deep a lot less. He could have been pressing with the offense playing poorly and him in another FA year and then settled in. The Packers STs penalties didn't help either as he could take it out 5 deep, get it to the 23...not a big deal, but then there was a block in the back that put us at the 13 and that seemed to happen regularly early in the season.

 

I hate gimmicky stuff and maybe that's what the new proposed KO rules are, but they seem really interesting. What is the proposal? The KO team starts at the 40, the return team starts at the 30, there is a ref who raises his hand and the KO team can't go until the ball is touched and the kicker has to get the ball in between the 20 and the endzone. Is that right? I saw it on a short McAfee clip. Didn't make total sense as he was talking about how just a regular kickback would come out to the 35. It also kinda punishes a kicker who can give you a lot of hangtime, but it doesn't sound like it's completely fleshed out yet. 

I think if the ball bounce between the 20 and goal line and goes in it is still at the 20 but if it lands in the end zone it is the 35. I would prefer they just get rid of the kickoffs but they need the onside kicks to keep people watching the game late for TV revenue reasons. It's not a horrible change and sounds like it would help with less collisions.  

[LouisEly]

3 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

Since agents have multiple clients, it is really hard to verify that they are talking about one player vs another.

And that's true.  But with the number of people and departments involved in the creation of a contract - not just the GM, but finance, legal, etc, it's hard to cover up all of those digital fingerprints (contracts aren't written with pen and paper) and/or not have a whistleblower or someone willing to spill the beans to a reporter.

Even if it's just "agreeing to terms", finance and others need to be involved to see at least how it affects their salary cap and organizational fit.

[areacodes]

3 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

That is surprising, but I don't think it can be attributed to Nixon too much. He took the ball out from 5 yards deep and failed to get back to the 25 a lot.

They're average field position after Kick Returns was 23rd. I think him being able to return kicks is more of a bonus than the reason they're paying him OR they think the new rule will go through and then Kick Returns are going to play a MUCH bigger role again.

(Just a source for average starting position after KRs as I NEVER remember where I find/see these). 

Unless there was clarification elsewhere in the article you cited, what you quoted doesn’t indicate they were 23rd after kick returns - it indicates they were 23rd after a kickoff.

[OldHeidelberg]

Dillon is back. Assuming it isn’t for much glad to see him back.

[HarryDoyle]

21 minutes ago, OldHeidelberg said:

Dillon is back. Assuming it isn’t for much glad to see him back.

Not a surprising move at all seeing as Jones is gone now. I couldn't see Jacobs doing all the heavy lifting. Probably just a one year deal.

[Fear The Chorizo]

25 minutes ago, HarryDoyle said:

Not a surprising move at all seeing as Jones is gone now. I couldn't see Jacobs doing all the heavy lifting. Probably just a one year deal.

1 yr contract that totals a VRBO credit for door county, slip in egg harbor for a boat, and confidentiality agreement that withholds any and all photos of his legs in the weight room should be about market rate...

Actually like the move, as it reduces the need to look at RB in the draft until late rounds and frees up those higher picks to target impact talent at positions teams shouldnt kill their salary caps with in free agency.

[duewizard]

Happy to see Dillon back. Decent RB2 and a great guy. Just waiting to see the cost.

[wallus]

Dillon as a RB2 is fine when Jacobs is going to get the vast majority of carries anyways.

[Brewin]

11 hours ago, wallus said:

Dillon as a RB2 is fine when Jacobs is going to get the vast majority of carries anyways.

I agree as long as Jacobs does get the majority of the carries. One of my biggest complaints with MLF is he used Dillon too much when it was Dillon and Jones. He treated them like RB 1 & 1A, not Jones as a clear #1 back. If he continues to do that with Jacobs, that's a problem.

[homer]

draft Braelon Allen for the three headed monster