Does Ben Sheets = Paul Molitor?

[RockCoCougars]

I've been reading a lot of threads recently about the Brewers possibly trading Sheets. Seems a lot of people are down on him due to his injury history the past few years. Due to these rumors, and his impending free agency, I can't help but compare Sheets' situation to that of Paul Molitor in the late 80's/early 90's. At the time, Paul had the reputation of being undependable because he was getting hurt seemingly all the time. Like Molitor, Ben's presence on the active roster undeniably makes the team better, and they seem to scuffle without him. Typical Brewers luck, but after Molitor left the Brewers, I'm not sure if he ever spent time on the disabled list again. Does anyone share my fear that the Brewers' are going to let Sheets go either via trade or free agency and he will become a perennial work horse Cy-Young candidate, never getting injured again?

[TooLiveBrew]

Yes, I do. Your comp made me chuckle. That's a decent way of putting it in perspective. But I also worry about us keeping him, & the nagging injuries persisting.

[joshjs]

I bet a lot of people share your fear. Especially the ones who are advocating the team trade Sheets (because they'd look pretty bad Sheeter took over the world). http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[TheBrewer]

At the same time though it's not as likely that a 30+ year old pitcher is going to put up Cy Young numbers as far as I can recall. It takes alot of energy and stamina which both of which will decline after your prime. And I think sheets is 30 now? He could still have some good years left in him, and I think will see that wherever he goes MIL or not, and I'm sure he'll have some injury free seasons down the line yet, but he may be a guy that fades by 36ish or so because of his injuries maybe catching up to him

[AdvantageSchneider]

Not really. Molly got healthy by DH'ing a lot later in his career. There is no comparable change that could help keep sheets on the field, unless you think moving him to the BP/closer would help, at which point you destroy most of his value that makes him special in the first place.

[valpocrewsader]

I can't help but compare Sheets' situation to that of Paul Molitor in the late 80's/early 90's.

 

From 88 to 92, Molly's last five years with the Brewers, he failed to play in 154 games only once. Even if Sheets made every start next season, he'll still have a gaping three year stretch in the middle of his last five years where he missed almost 40% of his starts. Seems only very slightly comparable, at most.

[brosto1]

I am not worried at all, because whether he is traded this year or not by this time next year he will be a free agent. I personally could care less if it was Ben Sheets or CC Sabathia, I would always be concerned about investing major money to a pitcher. This is why quality young pitcihing is so important to small market teams; they cannot afford to spend big money on pitchers who are one pitch away from the knife.

[endaround]

The problem isn't the money, the problem is that a team just can't stockpile pitchers because they are not enough of them around. It doesn't matter that Yo only cost $450K, if he goes down to injury the Brewers aren't able to replace him.

[KCBrewerfan34]

The quandary here is when healthy Ben Sheets makes the Brewer rotation so much better than without him, that's a difference maker and the Brewers don't have many of those on the mound. We're contending in 2008, if you trade Sheets the team has to be improved, Carl Crawford straight up (3 way deal) doesn't improve our team, it fills a hole and creates another. Melvin is going to earn his money this off-season, tough tough decisions ahead, not to mention the bullpen will probably have to be completely rebuilt.

[Invader3K]

I guess the refreshing thing I've seen on this board is that Sheets is no longer thought of as some untouchable deity, like he was up until about three months ago by most on this forum.

 

He's been a Brewer for quite a while...at some point in the future, he won't be. I'm guessing that will likely happen before he retires. If the Brewers can get something useful for him in return this off-season before he potentially leaves in free agency, I don't see a big problem with that.

[PeaveyFury]

Molitor was already a HOF'er before he left.

 

Sheets is not even close at this point.

[djoctagone]

no. as far as i know, all of ben sheets' children were conceived with one woman.

[JohnBriggs12]

Molitor never hurt himself in between innings warmups.

 

The "jump the shark" moment for me was his hurting himself warming up before an inning. That doesn't happen to normal 29 year olds, much less guys who are supposed to be top athletes. On top of all his other various maladies that have affected virtually his entire body, that just convinced me that he doesn't physically have the body to withstand the rigors of pitching.

