Luhnow and Hinch fired by Astros; Cora Out in Boston, Beltran Out in NY

[patrickgpe]

Didn't another team request permission to talk to Stearns about their open GM position and it was denied. I think its a non-story.

[xisxisxis]

The Smartest Guys in the Room II

 

Glad Luhnow is joining his buddy Taubman in the unemployment line. Couldn't happen to a nicer dick...

 

Am I the only one that thinks that Jim Crane looks like a funeral director?

[stalton]

Given the firing of those two, it does seem like the penalty is alot lighter.

[folly412]

It's probably a really good thing for baseball that the Nats won the Series. Though to be more cynical, it's probably also a good thing for baseball that its 2017 and 2018 champions weren't caught in 2017 or 2018.

[SeaBass]

Didn't another team request permission to talk to Stearns about their open GM position and it was denied. I think its a non-story.

That and it would be a lateral move, Stearns is President of Baseball Ops the same title Luhnow held making it more likely Attanasio wouldn't give the Astros permission to talk to Stearns.

[Thurston Fluff]

I like the hammer of justice when it's levied against others. I wonder what I would think if this were Stearns and Counsell and the Brewers draft picks.

 

The Astros and Red Sox have done enough winning to salve this wound. If they find a team that hasn't won, but cheated like this, that could really set back an organization.

 

From a day-to-day standpoint, the Astros have some work to do to find replacements for Luhnow and Hinch. The bigger news story will be when the Red Sox get their punishment.

 

This could end quite horribly. The Brewers were also accused of sign stealing at Miller Park.

 

https://www.brewcrewball.com/2019/11/14/20963825/milwaukee-brewers-mlb-sign-stealing-controversy-houston-astros

 

This is from the same source that pretty much contradicts the original story. https://www.brewcrewball.com/2020/1/8/21056573/zach-davies-says-brewers-didnt-use-video-equipment-to-steal-signs

 

Does anyone else here wonder why anyone would be so stupid as to think they could get away with this given the way players move around the league these days? I get players thinking they can get away with taking steroids but how can a team think it can get away with something that takes so many players involvement to make it worthwhile. All it takes is one player who feels slighted by the team or too honest and the whole house of cards falls down. Hell it doesn't even take that. All the motivation a player needs is the desire not to be the victim of said cheating. Why would anyone think every player who ever knew about it wouldn't say something after they leave?

[Thurston Fluff]

Given the firing of those two, it does seem like the penalty is alot lighter.

 

Those were pretty successful people. Especially the GM. You don't just replace people who build championship teams from scratch.

[topper09er]

I guess this is ok for this sort of unprecedented thing, but I think going forward the league should clearly state with no exceptions that the official penalty going forward for anyone, players included, for video cheating is a lifetime ban Pete Rose style.

[stalton]

Given the firing of those two, it does seem like the penalty is alot lighter.

 

Those were pretty successful people. Especially the GM. You don't just replace people who build championship teams from scratch.

 

I guess I'm thinking if the Astros got busted with lesser penalties, the coach and GM might still have been fired.

[MrTPlush]

It's probably a really good thing for baseball that the Nats won the Series. Though to be more cynical, it's probably also a good thing for baseball that its 2017 and 2018 champions weren't caught in 2017 or 2018.

 

Both of these teams were caught in the year they won the World Series. The Red Sox actually cheated in 2017 too I believe. They were the ones that caused the final “warning” on electronic sign stealing.

[3and2Fastball]

I think the Astros were lucky they weren’t stripped of their title, and Cora may get banned for life or at least 5 years. Meanwhile I’m surprised there aren’t any suspensions of players involved.

[MrTPlush]

I think the Astros were lucky they weren’t stripped of their title, and Cora may get banned for life or at least 5 years. Meanwhile I’m surprised there aren’t any suspensions of players involved.

 

I think Cora is going to be blacklisted if he suspended for life. Who is going to hire a guy coming off a multi year suspension? Not to mention his major success will be making two organizations cheat their way to titles?

[Brewcrewin07]

I guess I'm confused as to why people think this is a harsh punishment?? First of all, the picks are meaningless, the Astros can pretty much just buy players so no loss there. For me, the appropriate punishment and one that would make sure this never happens again would have been a postseason ban of at least one year. That would have gotten people's attention. Think about it from this perspective as well...if you issue a postseason ban, what incentive would fans have to show up knowing their team is basically playing an exhibition season. That hurts the bottom line of the team...$$ I thought this punishment was pretty light. Hell, if that's all the punishment was, to me it was well worth it.

