Clase and Luis Ortiz Indicted on Suspicion of Pitch Fixing

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

https://www.theringer.com/2025/11/10/mlb/emmanuel-clase-luis-ortiz-guardians-mlb-betting-scandal-pitch-fixing

A good article from Ben Lindbergh analyzing the recent indictment of two Guardians pitchers on suspicion of pitch-fixing. Lindbergh analyzes the underlying data and reflects on the broader implications of the scandal.

There's obviously momentum, given the recent NBA scandal along these same lines, building toward bans and restrictions on player props, especially in contexts like these, where the markets are more easily manipulable. Yesterday, MLB announced an agreement with sportsbooks to limit pitch-specific bets to $200. That's...something?

Living in a state with mobile sports betting and having enjoyed (and not enjoyed) the practice on and off for a few years, I'm not a gambling doomer. But I certainly think we need more public education on simple mathematical concepts, on how the vig operates in legal gambling operations, and on how the apps are designed to encourage certain kinds of bad bets and troubling behavior. More than that, I worry about gambling, when it becomes 40-50 percent of an individual's or society's relationship to sport as opposed to 5-10 percent (and you could argue that, today, gambling ads and revenue have a controlling stake in pro sports leagues and media), you get some really icky consequences. Watching a game to see how many rebounds Giannis gets is a weird reason to watch a game. Watching Game 7 of the World Series and caring primarily about one's financial interest reduces the emotional beauty of the event. I don't know what'll happen, and I think it's a complex topic given that the genie's way out of the bottle, but I didn't see a thread, so here's one to open discussion.

[TURBO]

Who didn't see this coming with the glorification and legalization of gambling in pro sports?

Real shocker.

[tmwiese55]

5 hours ago, Cool Hand Lucroy said:

https://www.theringer.com/2025/11/10/mlb/emmanuel-clase-luis-ortiz-guardians-mlb-betting-scandal-pitch-fixing

A good article from Ben Lindbergh analyzing the recent indictment of two Guardians pitchers on suspicion of pitch-fixing. Lindbergh analyzes the underlying data and reflects on the broader implications of the scandal.

There's obviously momentum, given the recent NBA scandal along these same lines, building toward bans and restrictions on player props, especially in contexts like these, where the markets are more easily manipulable. Yesterday, MLB announced an agreement with sportsbooks to limit pitch-specific bets to $200. That's...something?

Living in a state with mobile sports betting and having enjoyed (and not enjoyed) the practice on and off for a few years, I'm not a gambling doomer. But I certainly think we need more public education on simple mathematical concepts, on how the vig operates in legal gambling operations, and on how the apps are designed to encourage certain kinds of bad bets and troubling behavior. More than that, I worry about gambling, when it becomes 40-50 percent of an individual's or society's relationship to sport as opposed to 5-10 percent (and you could argue that, today, gambling ads and revenue have a controlling stake in pro sports leagues and media), you get some really icky consequences. Watching a game to see how many rebounds Giannis gets is a weird reason to watch a game. Watching Game 7 of the World Series and caring primarily about one's financial interest reduces the emotional beauty of the event. I don't know what'll happen, and I think it's a complex topic given that the genie's way out of the bottle, but I didn't see a thread, so here's one to open discussion.

Your points on the watching for stats is one of the reasons I got annoyed with NFL over the years and people who cram it down your face, but in that case it was fantasy football. Which is really what propelled to be far and away past all other sports in the US.  On and on how great it is but you're not even watching it for the game itself, but rather your $10 fantasy team so you just care about random stats in it

[kestrel79]

How does this compare to what Ohtani was accused of doing that was swept under the rug? Of course they stick it to a smaller market team and not the face of baseball worldwide. Still pretty crazy stuff like this happens, but with all the crazy betting stuff not surprising.

While it's pretty old now, everyone should watch that EPSN 30 for 30 Broke about how pro athletes go broke so fast. Even though they are making millions, a couple bad investments here and there and they could resort to this kind of stuff to earn some extra cash.

