Packers 2024 Season Thread

[adambr2]

I still don't know how the Chiefs got Mahomes to agree on a 10 year deal when all these other QBs are doing 4-5 years. Different time and market, I know, but that's already looking insanely team-friendly, can't imagine what it'll look like in 5 years. 

Really he could force them to renegotiate anytime but it doesn't sound like he's ever going to. 

[BrewerFan]

7 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

Nice to see a few others of you jump on the "rookie contract QB" being overrated bandwagon. 😂

I think the idea is attractive because it makes sense logically (great QB on the cheap) and spend $$ elsewhere.  But in practice it rarely plays out that way.  Most the time, the QB needs time to develop and grow in the position to be good enough to win a SB. 

And ironically, 3 of the 5 QBs listed (Brady, Warner, Wilson) weren't high draft picks (6th, UDFA - cut multiple times, and 3rd).  

I've always been on that bandwagon! And I think most of the "rookie QB contract," talk came from Wilson with that incredible defense they had. It was a 5 of 6 year run that they were #1 with a single season they were #2?

And yes, the QBs I listed were outliers and even Brady, as I said, they had a huge QB salary on that team, so does that even count? It's not like they saved their money on the QB position and put it toward other positions. They just had a great defense and early in Brady's career, he had to manage the game.

Warner jumped into an insanely talented offense. 

Big Ben was good, but again, that defense and Mahomes is the closest comp to Love on here...IMO, and just that much more talented than everyone else. Not saying Love is Mahomes(though he looked like it at times)...

And finally, Love is still pretty much on a rookie deal this year. 20M would be the 5th year option had they picked it up. It's likely to be around ~10% in the next couple of years(a little over, but hardly exorbitant).

I know it's technically the most for a QB ever, but the GTD money is 80M less than Watson, the contract is actually cheaper overall than the Lawrence or even Tua deals. Tua gets less than 10M this year and his cap hit jumps to ~60M the next couple years. 

 

6 hours ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

The Packers have managed the transition from on HOF qb to the next mainstay much more effectively than what they did between Favre and Rodgers - frankly any thoughts of them doing it better from either a PR or on the field standpoint is 20/20 hindsight that probably can't be proven true since it never would unfold the same way it actually did.

They really did. I still believe they were a Bakh injury away from winning a SB one of those two years, they were down one year with Rodgers still playing and then right back up there with Love the next year, now one of the SB favorites.

What could you really second guess? They should have gotten a GTD 1st for Rodgers? LOL...it's really not a whole lot you could ask for from Gute that he didn't get. That 1st would have been...pretty nice, but I think the Break-up was at the best possible time between injuries and Rodgers..."opening up," about some things. 

I don't even know if some of them are true, but I'm glad Jets fans have to answer if he was following the lead of some other media figures questioning the validity of certain high-profile events at any point in time. 

 

[Fear The Chorizo]

4 hours ago, adambr2 said:

I still don't know how the Chiefs got Mahomes to agree on a 10 year deal when all these other QBs are doing 4-5 years. Different time and market, I know, but that's already looking insanely team-friendly, can't imagine what it'll look like in 5 years. 

Really he could force them to renegotiate anytime but it doesn't sound like he's ever going to. 

Theyve already redone his deal once, and it will probably be an every other offseason sort of thing until he either gets badly injured or retires.

[adambr2]

47 minutes ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

Theyve already redone his deal once, and it will probably be an every other offseason sort of thing until he either gets badly injured or retires.

Yes, but those kind of contract restructures are pretty standard everywhere as works best for the organization and often even outside the own player's control. What I'm saying is that if he wanted to ask the organization to completely re-do his deal to put his AAV at the front of the line after all these new deals, he probably could. 

[mtsportsfan]

1 hour ago, adambr2 said:

Yes, but those kind of contract restructures are pretty standard everywhere as works best for the organization and often even outside the own player's control. What I'm saying is that if he wanted to ask the organization to completely re-do his deal to put his AAV at the front of the line after all these new deals, he probably could. 

He's just not a money grubber , like Brady , he just wants to win while still making excellent money. 

[BrewerFan]

7 hours ago, adambr2 said:

I still don't know how the Chiefs got Mahomes to agree on a 10 year deal when all these other QBs are doing 4-5 years. Different time and market, I know, but that's already looking insanely team-friendly, can't imagine what it'll look like in 5 years. 

