NBA's Market Size

[KeerthiEva]

hai,

Is it true that the Milwaukee Bucks are not the smallest market team in the NBA? Which cities are smaller in size than Milwaukee? Despite this, what do teams in Wisconsin have as an advantage when it comes to fan support? Do fans across the state show equal enthusiasm for teams like the Bucks, Brewers, and Packers?

[Brock Beauchamp]

2 hours ago, KeerthiEva said:

hai,

Is it true that the Milwaukee Bucks are not the smallest market team in the NBA? Which cities are smaller in size than Milwaukee? Despite this, what do teams in Wisconsin have as an advantage when it comes to fan support? Do fans across the state show equal enthusiasm for teams like the Bucks, Brewers, and Packers?

Off the top of my head, Memphis and OKC are smaller metro areas. There could be more I'm missing. Portland, maybe?

[Jimbo]

2 hours ago, KeerthiEva said:

Do fans across the state show equal enthusiasm for teams like the Bucks, Brewers, and Packers?

Packers > Brewers > Bucks

 

[CheezWizHed]

31 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

Packers > Brewers > Bucks

 

I think that is pretty typical for most places that have all three leagues.  NFL > MLB > NBA.

The Bucks have a good following once GA became a superstar.  Winning a championship sure helped too.  But my impression is that they don't get a ton of people outside of Milwaukee coming to see games before that.  

[MrTPlush]

56 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

I think that is pretty typical for most places that have all three leagues.  NFL > MLB > NBA.

The Bucks have a good following once GA became a superstar.  Winning a championship sure helped too.  But my impression is that they don't get a ton of people outside of Milwaukee coming to see games before that.  

Yah....NBA is so city centric. Of course, I am sure that has a lot to do with the demographics of basketball in general. 

Even with GA and the championship...you really just don't see much for legitimate Bucks interest outside of the 5-county area. 

[KeerthiEva]

13 hours ago, MrTPlush said:

Yah....NBA is so city centric. Of course, I am sure that has a lot to do with the demographics of basketball in general. 

Even with GA and the championship...you really just don't see much for legitimate Bucks interest outside of the 5-county area. 

You are right that the NBA tends to be city-centric, which can be attributed to the demographics of basketball as a sport. Major cities often have a larger fan base and more resources to support their teams. However, it's not uncommon for teams outside those major cities, like the Bucks, to have a strong and dedicated fan base within their immediate region.

[patrickgpe]

On 12/4/2023 at 8:48 AM, Jimbo said:

Packers > Brewers > Bucks

 

There is some space between brewers and bucks. The brewers and packers have statewide appeal, I don't think the bucks really do. 

[SeaBass]

I'd agree. The late Kohl years were spent in a weird purgatory, refusing to tank but never landing true difference making talent. Until Giannis. Not conducive to keeping more casual fans interested. Trading Ray Allen was a devastating mistake.

[Playing Catch]

I was born and raised in Wisconsin's NW, within the orbit of the Twin Cities. I was just as big a Bucks fan as I was a Brewers, Packers, and Badgers fan, reading the boxscores in the Milwaukee paper at school every day. But in the 90's, when as a middle-schooler/high schooler I actively began seeking and consuming sports media, I wasn't able to satisfy my cravings. I was able to get radio broadcasts of Brewers, Packers and Badgers, and it was easier to find games on TV for those teams as well. But my Bucks fandom faded significantly, as I wasn't able to "connect" with them they way I could with the other teams. I'm sure that would be different these days.

It actually impacted not only the Bucks, but the NBA as a whole. Jordan and the other Dream Teamers captured my imagination. But those late 90's and early aughts era, as much as I wanted to watch Glen Robinson and Ray Allen, I still wasn't able to follow them as much, and when Iverson's NBA supplanted Jordan's, I really lost interest in the NBA. (I've since learned to love Allen Iverson).

I became a basketball snob, preferring the imperfection and team-centric style of basketball offered by Bo Ryan's teams to the athletic dynamism offered by the NBA.