[3and2Fastball]

Suspending all the players involved for a year or half a year would be good. Let the Astros be partly a AAAA team for 2020. I suspect that MLB’s weak position with the Player’s Union (and the upcoming CBA negotiations) prevented MLB from suspending players.

[homer]

They should force the team to move to Bangor, Maine for a season.

[SomewhereInTime]

Yet alot of comments coming In from Astro fans that 5 mil, picks and the suspensions were worth it for a world series

 

I mean for a fan, who doesn't actually have to pay a fine, lose their job, or care about draft picks, sure.

[homer]

I guess I'm confused as to why people think this is a harsh punishment?? First of all, the picks are meaningless, the Astros can pretty much just buy players so no loss there.

 

To get Gerrit Cole, the Astros traded:

Colin Moran - 1st round pick

Joe Musgrove - 1st round pick

plus others

 

To get Justin Verlander, the Astros traded:

Daz Cameron - 1st round pick

plus others

 

To get Zack Greinke, the Astros traded:

Seth Beer - 1st round pick

J.B. Bukauskas - 1st round pick

Corbin Martin - 2nd round pick

plus others

 

Draft picks don't have to see the field to be valuable. I won't mention all the 1st rounders they have starting in the field (4) since the picks they are losing won't be as high in the order as those guys.

 

So to say they can "buy" players is odd given they have signed exactly zero big ticket free agents in this current window (unless you are counting Gurriel and Reddick)

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/how-they-were-acquired-the-houston-astros-alds-roster/

[burnzy24]

Logan Morrison us claiming that the Dodgers and Yankees have done something similar in the past.

[Jenkins5]

My only issue is that MLB did nothing on international spending. Even 2 years of not being allowed to spend over 100k on a player would have been nice. They do well in that market & get to keep all pool money.

 

Hopefully nothing comes to light about Brewers after all those rumors of people trying to link them to Sign Gate back in October.. Stearns link Astros will make him an easy target for accusations. A penalty like that for Brewers could be pretty devastating.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Here's my thoughts..

 

1) 2 firsts and 2 seconds is a pretty considerable punishment. Homer laid out why.

 

 

3) I'd be absolutely shocked if they put a post season ban in place on any team. THat would be an absolute crusher to revenue, and that affects every team, not just the Astros.

 

4) Honestly, I think the biggest detriment to keeping teams from doing this kind of stuff won't be a huge penalty or a post season ban, but Cora getting a lifetime ban from the game. IMO of course.

[JosephC]

I want to know if MLB has figured out why so many pitcher's spin rate has increased by a couple hundred rpm as soon as they pitch for the Astros.

[MrTPlush]

As previously mentioned the report outlines AJ Hinch did know. He hated it, so much so he smashed the TV in the hallway multiple times...but he didn’t stop it. Thus, he got a notable punishment.

[DuWayne Steurer]

As previously mentioned the report outlines AJ Hinch did know. He hated it, so much so he smashed the TV in the hallway multiple times...but he didn’t stop it. Thus, he got a notable punishment.

 

 

I missed that. I didn't read the whole report. I'll amend my statement. I actually find that interesting. He hated it, smashed the tv they used to do it, and the players kept doing it?

[nodakfan17]

This reminds me of Louisville men’s basketball.

 

Pitino had Adidas funnel payments to players while his assistants organized ‘escort parties.’ Sure, they had to vacate their 2013 NCAA title, but during Pitino’s tenure (2001-2017), Louisville went from Conference USA, to the American (via the Big East), and finally to the ACC. I’m sure most Louisville fans (and the school’s trustees) agree it was worth it. You can’t take away all that TV money.

[MrTPlush]

As previously mentioned the report outlines AJ Hinch did know. He hated it, so much so he smashed the TV in the hallway multiple times...but he didn’t stop it. Thus, he got a notable punishment.

 

 

I missed that. I didn't read the whole report. I'll amend my statement. I actually find that interesting. He hated it, smashed the tv they used to do it, and the players kept doing it?

 

The way I understood it is he didn’t really show his displeasure towards everyone. Maybe he smashed the TV when no one was around. Shows how determined some were to keep doing it.

 

Regardless it seemed like he was frustrated, but kept it to himself.