Really he could force them to renegotiate anytime but it doesn't sound like he's ever going to. 

It'll probably once again having him the highest paid QB in the game with another restructure. The 10-year 503M deal was just for accounting obviously. He got a ~4/220 extension before '23. That brought the total GTD money from 2020-2023 up to nearly 280M. 

His cap hit was 35 two years ago, 37 last year, 39 this year and then it jumps to the upper 60s the next couple years. So they'll likely restructure again, he'll probably get more money. 

 

[BrewerFan]

1 hour ago, mtsportsfan said:

He's just not a money grubber , like Brady , he just wants to win while still making excellent money. 

His average cap hit is 60M over the next 4 years. From '25 to '27 it's about 65. 

He's not taking any discounts. 

[adambr2]

18 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

His average cap hit is 60M over the next 4 years. From '25 to '27 it's about 65. 

He's not taking any discounts. 

That's awfully misleading, considering his first 2 years his cap hits were 7M or less, and he only has a total of 3 years in the entirety of his contract where his cap number exceeds 48M. In '28 and '29 it doesn't exceed 35M. Relative to today's market he's definitely signed on a huge discount. They're cap hits that they'll never see because they'll be restructured, but they're only that high because the Chiefs have already benefitted from the most cap friendly years on the deal. Just like the Lions aren't going to have a 70M cap hit on Goff and the Packers aren't going to have a 74M cap hit on Love because both will be restructured later.

 

[BrewerFan]

3 hours ago, adambr2 said:

That's awfully misleading, considering his first 2 years his cap hits were 7M or less, and he only has a total of 3 years in the entirety of his contract where his cap number exceeds 48M. In '28 and '29 it doesn't exceed 35M. Relative to today's market he's definitely signed on a huge discount. They're cap hits that they'll never see because they'll be restructured, but they're only that high because the Chiefs have already benefitted from the most cap friendly years on the deal. Just like the Lions aren't going to have a 70M cap hit on Goff and the Packers aren't going to have a 74M cap hit on Love because both will be restructured later.

 

No, it's not misleading at all. You're using numbers from his rookie contract. That'd be like using the last two years for Love('23 and '24).

Again, just restructured it adding 4 and nearly 220 himself before the '23 season.

There's nothing misleading about the numbers, the only thing misleading is thinking that's just a 10 year deal for 503M. 

His rookie deal went until 2021.

17.9% of the salary cap in 2022
16.5% of the cap in 2023
14.5% of the cap in '24
24% of the cap the next two years.

And he'll almost certainly get another restructure, another big check, they'll lower those 66M dollar cap hits down to 30, spread it all out more and continue to do so. 

He's not taking discounts. That's the point. 

Love has cap hits of ~8%(still kinda part of the rookie deal, but they added $), ~11%, 12.37%, 13.57% and then ~21.6% when it gets up to 72M or whatever in 2028  at which time, he'll also have restructured(if he performs). 

 

 

You might as well throw out the 10 year 503 numbers as they're ultimately mostly meaningless. From 2020 to '23, when he signed his first two contracts, he got ~275 in GTD money. And he should have, he deserved it and he's won a couple of SBs. But...he's not leaving money on the table, the numbers are the numbers. The only ones that matter are the cash paid and the cap hits(and they really only matter in 5 years increments). Not the 2030 numbers.

[Joseph Zarr]

Ahhhhh, yes. The early pre-season injuries start taking hold:

 

[OldHeidelberg]

On 7/30/2024 at 6:19 PM, BrewerFan said:

 

You might as well throw out the 10 year 503 numbers as they're ultimately mostly meaningless. From 2020 to '23, when he signed his first two contracts, he got ~275 in GTD money. And he should have, he deserved it and he's won a couple of SBs. But...he's not leaving money on the table, the numbers are the numbers. The only ones that matter are the cash paid and the cap hits(and they really only matter in 5 years increments). Not the 2030 numbers.