[LouisEly]

On 12/4/2023 at 8:45 AM, Brock Beauchamp said:

Off the top of my head, Memphis and OKC are smaller metro areas. There could be more I'm missing. Portland, maybe?

Four.  Salt Lake City is the third and New Orleans is the fourth when going by metropolitan statistical area.

Milwaukee is #40, OKC is #42, Memphis is #44, SLC is #46, New Orleans is #57.  Portland is #26.

[owbc]

On 12/4/2023 at 7:29 AM, CheezWizHed said:

I think that is pretty typical for most places that have all three leagues.  NFL > MLB > NBA.

The Bucks have a good following once GA became a superstar.  Winning a championship sure helped too.  But my impression is that they don't get a ton of people outside of Milwaukee coming to see games before that.  

The NFL obsession is off the charts in Wisconsin. Ive never been anywhere else where it was so far above the other sports. 
 

[CheezWizHed]

6 minutes ago, owbc said:

The NFL obsession is off the charts in Wisconsin. Ive never been anywhere else where it was so far above the other sports. 
 

It kind of has to be to fill a stadium of 80k people in a town of 100k.  😉 

[Jimbo]

12 hours ago, owbc said:

The NFL obsession is off the charts in Wisconsin. Ive never been anywhere else where it was so far above the other sports. 
 

I've been to New England and seen their love of the Red Sox.  I'd say it could rival Packer Nation.

 

[CheezWizHed]

1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

I've been to New England and seen their love of the Red Sox.  I'd say it could rival Packer Nation.

 

And the Patriots?

[homer]

An interesting thing to note is that while the NBA may be more city-centric here it's incredibly popular globally. They aren't picking up a baseball or a football in most countries outside North America (Latin American countries being the obvious exception for baseball) so it makes sense. I wonder if having the G League team in Oshkosh would help popularize the Bucks a bit in that region at least?

[CheezWizHed]

1 hour ago, homer said:

An interesting thing to note is that while the NBA may be more city-centric here it's incredibly popular globally. They aren't picking up a baseball or a football in most countries outside North America (Latin American countries being the obvious exception for baseball) so it makes sense. I wonder if having the G League team in Oshkosh would help popularize the Bucks a bit in that region at least?

Well, there is that whole "soccer thing" in just about every other country. 😅  But Basketball is certainly gaining in popularity globally.  I remember playing in Germany in the 90s (just pickup, nothing professional).  I looked like Michael Jordan out there.  It just wasn't a game people played.  Now many of the best players in the NBA are from other countries.

[Oxy]

I don't really buy Milwaukee being that small of a market, as I think the entire state is more homogenously one culture and pro MKE than other states (except for those states that only have ONE major market...like MN, CO, Washington).  So, GB/Appleton/FRV, Madison, Racine, etc... are basically lumped together in the same fanbase/market.  States like Missouri are divided between Kansas City and St Louis markets...Ohio, PA, same thing. Jacksonville and Miami might as well be on separate planets culturally.

 

(Except for NBA basketball.  The Bucks just don't translate to the rest of the state)

[CheezWizHed]

I grew up in Northern WI.  Yes, north of WI Dells, North of Tomah, North of Eau Claire...oops you hit Lake Superior, back up a little bit.  Yeah, right there in the middle of nothing. 

That area (and probably many others) had a lot of "homers" - Packers, Brewers, Bucks, Badgers.  Loyalty to the state.  Cheeseheads (except a few of those weird Viking fans because we were so close to MN).

But to travel to a Buck's game was almost unheard of.  After going to MSOE and being 1 mile from the Bradley Center, I think a big part of it was that huge dark arena wasn't very inviting.  Nor was the area around the center (we didn't linger, but hoofed it in and out of the Bradley center when going there).  I'm guessing a lot of "country folk" weren't too crazy about the downtown area either. 

Fizer Forum and the build up of the area around there feels VERY different now. The lighting and night life give it a very different feel.  Cleaner, safer, and more fun. I imagine that has changed a bit of the support outside of Milwaukee.