[Team Canada]

On 11/12/2025 at 8:32 AM, kestrel79 said:

How does this compare to what Ohtani was accused of doing that was swept under the rug

I think Ohtani was never actually accused of doing anything, but it's been a bit. It was his translator that he summarily fired.

Regardless, he definitely wasn't taking specific actions during a game to make money.

[Jopal78]

On 11/13/2025 at 2:17 PM, Team Canada said:

I think Ohtani was never actually accused of doing anything, but it's been a bit. It was his translator that he summarily fired.

Regardless, he definitely wasn't taking specific actions during a game to make money.

Yes it was the translator making bets with Ohtani’s money. If we want to be cynical how does a translator have access to Ohtani’s bank accounts unless it’s with knowledge and consent? 

As for Clase and Ortiz. I assume they’re about to get lifetime bans like Pete Rose, Joe Jackson etc. 

[BrewerFan]

On 11/12/2025 at 8:32 AM, kestrel79 said:

How does this compare to what Ohtani was accused of doing that was swept under the rug? Of course they stick it to a smaller market team and not the face of baseball worldwide. Still pretty crazy stuff like this happens, but with all the crazy betting stuff not surprising.

While it's pretty old now, everyone should watch that EPSN 30 for 30 Broke about how pro athletes go broke so fast. Even though they are making millions, a couple bad investments here and there and they could resort to this kind of stuff to earn some extra cash.

I don't believe Ohtani was gambling. The guy was making so much money, I just... really believe the story. Maybe I'm naive.

As for the gambling part, it's a disaster. I am a "gambling doomer." I have no doubt there'll be lawsuits and in 15 years we'll see documentaries about people who ruined their lives over this. Students who took out student loans so they could gamble and inevitably lost it.

Every sport is promoting it, every TV show. I turned on ESPN the other day and "Mad Dog," is just SCREAMING at the TV... I guess it's a segment where he rants about something, but it was all about how he lost his bet on an O/U on an NBA game and showing the last 90 seconds and the missed FTs. Like... really? It's not even a gambling session and this dude is acting like a clown. I get it's a bit of an act, but still. 

 

We need to teach people financial literacy and we're doing the EXACT opposite. Most people SHOULD retire millionaires. It takes surprisingly little, just starting at a young age and instead, that's going to fanduel or whatever. 

[BrewerFan]

On 11/13/2025 at 2:17 PM, Team Canada said:

I think Ohtani was never actually accused of doing anything, but it's been a bit. It was his translator that he summarily fired.

Regardless, he definitely wasn't taking specific actions during a game to make money.

I don't know... he hit some pretty suspicious home runs...

7 hours ago, Jopal78 said:

Yes it was the translator making bets with Ohtani’s money. If we want to be cynical how does a translator have access to Ohtani’s bank accounts unless it’s with knowledge and consent? 

He likely had access to his account with his knowledge and consent. I'd doubt it was to place bets, or that Ohtani realized the breadth of it, but a professional athlete who has someone he's given access to his finances and people have taken advantage of him. Pretty old story. 

He's also making 100M a year outside of Baseball. That's likely ramped up with the Dodgers, so say it was 50M before that. Not hard to lose track of a few Million a year. 

[dlk9s]

On 11/15/2025 at 12:25 AM, BrewerFan said:

The guy was making so much money

I'm not saying I believe or don't believe the story, but someone making tons of money does not matter. In fact, rich people often just want to make even more money. I mean, hell, look at the richest people on earth.

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

On 11/16/2025 at 7:27 PM, dlk9s said:

I'm not saying I believe or don't believe the story, but someone making tons of money does not matter. In fact, rich people often just want to make even more money. I mean, hell, look at the richest people on earth.

And, for most problem gamblers, winning or losing is less important that one would think. It's the behavior itself, the rush etc., the provides the hook. 

That's not a comment on the Ohtani situation. I have no idea what level of knowledge he had about his translator's bets. I would think more than zero, but nowhere close to 100. We'll never know either way, and it's in a whole different category than the recent cases of actual outcome fixing, so it feels less significant to me in terms of the integrity of the game, even though the dollar amounts are bigger.