I am not sure anyone is saying this(it's confusing) but I think it is pretty rare for an NFL team to actually tear up a deal and give a player more money halfway through for the same years. They will add years to a deal, and in doing so may move some of that pay to the years of the previous contract for cap reasons but the Chiefs will make Mahomes honor that 10 year contract. To put it another way, after 5 years of the deal the Chiefs won't tear it up and give him a brand new 5 year deal for $350 million. Any new money he gets will come from adding more years to the deal. Restructures are a cap tool that converts base to bonus to extend the cap hit, there is not actually more money added to deal. Sorry if this is obvious but I read a lot around the internet about how it didn't make sense to sign Love to 6 year deal since he would demand new contact in 3 years anyway and I don't think that is true. The Packers would have loved a couple of non guaranteed years tacked on. 

 

Back to camp talk, I have noticed Slaton is always listed as the starter next to Clark in the base D in camp reports. No one has said he is ahead of Wyatt but it still strikes me as odd, outside of short yardage I would think Slaton really is there to rotate in for Clark.

[BrewerFan]

Just now, OldHeidelberg said:

I am not sure anyone is saying this(it's confusing) but I think it is pretty rare for an NFL team to actually tear up a deal and give a player more money halfway through for the same years. They will add years to a deal, and in doing so may move some of that pay to the years of the previous contract for cap reasons but the Chiefs will make Mahomes honor that 10 year contract. To put it another way, after 5 years of the deal the Chiefs won't tear it up and give him a brand new 5 year deal for $350 million. Any new money he gets will come from adding more years to the deal. Restructures are a cap tool that converts base to bonus to extend the cap hit, there is not actually more money added to deal. Sorry if this is obvious but I read a lot around the internet about how it didn't make sense to sign Love to 6 year deal since he would demand new contact in 3 years anyway and I don't think that is true. The Packers would have loved a couple of non guaranteed years tacked on. 

That's exactly what the Chiefs did though. This was the point of the 10-year deal. It gives them more more room to maneuver. They just went and added 218M dollars GTD a couple of years after he signed that deal and no years(but voids) added. 

Restructures are not just converting base to bonus. That's just a restructure you can do without the player agreeing, but a restructure is just any changing in the contract. Yes, it's common to take a guy who's got a 60M salary, give it to him in a SB, spread that out over 5 years. That's not what KC has done with Mahomes. They've just increased his pay and are pretty open about doing it again in the future.  

 

Mahomes effectively has a 4-year contract and it'll almost certainly be restructured in '25 and he'll get more money at that point. 

[OldHeidelberg]

1 hour ago, BrewerFan said:

That's exactly what the Chiefs did though. This was the point of the 10-year deal. It gives them more more room to maneuver. They just went and added 218M dollars GTD a couple of years after he signed that deal and no years(but voids) added. 

Restructures are not just converting base to bonus. That's just a restructure you can do without the player agreeing, but a restructure is just any changing in the contract. Yes, it's common to take a guy who's got a 60M salary, give it to him in a SB, spread that out over 5 years. That's not what KC has done with Mahomes. They've just increased his pay and are pretty open about doing it again in the future.  

 

Mahomes effectively has a 4-year contract and it'll almost certainly be restructured in '25 and he'll get more money at that point. 

So you are saying Mahomes deal is now 10 years 668 million? I just did a quick search and it sounds like they guaranteed more and moved some money up but no new money. I could be wrong of course.

 

edit sorry had some dumb math and fixed it, I am sure that you didn’t mean they added 212 to the 450 million but I am not clear at all on it.

[BrewerFan]

6 hours ago, OldHeidelberg said:

So you are saying Mahomes deal is now 10 years 668 million? I just did a quick search and it sounds like they guaranteed more and moved some money up but no new money. I could be wrong of course.

 

edit sorry had some dumb math and fixed it, I am sure that you didn’t mean they added 212 to the 450 million but I am not clear at all on it.

They gave him more money...GTD, accelerating the money he'd get paid and they'll do so again in another ~year or so. 

A 20 year contract for 2B dollars doesn't mean anything if you're GTD 6M the first 2 years. They added 218B in GTDs a couple years after the first deal. So yes, they added money. 

They did give him more, they didn't add years. This will just...keep happening on a loop every couple of years. 

 

If, as you said, the Chiefs just wouldn't add money without giving him more years, they had literally no financial incentive to make restructure this contract. So why'd they do it? Because when you have a franchise QB, you keep them happy. You pay them. 