But hey, a championship doesn't hurt either. 

[owbc]

2 hours ago, Oxy said:

I don't really buy Milwaukee being that small of a market, as I think the entire state is more homogenously one culture and pro MKE than other states (except for those states that only have ONE major market...like MN, CO, Washington).  So, GB/Appleton/FRV, Madison, Racine, etc... are basically lumped together in the same fanbase/market.  States like Missouri are divided between Kansas City and St Louis markets...Ohio, PA, same thing. Jacksonville and Miami might as well be on separate planets culturally.

(Except for NBA basketball.  The Bucks just don't translate to the rest of the state)

I agree. The bigger cities also tend to be loaded with transplants. No offense to Wisconsin, but it's not a destination that people move to, other than Madison which is always churning people because of the university. 

Wisconsin is also up there in the 'state pride' rankings -- people who live in Wisconsin are proud of being from Wisconsin and cheer for Wisconsin sports teams. Texas is the only other state I've visited that is comparable. We've had that debate on the forum before with some arguing that one can't be a fan of multiple teams, but anyone who is a transplant knows that you tend to keep your hometown team and gradually pick up the local team as well, especially if the local team is not a rival of your hometown team. 

I don't think it is especially unusual for different sports to have different fanbases. NFL and MLB have the most overlap. The NBA audience is younger, diverse, urban, international. I've worked with a number of Chinese colleagues who have heard of Milwaukee because of the NBA but know nothing about any of the other American sports. Milwaukee doesn't have an NHL team but in my experience that is another sport that attracts a completely different demographic in many places. 

[BrewerFan]

20 minutes ago, owbc said:

I agree. The bigger cities also tend to be loaded with transplants. No offense to Wisconsin, but it's not a destination that people move to, other than Madison which is always churning people because of the university. 

Wisconsin is also up there in the 'state pride' rankings -- people who live in Wisconsin are proud of being from Wisconsin and cheer for Wisconsin sports teams. Texas is the only other state I've visited that is comparable. We've had that debate on the forum before with some arguing that one can't be a fan of multiple teams, but anyone who is a transplant knows that you tend to keep your hometown team and gradually pick up the local team as well, especially if the local team is not a rival of your hometown team. 

I don't think it is especially unusual for different sports to have different fanbases. NFL and MLB have the most overlap. The NBA audience is younger, diverse, urban, international. I've worked with a number of Chinese colleagues who have heard of Milwaukee because of the NBA but know nothing about any of the other American sports. Milwaukee doesn't have an NHL team but in my experience that is another sport that attracts a completely different demographic in many places. 

I don't have a lot to add other than I've just always been a fan of all 3....not equally, probably as others have said, Brewers/Packers more equally and then the Bucks, but a very small gap. 

 

But to the bolded part, the Giannis impact has been HUGE. He has done so much for the City and even the perception of the Bucks in every way. I hope he gets another chip this year to put another stamp on his legacy(and then lets say 4-5 more after that...).

[nate82]

3 hours ago, owbc said:

but anyone who is a transplant knows that you tend to keep your hometown team and gradually pick up the local team as well, especially if the local team is not a rival of your hometown team. 

Only if the team name starts with a B for me.  I have been in Phoenix for just over 10 years now and I don’t like the Dbacks, Cardinals, Suns or Coyotes.

I think the Suns and Cardinals are the #1 and #2 team here in Phoenix.  The Dbacks and Coyotes are a distant 3rd and 4th.

[nate82]

Also for the NBA it tends to be more a player’s league than a team’s league.  You will find a lot of fans of Kobe or LeBron who just like the player but not the team they play on.

The NBA is just different than the other leagues.  The NBA marketing of its top players is 100 times better than all of the other leagues combined.  

[Playing Catch]

10 hours ago, Oxy said:

(Except for NBA basketball.  The Bucks just don't translate to the rest of the state)

Maybe they should change their name to the Wisconsin Bucks?

[Jimbo]

21 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

And the Patriots?

I haven't been in New England during the fall, so cannot offer an observance.