 

To think that will change as he approaches 30 is living in dreamland. This team has to move on while there are still teams out there foolish enough to think he's worth giving up a lot for. If you keep him, when he goes down, now you go from a number one starter to a number 6 as his replacement. I'd rather go get a number 3 that can be counted on (like a Garland), and reduce the chances of having to use that 6th, 7th, or 8th guy.

[Tbadder]

Well, the easy answer is that there is no answer. Their physiologies are their own and no comparison can be made one way or the other. But I do know that the Brewers will not be able to afford Sheets if he's healthy because of the salary he'll command, and they can't afford to tie up resources in a pitcher who is always hurt. It really does come down to money. Everything has to come down to money for a team like Milwaukee. It's time to get something now--a young stud pitcher, or catcher, or outfielder.

[PKBadger]

Molitor never hurt himself in between innings warmups.

 

The "jump the shark" moment for me was his hurting himself warming up before an inning. That doesn't happen to normal 29 year olds, much less guys who are supposed to be top athletes. On top of all his other various maladies that have affected virtually his entire body, that just convinced me that he doesn't physically have the body to withstand the rigors of pitching.

 

To think that will change as he approaches 30 is living in dreamland. This team has to move on while there are still teams out there foolish enough to think he's worth giving up a lot for. If you keep him, when he goes down, now you go from a number one starter to a number 6 as his replacement. I'd rather go get a number 3 that can be counted on (like a Garland), and reduce the chances of having to use that 6th, 7th, or 8th guy.

 

Briggs, after that injury occurred, I wondered if Ben would benefit from yoga. (Insert Gallardo joke).

I've never taken a yoga class and know absolutely nothing about it, but Capuano raves about it and says that it helps to keep him loose and flexible. It would seem that a player who is constantly pulling and tearing muscles might need something like this.

 

[MBHA]

Molitor never hurt himself in between innings warmups.

I was at the game where he pulled a muscle in his side swinging the bat in the on deck circle. He was out for a while with that one.

[JimH5]

Ben Sheets couldn't carry Molitor's jock. Or if he did, he'd end up injured as a result.

 

I don't understand the thought of "We can't trade Sheets for fear that he might be great for his new team."

Gary Sheffield has had a very productive post-Brewer career, and you never hear people complaining about that trade.

 

They can keep Sheets or trade him, and I'll be fine with that.

 

If they extend his contract, then I'll be upset.

[RyDogg66]

If they extend him we should get an injury discount. Im on record of wanting to extend him another 3-5 years.

[Invader3K]

no. as far as i know, all of ben sheets' children were conceived with one woman.

Why does any discussion about Paul Molitor have to devolve into an attack on his personal life around here? I've noticed stuff like this multiple times, and it really bugs me.

 

[Invader3K]

Ben Sheets couldn't carry Molitor's jock. Or if he did, he'd end up injured as a result.

 

I don't understand the thought of "We can't trade Sheets for fear that he might be great for his new team."

Gary Sheffield has had a very productive post-Brewer career, and you never hear people complaining about that trade.

Oh boy, can you even even name the guys the Brewers got for Sheffield? They basically had to get rid of him, and got nothing in return.

[Mike Felder]

Ricky Bones, Jose Valentin, and Matt Mieske.

 

Bones and Valentin I remembered, had to go to baseball-reference.com to find Mieske.

 

The trade occurred at the tail end of spring training...I remember the Journal-Sentinel (it might have been just the Journal then) running a big story about a year later about the trade with the headline "No Regrets." I don't think anyone was upset about trading Sheffield, the guy has always been a first-class jag.

[Robideaux]

Molitor was already a HOF'er before he left.

 

Sheets is not even close at this point.

If Molitor retired at age 35 after the 1992 season, I doubt that he would have been elected to the hall of fame. He put up another 1,000+ hits after he left the Brewers, made two all-star games, finished second in the MVP voting, and won the world series MVP in the Blue Jays victory over the Phillies. Without that part of his career he's a .300 hitter with 2,300 hits--good, but I don't think it would have been enough.

 

[JJHardy7]

So what does Sheets have to do to get in the HOF? Molitor left...and got in (I don't know if that was the original poster's intention but it's true). I don't see a chance that Sheets gets in no matter who he plays for.

[JimH5]

Sheets can get into the HOF by setting $14.50 on the counter and smiling nicely to the retirees who work there.

 

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