The Packers did this with Rodgers a couple of years ago. Actually voided a year, and added 3 at 150.8 when he still had 3 years left on his contract because...he was unhappy.  

https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/18/football/patrick-mahomes-record-contract-deal/index.html

Quote

According to ESPN's Adam Schefter, Mahomes' restructured contract will pay him $210.6 million between 2023 and 2026. That makes his average annual salary $52.65 million, second among all quarterbacks behind only Joe Burrow's $55 million. The entire $210.6 million is guaranteed, and the deal can be worth $218.1 million with incentives.

Additionally, the Chiefs plan to revisit the contract after 2026. While Mahomes' deal technically still runs through 2031, money from those later years has shifted up into the next four years, so the two-time MVP will effectively need a new contract once these four years are up if he wants to remain among the highest-paid at his position.

 

 

[CheezWizHed]

I know it started with Love's contract, but Chief's talk could move to the NFL thread... 😉

I have to say that I'm not a fan of the all-white helmet. Part of me wants to like it... but with everything white, it is just too much.  Maybe if they could jazz up the uniform a bit more the white helmet wouldn't look so stark.

[young guns]

I hate the all white uniforms and a white helmet makes it worse.

[OldHeidelberg]

4 hours ago, young guns said:

I hate the all white uniforms and a white helmet makes it worse.

Yeah I laughed at Vikes when they rolled out the winter uniforms. Now we are copying the freaking Vikings. 😡

[nate82]

4 hours ago, young guns said:

I hate the all white uniforms and a white helmet makes it worse.

Why do you hate stormtroopers?  Isn’t it enough that they lost so many of their friends on two death stars? And now you make fun of their white uniforms and white helmets!

You should be ashamed of yourself!  ASHAMED I SAY!

[GAME05]

Some green and/or yellow stripes, especially on the helmet, sure would have helped. Otherwise it's just so plain and boring. Does the Graphic Arts Department have an offseason, too?

Of course now I'm really really hoping for a hard snowstorm for that game because that would be hilarious.

Unrelated, I've been hearing a lot about Kalen King recently and that he's been getting reps with the 1st team and is looking great. Another 7th Round CB find? And CBS seems to think Morgan has locked up the RG position and it'll be Walker getting the starting LT spot.

[homer]

The only thing that I'm remotely worried about this year is the kicking game. Let's roll.

[OldHeidelberg]

12 hours ago, GAME05 said:

Unrelated, I've been hearing a lot about Kalen King recently and that he's been getting reps with the 1st team and is looking great. Another 7th Round CB find? And CBS seems to think Morgan has locked up the RG position and it'll be Walker getting the starting LT spot.

Yes, it's early but King has gotten some good press. Had a pick 6 off of Love I think and has been playing the slot. It would be great if he can replace Nixon there. Stokes also looking good and seems to be winning his starting spot back.

It sounds like the staff decided before camp that Morgan would be worked in at RG, I guess they saw enough on OTA's/minicamp to know he wasn't ready for LT and Walker hopefully still improving. 

[BrewerFan]

19 hours ago, GAME05 said:

Some green and/or yellow stripes, especially on the helmet, sure would have helped. Otherwise it's just so plain and boring. Does the Graphic Arts Department have an offseason, too?

Of course now I'm really really hoping for a hard snowstorm for that game because that would be hilarious.

Unrelated, I've been hearing a lot about Kalen King recently and that he's been getting reps with the 1st team and is looking great. Another 7th Round CB find? And CBS seems to think Morgan has locked up the RG position and it'll be Walker getting the starting LT spot.

I'm wondering how much of that is Morgan struggling at LT vs just not having RG options?

In any event, looking at Wirfs and Darrisaw's extensions, I'll take as many people who can play OT as we can get. 

5 years 141M and 4/113? 

Zach Tom's off-season just got a little brighter. That will likely be a priority this off-season(assuming good health). 

[yourout]

It still blows my mind that we pack a stadium for a glorified practice.

 

[yourout]

New kickoff rules are definitely interesting.

[BrewerFan]

4 minutes ago, yourout said:

New kickoff rules are definitely interesting.

Yeah, looks odd. 

Nice to see Stokes looking good, making a couple plays. That'd be big if they can get him back playing well.