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R.A. Dickey to Blue Jays


Invader3K

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Yeah I don't get it. I'll be fine eating some crow in September but I really don't see Dickey replicating his season last year again this year. I know the rules of age don't apply as much with knuckleballers as with a fireballer, but he REALLY came out of nowhere. Definitely not worth two top prospects.
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D'Arnaud and Noah Syndergard? Nope, don't like it. Dickey is 38, and yes, a knuckle baller could play to his mid to late 40's. But his age is not the concern. It's his track record. He was great last year, and maybe he's a late bloomer. But outside of 2010 when he was 11-9 with a 2.84 ERA, when has he ever pitched well? That's a hefty price to pay for a guy without a track record.
There are three things America will be known for 2000 years from now when they study this civilization: the Constitution, jazz music and baseball. They're the three most beautifully designed things this culture has ever produced. Gerald Early
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lets just note that the "one good season" was a REALLY REALLY good one season that netted a Knuckleballer the CY Young. just let that sink in. a knuckle ball tosser... won. the cy young.

Posted: July 10, 2014, 12:30 AM

PrinceFielderx1 Said:

If the Brewers don't win the division I should be banned. However, they will.

 

Last visited: September 03, 2014, 7:10 PM

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Oh, and what a nice, young starting rotation the Mets are putting together for the future. Matt Harvey, Zack Wheeler, Noah Syndergaard. Jeurys Familia I think will be a good closer. And they've got their third baseman Wright locked in for a while.

 

The Mets are on the right track.

There are three things America will be known for 2000 years from now when they study this civilization: the Constitution, jazz music and baseball. They're the three most beautifully designed things this culture has ever produced. Gerald Early
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The trade is pending a Dickey extension so it's not just for one year of him.

 

This is exactly the tack Melvin should take should he consider trading Hart. Speak with Hart's agent and get a list of teams/cities where he'd consider signing an extension. Figure out which of those teams would be a good match in trade, and give them a call. He'd get more for Hart from a team if Hart was willing to extend with them, just like the Mets got more for Dickey because he is probably going to extend.

 

As to the Dickey deal, I don't know much about the prospects, but the new money flying around MLB seems to have put a damper on the perceived value of prospects. Teams seem willing to trade prospects for expensive vets this off season, so I hope Melvin can capitalize.

"The most successful (people) know that performance over the long haul is what counts. If you can seize the day, great. But never forget that there are days yet to come."

 

~Bill Walsh

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Now that its official:

Toronto wins in this deal for next 2years. It's like the KC-TB deal The ACE Pitcher has Immediate Impact. Dickey isn't a fluke, he's done it 3years running and has improved every year. Let's toss this in, you know the story, he wasn't a Knuckleballer in the Bigs to start and was mashed out of the Bigs as a plain pitcher. He had only dabbled with Knuckleballs but then it caught on and he's risen every year since. Toronto also gets Thole who at least had caught some of these Knucklers.

An added aspect to what makes me think Dickey will continue to pitch well is he's been at it for 3years and I'm sure its slowly come together for him what gets him outs. He probably threw too many of the PRE Knuckleballer pitches to mix it up and was getting hit. Now he's established his own pitch to pitch system(Thole) on how to manage his games to efficiency. He can make the Knuckle ball move how he wants,,,,Sink/rise. That's why he Ks so many. He'll be around for awhile and while not a sub-2.5 era in AL East, I see 3.3-3.6 to be expected. Oh, and Toronto has to be East Favorites. How's that rotation? Dickey,Johnson,Buerle,Morrow,and Romero? if of 2011 vs 2012? All of them could be sub 3.6era at season's end.

 

Now, Mets:

They make a Monster win on this trade on their end. They weren't going to extend Dickey for his price. They got a Prime Catcher in the making for years to come. It's what they wanted. Add the prospect of another Great Arm potential is icing on the cake. Let's face it, Mets weren't going to compete for this division in next 2years barring the whole everything comes together type season. You go to year 3 and Dickey is 40 at 12-13mil a year and has no where near the value he has now. This trade sures up at a high level, a position that often isn't counted on for offense. I really love a Great Catcher on the cheap. Theyre hard to come by, just look at Buck making 6mil./yr. TDA is making pennies to that contract and will outperform him by a mile. Anyway rambling. Good deal on both sides but Mets really made the best of their situation work for them. Something the Brewers may want to replicate.

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Well he is 38, but he's a knuckle baller, so age doesn't bother me too much. I did not know he's been so consistent the last three years. I was initially worried last year was not something you bank on happening in the future. I like this for the Mets, I would not give up much for a knuckle baller, but hey, it could work out well for both.

 

To add to the Hart discussion, I really don't think there is that much demand for a guy like him. It's the right time to try a trade, and finding teams he'd extend with is a no brainer, but I just don't think he's worth much. I think we end up with him on the team this year because there is no strong buyer. This of course will make people angry at Melvin for not trading him for (in blue) Felix Hernandez.

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It'll be fun to follow the Jays this season. They have a pretty good rotation w/ Dickey, Josh Johnson, Romero, Morrow and Buerhle. They also have a lot of good bats in that lineup w/ Reyes, Bautista, Lawrie, Melky, Rasmus and Encarnacion.

 

I agree that they might have given up a little too much, but that might change if Dickey keeps performing at this level.

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I seem to recall reading something about Dickey's knuckleball being unique. IIRC, a traditional knuckleball like Wakefield and others throw usually is in the high 50's as far as speed. Dickey's knuckle supposedly is in the low 70's, which apparently makes any break come later and is harder to gauge and thus the high strikeout totals.

 

This is a trade that you won't be able to judge for at least five years if not more. If the knuckle allows Dickey to pitch like he has the last three years over the next five to six and helps get Toronto into the playoffs it will be hard to say the Jays "lost" unless both prospects turn into perennial All-Stars. But prospects are just that - prospects. d'Arnaud has missed significant parts of two of his last three seasons (possibly 3 of his 5 full seasons - not sure about 2008, only played in 64 games that year); will he turn into Dave Nilsson, a good bat that can't stay on the field? Snydergaard had great numbers for a 19-year-old in low-A, but can he eventually make the adjustments to put up those numbers in AA and the majors? As with all young pitchers there is always an injury risk.

 

Many a good prospect has failed to live up to expectations at the big league level. This one we'll have to wait quite a while to see what happens.

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I seem to recall reading something about Dickey's knuckleball being unique. IIRC, a traditional knuckleball like Wakefield and others throw usually is in the high 50's as far as speed. Dickey's knuckle supposedly is in the low 70's, which apparently makes any break come later and is harder to gauge and thus the high strikeout totals.

 

This is a trade that you won't be able to judge for at least five years if not more. If the knuckle allows Dickey to pitch like he has the last three years over the next five to six and helps get Toronto into the playoffs it will be hard to say the Jays "lost" unless both prospects turn into perennial All-Stars. But prospects are just that - prospects. d'Arnaud has missed significant parts of two of his last three seasons (possibly 3 of his 5 full seasons - not sure about 2008, only played in 64 games that year); will he turn into Dave Nilsson, a good bat that can't stay on the field? Snydergaard had great numbers for a 19-year-old in low-A, but can he eventually make the adjustments to put up those numbers in AA and the majors? As with all young pitchers there is always an injury risk.

 

Many a good prospect has failed to live up to expectations at the big league level. This one we'll have to wait quite a while to see what happens.

 

Dickey throws 2 knuckle balls. One 80MPHish and one a more typical 65 MPHish. He really is unique in that sense.

"I wasted so much time in my life hating Juventus or A.C. Milan that I should have spent hating the Cardinals." ~kalle8

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